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bee

5G roll out in the UK

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Setton
4 hours ago, bee said:

lazy bones...... (and I don't think for one minute you would ;))

As we have all seen on this thread, what you think has little bearing on reality. 

I'm quite happy to prove you wrong but I'm not doing the legwork. You find the application, and I'll do the rest. 

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toast
4 hours ago, bee said:

you would have to be naive to think that secret experimentation on unsuspecting human subjects doesn't go on...

Well, I can look back to >25 years of job experience around the field of clinical research, clinical trials, medical-, biological- and biochemical fundamental- and contract research, IND contract development and contract manufacturing, I have tight contacts to CEOs and project managers of related companies/institutes (up to BSL4 standard) and to global player CROs as well, and I have a very good knowledge of the related ethics laws.

So what exactly is your qualification to be prepared well to call me naive to the matter?

Quote

it is confirmed that it has in the past and there is no reason to think that it doesn't now - and it would no doubt be classified...

Of course, its well known it happened in the past but if you think it still happen today please feel free to prove your fantasy claim/s with actual examples, not older than 10 years.

Quote

If they stick a 5G transmitter on a school in one of their test bed areas they are naturally going to be
interested in the mental and physical health of the children in the school (hopefully anyway)....
and will collect data on it..... but they won't be telling the parents so they don't cause alarm...

Prove it.

Quote

70 years ago. Something more actual in the drawer?

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toast
5 hours ago, bee said:

here's another professional person... who do you think is the better person out of her and your Nancy Hopkins,,?
see how silly it is to frame it like that.... it's all relative...

You totally missed my point. Until now I didnt stated 5G to be dangerous or not. My criticism to your statements is because you placed a number of CTs, and their stupid initiators, here and it has been shown that your knowledge about the matter is a little to low to be able to participate in a manner to keep the discussion fact based and free from any CT pollution.

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Emma_Acid
On 2/17/2020 at 5:54 PM, bee said:

 

Re bolded... what I have gathered (and I've said previously that, like most people I'm in the process
of learning about all this..).... what I've gathered is that the transmitters will have the capability of 
increasing the power...maybe right up to military WMD levels .... in the video below she says that 5G is a
different technology to the other generations of wireless technology and that it was first developed
by the military as a weapon (2:00).. she talks about the affect on insects and birds and wild life...
and at 3:00 says...

 "thousands of tiny little antennas and they put them in an array - then they focus this array
into a steerable laser beam....so the 4G is a light bulb - the 5G is a laser..." 

 Nancy Hopkins is a Bio/Electronic Weapons Expert.

5G: Weapon of Mass Destruction (YT video 6:01)

I am not clicking on a video called "5G - Weapon of Mass Destruction" - would it kill you to source more unbiased research or is it just easier to find something you agree with?

5G is not comparable to a laser. It just isn't, and is has been pointed out, Hopkins is not an expert in anything.

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Emma_Acid
On 2/19/2020 at 8:44 AM, bee said:

we are going into unknown territory..

Only for you. Trust me, its an area plenty of other people understand it perfectly well.

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bee
15 hours ago, Emma_Acid said:

I am not clicking on a video called "5G - Weapon of Mass Destruction" - would it kill you to source more unbiased research or is it just easier to find something you agree with?


that's your choice... but I have linked to sources with a neutral / pro position as well... and feel free to
post your own sources -
 

15 hours ago, Emma_Acid said:

5G is not comparable to a laser. It just isn't, and is has been pointed out, Hopkins is not an expert in anything.


I doubt you know anything about Hopkins or enough to make that blanket statement...

It looks like 5G IS comparable to a laser... a LASER being Light Amplification by Stimulated Emission
of Radiation... and 5G being an emission of microwave radiation for data etc transfer where a beam form is used...

 

a quick search turned up these couple of examples ... 

https://www.qualcomm.com/news/onq/2019/06/20/how-5g-massive-mimo-transforms-your-mobile-experiences

Beamforming is another key wireless technique that utilizes advanced antenna technologies on both mobile devices and networks’ base stations to focus a wireless signal in a specific direction, rather than broadcasting to a wide area. Think of the difference between using a flashlight — which kind of floods everyone in the room — versus a laser pointer, which can pinpoint and continuously track a given user.

With the massive number of antenna elements in a massive MIMO system, beamforming becomes “3D Beamforming.” 3D Beamforming creates horizontal and vertical beams toward users, increasing data rates (and capacity) for all users — even those located in the top floors of high-rise buildings .
 

and
 

https://spectrum.ieee.org/tech-talk/telecom/wireless/5g-beamsteering-antennas-more-accurate-less-power-hungry

Okada points out that the portion of the spectrum below the 6 GHz band was used for mobile communication because it benefits from a smaller free-space path loss. That’s the signal strength loss that occurs when an electromagnetic wave travels over a line of sight path in free space. “However, the incoming 5G mobile networks utilizing the millimeter-wave band demand a much larger array size due to the increased free-space path loss.” He added: “As a result, an accurate beam control with low latency experience will be essential.”

In future research, Okada and his team will be looking beyond 5G. He explains that today’s wireless communication is based on omnidirectional radiation (the radio wave is radiated in all directions). Now he is looking at multidirectional communication.

In this new paradigm, the radio wave is transmitted like a laser beam, and can be directed toward any arbitrary direction instantly. The beam can also be split and delivered to multiple target objects at the same time artificially and intelligently.

Okada added: “It will be one of the key technologies for beyond 5G technology.”

 

 

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bee
15 hours ago, Emma_Acid said:

Only for you. Trust me, its an area plenty of other people understand it perfectly well.

 

5G is a new technology that we are told will change society as we know it...  (like 4G did..)

I'd say that was 'unknown territory'.... on how it will impact day to day life - the environment etc..
in the short and long term...

 

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bee

 

This is a decent short video discussing 5G and how it's different to what people are thinking
at the moment... that it isn't just about faster downloading on phones... in fact at some point it
could eliminate the need for the phone in a lot of ways... the one guy gives the example of
someone who wants to order an Uber Taxi.... and where 5G is set up with the face recognition
and Artificial Intelligence someone would just have to SAY...'Uber'.... and a taxi would come...

the question of privacy and who has all the data also comes up...

+ companies involved and the Chinese developments in the 5G industry...

(4:05) quote.... " 5G is computing and networking combined on the same platform"

(don't get distracted or put off by the soundbite title...)
 

 

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bee

 

article from the BBC about the allocation of the wavelengths... (Oct 2019)

(note the usual example /  emphasis about being able to download films in seconds -
like this was the most important thing in life... :rolleyes:.. like... hey I've just downloaded 10 films
in 30 seconds....BUT now I need to spend around 25 - 30 hours watching them....^_^ duh)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-50208391

The World Radiocommunication Conference 2019 (WRC-19) in Sharm el-Sheikh will attempt to find a global agreement on how 5G airwaves should be used.

Launched in the UK this year, 5G enables users to download films over the internet in seconds rather than minutes.

UK media watchdog Ofcom said on Monday it would auction more sub-6GHz (gigahertz) low- and mid-level airwaves next year to boost coverage and support the rollout of 5G services.

But higher-level "millimetre wave" (mmWave) frequencies offer the scope to provide further 5G capacity.

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Setton
5 hours ago, bee said:

that's your choice... but I have linked to sources with a neutral / pro position as well... and feel free to
post your own sources

Still waiting for those journal articles... 

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WanderingFool0
On 2/14/2020 at 2:26 AM, Emma_Acid said:

Opt out of what? Its like saying "I want to opt out of oxygen". RF radiation is *EVERYWHERE*, you can't personally just "opt out" of it.

That is the point they were making I think. One can not opt out of this technology, so the implementation of it will force everyone to be exposed whether they want to be or not. And even if people fearing 5g and other electromagnetic radiation are wrong, why are they not free to not be exposed to it, like other man made substances. I think the war on tobacco is good analogy where many places smoking is being banned in public because people feel they have a right not to be exposed to noxious man made chemicals of others. Since one can not opt out of breathing the smoke, than smoking itself is banned.

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WanderingFool0
On 2/17/2020 at 1:40 AM, skookum said:

Does anyone else feel like me that I don't understand the rush for 5G to be installed?

Mobile internet is essential for my work. Infact I can't work without it. However I can work on less than 3G.

What and how many industries need 5G so badly and how are they coping now?

I can't understand why we are rushing into this that is pressuring us into using companies like Huawei to get it done fast.

Well, it's my personal opinion, but I think the reason it is being pushed has to do with something even more sinister than the possible health concerns and that is many years ago DARPA talked about creating the total information awareness network and the government even created a department with a department badge emblem with an all seeing eye scanning the globe.

Years after that you begin to see more and more stories about data mining and tracking on the internet and even of course the whistle blower revelations that the NSA was capturing the entire data streams of whole nations. I think the push for 5 g has to do with the further implementation of this total surveillance network, to the level where they will be able to have every electronic device you own down to your toaster collecting data and information about you and reporting it back to the servers.

And as far as the health concerns, I would say that their desire to build this total information awareness network, could very well make them overlook or downplay any possible health effects that may stand in the way of their Orwellian dream.

I would add in closing, the last thing they are in a rush to do is make sure we can download multiple movies and games in the shortest amount of time.

Edited by WanderingFool0
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Setton
3 hours ago, WanderingFool0 said:

That is the point they were making I think. One can not opt out of this technology, so the implementation of it will force everyone to be exposed whether they want to be or not. And even if people fearing 5g and other electromagnetic radiation are wrong, why are they not free to not be exposed to it, like other man made substances.

They are. Feel free to go live in a cave. Or up a mountain. 

Quote

I think the war on tobacco is good analogy where many places smoking is being banned in public because people feel they have a right not to be exposed to noxious man made chemicals of others. Since one can not opt out of breathing the smoke, than smoking itself is banned.

The difference being that the fear of smoke harming you is based on decades of extensively corroborated, peer-reviewed scientific research. 

The fear of 5G harming you is based on what some people on YouTube said so they'd make more money.

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jbondo

You can all argue back and forth, but personally, I don't like it. I don't think it's safe. We talk about "fake news" but forget that scientific studies and reports can be BS just as easily as the other side. With the exception of one aspect. The other side isn't looking for a new Gov grant, or funding to continue or start a new project. I love science,but I also keep it in perspective like everything else. Too often, we read or hear language like this in science: "We believe", "It's probably", "There's a good chance", etc...They fill in gaps with semi- factual data and downright filler. Once it gets into the mainstream, people just assume it's factual, especially in the public schools which often teach science theory as fact.

4G is just fine for me. Better safe than sorry. Of course, I have no control over cell towers, mini towers and other apparatus or stations. So, maybe my avoidance is all for nothing. Then again, I'd rather not make it easier, by having 5G in my hand or next to my head. Call me crazy or whatever you like, but I'm not comfortable with it.

I don't know a whole lot about Alex Jones, but I do know he's controversial. However, I just did a search for "dangers of 5G" and was greeted with this data, which is supposed to be fact: Decide for yourself.

Phone radiation levels above legal limits

Edited by jbondo
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Golden Duck
13 hours ago, jbondo said:

... don't know a ... lot ... Alex Jones ...

These words go well together in a sentence; and some combinations are better than others.

What legal limit is Alex Jones talking about?

Quote

... there is no federally developed national standard for safe levels of exposure to radiofrequency (RF) energy ...

If you want to be unnecessarily risk averse there are things you can do to alleviate your fear.

Quote

What You Can Do

Even though no scientific evidence currently establishes a definite link between wireless device use and cancer or other illnesses, and even though all cell phones must meet established federal standards for exposure to RF energy, some consumers are skeptical of the science and/or the analysis that underlies the FCC’s RF exposure guidelines. Accordingly, some parties recommend taking measures to further reduce exposure to RF energy. The FCC does not endorse the need for these practices ...

https://www.fcc.gov/consumers/guides/wireless-devices-and-health-concerns

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bee
13 hours ago, jbondo said:

4G is just fine for me. Better safe than sorry. Of course, I have no control over cell towers, mini towers and other apparatus or stations. So, maybe my avoidance is all for nothing. Then again, I'd rather not make it easier, by having 5G in my hand or next to my head. Call me crazy or whatever you like, but I'm not comfortable with it.

 

The problem is that people are actually addicted to their '''smart''' phones (that make them stupid ^_^ )
so now they are being shunted onto 5G although 4G is fine for them, like it is for you... 

Thanks for the Infowar link... 

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Montmorency the Dog
23 hours ago, bee said:

Launched in the UK this year, 5G enables users to download films over the internet in seconds rather than minutes.

I love how modern society highlights that as the main advantage. Never mind its usefulness for, say, business, or in enhancing safety-critical communications in remote areas, or whatever else they might promote, hey! You can spend even longer slumped in front of Net Flicks and benefit the economy by being even more of a couch potato!

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Montmorency the Dog
14 hours ago, Setton said:

They are. Feel free to go live in a cave. Or up a mountain. 

isn't that a good place to put transmitters? Up mountains anyway. 

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bee
1 minute ago, Dumbledore the Awesome said:

I love how modern society highlights that as the main advantage. Never mind its usefulness for, say, business, or in enhancing safety-critical communications in remote areas, or whatever else they might promote, hey! You can spend even longer slumped in front of Net Flicks and benefit the economy by being even more of a couch potato!

 

I know... they must think the Plebs are REALLY stupid... to keep pushing that Download a Film in 3 seconds
angle as the Great Wonder of 5G...... as I have said... it still takes 2 or 3 hours to watch the blummin thing so
what's the big deal...

like DUH.... and double DUH...

 

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Golden Duck
10 minutes ago, Dumbledore the Awesome said:

I love how modern society highlights that as the main advantage. Never mind its usefulness for, say, business, or in enhancing safety-critical communications in remote areas, or whatever else they might promote, hey! You can spend even longer slumped in front of Net Flicks and benefit the economy by being even more of a couch potato!

The low latency is useful for driverless vehicle.  I haven't heard that small cell technology will benefit remote areas.

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bee
18 hours ago, WanderingFool0 said:

That is the point they were making I think. One can not opt out of this technology, so the implementation of it will force everyone to be exposed whether they want to be or not. And even if people fearing 5g and other electromagnetic radiation are wrong, why are they not free to not be exposed to it, like other man made substances. I think the war on tobacco is good analogy where many places smoking is being banned in public because people feel they have a right not to be exposed to noxious man made chemicals of others. Since one can not opt out of breathing the smoke, than smoking itself is banned.

 

good analogy with the smoking ban ......

if they get their way there will be NO OPT OUT of exposure to the 5G frequencies and wavelengths
that have not been given the All Clear.... no matter how hard we are being conned into thinking that
they have....

and if humans - their pets - etc ARE harmed or killed by 5G... there will be no recourse ...

Lloyds of London (who has a major control the Insurance market) have excluded it from liability..
 

https://www.jrseco.com/lloyds-insurance-company-does-not-cover-health-damage-caused-by-electromagnetic-radiation/

EXCLUSIONS
We will not
a) make any payment on your behalf for any claim, or
b) incur any costs and expenses, or
c) reimburse you for any loss, damage, legal expenses, fees or costs sustained by you, or
d) pay any medical expenses:

GENERAL INSURANCE EXCLUSIONS:

32. Electromagnetic fields
directly or indirectly arising out of, resulting from or contributed to by electromagnetic fields, electromagnetic radiation, electromagnetism, radio waves or noise.

 

 

  

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bee
5 minutes ago, Golden Duck said:

The low latency is useful for driverless vehicle.  I haven't heard that small cell technology will benefit remote areas.

 

well there's another thing.... does anyone actually WANT driverless cars and all that that entails...?

do people want the robotic world that is being planned for us...? 
(Being planned by God knows who....) 

 

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bee

 

 

random link about a Driverless Car Trial in the UK (London)... article written Oct 2019

And the name of the Taxi Car....................... Five AI........

(as in 5G and Artificial Intelligence I suppose.... picture on link...

 

Mirror : Driverless Car Trial in London

quote...

Driverless cars are carrying passengers on British roads for the first time in trials making motoring history.

The pioneering experiment is taking place on a 12-mile circuit in south London, but the exact route is being kept secret by the government-backed consortium behind the project.

Trials began this week in Bromley and Croydon using converted Ford Mondeos to see if the technology can operate safely on Britain’s busy roads.

 

I was just having a quick look about this - because I was thinking that to do this with the Driverless Car
they must have had a 5G set up activated in those areas....

I haven't got time to look into it further right now but ...

https://en.everybodywiki.com/FiveAI

Quote

Overview

FiveAI uses a combination of its software stack, cameras and sensors to help the autonomous vehicles navigate.

In 2018, CAT developed the world’s first autonomous driver training course with their partner FiveAI.

Testing

In 2018, FiveAI started data gathering in London’s Bromley and Croydon Boroughs.[10]In 2019, FiveAI started autonomous tests of their vehicles on the streets of London by Bromley and Croydon councils. The tests are carried out  using converted Ford Mondeos.[11] Each car is equipped with cameras, radars and LiDARs. During the tests, the cars have trained safety drivers, who can take control of the car at any point.


re the bit about each car being equipped with cameras, radars and LiDAR....

note the use of lasers...

https://oceanservice.noaa.gov/facts/lidar.html

LIDAR, which stands for Light Detection and Ranging, is a remote sensing method that uses light in the form of a pulsed laser to measure ranges (variable distances) to the Earth. These light pulses—combined with other data recorded by the airborne system— generate precise, three-dimensional information about the shape of the Earth and its surface characteristics.

 

How is LIDAR data collected?

When an airborne laser is pointed at a targeted area on the ground, the beam of light is reflected by the surface it encounters. A sensor records this reflected light to measure a range. When laser ranges are combined with position and orientation data generated from integrated GPS and Inertial Measurement Unit systems, scan angles, and calibration data, the result is a dense, detail-rich group of elevation points, called a "point cloud."

Each point in the point cloud has three-dimensional spatial coordinates (latitude, longitude, and height) that correspond to a particular point on the Earth's surface from which a laser pulse was reflected. The point clouds are used to generate other geospatial products, such as digital elevation models, canopy models, building models, and contours.[/quote]

 

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Golden Duck
52 minutes ago, bee said:

 

well there's another thing.... does anyone actually WANT driverless cars and all that that entails...?

do people want the robotic world that is being planned for us...? 
(Being planned by God knows who....) 

 

Aren't you concerned about some users here road raging on a street near you?

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bee
Just now, Golden Duck said:

Aren't you concerned about some users here road raging on a street near you?

 

No.... I'm actually impressed by how few problems there are on the roads when you think of
how many cars are going around all the time.... we have each other's lives in our hands when
we go on the road and apart from the occasional hiccup I think everyone does really well...

and re the Driverless Cars... I wonder what Taxi Drivers think about it all.. because they
would be put out of a job.... and the whole tradition of taxi's and taxi drivers would be gone...

another area of job loss and robotic conversion that isn't necessary or even wanted...

???

 

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