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Leon G

gravity control

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Leon G

I am not sure I'm in right section of the forum for this but I guess I am. If not...apolligies.

 

I was looking at a documentary about spaceflight. Explenations in that docu given by Chris Hadfield. And he states their is no way in current time that we know how to control gravity on a spaceship. Hadfield reviewed a few movies that had spaceflight and in one particular movie he explains that the rotating of the ship somehow does the trick. 

 

Wich made me wonder. If you have a spaceship wich has the form of a long tube or cigar or something like that. And at the outeside off that ship you have a mechanism rotating at a high speed, would that do the trick? Would it be realistic to lets say this outeside mechanism of high velocity rotating parts to somehow make sure there is a gravity field in tha ship itself. 

 

Im asking because I'm an author and working at this time on a set up in wich the story tells itself. Their is spaceflight in it. And I want to keep it as realistic as possible. Thanks in advance for the help.

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Piney
2 hours ago, Leon G said:

Wich made me wonder. If you have a spaceship wich has the form of a long tube or cigar or something like that. And at the outeside off that ship you have a mechanism rotating at a high speed, would that do the trick? Would it be realistic to lets say this outeside mechanism of high velocity rotating parts to somehow make sure there is a gravity field in tha ship itself. 

Artificial gravity is what your thinking about. It's created by inertia.

True gravity is a "indentation" in spacetime. 

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lightly

I don't see how any rotation "outside" the ship would affect the lack of gravity inside the ship.  

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Leon G
15 minutes ago, Piney said:

Artificial gravity is what your thinking about. It's created by inertia.

True gravity is a "indentation" in spacetime. 

Indeed artificial gravity it is. Question is, how do I get this in a realistic manner?

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Piney
Just now, Leon G said:

Indeed artificial gravity it is. Question is, how do I get this in a realistic manner?

A rotating center hub.

 

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Piney
22 minutes ago, lightly said:

I don't see how any rotation "outside" the ship would affect the lack of gravity inside the ship.  

centrifugal force holds you like that carnival ride where the floor drops out and your stuck to the wall. 

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L.A.T.1961

SpinCalc will provide different artificial gravity options, just put in the numbers to suit your scenario and have a play with it. 

https://www.artificial-gravity.com/sw/SpinCalc/  

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Leon G
57 minutes ago, Piney said:

A rotating center hub.

 

 

37 minutes ago, L.A.T.1961 said:

SpinCalc will provide different artificial gravity options, just put in the numbers to suit your scenario and have a play with it. 

https://www.artificial-gravity.com/sw/SpinCalc/  

Thank you very much for these tips. They are very welcome :D

 

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lightly
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Piney said:

centrifugal force holds you like that carnival ride where the floor drops out and your stuck to the wall. 

Good way to put it ^.    Yup, I understand.   I think Leon was asking if something spinning  Outside, around, surrounding, the craft would crate gravity Inside the craft.    I reckon it wouldn't,

 

 

Edited by lightly
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Desertrat56
5 hours ago, Leon G said:

I am not sure I'm in right section of the forum for this but I guess I am. If not...apolligies.

 

I was looking at a documentary about spaceflight. Explenations in that docu given by Chris Hadfield. And he states their is no way in current time that we know how to control gravity on a spaceship. Hadfield reviewed a few movies that had spaceflight and in one particular movie he explains that the rotating of the ship somehow does the trick. 

 

Wich made me wonder. If you have a spaceship wich has the form of a long tube or cigar or something like that. And at the outeside off that ship you have a mechanism rotating at a high speed, would that do the trick? Would it be realistic to lets say this outeside mechanism of high velocity rotating parts to somehow make sure there is a gravity field in tha ship itself. 

 

Im asking because I'm an author and working at this time on a set up in wich the story tells itself. Their is spaceflight in it. And I want to keep it as realistic as possible. Thanks in advance for the help.

I think the author of the story that had the ship rotating was thinking of a gyroscope.  Explore how that works, also the idea that when you have a bucket of water, you can swing it around in circles and the water will stay in the bucket due to gravity. 

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Piney
25 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

I think the author of the story that had the ship rotating was thinking of a gyroscope.  Explore how that works, also the idea that when you have a bucket of water, you can swing it around in circles and the water will stay in the bucket due to centrifugal force

:tu:

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Desertrat56
4 minutes ago, Piney said:

:tu:

Thanks.  I couldn't remember that word, too many stresses today.

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Abramelin

Leon, at first I thought you wanted to know about the socalled 'Searl effect':

https://www.robkalmeijer.nl/techniek/energie/searl_effect/index.html

It's still - let's say - somewhat disputed...

 

Edited by Abramelin

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tmcom

Einstein said it best, "space/time eddies created by the earths rotation and moving around the sun".

Which can be overcome with bruit force, (a million volts) or kenetic energy by mass or movement, (conventional rockets, or mechanizing repulsive movement).

As far as l know.

Or mainstream media is right, and just p....about with flywheels for decades without any advancement, (barring room, tem, superconductors, perhaps).

^_^

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ChrLzs

Watch 2001: A Space Odyssey , especially:

 

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ChrLzs
10 hours ago, tmcom said:

Einstein said it best, "space/time eddies created by the earths rotation and moving around the sun".

I might have missed that bit .. "eddies"?  That suggests a variable, fluctuating effect...  Can you cite the bit of Einstein's work that says that?

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tmcom
1 hour ago, ChrLzs said:

I might have missed that bit .. "eddies"?  That suggests a variable, fluctuating effect...  Can you cite the bit of Einstein's work that says that?

Not off hand.

:P

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ChrLzs
1 hour ago, tmcom said:

Not off hand.

:P

Oh.  That's an unexpected shame...

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Free99

For a man made flying machine to manipulate its way through gravity at this time it takes allot of energy. To do this in science fiction style like with a saucer you wouldn’t need to create gravity you would have to trick it or repel it away from the flying machine. Much like how radar bounces back but on spy planes the tiles used under them are shaped at different angles to throw off the radar. Figure out how to do that with gravity and you could fly around like you’re in a Star Trek movie.

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keithisco
On 10/25/2020 at 3:06 PM, tmcom said:

Einstein said it best, "space/time eddies created by the earths rotation and moving around the sun".

Which can be overcome with bruit force, (a million volts) or kenetic energy by mass or movement, (conventional rockets, or mechanizing repulsive movement).

As far as l know.

Or mainstream media is right, and just p....about with flywheels for decades without any advancement, (barring room, tem, superconductors, perhaps).

^_^

You have kinda lost me here with the "Million" volts comment because Volt is a ratio of Joule / Coulomb? It is a simple task to generate 1 million volts, you can do this at home, for this to be useful however you would also need a current source, unless you are just generating electro-static energy

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tmcom
17 minutes ago, keithisco said:

You have kinda lost me here with the "Million" volts comment because Volt is a ratio of Joule / Coulomb? It is a simple task to generate 1 million volts, you can do this at home, for this to be useful however you would also need a current source, unless you are just generating electro-static energy

I was thinking more alone the lines of a nuclear generator putting volts through a series of capatators, to ramp then up, which encapulates a metal craft, and distorts space/time so gravity and inertia can be overcome.

:P

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keithisco
2 minutes ago, tmcom said:

I was thinking more alone the lines of a nuclear generator putting volts through a series of capatators, to ramp then up, which encapulates a metal craft, and distorts space/time so gravity and inertia can be overcome.

:P

Still not getting it...there is (virtually) no mass in electron flow so how does this have an effect on subventing Spacetime which is Mass dependent?

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Cookie Monster
On 6/24/2020 at 11:40 AM, Leon G said:

I am not sure I'm in right section of the forum for this but I guess I am. If not...apolligies.

I was looking at a documentary about spaceflight. Explenations in that docu given by Chris Hadfield. And he states their is no way in current time that we know how to control gravity on a spaceship. Hadfield reviewed a few movies that had spaceflight and in one particular movie he explains that the rotating of the ship somehow does the trick. 

Wich made me wonder. If you have a spaceship wich has the form of a long tube or cigar or something like that. And at the outeside off that ship you have a mechanism rotating at a high speed, would that do the trick? Would it be realistic to lets say this outeside mechanism of high velocity rotating parts to somehow make sure there is a gravity field in tha ship itself. 

Im asking because I'm an author and working at this time on a set up in wich the story tells itself. Their is spaceflight in it. And I want to keep it as realistic as possible. Thanks in advance for the help.

Gravity is the least understood force in physics.

General Relativity (GR) doesnt explain how it works at the microscopic or galactic scales. No gravity particle has ever been detected. No one knows why gravity exists, where it comes from, or what causes it. We just have a set of formula that appear to explain how it works on the scale of planets, but it should be pointed out that GR cannot cope with multi-body systems (more that 2 objects).

Back in the 1990s the European Space agency put a satellite into orbit to measure the strength of gravity at different places across our planets surface. Differences were found. It was put down to different densities of rock under the Earths surface at different places. But the scientists realised they couldn`t test if that was true because they don`t know what material is below our feet.

They came up with an indirect way of testing it. While we dont know the density of rock below our feet we do know the air pressure above us. So they built a tower, and measured how the strength of gravity declined the higher up the tower they went. What they found was evidence for 3 forces of gravity (with one being repuslive). Each dying off at a different rate. I have linked the documentary on it to these forums before but I cannot remember what its called now. It would mean that GR is calculated a Net force from the 3 forces. As they each die off at different rates it would explain why GR cannot calculate the strength of gravity at microscopic or galactic scales.

But anyway, we can produce gravity fields.

This is because while we cannot produce gravity we do know about sub-atomic particles that feel the force of gravity. Electrons for example. It means to create a warp drive we dont need to directly create a gravity field, we could create an electro-magnetic field around a ship instead. The energy requirements to get a spaceship to the next star system in a day are currently impractical. We would need fusion reactors and a lot of them on the ship to generate the level of energy required.

Edited by Cookie Monster

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keithisco
9 hours ago, Cookie Monster said:

Gravity is the least understood force in physics.

General Relativity (GR) doesnt explain how it works at the microscopic or galactic scales. No gravity particle has ever been detected. No one knows why gravity exists, where it comes from, or what causes it. We just have a set of formula that appear to explain how it works on the scale of planets, but it should be pointed out that GR cannot cope with multi-body systems (more that 2 objects).

Back in the 1990s the European Space agency put a satellite into orbit to measure the strength of gravity at different places across our planets surface. Differences were found. It was put down to different densities of rock under the Earths surface at different places. But the scientists realised they couldn`t test if that was true because they don`t know what material is below our feet.

They came up with an indirect way of testing it. While we dont know the density of rock below our feet we do know the air pressure above us. So they built a tower, and measured how the strength of gravity declined the higher up the tower they went. What they found was evidence for 3 forces of gravity (with one being repuslive). Each dying off at a different rate. I have linked the documentary on it to these forums before but I cannot remember what its called now. It would mean that GR is calculated a Net force from the 3 forces. As they each die off at different rates it would explain why GR cannot calculate the strength of gravity at microscopic or galactic scales.

But anyway, we can produce gravity fields.

This is because while we cannot produce gravity we do know about sub-atomic particles that feel the force of gravity. Electrons for example. It means to create a warp drive we dont need to directly create a gravity field, we could create an electro-magnetic field around a ship instead. The energy requirements to get a spaceship to the next star system in a day are currently impractical. We would need fusion reactors and a lot of them on the ship to generate the level of energy required.

Yes we can produce gravity, anything with Mass "creates" Gravity. But, Gravity is NOT a force, it is an effect. An effect of mass sitting within Spacetime. The classical depiction of the Earth sitting on Spacetime,  and therefore "indenting" Spacetime  is however completely innacurate. The Earth sits WITHIN Spacetime  so the distortion is 360 degrees around the earth, otherwise the gravitaional effecct would be directional...which it is not

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