Possible Explanation for ESP

[XenoFish]

First thing I want to make clear, this is just an idea. This isn't me saying "Yes psychic abilities are real." This is me expressing an idea of how esp might work. Do not take this a fact or the truth. I would like to discuss this in a causal manner. 

With that out of the way let us get to the mean and potatoes of this thread shall we.

We know that due to the electrical activity within our bodies that we generate a subtle electromagnetic field. We also know that people may very well be able to detect the earth's magnetic field. Now just for a moment, what if we can transfer information between one another at short distances, maybe through touch. Not "You can hear my thoughts" type of stuff but an intention laden feeling. A kind of knowing that affects another person on a subconscious level. Distance would be an issue as the further the distance the more the information would degrade. Also in the case of "energy healing" the touch would be the shortest connection. The information sent form Person A to Person B to heal. Wouldn't actually "heal" them, it may perhaps send a signal to their CNS with instructions to heal the affected area. If this were true you'd still have to an issue with the placebo effect. Then again the placebo effect might allow for the receptivity of the information sent.

Again this is just an idea. Something to think on. 

[papageorge1]

I think one of the baffling things about ESP is how little physical distance means between subjects and receivers. This suggests that we are dealing with things not much affected by physical distance. In fact it suggests involvement then of things that are not of the known physical realm at all. I'll go full monty and suggest the subjects may not even possess a physical body.

Edited April 21, 2020 by papageorge1

[Piney]

8 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

 We also know that people may very well be able to detect the earth's magnetic field.

There's certainly a little compass there.

https://anthropology.net/2006/11/21/the-tiny-magnetite-compass-in-the-human-nose/

It's a good Idea but when it comes to real Reiki as practiced by my sister,  it's not actually for healing but to eliminate pain so I was always certain the power of suggestion plays a big part.

I actually considered the "ESP" between my son. my grandson and myself just processing thoughts the same way. 

 

[+Desertrat56]

What you describe in healing sent from person A to person B by touch is how I was taught Reiki works, it is the person receiving that does the healing if it happens, not the person sending. Maybe it is the placebo effect, maybe it is just a person receiving "permission" to change their mind about their condition, depending on the type of ailment they are wanting "healed".  Usually people do not get reiki treatments for something they can get taken care of from a doctor. 

I have played games with my children involving the electromagnetic fields we have using wire "dowsing rods" and showing them how the rods will open the closer you get to a person who is standing still.  It is not magic. 

[XenoFish]

1 minute ago, Piney said:

There's certainly a little compass there.

https://anthropology.net/2006/11/21/the-tiny-magnetite-compass-in-the-human-nose/

It's a good Idea but when it comes to real Reiki as practiced by my sister,  it's not actually for healing but to eliminate pain so I was always certain the power of suggestion plays a big part.

I actually considered the "ESP" between my son. my grandson and myself just processing thoughts the same way. 

 

I didn't mean healing to come off as it would. It was mostly used as a way of conveying a potential transfer of information from one person to another. I do wonder if people were to sync their brain waves would there be an effect. 

[XenoFish]

2 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

What you describe in healing sent from person A to person B by touch is how I was taught Reiki works, it is the person receiving that does the healing if it happens, not the person sending. Maybe it is the placebo effect, maybe it is just a person receiving "permission" to change their mind about their condition, depending on the type of ailment they are wanting "healed".  Usually people do not get reiki treatments for something they can get taken care of from a doctor. 

I have played games with my children involving the electromagnetic fields we have using wire "dowsing rods" and showing them how the rods will open the closer you get to a person who is standing still.  It is not magic. 

Like I mentioned in my opening statement, all of this is just for thought. This is basically something I'm pulling for the archives of my mind (around 2010). 

[+Desertrat56]

Just now, XenoFish said:

Like I mentioned in my opening statement, all of this is just for thought. This is basically something I'm pulling for the archives of my mind (around 2010). 

It is something I have thought about for a long time. 

[XenoFish]

Just now, Desertrat56 said:

It is something I have thought about for a long time. 

Around 2003 to 2010 I was heavily into energy work. And I began to think about the how and why it might work. The OP is basically that. I also figured that perhaps we can not consciously use "Psychic abilities". That's why things like magick work. They bypass the conscious filter. It was an idea I had at that time. 

[+Desertrat56]

2 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Around 2003 to 2010 I was heavily into energy work. And I began to think about the how and why it might work. The OP is basically that. I also figured that perhaps we can not consciously use "Psychic abilities". That's why things like magick work. They bypass the conscious filter. It was an idea I had at that time. 

I have thought along the same line, it has to be something you don't think about, but something you know and/or expect without deciding how it will work.  When you have to have a way of why and how it works you are thinking too much about it and there are variables we ignore or are unaware of, so when it does work, we can pretend it's magic.

[XenoFish]

Just now, Desertrat56 said:

I have thought along the same line, it has to be something you don't think about, but something you know and/or expect without deciding how it will work.  When you have to have a way of why and how it works you are thinking too much about it and there are variables we ignore or are unaware of, so when it does work, we can pretend it's magic.

Magick would be using spell, rituals, sigils, even prayer to emotionally empower an intention so that it slips passed the consciousness and takes root in the subconscious. Then again who's to say that it isn't just a perspective shift. 

[Piney]

32 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

I didn't mean healing to come off as it would. It was mostly used as a way of conveying a potential transfer of information from one person to another. I do wonder if people were to sync their brain waves would there be an effect. 

I somethings thought the boys and I were "in sync" too.

35 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

I have played games with my children involving the electromagnetic fields we have using wire "dowsing rods" and showing them how the rods will open the closer you get to a person who is standing still.  It is not magic. 

Even some of the most staunch skeptics think there is something to dowsing.  I worked with a archaeologist/ geologist who could find anything in the natural resources department without trying. 

[Hankenhunter]

I've always been able to find North. Even blind folded. I don't know if I was born with it, or as a result of many decades in the woods. I feels like a slight pull. I lost it for a while after a head injury, but it came back. It was very confusing not having it.  Kind of like a migrating bird that doesn't know which way to go. I'm also an empath who agrees that proximity is a huge factor. Hospitals are anathema to me. I have to be in pretty bad shape to agree to go to the hospital. It basicly turned me into a night owl. Less people around to distract me with their overwhelming fear and ailment pain. Covid-19 is not kind to empaths. The sheer amount of fear revolving around folks right now can be extremely daunting to say the least. Good thread, Zeno.

[+Desertrat56]

38 minutes ago, Hankenhunter said:

I've always been able to find North. Even blind folded. I don't know if I was born with it, or as a result of many decades in the woods. I feels like a slight pull. I lost it for a while after a head injury, but it came back. It was very confusing not having it.  Kind of like a migrating bird that doesn't know which way to go. I'm also an empath who agrees that proximity is a huge factor. Hospitals are anathema to me. I have to be in pretty bad shape to agree to go to the hospital. It basicly turned me into a night owl. Less people around to distract me with their overwhelming fear and ailment pain. Covid-19 is not kind to empaths. The sheer amount of fear revolving around folks right now can be extremely daunting to say the least. Good thread, Zeno.

My daughter has that ability.  I don't.  When she was a kid we would go to a new city and I would have to ask her "Which way is North."  She was never wrong and i used her as my navigator. 

[Hankenhunter]

1 minute ago, Desertrat56 said:

My daughter has that ability.  I don't.  When she was a kid we would go to a new city and I would have to ask her "Which way is North."  She was never wrong and i used her as my navigator. 

My dad would always ask me when we were hunting. He never seemed to tire of it. In all my years in the woods, I've never been close to being lost. It's a comforting feeling, let me tell you. I do use a gps, but only to mark spots, or making short cuts. My kids don't have the ability. I'm also very glad they didnt inherit my empathy "gift". It's way more a curse than a gift to me. The only benefit I've found to bring an empath is knowing when people have bad intentions towards me. The rest I would gladly do without. It only seems to work with negativity. Pain, bad thoughts, suspicion,confusion, fear etc. So when people say I have a gift that I should use to help others, I ask them who would help me after I go insane. Some things should not be played with, the darker emotions being one of them.

[Hankenhunter]

30 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

My daughter has that ability.  I don't.  When she was a kid we would go to a new city and I would have to ask her "Which way is North."  She was never wrong and i used her as my navigator. 

Your daughter is a lucky girl. Don't be surprised when she turns out to be very independent, and confident. Not to mention a great dad who encourages her to use her talent. My dad was the one who would get me to wear a blind fold, spin me around, then ask. I was one of his favorite party tricks. He even won a few bets off of me. I miss that old man so much still. Cant wait to see him again. At 60, I don't have to much longer to wait. 

[+Desertrat56]

12 hours ago, Hankenhunter said:

Your daughter is a lucky girl. Don't be surprised when she turns out to be very independent, and confident. Not to mention a great dad who encourages her to use her talent. My dad was the one who would get me to wear a blind fold, spin me around, then ask. I was one of his favorite party tricks. He even won a few bets off of me. I miss that old man so much still. Cant wait to see him again. At 60, I don't have to much longer to wait. 

You are younger than I am, are you ill?  And you are right, both my daughters are independent and confident. 

[Hankenhunter]

8 hours ago, Desertrat56 said:

You are younger than I am, are you ill?  And you are right, both my daughters are independent and confident. 

Well, I am half Norwegian and inherited a wierd gene that makes me immune to most painkillers including all the sedatives for intubation. That and I'm 60 years old. The chances of getting off a ventalator at my age are slim. I know I will probably catch it eventually before a vaccine can be discovered, so I have a order that I refuse to be intubated. I'll either survive on my own or pass on. I dont want to use up resources that can be better used on someone younger with kids or more productive. I want to go out on my terms, not some viruses. The thought of laying there, day after day with a tube down my throat, waiting to die, gives me the heebies real bad. So there you have it.

[+Desertrat56]

2 minutes ago, Hankenhunter said:

Well, I am half Norwegian and inherited a wierd gene that makes me immune to most painkillers including all the sedatives for intubation. That and I'm 60 years old. The chances of getting off a ventalator at my age are slim. I know I will probably catch it eventually before a vaccine can be discovered, so I have a order that I refuse to be intubated. I'll either survive on my own or pass on. I dont want to use up resources that can be better used on someone younger with kids or more productive. I want to go out on my terms, not some viruses. The thought of laying there, day after day with a tube down my throat, waiting to die, gives me the heebies real bad. So there you have it.

Oh, I understand.  I feel the same way.  I have a weird gene that makes any pain killer double strength so I would probably be overdosed with the first dose and out of it or dead, but I don't plan on getting the virus and I am doing my best to keep my immune system strong in case I do get it. 

[XenoFish]

Here's something I found interesting.

https://www.businessinsider.com/what-is-mirror-touch-synaesthesia-2018-6

This is just another potential explanation for empathic traits. Making them less psychic and more psychological. 

[Hankenhunter]

4 hours ago, XenoFish said:

Here's something I found interesting.

https://www.businessinsider.com/what-is-mirror-touch-synaesthesia-2018-6

This is just another potential explanation for empathic traits. Making them less psychic and more psychological. 

Interesting study. Their's is a case for sight to touch empathy. Many others, me included don't have to see. I was walking in town with my wife and the weirdest flash headache nailed me. Hurt like hell. My wife said that its not real and directs my attention behind me where a gentleman had walked out of a store with a big bandage on his head. It turned out the guy had gotten chucked off a horse and banged his head and also got stitches. Thankfully my wife knows, and she helps a lot. It can really take you by surprise if your guards arent up. I'm one of the few guys that knows what childbirth feels like. It ain't pretty.

Edited April 23, 2020 by Hankenhunter

[Hankenhunter]

2 minutes ago, Hankenhunter said:

Dammit. Double post.

 

Edited April 23, 2020 by Hankenhunter

[+Desertrat56]

12 hours ago, XenoFish said:

Here's something I found interesting.

https://www.businessinsider.com/what-is-mirror-touch-synaesthesia-2018-6

This is just another potential explanation for empathic traits. Making them less psychic and more psychological. 

That's interesting.  I wonder how many people with this kind of issue grew up in a chaotic, sometimes dangerous, household.  Some have to know how the "authority" is feeling in order to know when to hide or cower.  Which makes them excessively aware of others behavior and emotions.  Though the mirror touch synaesthesia seems to be more of a disability based on not being able to differentiate between self and others.  Not the same as empathy in my opinion, more of a filter issue or self identity issue.

[XenoFish]

Just now, Desertrat56 said:

That's interesting.  I wonder how many people with this kind of issue grew up in a chaotic, sometimes dangerous, household.  Some have to know how the "authority" is feeling in order to know when to hide or cower.  Which makes them excessively aware of others behavior and emotions.  Though the mirror touch synaesthesia seems to be more of a disability based on not being able to differentiate between self and others.  Not the same as empathy in my opinion, more of a filter issue or self identity issue.

They way "empathy" is described by those claiming it's a psychic ability pretty much match up to it. Real empathy is the result of mirror neurons. The synesthesia in this case creates a psychosomatic effect. 

[XenoFish]

I'm also wondering if some level of sensory overload plays a part in some supposed abilities.

[+Desertrat56]

15 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

They way "empathy" is described by those claiming it's a psychic ability pretty much match up to it. Real empathy is the result of mirror neurons. The synesthesia in this case creates a psychosomatic effect. 

Yes, I think anyone claiming they have any kind of "psychic" ability is either wanting attention or needing to be special.  It has nothing to do with what empathy really is.  The definition of a psychopath includes the inability to feel empathy for others, so in reality it is expected that empathy is a human trait that all of us have of varying degrees.  An overly empathic person cannot function normally in groups any more than someone who has no empathy.  There are always spectrums and everyone falls in to some range of the spectrum, the extremes being non-functional.