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Eerie shadow figure captured on hotel CCTV


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55 minutes ago, preacherman76 said:

With people demanding proof that this is a the real thing. There is no way to prove that.

I guess I don't see anyone here on this thread 'demanding proof' that it's real.  

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5 hours ago, preacherman76 said:

I have no problem with people discussing these subjects I love doing that myself. I just get tired of these threads turning out the same way every time. With people demanding proof that this is a the real thing. There is no way to prove that. Then it turns into a thread about why they don’t believe anything. The massive ego it takes to turn this subject into a discussion about them is amazing
 

Maybe one day there will be absolute proof of the paranormal, but it won’t be discovered through a video on a message board

I agree about some dear belivers being more ego driven than logical. C'est la vie.

I caught up with the last several posts and see you are still spending most of your time complaining how others participate in this open thread discussions,  you make some very broad assuming  slams at people and i cant speak for them but as for myself im not here "demanding" anything, IF an extraordinary, questiable story is presented as fact and real i will ASK for evidence, collabaration, anything more than JUST that persons story, if they dont have any i move on.

And you are correct  that paranormal has NOT yet been proven and likely never will be, im not here hand waving expecting it to be proven by a video or message board but i dont rule that out either because paranormal hasnt ever been proven doesnt mean it wont be but i do go into these cases from a different viewpoint, less time wasting for me.

i dont demand for example any dear believer proves the shadow in this video is paranormal and the burden if far from on me to prove its not paranormal since paranormal itself isnt proven but rather i look at other possiblities which yes, those possibilities are not based in paranormal,  supernatural, otherwordly but rather prosaic practical explanations,

I do jump assuming anything as with the patterson film hoax example i do not only go by the crappy fur costume i also go by patterson horrible lacking integrity and credibility, all is taken into account.

Its real simple, since paranormal has yet been proven  i take everything about it in account and its not likely paranormal exists outside the mind of the dear believer but im open,

In the meantime, a story is just a story no insult intended and non should be taken, not my fault some believers get cross that i dont believe their stories i do NOT try to force my non belief on paranormal on those who believe yet countless times ive been ad hominem attacked for simply not beling a story.

While this threads ot is iffy there is another thread on here started by a respected member concerning him and other witnesses on 2 occasions seeing what appeared to be a dark mass leave an elevator go down the hall around the cornor, do i believe his story? You bet! Do i believe its paranormal? Nope, could it still be proven what it really is? Yes! And that makes that thread very interesting, ill link it here...

https://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum/topic/337600-strange-something-or-other-in-the-elevator/

Edited by the13bats
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No bats, I spend most of my time working, and spending time with my family. I spend very little time here at all. 
 

Thanks for proving my point though, this is all about you. 

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10 hours ago, preacherman76 said:

No bats, I spend most of my time working, and spending time with my family. I spend very little time here at all. 
 

Thanks for proving my point though, this is all about you. 

You work and spend time with your family...when you take a break from complaining and ad hominem on here, example being this larest reply from you.

Your proven point is you are an epic fail.  All about me? You sure look the fool my last post was linking to another members great thread, had it been "all about me" i would have linked to something about me, you,

You never seem to add to the threads subject you just complain about those who do.

So anyone want to discuss this threads event compared to the other thread and  "kittens are jerks" experience

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On 6/17/2020 at 6:58 PM, the13bats said:

I agree about some dear belivers being more ego driven than logical. C'est la vie.

I caught up with the last several posts and see you are still spending most of your time complaining how others participate in this open thread discussions,  you make some very broad assuming  slams at people and i cant speak for them but as for myself im not here "demanding" anything, IF an extraordinary, questiable story is presented as fact and real i will ASK for evidence, collabaration, anything more than JUST that persons story, if they dont have any i move on.

And you are correct  that paranormal has NOT yet been proven and likely never will be, im not here hand waving expecting it to be proven by a video or message board but i dont rule that out either because paranormal hasnt ever been proven doesnt mean it wont be but i do go into these cases from a different viewpoint, less time wasting for me.

i dont demand for example any dear believer proves the shadow in this video is paranormal and the burden if far from on me to prove its not paranormal since paranormal itself isnt proven but rather i look at other possiblities which yes, those possibilities are not based in paranormal,  supernatural, otherwordly but rather prosaic practical explanations,

I do jump assuming anything as with the patterson film hoax example i do not only go by the crappy fur costume i also go by patterson horrible lacking integrity and credibility, all is taken into account.

Its real simple, since paranormal has yet been proven  i take everything about it in account and its not likely paranormal exists outside the mind of the dear believer but im open,

In the meantime, a story is just a story no insult intended and non should be taken, not my fault some believers get cross that i dont believe their stories i do NOT try to force my non belief on paranormal on those who believe yet countless times ive been ad hominem attacked for simply not beling a story.

While this threads ot is iffy there is another thread on here started by a respected member concerning him and other witnesses on 2 occasions seeing what appeared to be a dark mass leave an elevator go down the hall around the cornor, do i believe his story? You bet! Do i believe its paranormal? Nope, could it still be proven what it really is? Yes! And that makes that thread very interesting, ill link it here...

https://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum/topic/337600-strange-something-or-other-in-the-elevator/

You have never been attacked by me for not believing a story. I never get on people over their beliefs or lack there of. 
 

I have a question. How did you get involved in searching out paranormal things to begin with? Have you ever had, or know someone who had something happen that they couldn’t explain?

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9 hours ago, preacherman76 said:

You have never been attacked by me for not believing a story. I never get on people over their beliefs or lack there of. 
 

I have a question. How did you get involved in searching out paranormal things to begin with? Have you ever had, or know someone who had something happen that they couldn’t explain?

Im going to answer this but im not going to get dragged into another one of your long running rants about non belivers that you love to do that never have anything to do with the threads topic, thats not what im here for, so i wont reply to more personal off topic posts from you.

You have gotten cross with me and others and you have posted lectures scolding peoole for asking questions you didnt like, or being asked for proof because we desire evidence not stories, many of your posts are just complaining about others not the threads topic,  anyone who reads your posts can see that.

Now your next question at least it didnt just cut to why am i here if i dont blindly believe,  i will answer it, i dont go searching paranormal, its not my job, as a kid in the 70s a lot of paranormal supernatural otherwordly stuff was on the TV and my grandmother watched it all, so did i.

i got intrigued with the unknown the mystery of it,  i was into the possibilities, i especially liked cryptid stuff and aliens, as i grew i read, i did my own research and did more when the web happened,

I simply wasnt ever a person who heard a campfire story or tall tale and believed it, i was the bat who went to learn what was really going on, folklore? Etc same with magic tricks, i wanted to know how, why, if that wasnt a ghost, a bigfoot or an alien what the devil was it. To start down my path i had to peel away embellishment and bs.

And what i learned was so much of what i had been told the "stories" went to the trash can, or that person making up the stories did it for attention or profit, or dear folks who or not mentally stable like the lady in the thread here that thinks aliens are birds, or people who have sleep issues and think aliens or monsters are getting them, its perception, man, monster, alien, angel. The mind plays tricks as do eyes they along with memory are poor witnesses.

The one common denominator with paranormal etc is since i do not hold "stories" as proof is there is ever any evidence or proof of these claims of paranormal supernatural otherwordly experences? No, none yet, does that mean there is no such thing? No, it means there is no proof and i desire more than just a story im not a blind believer of everything im told. If i were it would be easier.

"Couldnt explain" "unexplained" is a bit different now isnt it? This threads video and the thread by "kittens are jerks" are very similar, yet very different and i have no clue what they really are and since i do not jump from "i dont know" to some conclusion im comfortable with "unexplained"

however, i find KAJs story credible, i respect him from previous posts and greatly respect he doesnt make any jumps, he personally doesnt think its likely supernatural but is open it could be.

While im no where near as smooth in my expression as KAJs i am simpatico in that i too leave all options opens, to get back on this thread topic for example, it starts out questiablefor me,  i dont know the provenance of the video i see that its presented not as "what is this?" But rather eerie shadow figure captured, it sets out with the notion its not prosiac, then its their burden to prove what they think or leave me to my own different opinion.

The burden has never been on the skeptic to prove something unproven isnt the answer, but to take that further im not trying to prove anything to anyone here, like others i spew my opinion, right or wrong i post it, in this case i lean likely hoax,

i do not know if it was diliberate or not, many things show up on pix later on, look at the countless security cameras that have a bug trucking across the lens being called ghosts aliens whatever, they were likely not preplanned hoaxes.

So sure i know of lots of cases of "unknown" "unexplained" like when we moved in the seller claimed ghosts opened and closed doors, and sure enough doors opened and closed, it was "unexplaned" for 20 years, i solved it the first week. It was prosaic, sorry.

And if someone proves paranormal supernatural otherwordly  i will be tickled pink but that hasnt happened yet.

Now i will only reply to things you direct at me if they are directly related to the threads topic, ive covered all else in this reply to you.

Cheers

b

 

 

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I will read this in its entirety, but after the first paragraph I have to address it. I have never cared about what anyone believes. I care about how people here are treated. I never once gave anyone a hard time about the questions that are asked. Not once. Unless you are asking if someone is a moron, or whatever for what they believe. 
 

BTW sometimes people come here just to tell their stories. Why is that so difficult to allow? Even then I don’t care what people say, again until they become *******s about it. 

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1 hour ago, the13bats said:

Im going to answer this but im not going to get dragged into another one of your long running rants about non belivers that you love to do that never have anything to do with the threads topic, thats not what im here for, so i wont reply to more personal off topic posts from you.

You have gotten cross with me and others and you have posted lectures scolding peoole for asking questions you didnt like, or being asked for proof because we desire evidence not stories, many of your posts are just complaining about others not the threads topic,  anyone who reads your posts can see that.

I already addressed this. 

1 hour ago, the13bats said:

Now your next question at least it didnt just cut to why am i here if i dont blindly believe,  i will answer it, i dont go searching paranormal, its not my job, as a kid in the 70s a lot of paranormal supernatural otherwordly stuff was on the TV and my grandmother watched it all, so did i.

You are taking a shot at me that I blindly believe? I don’t blindly believe in anything. Have never once expressed a blind belief in anything. I only support things I’ve directly seen or experienced, and even then I have always been careful to not say I knew anything for sure. Have always had more questions than answers. 

1 hour ago, the13bats said:

i got intrigued with the unknown the mystery of it,  i was into the possibilities, i especially liked cryptid stuff and aliens, as i grew i read, i did my own research and did more when the web happened,

I simply wasnt ever a person who heard a campfire story or tall tale and believed it, i was the bat who went to learn what was really going on, folklore? Etc same with magic tricks, i wanted to know how, why, if that wasnt a ghost, a bigfoot or an alien what the devil was it. To start down my path i had to peel away embellishment and bs.

I feel that. I don’t believe in most of the things posted here. Guess I just don’t feel the need to try and hurt or make fun of people who do believe them. 

1 hour ago, the13bats said:

And what i learned was so much of what i had been told the "stories" went to the trash can, or that person making up the stories did it for attention or profit, or dear folks who or not mentally stable like the lady in the thread here that thinks aliens are birds, or people who have sleep issues and think aliens or monsters are getting them, its perception, man, monster, alien, angel. The mind plays tricks as do eyes they along with memory are poor witnesses.

The one common denominator with paranormal etc is since i do not hold "stories" as proof is there is ever any evidence or proof of these claims of paranormal supernatural otherwordly experences? No, none yet, does that mean there is no such thing? No, it means there is no proof and i desire more than just a story im not a blind believer of everything im told. If i were it would be easier.

How could there ever be anything but stories? What could happen that you would consider proof? BTW, I myself wrote a book on my OOB experiences. I did so because I loved and had a strong passion for the subject. One day I might even self publish it. If I happened to make money, why should that disqualify me? It’s people who are passionate for ligit reasons who write books ect. 

1 hour ago, the13bats said:

"Couldnt explain" "unexplained" is a bit different now isnt it? This threads video and the thread by "kittens are jerks" are very similar, yet very different and i have no clue what they really are and since i do not jump from "i dont know" to some conclusion im comfortable with "unexplained"

however, i find KAJs story credible, i respect him from previous posts and greatly respect he doesnt make any jumps, he personally doesnt think its likely supernatural but is open it could be.

While im no where near as smooth in my expression as KAJs i am simpatico in that i too leave all options opens, to get back on this thread topic for example, it starts out questiablefor me,  i dont know the provenance of the video i see that its presented not as "what is this?" But rather eerie shadow figure captured, it sets out with the notion its not prosiac, then its their burden to prove what they think or leave me to my own different opinion.

The burden has never been on the skeptic to prove something unproven isnt the answer, but to take that further im not trying to prove anything to anyone here, like others i spew my opinion, right or wrong i post it, in this case i lean likely hoax,

Cool. For me personally I think it’s a interesting video. I have no belief about it though. Nor do I really ever about any of these subjects. 

1 hour ago, the13bats said:

i do not know if it was diliberate or not, many things show up on pix later on, look at the countless security cameras that have a bug trucking across the lens being called ghosts aliens whatever, they were likely not preplanned hoaxes.

So sure i know of lots of cases of "unknown" "unexplained" like when we moved in the seller claimed ghosts opened and closed doors, and sure enough doors opened and closed, it was "unexplaned" for 20 years, i solved it the first week. It was prosaic, sorry.

There is nothing to be sorry about. The way you paint me here I don’t think you actually try to understand anything I say. 

1 hour ago, the13bats said:

And if someone proves paranormal supernatural otherwordly  i will be tickled pink but that hasnt happened yet.

Now i will only reply to things you direct at me if they are directly related to the threads topic, ive covered all else in this reply to you.

Cheers

b

 

 

Including laughing and the dumb confused emoji’s?

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Back on topic please.

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Wow, what a convoluted thread....  A coupla brief points:

1. Video editing is easy.  And those who do it do not generally use Photoshop, it's much more likely to be software like Adobe After Effects / Premiere, Blender.  Note that there are lots of plugins to do ghosts, shadowy figures, explosions, lightning... you name it..

2. Good video editing is very hard.

3. Duplicating an effect is even harder! .. especially when that effect/ghost/whatever interacts in any way with the rest of the scene.  It's very difficult and extremely time consuming.  It's many times harder than just fooling around with effects and plugins until you get something you like....

So, it is NOT a fair test to demand that someone duplicates a video closely - unless you're willing to pay them...

But equally, it is pretty much irrelevant if someone can closely duplicate an event (and a good operator WILL be able to do so..*- see below), in regards to whether or not that original video is a real event or a fabrication.  The vast majority of hoaxes are not uncovered by duplication, they are uncovered either by:

- a problem with provenance, eg a bright UFO over a city at night, and only one video?  What about all the hundreds of webcams and dashcams that would have been pointing in that direction, and were probably much nearer and clearer?  That doesn't really apply here, but similar issues do apply..

- a basic error in the editing that leaves some kind of obvious telltale (see below for examples)

I would argue that any professional or highly skilled amateur video effects enthusiast, can duplicate virtually any of the (generally low-res) paranormal videos out there (- again, see below) - given enough time and given motivation...

 

* Note I'm not a video editing enthusiast and I'm not offering my time to try to duplicate a video for no useful reason..., but if you want to see what a 'good operator' can do, may I simply suggest you look up 'Captain Disillusion' on Youtube, and find one of his videos where he shows the step by step process of duplicating all the effects on a well-created video.  Note that ALL of the special effects and titles in the Captain's videos are done by the Cap'n himself.. 

You could start here - don't be too put off by the makeup... This is him going through the steps (pun intended) to make an 'invisible box' video:

 

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1 hour ago, ChrLzs said:

I would argue that any professional or highly skilled amateur video effects enthusiast, can duplicate virtually any of the (generally low-res) paranormal videos out there (- again, see below) - given enough time and given motivation...

Agreed.  I would add to that the only part of this that would require someone highly skilled is the 'duplication' part; to just create the OP video, with no requirement to make it match exactly another video, does not require a professional.  This video I only consider to be 'hard' to reproduce because it's tedious, not that it requires very special skills; it's hard for the same reason peeling 200 potatoes is hard.

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I think that if we saw the full video it might solve/resolve this issue. If it was a cleaning cart then it could just be someone from room service casting a shadow on it. 

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Such boring topics now a days never nothing new or something to make you think "Hmmmm"  Makes ya wanna give up on the paranormal, seems their is  nothing to it thats real.

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43 minutes ago, jamesjr191 said:

Such boring topics now a days never nothing new or something to make you think "Hmmmm"  Makes ya wanna give up on the paranormal, seems their is  nothing to it thats real.

I can't help but agree, sadly though. 

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To be fair I went and watched the OP video again, its presented both as clickbait and as something supernatural, so i do have to shake off my biases to those things.

I did appreciate the blow ups, and i believe as mentioned it would be a clue if we got to see before or after the clip where it shows the cleaning person,

To me it looks like some sort of time lapse, it doesnt flow fluid, and while this is a still it reminded me of,

OIP.bcP2xV_rP-KEuHPt2U4CKQHaEo?w=193&h=1

This was a pic that the photographer claimed was taken with about a 2 second time exposure and he swears nothing was there, in better versions its clearly a cleaning lady with mop bucket, so the photographers story doesnt add up.

The OP video besides the alleged shadow thing being short compared to most adults looks like someone grabbing something from the cart, if a shadow eninty was real would they be stopped by doors and carts? I do not know and of course any answer is spectutive.

Is this a diliberate hoax with photo editing? I am not so sure, if a person is going to do a 'shop of a shadow being why do it so craptasticly?  it doesnt make it a real shadow being either, we could guess lots of reasons someone happened to find that on the cctv tape.

my guess is the cleaning person had their kid with them and the kid was grabbing something from the cart, either that of a shadow being needed an extra little thin soap bar.

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57 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

I can't help but agree, sadly though. 

I don't think it's that sad.. we learn lessons about fakery, about human nature, about critical thinking, and of course the *natural* world is full of rich complexity and beauty and lots of cool new stuff to uncover and explain, even if those explanations are not the desired fairies...  :D 

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4 minutes ago, ChrLzs said:

I don't think it's that sad.. we learn lessons about fakery, about human nature, about critical thinking, and of course the *natural* world is full of rich complexity and beauty and lots of cool new stuff to uncover and explain, even if those explanations are not the desired fairies...  :D 

At what point does it get monotonous? How many times have threads like this happened and it's nothing. I don't know, eventually giving up seems the only option. Probably explains my posting style lately.....

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59 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

At what point does it get monotonous?

For the person posting it, it may be quite new, and they might learn some stuff.  We're not born with innate knowledge, and sadly, there is very little teaching of critical thinking and systems analysis in schools..

But I do understand the sentiment, and when new posters come here with attitude, I too get sick of it..

Did you watch that Tim Minchin video I linked to?  I thought it would resonate with you, but it seems it didn't.. :D 

Here's the bit that sometimes I think we all need to remind ourselves...

Quote

You will soon be dead. Life will sometimes seem long and tough and, god, it’s tiring. And you will sometimes be happy and sometimes sad. And then you’ll be old. And then you’ll be dead.

There is only one sensible thing to do with this empty existence, and that is: fill it. Not fillet. Fill. It.

And in my opinion (until I change it), life is best filled by learning as much as you can about as much as you can, taking pride in whatever you’re doing, having compassion, sharing ideas, running(!), being enthusiastic. And then there’s love, and travel, and wine, and sex, and art, and kids, and giving, and mountain climbing … but you know all that stuff already.

It’s an incredibly exciting thing, this one, meaningless life of yours.

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The first thing I noticed was the strong priming that was done by the voice on the video.

It's called a ghost. It is stated to be a child. The hotel is supposed to have paranormal activity.

My papameter went to 0% chance of paranormal. There is a shadow or is it a photoediting trick? Not much to see.

What doe we actually see? Our eyes detect some movement. The dark object we assume to be behind the cart because we have a built in preference that something that obscures something must be closer. The cart appears to obscure something our brain thinks is one object and the cart must be closer. This is what gives us the sense of structure and order in video games that are not 3d. But what if the object were a ghost and was making different parts of itself less or more visible. Then the brain's heavy reliance on obscuring to evaluate a scene is useless.  What we do notice is that the darkness of the object, whatever it is, depends on how fast it is moving. Do ghosts vary their ability to absorb light as they move? That would be odd indeed. More likely the issue is in the camera and not the object being recorded. Nat Geo is repleted with photos of time lapsed imaged showing the fluid motion of people jumping, ding gymnastics, circus acts, etc. We don't think that Nat Geo is showing us ghosts, yet a crappy video from a hotel is supposed to.

My papameter is 0% paranormal 100% influencing those with no critical thinking

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