Habitat Posted February 8, 2020 #51 Share Posted February 8, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, drakonwick said: I'm not blind. I have had personal experiences that I cannot understand! It still doesn't automatically justify it as something paranormal just because I cannot explain it. I suppose after the first couple of dozen instances, the only thing you marvel at, is why you resisted the obvious conclusion for so long. It becomes just a part of "normal". I don't know whether I feel a sense of pride, or of bone-headedness, for not accepting it that readily. Edited February 8, 2020 by Habitat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freetoroam Posted February 8, 2020 #52 Share Posted February 8, 2020 10 hours ago, papageorge1 said: I have healthy skepticism Morning paraG, you do make me laugh. Have a good day. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psyche101 Posted February 8, 2020 #53 Share Posted February 8, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Habitat said: I am assigning very high probability, but only based on experience, otherwise I would simply be saying, "how would you know ?" Like Randi illustrated, with some investigating we can at least find a very realistic explanation. Defaulting to the superstitious is irrational. Edited February 8, 2020 by psyche101 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habitat Posted February 8, 2020 #54 Share Posted February 8, 2020 21 minutes ago, freetoroam said: Morning paraG, you do make me laugh. You have rebadged him a para-George ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onlookerofmayhem Posted February 8, 2020 #55 Share Posted February 8, 2020 1 minute ago, Habitat said: You have rebadged him a para-George ? If the tinfoil hat fits... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakonwick Posted February 8, 2020 #56 Share Posted February 8, 2020 43 minutes ago, Habitat said: I suppose after the first couple of dozen instances, the only thing you marvel at, is why you resisted the obvious conclusion for so long. It becomes just a part of "normal". I don't know whether I feel a sense of pride, or of bone-headedness, for not accepting it that readily. Thanks! I would rather be "bone-headed", as you call it! You need to let go and understand that not everyone thinks like you! I feel you're basing everything off your personal experiences, which only grasp people with similar beliefs. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habitat Posted February 8, 2020 #57 Share Posted February 8, 2020 (edited) 33 minutes ago, drakonwick said: Thanks! I would rather be "bone-headed", as you call it! You need to let go and understand that not everyone thinks like you! I feel you're basing everything off your personal experiences, which only grasp people with similar beliefs. I think a lot of people are like me, they are not that interested, and not really accepting of anything of the kind, until they acquire evidence that might change that view. That is the sensible position. And "sensible" also in the sense, of being able to be sensed directly. If that makes "sense" ! LOL Edited February 8, 2020 by Habitat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakonwick Posted February 8, 2020 #58 Share Posted February 8, 2020 7 minutes ago, Habitat said: I think a lot of people are like me, they are not that interested, and not really accepting of anything of the kind, until they acquire evidence that might change that view. That is the sensible position. And "sensible" also in the sense, of being able to be sensed directly. If that makes "sense" ! LOL 7 minutes ago, Habitat said: That is the sensible position. Really now, and what makes you the judge of that preconceived notion? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habitat Posted February 8, 2020 #59 Share Posted February 8, 2020 Just now, drakonwick said: Really now, and what makes you the judge of that preconceived notion? It's obvious, it isn't a matter of practical concern to most people. Let's face it, I know of no law that makes reference to paranormal happenings. It is not a matter people need worry their head about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psyche101 Posted February 8, 2020 #60 Share Posted February 8, 2020 11 minutes ago, Habitat said: It's obvious, it isn't a matter of practical concern to most people. Let's face it, I know of no law that makes reference to paranormal happenings. It is not a matter people need worry their head about. No, there's nothing to show it's actually real, so the paranormal can only ever be a discussion. Just like religion or politics, it's a regular subject. Mostly due to the irrational support of such a dubious proposition based on man made superstitions. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stereologist Posted February 10, 2020 #61 Share Posted February 10, 2020 On 2/7/2020 at 5:22 PM, papageorge1 said: I watched the video. That may be paranormal activity but is not overly impressive or dramatic. I've certainly seen more dramatic. The integrity of the individuals is the key issue. Papameter: 60% Paranormal 40% Natural/Hoax So that is paranormal means - a simple trick that fools the gullible. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stereologist Posted February 10, 2020 #62 Share Posted February 10, 2020 On 2/7/2020 at 7:09 PM, papageorge1 said: How does that show us ghosts can never be involved Mr. Logic school drop-out! So you failed to understand what was stated. That's par for the course 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stereologist Posted February 10, 2020 #63 Share Posted February 10, 2020 On 2/7/2020 at 9:37 PM, papageorge1 said: OK, I thought you were saying Randi could debunk this. My opinion is that Randi will claim to debunk everyone and everything and if he can’t do it legitimately he will resort to lying and deceit. Do you have anything to back up this claim or is this more malarkey due to failure to support your ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papageorge1 Posted February 10, 2020 #64 Share Posted February 10, 2020 1 minute ago, stereologist said: So you failed to understand what was stated. That's par for the course In this case it’s you not understanding what I say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papageorge1 Posted February 10, 2020 #65 Share Posted February 10, 2020 34 minutes ago, stereologist said: Do you have anything to back up this claim or is this more malarkey due to failure to support your ideas. Yes, the testimony of paranormal researchers I respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stereologist Posted February 10, 2020 #66 Share Posted February 10, 2020 There seems to be a continuing misunderstanding of probability. probability = (# of cases of interest)/(total # of cases) When it comes to things like the paranormal claims what we have is a probability of 0. The answer is quite simple. All of the cases presented so far do not involve anything paranormal. probability = 0/(total # of cases) = 0 Does this disprove the existence of anything paranormal? Of course not. It just shows that to date the probability appears to be 0. That's really not so surprising since the cases presented have been so flimsy. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stereologist Posted February 10, 2020 #67 Share Posted February 10, 2020 33 minutes ago, papageorge1 said: Yes, the testimony of paranormal researchers I respect. An appeal to authority is all you have. That is a way to avoid the evidence. The quantity, quality, and consistency of evidence shows that the paranormal is extremely unlikely to exist. In fact, it goes away when the controls are tightened properly as they are done in real science and not the sort of goofy foolishness some like to look up to. What we find is that people that think Randi is deceitful are people that can't accept that their cherished ideas are wrong. They attack Randi but never show the deceit or the mistakes in his demonstrations. Papameter: 100% based on ignorance of math and science 0% based on reasoning and logic and evidence 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papageorge1 Posted February 10, 2020 #68 Share Posted February 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, stereologist said: An appeal to authority is all you have. That is a way to avoid the evidence. The quantity, quality, and consistency of evidence shows that the paranormal is extremely unlikely to exist. In fact, it goes away when the controls are tightened properly as they are done in real science and not the sort of goofy foolishness some like to look up to. What we find is that people that think Randi is deceitful are people that can't accept that their cherished ideas are wrong. They attack Randi but never show the deceit or the mistakes in his demonstrations. Papameter: 100% based on ignorance of math and science 0% based on reasoning and logic and evidence Our appraisals are only as valuable as our effort, logic, intelligence and fair-mindedness makes them. I am comfortable that my skills are strong in those areas. I also believe when one becomes too attached to an anti-paranormal or any hard-line position the wheels come off the fair-mindedness and you enter the show no weakness defensive mode. Objectiveness is then gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stereologist Posted February 10, 2020 #69 Share Posted February 10, 2020 1 minute ago, papageorge1 said: Our appraisals are only as valuable as our effort, logic, intelligence and fair-mindedness makes them. I am comfortable that my skills are strong in those areas. I also believe when one becomes too attached to an anti-paranormal or any hard-line position the wheels come off the fair-mindedness and you enter the show no weakness defensive mode. Objectiveness is then gone. Thanks for once again being very wrong. The main problem is the lack of evidence or the paranormal. The quantity, quality, and consistency of the evidence shows it is extremely unlikely to exist. Notice the following quote without any evidence and no follow up: " My opinion is that Randi will claim to debunk everyone and everything and if he can’t do it legitimately he will resort to lying and deceit. " If that is what the appraisal is all about then we have clear evidence of the poor quality of that appraisal. Clearly that opinion is not based on evidence, not based on logic, not based on fair-mindedness, and since it is not based on or backed up by evidence it certainly tells us about the intelligence of that opinion. The evidence speaks for itself. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted February 10, 2020 #70 Share Posted February 10, 2020 People can't get past their superstitious beliefs. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stereologist Posted February 10, 2020 #71 Share Posted February 10, 2020 7 minutes ago, XenoFish said: People can't get past their superstitious beliefs. It would be one thing if there were a basis for a statement. Sometimes people just want to say they know. How? Doesn't matter they know. They know the world is flat. They know that the government is spraying mind control chemicals out of commercial jets. They know that crop circles are made by mysterious forces. They just know. I had an experience I can't explain therefore I have an explanation - mystical, magic, paranormal, ultra-dimensional, alien, crystal power, psychic energy, etc., et.c etc. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted February 10, 2020 #72 Share Posted February 10, 2020 1 minute ago, stereologist said: It would be one thing if there were a basis for a statement. Sometimes people just want to say they know. How? Doesn't matter they know. They know the world is flat. They know that the government is spraying mind control chemicals out of commercial jets. They know that crop circles are made by mysterious forces. They just know. I had an experience I can't explain therefore I have an explanation - mystical, magic, paranormal, ultra-dimensional, alien, crystal power, psychic energy, etc., et.c etc. The problem arises when there are explanations for the event that are faked or misunderstood. Some people convince themselves so thoroughly that what they believe is true, that no amount of evidence to the contrary will shake their faith. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TashaMarie Posted March 1, 2020 #73 Share Posted March 1, 2020 On 2/8/2020 at 1:42 AM, drakonwick said: I bet James Randi would have put this under scientific tests and came up with a logical explanation! lol Yes, funny how no one has ever walked away with the money James has on offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollo Posted March 21, 2020 #74 Share Posted March 21, 2020 Seen the video, and looks like it can be faked buy everyone working together. Center of gravity on TV tray is easy to manipulate by pushing down the corners. Sorry but that one just looks staged Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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