Jump to content
Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -
Manwon Lender

Obamagate important or another diversion

Whats more important  

18 members have voted

  1. 1. What will influence the election most

    • Parties actions / inactions from the beginning of the Pandemic up until the Election
      8
    • Parties political diversions that are designed to hide their action / inactions up until the Election
      10


286 posts in this topic

Recommended Posts

Manwon Lender
19 minutes ago, ChrLzs said:

WTH?  So you just changed sides?  Did you or did you not say, earlier:

Yes, the Chinese were being somewhat cagey about it, and the WHO were slow to catch on (and had to initially work from the Chinese reports), but they began warning about the high likelihood of human transmission as early as mid January, making it very offficial by mid thru late January, as I posted.  And of course plenty of other health professionals were warning of the possibilities.

No, they were completely incompetent.  And funnily enough, earlier you claimed "we feel we've done quite well".  Yeah, congrats on over 80,000 dead.

And in the meantime, your administration, with all that access to the CDC etc, just sat back and blamed everyone else

That's pretty low, even for you....

But YES, you're totally right, the virus was already spreading by late Jan, which is why most countries with a clue were taking action.

And yes, the US has a unique set of characteristics that mean it, MORE THAN MOST, should have acted early, and not only introduced that dumbass travel ban on some Chinese flights, but also started testing and checking all incomings, as well as large scale testing of the populace, AND contact tracing on those who had already come in.

But nah that was all too hard for trump and his merry band of scum, who just twiddled their thumbs and sat on their hands.  Right through February..... 

Do you honestly not see why "we feel we've done quite well" just isn't quite cutting it?  I'm staggered.

The Who reported person to person spread in Wuhan China on 23 January 2020 and here is link: https://www.who.int/docs/default-source/coronaviruse/situation-reports/20200123-sitrep-3-2019-ncov.pdf?sfvrsn=d6d23643_8

Peace

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
and then
5 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

so we can get back to more important issues at hand ( Pandemic )

First, I just want to acknowledge that I respect your topic though I'm pretty sure we'll never agree but hopefully we can civilly agree to disagree :) 

Have you read any of the information his administration has made available as a plan for the nation to move forward?

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-opening-america-again-lockdown-coronavirus-guidelines-1498518

There are other sources to explain the phased reopening that he and his medical experts have agreed to in principle.  MOST importantly, he is leaving the decision totally at the state level and the governor's discretion.

According to the numbers I've most recently seen, most states have reached their peak and are on the backside of the curve.  There are a substantial number of Americans in all the states that want to go back to work and understand that this will require them to continue with recommended safety procedures.  As more begin to reopen we Will SEE spikes and possibly even small outbreaks and the states will need to adhere to the 3 phase plan to keep those numbers tamped down.

My point is that most of the states realize that the pandemic is a real problem but economic freefall will be worse.  The evidence that is coming to light from Barr, Durham and Jensen has been percolating for quite awhile already.  I'd remind you (civilly) that for the first 3 years of his presidency, nothing else even came close to getting in the way of government agencies while they were investigating Trump and his team.  Now that we are beginning to see factual information being declassified so the nation can make judgments about the predicate for those years of accusations without proof, I'm hoping that those who are willing to keep an open mind will begin to see just how badly our nation has been failed by the unprecedented level of corruption in the Obama administration. Have you seen the handwritten notes our FBI took leadership took as they decided how to best destroy a 3 Star who doesn't have a blemish on his service record?  They even threatened his son with the same ruin if he didn't plead out.  That is factual.  That is not in dispute.

Now that these facts are coming out, it grieves me to see people here who will still refuse to acknowledge what Obama's people did to this man and his family.  If he committed a "crime" it was his negligence in ensuring his FARA documentation was properly presented.  He WAS working as a representative of a foreign power - Turkey - and if that is grounds to destroy a person with his record then DC would be gutted if everyone else got nailed on the same charge.  But they aren't, are they?  Why?  Because Trump.  

I have no interest in relitigating Trump's decisions.  People can accept them or reject them but the record will show an unbiased person that he took steps sooner even than his own people advised him to.  Do you recall how Xi &Co raised a fuss about Trump mistreating them?  Closing air traffic while cases were ongoing in China was somehow a sin according to our media.  He was RAY-SUS and Xenophobic.  He was going to cause the wrath to descend on Asian Americans. 

IMO, the facts coming into the light of day are worthy of every American's attention because if our government gets away with this level of wholesale corrupt/politicized behavior then there is no coming back from that without a serious, potentially devastating "airing of differences"  One half of this nation, either half, is never going to be compelled to prostrate ourselves to the other half.  I believe that the 5th column has so thoroughly gutted their credibility that the hysteria we'll be seeing will just solidify more votes for Trump.  Remember that NO POLLING between now and November will show this.  Just remember how it felt on 11/6/16 when the NYT ticker began the night with HRC having over 90% confidence she was the next president.

Unless there is some kind of serious malfeasance/cheating in this election, I find it nearly impossible to believe that Biden can draw any youth vote or even much of the female vote.  I don't think we can survive another election where one side refuses to accept the verdict.  For that reason, I really hope the state governors in the battleground states refuse to make cheating easy with mail in ballots that have no way of being certified.  If that kind of variable is injected into this election then no winner is going to be acceptable and that bodes really poorly for our nation.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tatetopa
2 hours ago, Hammerclaw said:

Before Europe and China did. 

You know that some airlines were already cancelling flights as early as  Jan 23.  British Airways cancelled all flights on  1/30.   Delta, United, and American Airlines were talking about voluntarily cancelling flights  on Jan 31. 

The travel ban was a travel restriction, and sadly too porous apparently.  Roughly 40,000 Americans and approved travelers came in after the ban. 

But, there were 45 countries that imposed travel bans  Jan. 30- Feb.4.  In fact Italy beat us by hours.  Didn't help them a lot either.  We did beat South Korea whose ban was Feb. 4 but by being aggressive from the get-go, they came out spectacularly well.

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tatetopa
13 minutes ago, and then said:

refuse to make cheating easy with mail in ballots that have no way of being certified. 

Do you know how mail in ballots work?

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Manwon Lender
4 minutes ago, Horta said:

It's difficult to do that when politicians don't listen to scientists, and when you haven't got the necessary supplies. The fact that the US felt it needed to (ahem) "acquire/intercept" emergency shipments of medical equipment that were en route to Germany and Canada, seems to indicate preparedness wasn't great.

There is all talk of this being a "black swan" event that no one could have predicted. That's absolute nonsense of course, scientists have been telling the world to prepare for the certainty of a pandemic such as this for decades.

Absolutely nothing could be more true, and the President of the United States is still not listening to the Highest Level medical personnel in the Country ( CDC ) or his personal medical advisers, unless they acquis and agree with his personal ideas concern the situation. That's why the President sidelined Dr. Anthony Fauci, while he did not speak openly in the beginning, he did begin to speak against what the President was saying. Even in his testimony to Congress he keep nothing back and spoke honestly about what the true implications of reopening of America would be like, today President Trump commented that he didn't agree with those statements. LOL

I can respect DR. Fauci for being honest in the face of adversity, he realizes that he has to be able to live with himself, unlike the Doctors that are currently advising the President, Fauci will not selling himself in that manner any longer. Here s a link to DR. Fausis comments to Congress:  https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/12/dr-anthony-fauci-testifies-before-congress-on-coronavirus-heres-what-he-says.html

Peace

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Manwon Lender
2 hours ago, Hammerclaw said:

Before Europe and China did. 

I expected more from you but by not answering those simple questions you have proven that you have already made up mind and you will never except anything accept information that supports your beliefs. That's fine with me, but expect me to reply to anything else you say.

Peace

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
and then
1 minute ago, Tatetopa said:

Roughly 40,000 Americans and approved travelers came in after the ban.

Yes, this is true but you need also to acknowledge that we can't exactly refuse entry to Americans abroad.  I think reasonable people can agree that ALL governments were very hesitant to take actions that would spook their markets or damage their economies.  That's just how governments think.  Thank God this thing wasn't more catastrophic than it is.  I think we can safely predict that whatever the next pandemic is or where it originates, governments will try CYA first, no matter how clear the medical science is made.

That said, the evidence is overwhelming that the CCP lied, destroyed evidence and carried on a coverup for as long as they could.  Had they behaved as a decent global citizen this thing might still have spread but there was a reasonable chance it could have been stopped.  I get that those who wake up muttering "Orange Man BAD!" every day since 2016, will not give him any benefit of doubt, regardless of the facts in evidence.  In fact, the jackals seem to be at the gates with this one.  They not only are blaming his choices, they are pounding the drum that he, personally is responsible for every death in every state.  That is childish, of course but that's where they are these days.

9 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

We did beat South Korea whose ban was Feb. 4 but by being aggressive from the get-go, they came out spectacularly well.

I agree.  We should be studying their steps and using the success to help minimize the deaths yet to come from this scourge.  And if you are impressed with how Seoul handled this, imagine how this thing would look today if the CCP had tried even a little to restrict the flow of millions out of the zone where this all began?  

I have said for weeks that the ONE major fault I find in the Trump administration was their seeming inability to get testing and contact tracing into action sooner.  IMO, they STILL are screwing the pooch on this.  Here in Alabama, you either have to be working in healthcare or symptomatic to get a test.  As a part of the phased, sensible reopening plan, testing is so critical that not having it will be like swinging at a Wuhan bat in the dark.  Early tests had some problem with reliability but surely that has been handled.

23 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

The Who reported person to person spread in Wuhan China on 23 January 2020 and here is link: https://www.who.int/docs/default-source/coronaviruse/situation-reports/20200123-sitrep-3-2019-ncov.pdf?sfvrsn=d6d23643_8

Peace

And Trump closed off entry for most from China on 1/31/20.  So we're saying that 8 days were the difference between a catastrophe and smooth sailing?  I'll remind you that all nations were hesitant to blow up their economies.  And if 8 days really makes him culpable for all U.S. deaths then what about China, who had been dealing with this since mid November but only admitted H2H transmission on 1/23?  I get the politics, but when we're talking about an issue that could tear this country apart, I think a certain amount of humility and latitude should be shown toward all the world's leaders, ours included

That said, people will believe what they want to believe and I'll make a prediction that the harder the 5th column spins responsibility for this virus' toll in lives, the more support they'll drive his way.   I expect the same outcome for the hysteria we're about to see from them with regards to the corrupt dealings of the Obama administration.  Too many facts are coming for media reports to spin away.  America endured over 3 years of anonymous sources, overt accusations without proof, and finally a report that was the fruit of 2 years, 30+ million dollars and a dream team of all Democrat prosecutors and they still did not find criminal wrongdoing on his part or anyone in his administration for actions taken as members of that administration.

I'm curious about this and wanted to begin a thread on it but I suspect it wouldn't get beyond red team vs blue team posturing.  This question is for anyone who cares to discuss - IF Trump is re-elected, do any of you see moderation in our political sphere returning or are we broken for good?  Those here who support anyone but Trump, have you considered what the country looks like the day after he wins re-election?

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
and then
20 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

Do you know how mail in ballots work?

The explanation I've seen is that the Registrars in the states will mail ballots to every citizen who is registered to vote.  Are you aware of any kind of certification of ID for when those ballots come in to be counted?  I'd say that at a minimum we'd need some kind of biometric ID to ensure there is no cheating.  If a county mails out 400 K ballots and those rolls haven't been updated in years there's a really good chance for some corpses to be having their say.  I have no problem with mail in /absentee ballots for the elderly or those at high risk.  The rest, it's up to them whether voting is worth taking an hour to go to a polling place.

IMO, there is no justification for turning the security of this election on its head and causing even LESS trust in the process.  But if that's what the Ds want then they can deal with the potential denial of their victory - kind of like they've done to Trump for 3 years.  

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
and then
26 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

the President of the United States is still not listening to the Highest Level medical personnel in the Country ( CDC )

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/birx-said-there-is-nothing-from-the-cdc-that-i-can-trust-in-a-white-house-coronavirus-task-force-meeting/ar-BB13R4Wn

She's the number two most respected advisor.  Maybe CDC has some explaining to do about inflating the numbers of dead?  Several politicians are having disagreements with Fauci.  He is a well renowned scientist in this field but even he isn't perfect and it is only his opinion that reopening may be happening "too soon".  He's also a bureaucrat and is engaging in some CYA because he knows how the media are going to go all in to blame everyone on Trump's team for everything from small outbreaks to hangnails.

As the states reopen we will begin to see just how well Americans are able to discipline themselves for the greater good.  States will need to be responsible for their actions and anyone who is going to point at every death anywhere in the country and say - TRUMP has blood on his hands - I think they're going to find their audience is shrinking.  

Finally...reopening this economy will be just as risky in a month or a year as it is right now.  There is no vaccine and few therapeutics available.  Hiding at home only has one group's support and they are the ones who are willing to literally burn it all down to blame Trump.  Comes the fall and Red states are beginning to get back to normal while blue states are protesting their governors and Trump is going to roll in that election.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
and then
3 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

again far are way to complacent to do what it takes to find the truth.

When the information that is declassified clearly shows illegal actions were taken, they should have more trouble dismissing it than they did believing everything that the media spewed about Trump for 3 years.  There is a factual record and if it's made public then only partisans will deny it.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hammerclaw
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, ChrLzs said:

WTH?  So you just changed sides?  Did you or did you not say, earlier:

Yes, the Chinese were being somewhat cagey about it, and the WHO were slow to catch on (and had to initially work from the Chinese reports), but they began warning about the high likelihood of human transmission as early as mid January, making it very offficial by mid thru late January, as I posted.  And of course plenty of other health professionals were warning of the possibilities.

No, they were completely incompetent.  And funnily enough, earlier you claimed "we feel we've done quite well".  Yeah, congrats on over 80,000 dead.

And in the meantime, your administration, with all that access to the CDC etc, just sat back and blamed everyone else

That's pretty low, even for you....

But YES, you're totally right, the virus was already spreading by late Jan, which is why most countries with a clue were taking action.

And yes, the US has a unique set of characteristics that mean it, MORE THAN MOST, should have acted early, and not only introduced that dumbass travel ban on some Chinese flights, but also started testing and checking all incomings, as well as large scale testing of the populace, AND contact tracing on those who had already come in.

But nah that was all too hard for trump and his merry band of scum, who just twiddled their thumbs and sat on their hands.  Right through February..... 

Do you honestly not see why "we feel we've done quite well" just isn't quite cutting it?  I'm staggered.

It was spreading months before the official timeline. It's symptoms in the worse cases resemble those of flu. For most, the symptoms are mild, like a classic 24 hour virus. Flu is deadly and kills 80,000 plus a year here. Because of the similarity, the actual death count for the virus is probably much higher, since it wasn't heard of here until the end of last year. We probably had  tens of thousands of cases and hundreds of deaths from it by then. No one knew about it and no one was looking for it prior to China's belated announcement. Taiwan figured this out early, sounded a warning and were ignored by the WHO. Australia is taking China to the woodshed over this. All that beef they won't accept now, ship it here; you'll get a better price.

Edited by Hammerclaw
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hammerclaw
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Tatetopa said:

You know that some airlines were already cancelling flights as early as  Jan 23.  British Airways cancelled all flights on  1/30.   Delta, United, and American Airlines were talking about voluntarily cancelling flights  on Jan 31. 

The travel ban was a travel restriction, and sadly too porous apparently.  Roughly 40,000 Americans and approved travelers came in after the ban. 

But, there were 45 countries that imposed travel bans  Jan. 30- Feb.4.  In fact Italy beat us by hours.  Didn't help them a lot either.  We did beat South Korea whose ban was Feb. 4 but by being aggressive from the get-go, they came out spectacularly well.

Yeah, with China next door, it makes sense. If it had been the Vancouver Virus, instead, we might have been quicker on the draw, too.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/dems-media-change-tune-trump-attacks-coronavirus-china-travel-ban

Edited by Hammerclaw
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hammerclaw
1 hour ago, Manwon Lender said:

I expected more from you but by not answering those simple questions you have proven that you have already made up mind and you will never except anything accept information that supports your beliefs. That's fine with me, but expect me to reply to anything else you say.

Peace

On the contrary, I'm thinking outside the box on it while you cling religiously to the official China and their lapdog, WHO's official narrative. There's no need to reply; no one is listening.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Manwon Lender
1 minute ago, Hammerclaw said:

On the contrary, I'm thinking outside the box on it while you cling religiously to the official China and their lapdog, WHO's official narrative. There's no need to reply; no one is listening.

My thoughts exactly, because thinking outside the box, is exactly what I do, however the difference is my thoughts are based upon fact, and not upon opinion like yours.

Peace

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Manwon Lender
1 hour ago, and then said:

When the information that is declassified clearly shows illegal actions were taken, they should have more trouble dismissing it than they did believing everything that the media spewed about Trump for 3 years.  There is a factual record and if it's made public then only partisans will deny it.

I wish you were right and all the information was declassified, but the truth is there is little need to classify much at this point. Like the Presidents statement about the Virus coming out of Lab in Wuhan, and Pompeos comment that echo those comments. If they are true the President needs to release the information and prove it, because no other country in the World agrees with his assessment. So let let's hope that the factual information he has is released to the public and the World, because that's what needs to happen.

peace

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hammerclaw
9 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

My thoughts exactly, because thinking outside the box, is exactly what I do, however the difference is my thoughts are based upon fact, and not upon opinion like yours.

Peace

More like your own opinion based on false information. I think about things and when they don't make sense, pick at them like a dog worrying a bone. I don't let others define facts for me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Manwon Lender
1 hour ago, and then said:

When the information that is declassified clearly shows illegal actions were taken, they should have more trouble dismissing it than they did believing everything that the media spewed about Trump for 3 years.  There is a factual record and if it's made public then only partisans will deny it.

I wish you were right and all the information was declassified, but the truth is there is little need to classify much at this point. Like the Presidents statement about the Virus coming out of Lab in Wuhan, and Pompeos comment that echo those comments. If they are true the President needs to release the information and prove it, because no other country in the World agrees with his assessment. So let let's hope that the factual information he has is released to the public and the World, because that's what needs to happen.

peace

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Manwon Lender
39 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

More like your own opinion based on false information. I think about things and when they don't make sense, pick at them like a dog worrying a bone. I don't let others define facts for me.

That's pretty obvious, but facts based upon your own assumptions are not facts at all, they are just your opinion.

Peace

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Manwon Lender
2 hours ago, and then said:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/birx-said-there-is-nothing-from-the-cdc-that-i-can-trust-in-a-white-house-coronavirus-task-force-meeting/ar-BB13R4Wn

She's the number two most respected advisor.  Maybe CDC has some explaining to do about inflating the numbers of dead?  Several politicians are having disagreements with Fauci.  He is a well renowned scientist in this field but even he isn't perfect and it is only his opinion that reopening may be happening "too soon".  He's also a bureaucrat and is engaging in some CYA because he knows how the media are going to go all in to blame everyone on Trump's team for everything from small outbreaks to hangnails.

As the states reopen we will begin to see just how well Americans are able to discipline themselves for the greater good.  States will need to be responsible for their actions and anyone who is going to point at every death anywhere in the country and say - TRUMP has blood on his hands - I think they're going to find their audience is shrinking.  

Finally...reopening this economy will be just as risky in a month or a year as it is right now.  There is no vaccine and few therapeutics available.  Hiding at home only has one group's support and they are the ones who are willing to literally burn it all down to blame Trump.  Comes the fall and Red states are beginning to get back to normal while blue states are protesting their governors and Trump is going to roll in that election.

There is no doubt she has the necessary qualifications and that she has been well respected up to this crisis. The problem now is unlike Dr. Fauci she is only being honest to the point where the leash President Trump holds allows her to be. The reason she was given the current position is because Dr. Facusi could not continue with a clear conscience to only give the facts in the narrative that president Trump required. Because of this he will be remembered as an honest man who could not be controlled. On the other hand she will be remembered as the Presidents lap dog and in the future her credibility will be ruined. I don't agree with your statement that he is engaging in any CYA, in truth his concern is for the American people and in time he will be recognized for not hold back information that is needed, like she is doing.

When the states reopen its not really a question of how well the American public has disciplined itself, and neither are the state Governors. According to the Presidents plan states will be responsible for their own actions, but that is only because they have been abandoned by the Federal Government because there is no Federal Guidance to follow. This way again any disaster that may occur can and will be blamed upon the State Governors, that is the only Federal plan that President Trump has assembled.

Unlike you this is not a political situation for me, I understand that the economy must be kick started and yes there will be many thousand deaths, do to a lack of coordination between the Federal Government and the states. Its going to like a free for all, with each Governor doing thing his own way without the needed Federal guidance. As far as, states protesting their Governors and trump rolling to the election, again unlike you I could careless and I would rather see the reopening be a success and I do believe you would like to see that also.

Peace 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
RoofGardener

The poll is flawed. There is no "other factors" button. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
and then
18 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

Because of this he will be remembered as an honest man who could not be controlled. On the other hand she will be remembered as the Presidents lap dog and in the future her credibility will be ruined.

This is a supposition.  Should the reopening plan meet with great success and there be no significant spikes in cases, then what?  You know, that actually IS possible. 

  • Thanks 1
  • Confused 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Manwon Lender
14 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

The poll is flawed. There is no "other factors" button. 

I know, I am not a pollster sorry about that Roofy.:D

Peace

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Manwon Lender
24 minutes ago, and then said:

This is a supposition.  Should the reopening plan meet with great success and there be no significant spikes in cases, then what?  You know, that actually IS possible. 

I want nothing more than for this to work, and I am also certain Dr. fauci wants the same thing to occur. However, unlike some people this is not a completion for me, and it has nothing to do with politics, we are talking about American lives here, only a traitor would wan to see the reopening fail.

Peace

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Manwon Lender
4 hours ago, and then said:

First, I just want to acknowledge that I respect your topic though I'm pretty sure we'll never agree but hopefully we can civilly agree to disagree :) 

Have you read any of the information his administration has made available as a plan for the nation to move forward?

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-opening-america-again-lockdown-coronavirus-guidelines-1498518

There are other sources to explain the phased reopening that he and his medical experts have agreed to in principle.  MOST importantly, he is leaving the decision totally at the state level and the governor's discretion.

According to the numbers I've most recently seen, most states have reached their peak and are on the backside of the curve.  There are a substantial number of Americans in all the states that want to go back to work and understand that this will require them to continue with recommended safety procedures.  As more begin to reopen we Will SEE spikes and possibly even small outbreaks and the states will need to adhere to the 3 phase plan to keep those numbers tamped down.

My point is that most of the states realize that the pandemic is a real problem but economic freefall will be worse.  The evidence that is coming to light from Barr, Durham and Jensen has been percolating for quite awhile already.  I'd remind you (civilly) that for the first 3 years of his presidency, nothing else even came close to getting in the way of government agencies while they were investigating Trump and his team.  Now that we are beginning to see factual information being declassified so the nation can make judgments about the predicate for those years of accusations without proof, I'm hoping that those who are willing to keep an open mind will begin to see just how badly our nation has been failed by the unprecedented level of corruption in the Obama administration. Have you seen the handwritten notes our FBI took leadership took as they decided how to best destroy a 3 Star who doesn't have a blemish on his service record?  They even threatened his son with the same ruin if he didn't plead out.  That is factual.  That is not in dispute.

Now that these facts are coming out, it grieves me to see people here who will still refuse to acknowledge what Obama's people did to this man and his family.  If he committed a "crime" it was his negligence in ensuring his FARA documentation was properly presented.  He WAS working as a representative of a foreign power - Turkey - and if that is grounds to destroy a person with his record then DC would be gutted if everyone else got nailed on the same charge.  But they aren't, are they?  Why?  Because Trump.  

I have no interest in relitigating Trump's decisions.  People can accept them or reject them but the record will show an unbiased person that he took steps sooner even than his own people advised him to.  Do you recall how Xi &Co raised a fuss about Trump mistreating them?  Closing air traffic while cases were ongoing in China was somehow a sin according to our media.  He was RAY-SUS and Xenophobic.  He was going to cause the wrath to descend on Asian Americans. 

IMO, the facts coming into the light of day are worthy of ior then there is no coming back from that without a serious, potentially devastating "airing of differences"  One half of this nation, either half, is never going to be coevery American's attention because if our government gets away with this level of wholesale corrupt/politicized behavmpelled to prostrate ourselves to the other half.  I believe that the 5th column has so thoroughly gutted their credibility that the hysteria we'll be seeing will just solidify more votes for Trump.  Remember that NO POLLING between now and November will show this.  Just remember how it felt on 11/6/16 when the NYT ticker began the night with HRC having over 90% confidence she was the next president.

Unless there is some kind of serious malfeasance/cheating in this election, I find it nearly impossible to believe that Biden can draw any youth vote or even much of the female vote.  I don't think we can survive another election where one side refuses to accept the verdict.  For that reason, I really hope the state governors in the battleground states refuse to make cheating easy with mail in ballots that have no way of being certified.  If that kind of variable is injected into this election then no winner is going to be acceptable and that bodes really poorly for our nation.

Hey buddy I respect your opinion too, and like you said I fully realize that we wont agree. But I have know doubt that we can act in a civil manner towards each other, we have both mellowed a bit and have had no issues to date. As far as leaving everything up to the Governors without Federal planning and guidance that could be a disaster waiting to happen. Partner, I totally agree that things are broken, where we disagree is that from my perspective I don't trust the Demarcates anymore than I trust the Republicans. Both sides are so F-up that we as a Nation had better wake up because these people are setting us up for failure, so I have hoped that our current situation would create some unity, however, even in the middle of dam Pandemic politics continues to rule the day, and that makes me sick.

I agree that the Presidents record will show, but not as soon you appear to think it will. I think that in the future hopefully before we both have passed:P, the Academics that write the National history will complete the Trump Administrations history. Then and only then will the truth be exposed, good or bad. I also agree that the corrupt and illegal behavior that has been allowed to occur must be brought to the attention of the American public, the problem is that our media is so biased one way or the other that it's impossible for people to know what to believe, so the facts are skewed. I cant disagree with anything you are saying concerning the politics between Biden and trump, because I do not follow whats going at this time, the Pandemic and whats happening with it has my full attention. If some how this problem becomes controlled before November, I will pay attention to the political aspects going on in America. 

Peace

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Manwon Lender
5 hours ago, Horta said:

It's difficult to do that when politicians don't listen to scientists, and when you haven't got the necessary supplies. The fact that the US felt it needed to (ahem) "acquire/intercept" emergency shipments of medical equipment that were en route to Germany and Canada, seems to indicate preparedness wasn't great.

There is all talk of this being a "black swan" event that no one could have predicted. That's absolute nonsense of course, scientists have been telling the world to prepare for the certainty of a pandemic such as this for decades.

That is all very true, these politicians  never listen to the Medical an Scientific community until its too late, but hopefully they have learned some thing this time, nut I won't hold my breath, because I don't want to die!!!:w00t::D

 Peace 

  • Thanks 1
  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.