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and then

General Flynn was set up

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DieChecker
14 minutes ago, hacktorp said:

Flynn goes free...now the fun begins:

Appeals Court Orders Flynn Judge To Dismiss Case

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/appeals-court-orders-flynn-judge-dismiss-case

People who criticize this need to look at if it was one if their own favored politicians in this situation, and if they would then support such a legal opinion.

Much like when Democrats used the Nuclear Option in the Senate, allowing Republicans to use it going forward. Using drastic tactics needs to be evaluated for future abuse before precedent is set.

Too many people in government who are swayed too easily.

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Gromdor
2 hours ago, DieChecker said:

People who criticize this need to look at if it was one if their own favored politicians in this situation, and if they would then support such a legal opinion.

Much like when Democrats used the Nuclear Option in the Senate, allowing Republicans to use it going forward. Using drastic tactics needs to be evaluated for future abuse before precedent is set.

Too many people in government who are swayed too easily.

Imagine it was Hillary Clinton, she was found guilty, and Biden orders the Justice Department to drop the case before sentencing......  Scary, isn't it?

We just set the precedent.

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hacktorp
21 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

Imagine it was Hillary Clinton, she was found guilty, and Biden orders the Justice Department to drop the case before sentencing......  Scary, isn't it?

We just set the precedent.

You've just set the precedent for most ridiculous comparison imaginable.

I don't think anyone will top that.

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Hammerclaw
32 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

Imagine it was Hillary Clinton, she was found guilty, and Biden orders the Justice Department to drop the case before sentencing......  Scary, isn't it?

We just set the precedent.

Isn't that what Obama did for her?:whistle:Told'em to drop the investigation?

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and then
On 6/22/2020 at 12:45 AM, RavenHawk said:

He’s a bulldog on committees, but he doesn’t have what it takes to be a President these days.

If Trump gets re-elected, I sincerely hope that he gets the chance to make a Supreme Court Justice out of Cruz.  He deserves it and he'd make an EXCELLENT addition to the court.  I'd like to see him made Chief Justice at some point.

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and then
On 5/20/2020 at 3:28 PM, OrangeOaf said:

Once again you show a disconnect from reality. Trump is incapable of completing a sentence, let alone a thought without rambling on like grampa simpson 

Yet, he beat HRC, the Democrat Plantation bosses, the 5th column media shills and an Impeachment rap all in his first 3 years.  What does that say about his enemies, Sport?  :w00t:

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and then
On 6/15/2020 at 4:52 PM, Tatetopa said:

Here is a shocker from some of us liberals, we don't give a fig if former and current administration officials are indicted

Excellent!  Unless Barr and Durham are just slow rolling everyone, you should have a chance to show how pleased you are when the indictments are announced.  As we move into the summer, however, I begin to have less and less faith that anyone is going to be held accountable.  In fact, if Trump isn't re-elected, I KNOW none of the investigations will yield anything because every one of them will be tossed as soon as a Dem takes office.  IF that becomes the case then America will be fractured in a way that cannot be healed by rebuilding faith.  So, while those who cheer for the blue team are howling with laughter, their future and the future of their children will be ended.  They'll just be too arrogant to see or admit it.  

IF indictments ARE handed down at the end of summer then of course all we'll hear is that it's all political.  IF Barr and Durham are men of integrity then those howls coming from the Left will become screams because they won't be indicted unless Barr believes he has a solid case.  If they are indicted and Trump loses then Democrats will have to show their true colors if they want to sweep it under a rug.  If that happens, I predict that it's going to become REALLY difficult to be a Federal Law Enforcement officer of any description.  They will become hated and even targeted before we see the end of the lawlessness that will be growing.  It's a cancer and once it metastasizes, no one is going to be safe.

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CrimsonKing
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, DieChecker said:

People who criticize this need to look at if it was one if their own favored politicians in this situation

You gotta be BS'ing around...

Politics has become very cult like,and people just "close the blinds" in their minds when ANYTHING goes against the beloved party...Right and wrong or hell being complete and utter hypocrites means nothing to them.

Remember the colorful language Trump used during his co-writing of the 94 Crime Bill that is 100% responsible for a quarter century of our current mess of law enforcement?

Maybe everyone remembers Donny Trump giving the eulogy at Robert Byrds funeral and all the loving admiration he professed for the former klansman,even saying he embodied the very spirit of the Democrat party?

Anyone else remember those recorded gems from Donny?

Yeah Don says stupid s***,but my god,Biden is a treasure trove of blatant outright scumbag comments all the while sitting in a position of power and leadership since the early 70's!

Both parties need to be abolished...

Edited by CrimsonKing
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Tatetopa
2 hours ago, and then said:

Excellent!  Unless Barr and Durham are just slow rolling everyone, you should have a chance to show how pleased you are when the indictments are announced. 

Maybe I will, or maybe only be able to half celebrate.  I am for finding the corruption, just not stopping at half of it.  Republican and Democratic poop both stink.

Durham still seems like a pretty stand up guy.  I will pay attention to what he says.

Barr, not so much any more.  Firing the prosecutor who was investigation Epstein and Guilani  seems too much like a personal favor cover up.  Bad timing.

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hacktorp
27 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

Firing the prosecutor who was investigation Epstein and Guilani  seems too much like a personal favor cover up.  Bad timing.

Berman was not progressing on ANYTHING, and, in fact, was blocking access to an entire raft of evidence concerning HRC...including the Weiner laptop.

The only thing "bad" about the timing of Berman's firing, is that it has taken this long to get it done.

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Gromdor
9 minutes ago, hacktorp said:

Berman was not progressing on ANYTHING, and, in fact, was blocking access to an entire raft of evidence concerning HRC...including the Weiner laptop.

The only thing "bad" about the timing of Berman's firing, is that it has taken this long to get it done.

We are talking about that life-long Republican guy that donated to Trump's campaign and green-lit by Trump to take the job after Trump fired Preet Bharara, right?

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and then
1 hour ago, Tatetopa said:

, just not stopping at half of it. 

No problem.  If you have examples of Republicans weaponizing CIA, FBI and the rest of the DoJ in an attempt to defeat a political opponent THEN to remove him from office after he is duly elected, by all means, lets get the indictments going.  America may not get justice from this administration or any other administration but by damn, we at least need to see the evidence in public and let people decide where they stand.  

Just out today:

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/strzok-comey-obama-biden-flynn-case

The irony here is too rich to miss.  Strzok pens some notes during a meeting and they finally come to the surface.  Looks like Biden AND O Barry were in on trying to take Flynn down.  You may never admit it but it doesn't matter at all.  That administration is the dirtiest in my lifetime and they are going to have their dirty secrets aired.  If they were in on these meetings then they BOTH are guilty of trying to manage a coup.  The fact that half the nation will give them a pass doesn't mean a damn thing to the other half of us.  The lines are firming up.

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hacktorp
59 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

We are talking about that life-long Republican guy that donated to Trump's campaign and green-lit by Trump to take the job after Trump fired Preet Bharara, right?

Yes...same guy.  It sounds like you might still be under the impression that "party matters" to the DC swamp.  How quaint.

Would you be shocked to learn the Clintons and the Bushes have been partners in crime for many decades?  Probably...

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and then
1 hour ago, Tatetopa said:

Durham still seems like a pretty stand up guy.  I will pay attention to what he says.

I'm reasonably sure that's why Barr chose Durham.  Unlike the Mueller crusade with an entire stable of HRC donors, Barr knew that if crimes were found, it would be hard enough to get convictions even with a straight shooter who had some bipartisan respect.  I'd never heard of Durham before but it sounds like he may be one of the last prosecutors that both sides tended to trust.  If indictments are handed down, politics won't defeat evidence.

Granted, if trials are held in DC a conviction of a Democrat would be damned near impossible if there was video of one pulling the trigger but at least we'll get to see the evidence that is presented, even if a jury nullifies and lets the perp go.

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Tatetopa
1 hour ago, hacktorp said:

The only thing "bad" about the timing of Berman's firing, is that it has taken this long to get it done.

That explains it.

Barr says Berman is stepping down

Berman says he is not

Barr says Trump just fired you

Trump says I don't know anything about it

Barr says Yes you did.

That is so nice and above board and beyond suspicion.  It really shows an administration in-sync and working like clockwork.

But you are saying parties don't mean anything in Trumps DC swamp, only contributors?  

 

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and then
2 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

That is so nice and above board and beyond suspicion.  It really shows an administration in-sync and working like clockwork.

Is there ANY example of an action taken under Trump's watch that you wouldn't find suspect?  Just a rhetorical question.  I'm more interested in how the Democrats are going to try to derail any legal action that is taken against Obama DoJ, FBI and CIA officials.  I mean, other than the usual media hysteria about Trump destroying the rule of law or some such nonsense.  No matter how much airtime is put in with defense of Clapper, Comey, Brennan, Strzok and company, the indictments will have actual evidence... documentation, texts, phone transcripts and so on.  They can deny and stonewall or plead the 5th but they can't stop the evidence being publicly presented.

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Tatetopa
1 minute ago, and then said:

Granted, if trials are held in DC a conviction of a Democrat would be damned near impossible if there was video of one pulling the trigger but at least we'll get to see the evidence that is presented, even if a jury nullifies and lets the perp go.

Well I heard a guy say he could shoot somebody on 5th avenue and not lose any votes, so you may be right.  If it led to evidence and a trial with public coverage that would be interesting.

Of course President Trump calling treason doers not fit the narrow definition the US uses for treason.

The evidence issue might get interesting.  

FBI folks and others may claim just cause to investigate Trump campaign based on evidence of Trump officials contacts with Russians who were being monitored as known spies and inimical to US interests.  

Trump and all of his officials may be totally innocent, but the link might be sufficient for just cause and dismissal of charges.

Ye

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Tatetopa
4 minutes ago, and then said:

Is there ANY example of an action taken under Trump's watch that you wouldn't find suspect? 

Yes indeed.  THANK YOU PRESIDENT TRUMP FOR NOT GETTING US INVOLVED IN ANOTHER WAR!

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DieChecker
Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Gromdor said:

Imagine it was Hillary Clinton, she was found guilty, and Biden orders the Justice Department to drop the case before sentencing......  Scary, isn't it?

We just set the precedent.

Depends...

Democrats argued strongly she didn't do anything wrong. Thus her being guilty, to them, would be a miscarriage of justice.

Youd rather Hillary was found guilty for political reasons and it not be challenged?

What if it was discovered that someone at FBI said... dont worry, ill put a fix on it... And then she was found guilty with that person being basically in charge. You'd not challege that?

Edited by DieChecker

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hacktorp
51 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

But you are saying parties don't mean anything in Trumps DC swamp, only contributors?

Are you really this confused...or are you deliberately trying to obfuscate the facts?

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Tatetopa
1 hour ago, hacktorp said:

Are you really this confused...or are you deliberately trying to obfuscate the facts?

Well President Trump approved this guy, now he has been  in charge of investigating Epstein and Guiliani  plus maybe some other Trump business dealings.

You say Berman was not doing anything, and I don't know where you got that information or your source is.   But I believe you read it somewhere. 

Just for argument's sake, lets say Berman was not dishing up a lot of  dirt on Epstein, .not taking an investigation into Rudy seriously and not touching any investigation that tied to Trump enterprises.  In other words, he was  not doing anything last week, didn't plan on doing anything next week..

Really, a guy not doing anything seems to be the least of the President's worries right about now after a disappointing rally  and other active hassles.  More ammo for the Lincoln Group. Hello George Conway.  "Why the panic weekend firing of a persecutor?  Is he getting too close?"  Wanna bet we see that as in a week or so?

Maybe Trump fired him to keep him from investigating his son.  That would be rather ironic.

 

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Tatetopa

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/20/nyregion/trump-geoffrey-berman-fired-sdny.html

Might be hard for some to believe the NY Times, but they have another angle on Berman:

The swirl of events on Saturday, which changed by the hour, was the culmination of longstanding tensions between the White House and Mr. Berman’s office, which in the past three years has brought a series of highly sensitive cases that have troubled and angered Mr. Trump and others in his inner circle.

First, there was the arrest and prosecution in 2018 of Michael D. Cohen, Mr. Trump’s longtime legal fixer. Then, there was the indictment last year of a state-owned bank in Turkey with political connections that had drawn the president’s attention. More recently, Mr. Berman began an inquiry into Rudolph W. Giuliani, Mr. Trump’s personal lawyer and one of his most ardent supporters.

Speaking briefly to reporters outside the White House before heading to a campaign rally in Tulsa, Okla., Mr. Trump tried to distance himself from the firing. He insisted he was “not involved” in the decision to remove Mr. Berman despite what Mr. Barr said in his letter.

Mr. Clayton had recently signaled to his friends and the president that he wanted to return to home in New York City and was interested in Mr. Berman’s job, according to people familiar with the matter. Mr. Barr had said New Jersey’s top federal prosecutor, Craig Carpenito, would hold the seat until the Senate could confirm Mr. Clayton.

By Saturday afternoon, the plan began to unravel, as the president and his senior aides scrambled to secure support for Mr. Clayton’s confirmation in the Senate, according to people familiar with the events.

The refusal of Republicans to defend Mr. Trump was palpable, and some people close to the president expressed concern that lawmakers in his own party would feel compelled to distance themselves from Mr. Trump’s decision.

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ChrLzs
Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

...First, there was the arrest and prosecution in 2018 of Michael D. Cohen, Mr. Trump’s longtime legal fixer. Then, there was the indictment last year of a state-owned bank in Turkey with political connections that had drawn the president’s attention. More recently, Mr. Berman began an inquiry into Rudolph W. Giuliani, Mr. Trump’s personal lawyer and one of his most ardent supporters.

Speaking briefly to reporters outside the White House before heading to a campaign rally in Tulsa, Okla., Mr. Trump tried to distance himself from the firing. He insisted he was “not involved” in the decision to remove Mr. Berman despite what Mr. Barr said in his letter.

...The refusal of Republicans to defend Mr. Trump was palpable, and some people close to the president expressed concern that lawmakers in his own party would feel compelled to distance themselves from Mr. Trump’s decision.

Gee whillikers. If I had a brain, I'd be tempted to think that it is Trump and his bed-wettepartners that are the crooks, rather than the entire legal system...  But surely if he keeps sacking people, he can eventually find a good shyster...

Edited by ChrLzs
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hacktorp
Posted (edited)
45 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

Well President Trump approved this guy, now he has been  in charge of investigating Epstein and Guiliani  plus maybe some other Trump business dealings.

You say Berman was not doing anything, and I don't know where you got that information or your source is.   But I believe you read it somewhere. 

Just for argument's sake, lets say Berman was not dishing up a lot of  dirt on Epstein, .not taking an investigation into Rudy seriously and not touching any investigation that tied to Trump enterprises.  In other words, he was  not doing anything last week, didn't plan on doing anything next week..

Really, a guy not doing anything seems to be the least of the President's worries right about now after a disappointing rally  and other active hassles.  More ammo for the Lincoln Group. Hello George Conway.  "Why the panic weekend firing of a persecutor?  Is he getting too close?"  Wanna bet we see that as in a week or so?

Maybe Trump fired him to keep him from investigating his son.  That would be rather ironic.

 

To be honest, I don't think Trump expected much out of Berman anyway...his role was "acting" US Attorney; a temporary position.  Trump was always going to fire him and replace him with someone else when the time was right.  Still, Trump faces a battle getting Clayton confirmed, because everyone knows that Clayton (or whoever Trump selects) will be charged with helping to pursue some big-name offenders.  Like I said...SDNY is sitting on a massive pile of explosive, damning information.  Maybe it will now finally see the light of day.

Lincoln Group and George Conway aren't even on the radar...they are gnats.

 

Edited by hacktorp

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RavenHawk
On 6/23/2020 at 12:47 PM, Tatetopa said:

Two weeks and some research.  I am still sick of both parties, but we have slightly different triggers.

You should do more than listen to the MSM.  That’s not real research.

 

I am still sick of both parties, but we have slightly different triggers.

If you are sick of these parties, then Trump is the one to clean it up.  Do you think Biden is going to do anything?  Biden is as corrupt as the parties.  Slightly?  I go off on real triggers not off of any little old thing that fits the narrative.

 

It takes resolution, intelligence, and courage. 

Of course and Trump has those.  But if that’s all you have then you get taken advantage of.  You need something else to protect those values.

 

It doesn't take mean. 

It absolutely does take mean and a lot of it.  As mentioned above, if you are not mean, you will be taken advantage of.  Every President since Bush 41 has been limp-wristed.  In some cases, that was as intended.  Schumer warns Trump that Intel officials “have six ways from Sunday at getting back at you”.  And they have been trying but Trump has been meaner and more stubborn than the bureaucracy.  And you still don’t understand that it was not wise for Trump to believe everything the intel services were telling him?  It has probably come a long way since the early days.  That’s what I think Syria and Iran were, testing the intel service.  He gave them ISIS so that he could observe their MO.

 

5th grade kids can be mean.   Hillary is mean.  

True but in those cases, they are just viciously mean.  A President needs to be mean in a tough way, stand your ground.  Take no bull!  Give as good as you take.  That’s how you change the status quo in Washington.  Do you want the bureaucracy that existed before Trump became President?  It was weaponized against the people.

 

I was looking for  a determined general with a plan to protect our borders yet still enhance our country. 

And we finally have one in Trump.  You really don’t think Trump is determined?  Taking on the Left with one fake scandal after another and Trump is still standing is not determined?

 

Growing up in Texas, I had a lot of childhood friends of Mexican extraction. 

Were they here legally or illegally?  It doesn’t matter where they come from, do they have good character?  If they are here illegally then they do not have good character.  Character matters.

 

There was no need to vilify people to protect our border. 

If they are already villains, then calling them what they are is appropriate.

 

There is no need to still have kids in chain-link cages. 

That sounds like adherence to talking points from the Left.  It was Obama that started that.  But what else can you do with such children?  BTW, they are not cages.  Where do you put them so that they can be safe?  Their parents need to be identified first.  Not all adults that crossed with a child is its parent.  It takes time to make sense out of the chaos.  But do you want to return a child to a parent that dragged the child over 2000 miles of hostile terrain?  That is child abuse.  If the parent will do that to a child, they are not fit to be a parent.

 

 A high tech country on its game could have had them all at home, wherever it was they came from,. 

Really?  You think that kind of high tech exists?  Some countries probably don’t know who left and don’t care.  Again, if the parent sold their child to someone so that they could sneak across the border, would you want to return that child back into an abusive home?  The odds are good that the child will be sold again.

 

Donald Trump was not a general, he was a car salesman selling the latest model of True Hyperbole with big fins and a shiny paint job that never made it out of the lot.

He must have been a general of something.  You don’t build a multibillion-dollar empire if you’re not.  Besides, that TH model is an awesome muscle car; it is righteous.  I heard that Washington was a good salesman too. He was able to talk thousands of men into becoming traitors.  And something pretty special came of it.  Unlike what Obama had planned.  When Trump has completed his two terms with all of his achievements, he will have left this nation much better off than when he arrived.

 

It takes courage in convictions. 

Yes it does. I think the Left finally found a chink in Trump’s armor. He has been clearly affected by the riots.  It has troubled him and left him paralyzed.  He has tried to get the governors and mayors to do their duty. They haven’t.  I think Trump has worked it out now within himself and he is ready to move on.  We are going to see new convictions in the way he deals with the chaos.

 

Why would I believe that  a man is right if he does  not have the courage to believe himself? 

I don’t know where that came from.  Oh wait, MSM…  He wouldn’t be good at persuasion if he didn’t believe in himself.  Before you can sell someone else, you need to be able to sell yourself and that takes confidence and courage.

 

With the President it is all excuses and back-peddling.  He takes no responsibility for any action or statement..

More Leftist talking points.  He takes the media to task and they fall all over themselves to twist what he says.  I love what he did in Tulsa.  He stated that he was asking his staff to cut testing because the testing is just getting too good.  His staff were asked if the President had asked them to cut the testing and they said that Trump hadn’t asked.  Someone brought up the idea that maybe Trump was being sarcastic (about time)?  And then Trump did something beautiful.  When the press caught him between locations, they asked if he meant it when he said that he wanted the testing cut?  His answer was classic, he said that he meant it!  Trump continues to string the media along and shows that they have no common sense.  Then you take in their reporting.

 

All presidents are salesmen.  Most of them sell a vision of America, Donald Trump just sells himself.

In selling America, you have to sell yourself.  You need to have the President all in in believing in this nation.  Trump is.  Obama wasn’t.  He wanted to transform this nation into something else.  In an interview before he ran, I think Trump had said that he was fed up with the government and he worried about his children’s future.  But when you take on the roll of President, you take on the concern of all children’s futures.

 

You are sweet to be so faithful and believing  but President Trump is not like Lincoln. 

In many ways, he is like Lincoln.  Like Lincoln, he is dealing with a separatist group.  Then, it was based on the division between States and the Union.  Now, it is Socialism vs Republic.  The difference is that State/Union are two sides of the same coin.  Socialism is not a companion of Republic.  It is the Usurper.  Both Separatist groups view the President as a tyrant.  Both Presidents are concerned for the preservation of the Union.  Both have strong character and strong will.

 

He is fixated on himself not the good of America. 

And I suppose you have indisputable proof of that?  Or is that another talking point.  He ran because he was not fixated on himself.  He could find other easier avenues to amuse himself.  You don’t put yourself through all that Trump has gone through if he didn’t have the best interests of the country in focus.

 

President Trump was not looking for a team of rival experts,

Then you didn’t pay attention.  He interviewed people left and right.  He was trying to select the best from the Swamp so utilize.  He took a page out of Patton’s book.

 

he was looking for non-troublesome yes men.  He is weeding out anybody that looks too competent

You should know better in that Trump doesn’t do incompetent.  On the “Apprentice”, I don’t recall him rewarding incompetence??  A President has an expectation that the men under him are capable in making his wishes a reality.  This has nothing to do with “yes” men.  If you are on the Cabinet and the President asks you to do something, you can say “yes sir!” or you can resign.  It is not up to you to question him.  This is not the case where Trump is doing something immoral like sending people to the gas chambers.

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