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The Work that God does

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Cookie Monster

We are born into a universe that has both positive and negative aspects.

Life doesnt go how any of us expect as we get both negative experiences and problems come our way. Some of them everybody has like at some point we all have to go through dying. But some are unique to us. Maybe we arent as attractive or intelligent or healthy or successful as we had hoped, etc. Maybe we encounter accidents that change us, maybe we are the victims of crime, maybe life goes badly for us at different stages.

So I have developed a really weird approach to religion. To begin with our societies are full of ideals which tell us we are good and valuable people if we behave in one way. But that we are bad and worthless if we behave another. After reflecting on societies ideals I have realised that they originated (or originate for new ones that emerge) from people trying to satisfy their own particular needs.

I notice many poor people demonise the rich as corrupt or greedy. I notice that those with nothing particularly special going for them demonise those that have. I noticed those who are miserable hate pleasure. With societies ideals I reached the conclusion that anti-materialism, anti-egotism, and anti-hedonism are not inherently wrong. That collectively people have created ideals to protect themselves from negative emotions that society has adopted.

I realised that this is Gods universe, not mine, not other peoples, and not societies. Therefore what matters is what God considers good and valuable, not the ideals which are projected onto us. It changed me. I started to enjoy material things, I let myself have a big ego, and I sought out pleasure wherever I could find it. Nothing bad happened at all, in fact it changed my life. 

In my opinion God created us the way that we are to be the way that we are. He created a universe for us to fully enjoy. He gave us positive traits so we could gain pleasure from them and enjoy the way they flatter our egos. In my opinion anti-materialism, anti-egotism, and anti-hedonism, put us at odds with Gods intention and we get punished for it. Likewise if we take out our negative traits or negative life experiences on other people we get punished for that too.

So we are supposed to enjoy material possessions, to enjoy what makes us special and let it go to our heads, and to be pleasure seeking people. All of us. Not only are we supposed to behave that way ourselves but try to help other people be that way too. Then we are all aligned with God and things go great for us.

My views have been heavily shaped by Kabbala. Something else weird I noticed about Kabbala is that it talks about words impacting the way reality unfolds. I dont get how to do it, but I noticed simply reading Kabbala texts before applying the practices has an affect too. I dont know what thats about or why it works but its there.

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Desertrat56
Posted (edited)

Meanwhile, Rome burns and some mad emperor stands on top of the rubble playing his fiddle.

(figures, Will Due likes this .  :lol:)

Edited by Desertrat56
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Will do
3 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

Will Due likes this

 

Of course I do.

It's also why I like you. 

 

 

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GlitterRose

It seems like there has to be a balance or things get wonky. 

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joc
17 minutes ago, GlitterRose said:

It seems like there has to be a balance or things get wonky. 

You can ask Oprah about that! :whistle:

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freetoroam
1 hour ago, RabidMongoose said:

But some are unique to us. Maybe we arent as attractive or intelligent or healthy or successful as we had hoped, etc. Maybe we encounter accidents that change us, maybe we are the victims of crime, maybe life goes badly for us at different stages.

How is any of those unique when they are what many people go through?

Maybe I have read it wrong, so can you give an example of what is unique.

 

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zep73

Do what makes you happy (unless you're a serial killer). Everything else is a waste of life and opportunity.

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and then
2 hours ago, joc said:

You can ask Oprah about that! :whistle:

I'm no Oprah fan but I have to say the old girl impressed me with her mental poise.  She'd barely landed and was still in control of her audience.  Falling down, even with no one around to see it, is embarrassing for most of us.

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GlitterRose
2 hours ago, XenoFish said:

The only answer is to become a materialistic selfish hedonist, because God.

LOL. You have such a way of putting things.

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XenoFish
Just now, GlitterRose said:

LOL. You have such a way of putting things.

Accept Christ and rack up those sinner points, get a high score for Jesus. Don't let his sacrifice be for nothing.:lol:

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Kaikou
3 hours ago, joc said:

You can ask Oprah about that! :whistle:

I asked her, she just said: You get a car, you get a car, you get a car.
Honestly, she seemed pretty chilled out about everything, I don't even think she heard what I sad.

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lightly
4 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

 

My views have been heavily shaped by Kabbala. Something else weird I noticed about Kabbala is that it talks about words impacting the way reality unfolds. I dont get how to do it, but I noticed simply reading Kabbala texts before applying the practices has an affect too. I dont know what thats about or why it works but its there.

I haven't read Kabbala...... and maybe it's my imagination...but I have come to believe that ,somehow, spoken words actually do have power and affect reality.     

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The Wistman

I dunno, in a broad sense, I've found that narcissistic sociopaths tend to be pretty good at twisting most anything into a form that validates their own high opinion of themselves, and justifies their indifferent and exploitive ideation with regard to others, locally and globally.  Don't you?

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XenoFish
15 minutes ago, lightly said:

I haven't read Kabbala...... and maybe it's my imagination...but I have come to believe that ,somehow, spoken words actually do have power and affect reality.     

Language is a form of magick. Both the written and spoken word. 

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joc
4 hours ago, joc said:
5 hours ago, GlitterRose said:

It seems like there has to be a balance or things get wonky. 

You can ask Oprah about that! 

 

1 hour ago, Kaikou said:

I asked her, she just said: You get a car, you get a car, you get a car.
Honestly, she seemed pretty chilled out about everything, I don't even think she heard what I sad.

lol...I was referring to he great fall...

 

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GlitterRose
7 minutes ago, joc said:

 

lol...I was referring to he great fall...

 

Oh my.

I don't watch her and didn't even hear about this.

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Mr Walker
12 hours ago, sci-nerd said:

Do what makes you happy (unless you're a serial killer). Everything else is a waste of life and opportunity.

Just maybe, there are a few other things you shouldn't do /be, even if they make you  happy :) 

 

eg there are many humans who get great pleasure from hurting others, controlling /dominating them, or exercising power over them. 

 

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Cookie Monster
Posted (edited)
22 hours ago, lightly said:

I haven't read Kabbala...... and maybe it's my imagination...but I have come to believe that ,somehow, spoken words actually do have power and affect reality.     

They have some weird numbering system they attach to words but its hard to follow. 

I have read many articles only to then find odd experiences.

Edited by RabidMongoose
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Cookie Monster
On 3/8/2020 at 10:19 PM, The Wistman said:

I dunno, in a broad sense, I've found that narcissistic sociopaths tend to be pretty good at twisting most anything into a form that validates their own high opinion of themselves, and justifies their indifferent and exploitive ideation with regard to others, locally and globally.  Don't you?

Please complete the following in a few sentences -

Materialism is immoral because:

Egotism is immoral because:

Hedonism is immoral because:

The thing is none of them are inherently immoral, but if a person is that way inclined they can use them in immoral ways. Furthermore there are people claiming they are immoral too to cover their own failures, insecurities, and jealousies. If I am poor and cannot afford any luxury in my life then how easy is it for me to demonise materialism to cover my own short comings?

There is nothing inherently wrong with enjoying material possessions, with enjoying what is special about yourself and letting it go to your head, and seeking out all the pleasures to be enjoyed in life. It is nothing more than idealism claiming they are bad. They do not make a bad person, although bad people might use those approaches.

I refuse to believe that God created a universe in which we are supposed to live the life of a reclusive hermit otherwise we are immoral. God created us with egos, he created us in a reality where we get to own and enjoy material possessions, and he created a world for us full of pleasures to enjoy. We are supposed to be what God created us to be, and to fully embrace it. Not doing so puts us at odds with God and this in my opinion is what the fall of man is actually about. Self-imposed separation from God.

God is the giver and we are the receiver. Yet the people in society who are actually corrupt (those spreading ideals at odds with Gods intentions) lead people away from God. Our job is to wholly and completely receive, not to deny ourselves. Be what we are and enjoy it because thats what God intended for us and why he created the world that exists for us. 

Punishments come our way in life from God when we dont do that by denying ourselves what we exist for - to serve God the giver by wholly and completely receiving.

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XenoFish

discipline-equals-freedom-1.jpg

Control yourself or others will not control you. Master yourself. The greatest strength is self control.

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Piney
1 hour ago, XenoFish said:

"Control yourself and others will not control you. Master yourself. The greatest strength is self control.

......and nobody can save you but yourself"

  Buddha

Your hired. :yes:

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Stubbly_Dooright
On 3/8/2020 at 1:38 PM, RabidMongoose said:

We are born into a universe that has both positive and negative aspects.

Life doesnt go how any of us expect as we get both negative experiences and problems come our way. Some of them everybody has like at some point we all have to go through dying. But some are unique to us. Maybe we arent as attractive or intelligent or healthy or successful as we had hoped, etc. Maybe we encounter accidents that change us, maybe we are the victims of crime, maybe life goes badly for us at different stages.

So I have developed a really weird approach to religion. To begin with our societies are full of ideals which tell us we are good and valuable people if we behave in one way. But that we are bad and worthless if we behave another. After reflecting on societies ideals I have realised that they originated (or originate for new ones that emerge) from people trying to satisfy their own particular needs.

I notice many poor people demonise the rich as corrupt or greedy. I notice that those with nothing particularly special going for them demonise those that have. I noticed those who are miserable hate pleasure. With societies ideals I reached the conclusion that anti-materialism, anti-egotism, and anti-hedonism are not inherently wrong. That collectively people have created ideals to protect themselves from negative emotions that society has adopted.

I realised that this is Gods universe, not mine, not other peoples, and not societies. Therefore what matters is what God considers good and valuable, not the ideals which are projected onto us. It changed me. I started to enjoy material things, I let myself have a big ego, and I sought out pleasure wherever I could find it. Nothing bad happened at all, in fact it changed my life. 

In my opinion God created us the way that we are to be the way that we are. He created a universe for us to fully enjoy. He gave us positive traits so we could gain pleasure from them and enjoy the way they flatter our egos. In my opinion anti-materialism, anti-egotism, and anti-hedonism, put us at odds with Gods intention and we get punished for it. Likewise if we take out our negative traits or negative life experiences on other people we get punished for that too.

So we are supposed to enjoy material possessions, to enjoy what makes us special and let it go to our heads, and to be pleasure seeking people. All of us. Not only are we supposed to behave that way ourselves but try to help other people be that way too. Then we are all aligned with God and things go great for us.

My views have been heavily shaped by Kabbala. Something else weird I noticed about Kabbala is that it talks about words impacting the way reality unfolds. I dont get how to do it, but I noticed simply reading Kabbala texts before applying the practices has an affect too. I dont know what thats about or why it works but its there.

I do not know, if I am understanding you correctly, but it seems like you are discussing (or correcting) what I feel most stringing orthodox believers think. And that is, that you don’t have to fight off the enjoyment of materialism and that it’s good for you to do so. I often wondered that myself, and this thought is coming from a person growing up with no religion and it’s tools and traditions. I mean, granted, they’re there and why is that? ;) 

As someone who has had her own New Age/weird spiritual enlightenment and experiences though out her life, I feel there is a freedom from materialism, for the sake of each individual. And to see this, helps one enjoy the materialism more, because there is freedom from the dependence, and it’s heightened the appreciation for them. My opinion is of course, I can’t really see the orthodox in this, there is no basis in my life to see it. There really is no objective clues to show it. Isn’t it interesting, that I have my own opinion of what is there and the reason to what we have in this world? 

How about the fact, the reason we don’t have objective understanding of what ever may have given us this world, maybe is to realize what we do have is not always there to use irresponsibly? I think Xeno’s post #23, is pretty much a great sum up in understand life itself, and I think it’s interesting that we don’t necessarily have to come to that conclusion that it’s because an orthodox God. It could be unorthodox, how I see it, or not at all, in which I think Xeno sees it. 

Does the orthodox God want us to believe we can come to the conclusion with objectively seeing him or not? 

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Cookie Monster
2 hours ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

I do not know, if I am understanding you correctly, but it seems like you are discussing (or correcting) what I feel most stringing orthodox believers think. And that is, that you don’t have to fight off the enjoyment of materialism and that it’s good for you to do so. I often wondered that myself, and this thought is coming from a person growing up with no religion and it’s tools and traditions. I mean, granted, they’re there and why is that? ;) 

As someone who has had her own New Age/weird spiritual enlightenment and experiences though out her life, I feel there is a freedom from materialism, for the sake of each individual. And to see this, helps one enjoy the materialism more, because there is freedom from the dependence, and it’s heightened the appreciation for them. My opinion is of course, I can’t really see the orthodox in this, there is no basis in my life to see it. There really is no objective clues to show it. Isn’t it interesting, that I have my own opinion of what is there and the reason to what we have in this world? 

How about the fact, the reason we don’t have objective understanding of what ever may have given us this world, maybe is to realize what we do have is not always there to use irresponsibly? I think Xeno’s post #23, is pretty much a great sum up in understand life itself, and I think it’s interesting that we don’t necessarily have to come to that conclusion that it’s because an orthodox God. It could be unorthodox, how I see it, or not at all, in which I think Xeno sees it. 

Does the orthodox God want us to believe we can come to the conclusion with objectively seeing him or not? 

I agree in that materialism, egotism, and hedonism, do not necessarily mean we have to be negative towards other people. Wrongly applied they can, and it is for us to be mindful of the difference and learn about the two. Likewise there are people who enjoy shooting others down because they haven't learned how negativity works within themselves. I think its wrong to live by other peoples expectations or societal ideals because of that. Do what we want, be happy, enjoy it to its maximum, and try to get others doing the same. It is for this reason (and I might attract opposition for saying it) that I think currently the most moral country on the planet is the USA. 

The USA isn't perfect because it doesnt mould or train people to deal with their own negativity. But by giving people as much freedom as possible they are free to enjoy material things, to enjoy what is special about themselves, and to seek out and enjoy whatever brings them pleasure in life. I think the Founding Fathers were very wise and it comes as no surprise to me to find the USA is the leading nation on the planet because of it. It used to be Britain but the `progressive politics` throughout the 20th century has projected ideals onto the population where denial is good, indulgence is wrong. While we are still more moral than most countries we have declined because of it. Individualism is far superior to collectivism.

Whether we believe the universe has come from a God, or non-theistic creative force, it seems to be working quite well for the Americans. All I see when people criticise materialism, egotism, and hedonism, is people trying to promote ideals of self-denial because they themselves are lacking things in life. There is the demonization of other people from them too who enjoy the materialism, the egotism, and the hedonism. Its selfish behaviour where they want to lower everyone else down to their level. Its black and white thinking at its worst. For me when I reflect over the way reality is then I find myself asking what would be the point of living a life of denial rather than indulgence? All that does is lead to unsatisfied people that are miserable in life and bitter towards others because of it.

The way I like to frame things is a super advanced civilization has created the universe. That we have been created inside it to enjoy it. And that what is actually immoral is not playing out our part in the game by enjoying the experience to the maximum. Worse, I think there is a hidden structure buried in reality that confirms back to us how we are. So if we live by denial we attract a lack of things which bring us pleasure back. If we are materialistic, egotistical, and hedonistic, we get back a wealth of material possessions, get to realise we are truly special in life, and get lots of pleasures come our way to enjoy. It has to be done responsibly as in not being negative towards others or we attract back consequences for that too. But essentially reality is about individualism and pleasure.

I do not know if that structure is the result of quantum non-locality, and at this point in history we dont have the technology to investigate most quantum behaviour at the macroscopic level anyway. But from experiences alone I think it is there shaping our lives for us as we go along. Its like a mirror image reflecting back how we are to ourselves with the experiences it sends our way. I also think many other views in society are completely the wrong way around too. Its like people dont take into account the political nature of human beings acting to maximise their pleasure at others expense when it comes to where ideals come from.#

I think you know what I`m trying to say - I`m poor so rich people are bad. I`m ugly so attractive people are monsters. I`m unsuccessful so the successful must be exploitative of others. Once we stop listening to the negativity, once we see through how we are told we should be, we can align ourselves with what the super advanced civilization actually intended for us. And that is the highest morality.

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