Israel announced to Annex West Bank

[spartan max2]

Hot day for international news

 

Quote

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has said he will begin to annex one third of the already illegally occupied West Bank, including parts of the strategic Jordan Valley, in line with US President Donald Trump’s controversial so-called "Middle East plan".

 

https://www-aljazeera-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2020/06/explainer-israel-annexation-plan-occupied-west-bank-200627085214900.html?amp_js_v=a3&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQFKAGwASA%3D#aoh=15934752001571&csi=1&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From %1%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.aljazeera.com%2Fnews%2F2020%2F06%2Fexplainer-israel-annexation-plan-occupied-west-bank-200627085214900.html

[Piney]

And the self-fulfilling prophecies begins......

When the whole Middle East is ashes and none of their imaginary Messiahs show up. I'm just going to laugh. 

[+and-then]

It would also effectively kill the two-state solution to the Arab-Israeli conflict that was based on the idea of land for peace.

There was never any intention to be peaceful.  Israel is taking advantage of a moment in history where an American administration decided to behave as allies and to help Israel to strengthen security of their land.  Europe is going to lose its mind and the Palestinians will increase their violence.  In other words, it's Tuesday in Gaza.

[Grim Reaper 6]

This is a wonderful development, and I am certain that the Christian Zionists in the White House are all very pleased by this. This is just another part of the plan, that was started when President Trump declared Jerusalem the capital of Israel, and then moved the US Embassy there. This move is going to do nothing but cause a War between Israel and the Palestinians, and it will also more than likely some how bring Iran in to the mix. All I can say is this is a very sad state of affairs, that could have been avoided if it were not for a group Radical Right Winged Religious fanatics who are able to influence US Policy, which in turn influences policies in that region of the Middle East. Well it's time to stock up on popcorn, and get ready to watch it all burn!!!!

Peace

[zep73]

Trump and Netanyahu should make a movie together, and call it "Dumb and Dumber 3". It can be released when WW3 starts.

[+and-then]

13 minutes ago, sci-nerd said:

Trump and Netanyahu should make a movie together, and call it "Dumb and Dumber 3". It can be released when WW3 starts.

Why would WWIII begin?  Or, if it does, who'd be watching the movie?  What we are seeing in Israel is the culmination of decades of U.S. attempts to broker a peace deal between two groups that know each other well enough to realize the peace that will ever come to them is the peace of the grave.  Trump has an instinct for causing people to go to their corners and come out fighting.  The soy generation find that appalling but it's been the way of the world for millennia.

[+and-then]

22 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

This move is going to do nothing but cause a War between Israel and the Palestinians

I think a solid case can be presented that the two groups have been "at war" for many decades.  This situation is apt to cause more violence but unless other nations decide to send troops, it will be the same wash, rinse repeat we've seen over the years.  Perhaps the globalists who are stirring the pot will bring significant sanctions against Israel but, again, this was always going to happen.  At some point, the issue will have to be resolved with violence that is overwhelming enough to remove the will of one side or the other to fight any longer.

[zep73]

5 minutes ago, and then said:

Why would WWIII begin?

Let's see. All Arab countries are already on the Palestinian side. And Iran is p!ssed at the US, who's the only ally Israel's got. The EU are secretly pro Palestinian. Russia is pro Arab. It has all the ingredients of a world war, it just needs a fuse big enough to ignite it. Like an unprovoked imperial Israeli move, backed by the US.

[+and-then]

6 minutes ago, sci-nerd said:

All Arab countries are already on the Palestinian side.

That simply isn't the case any longer.  It isn't because the Muslims in these countries have been convinced to stop hating Jews for breathing.  The leaders of most of the Gulf States and Saudi Arabia see a VERY large threat from their ancient enemies the Persians and they know that Israel is their only hope of not being swallowed, one state at a time.  I agree that these nations will quickly return to form as soon as the Iranian state is no longer a threat but, until then, enemy of my enemy will rule the day.

 

https://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2020/05/21/saudi-ramadan-tv-dramas-invite-scrutiny-of-israel-ties.html

https://besacenter.org/perspectives-papers/israel-gulf-states-weapons/

And I saved the best for last:

https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/06/26/israel-netanyahu-annexation-uae-gcc-arab-cooperation/

9 minutes ago, sci-nerd said:

And Iran is p!ssed at the US, who's the only ally Israel's got.

True, but Iran is significantly weaker by every measure since Trump was elected.  In fact, if the IDF decided it HAD to defeat Iran militarily, they would do it and damn the consequences.

 

11 minutes ago, sci-nerd said:

The EU are secretly pro Palestinian. Russia is pro Arab

They don't make as much a secret of it any longer.  An exploding number of their constituencies are Islamic.

I'd disagree somewhat about Russia being "pro-Arab".  Russia, is pro RUSSIA  Look no further than Syria to see the truth in this.

[zep73]

@and then

Looks like you did your homework. Not gonna even try to fact check that. You win this one. Time will tell if you were right or wrong.

[Hankenhunter]

59 minutes ago, and then said:

Why would WWIII begin?  Or, if it does, who'd be watching the movie?  What we are seeing in Israel is the culmination of decades of U.S. attempts to broker a peace deal between two groups that know each other well enough to realize the peace that will ever come to them is the peace of the grave.  Trump has an instinct for causing people to go to their corners and come out fighting.  The soy generation find that appalling but it's been the way of the world for millennia.

No your seeing decades of Israel bribing, and lobbying the U.S for weapons to enable their illegal expansion. Every bit as bad or worse than China's expansionism. I will also will be laughing my head off when Jesus fails to show. One things for sure, every inch they try to take eill be paid in full with blood from both sides. Not that Bibi cares one iota for anyone but his party.

[Grim Reaper 6]

37 minutes ago, and then said:

I think a solid case can be presented that the two groups have been "at war" for many decades.  This situation is apt to cause more violence but unless other nations decide to send troops, it will be the same wash, rinse repeat we've seen over the years.  Perhaps the globalists who are stirring the pot will bring significant sanctions against Israel but, again, this was always going to happen.  At some point, the issue will have to be resolved with violence that is overwhelming enough to remove the will of one side or the other to fight any longer.

You know I don't disagree with what you are saying, but President Trump, His religious advisers, his Vice President, others in his administration have exasperated the situation, especially President Trump for proclaiming Jerusalem Israel's Capital, and making the decision to move the US Embassy there. Now we all know the President isn't a religious man by any stretch, it's very obvious these decisions were not something he just thought up by himself. There is absolutely no doubt he was influenced by members of his inner circle, religious advisers, other members of his administration, and his most like by members of his own family. But, where the choices he made good choices, I don't think so, because they will only to lead war, and the sad thing is he knew this before he made those decisions, but he made them anyway.

Now we both know that his Christian Zionist advisers are Extreme Right Wing Radicals who are part of that fringe movement that does want to create an environment where wars will be started and Israel will take back the original lands that were promised to them by God. In the end these individuals want to bring about the second coming of Christ and the battle of Armageddon, and while to many this seems outrageous and even crazy, Duncan you know it isn't and so do I. So like I said, this new development is the next step in their plan, so like I said above, there is nothing else to do except stock up on popcorn and watch it all burn, I don't know what else to say to me Israel is nothing but a tool to achieve an end others want, and that is really sad.

Peace

 

[+and-then]

51 minutes ago, Hankenhunter said:

I will also will be laughing my head off when Jesus fails to show.

Laughing in hate at the misery on the ground there?  I have no need to defend my beliefs with you or anyone else here.  As to your laughter, be my guest.  The one who arrives there calling himself Issa is going to have a brief but very deadly tenure.  The Jews of Israel are going to face a time of trouble unlike anything in their history and THAT, is saying something.  The country will be defeated and "gentiles" probably an Islamic coalition, will take possession of the land.  That idea should give you great joy.  If you're around to see it, that is.  Who knows how long it will be before it happens.  If you DO see it, I'd advise a little restraint because the Jews of Israel will never be totally removed from that land again.

On the contrary, there are some of those silly "prophecies" that clearly point to a total removal of those in Gaza.  TOTAL.  They aren't going to be eliminated because of God's hate.  They will be eliminated because of their own.  

59 minutes ago, Hankenhunter said:

One things for sure, every inch they try to take eill be paid in full with blood from both sides.

No doubt.  Yet, that news isn't news, is it?  The world has tried to remove the Jews from that land for 70 years or so.  No reason to think they'll ever stop so when viewed in that reality, why not reclaim the land?  If your enemy has shown that only your total annihilation will ever be enough for them... who would be fool enough to trust them again?

[+and-then]

58 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

So like I said, this new development is the next step in their plan, so like I said above, there is nothing else to do except stock up on popcorn and watch it all burn, I don't know what else to say to me Israel is nothing but a tool to achieve an end others want, and that is really sad.

That is YOUR perspective.  It is not shared by most people yet I respect your right to communicate it here.  My perspective sees the same events in the fullness of time and I believe what is written in the Bible about this struggle.  Yes, it IS going to be a horrible time for Israel.  That is part of their future and God doesn't need any man to help Him out with making it happen.  I, for one, have never desired war that will bring Christ's return.  The scriptures clearly tell us no one can know when that will happen.  

A very clear statement is made about His return and anyone who is here, watching the chaos unfold would do well to remember it.

For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

22And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

 

 

[Hankenhunter]

23 minutes ago, and then said:

The world has tried to remove the Jews from that land for 70 years or so.

No, the world has condemned them for expansionism beyond what was given to them. But, they got the greed, and the covetousness disease, and here we are. Man, could you be anymore duplicitous, or disingenous with your posts?

[Grim Reaper 6]

1 hour ago, and then said:

That is YOUR perspective.  It is not shared by most people yet I respect your right to communicate it here.  My perspective sees the same events in the fullness of time and I believe what is written in the Bible about this struggle.  Yes, it IS going to be a horrible time for Israel.  That is part of their future and God doesn't need any man to help Him out with making it happen.  I, for one, have never desired war that will bring Christ's return.  The scriptures clearly tell us no one can know when that will happen.  

A very clear statement is made about His return and anyone who is here, watching the chaos unfold would do well to remember it.

For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

22And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

 

 

While I believe that you have never desired a war that would bring to Christs return, I wish you could be honest and admit that you know their are those of The Christian Zionist faith who do, that's all I ask from you nothing else. While you say that those beliefs are not shared by most people that may also be true, but the thing you refuse to admit is that the Presidents Religious advisers are those exact kind of people and that they have congregations that number in the millions. I find it interesting where you say God doesnt need any man to help him out with the right setting for the return of Jesus, well that is incorrect, because according the Bible God will use men for that very purpose.

Thank you for respecting my right to communicate my thoughts here, I also feel the same concerning your stance on this subject. The only difference between us is I will speak out based upon facts that anyone who choses can find online, and you will remain quite about the subject like you have done here and bring up additional points of interest instead of admitting the truth about this situation. Let me say that is certainly your right, and I respect that, but it is hard to have a conversation on this subject when one side will identify a situation that exists and the other side also knows it exists, but will avoid that situation at all costs. 

Peace

[+and-then]

42 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

I wish you could be honest and admit that you know their are those of The Christian Zionist faith who do

The entire truth of this is that I have never been a member of a church that had this attitude.  Are there some out there who are that deceived?  Probably but I've never been personally aware of any of them nor would I congregate with anyone of ANY faith or denomination that is saying the Jews are expendable.  There is a major difference, IMO, of a person of faith that takes the predictions of the Bible on faith and one who has a motive to use prophecy to bring about a desired result.  

[Grim Reaper 6]

8 hours ago, and then said:

That is YOUR perspective.  It is not shared by most people yet I respect your right to communicate it here.  My perspective sees the same events in the fullness of time and I believe what is written in the Bible about this struggle.  Yes, it IS going to be a horrible time for Israel.  That is part of their future and God doesn't need any man to help Him out with making it happen.  I, for one, have never desired war that will bring Christ's return.  The scriptures clearly tell us no one can know when that will happen.  

A very clear statement is made about His return and anyone who is here, watching the chaos unfold would do well to remember it.

For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

22And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

 

 

First let me say that my comments are not directed at you or your religious beliefs because I respect them and I support you in them. They are however directed at the Religious Organizations that currently have far too much influence over President Trump, and that are influencing out Nations Foreign Policy. One of these groups is run by the Reverend John Hagee who founded one of the largest pro-Israel lobbying groups, Christians United for Israel (CUFI), this organization is run out of his Church in Texas, currently he has a congregation of 18,000 members. However, he reaches Millions through his TV and online Ministries the reason this gentleman has enough clout to influence President Trump is simple votes, Reverend Hagee trades votes for Foreign Policy decisions.

 Robert James Jeffress Jr. is an American Southern Baptist pastor, author, and radio and television host. He is the Senior Minister of the 14,000-member First Baptist Church in Dallas. This gentleman like Reverend Hagee has a large congregation of 14,000 members and he also reaches Millions through his TV and online Ministries and also like Reverend Hagee he also influences President Trump with votes. Foreign Policy issues that they have influenced include ending the Nuclear Deal with Iran, Declaring Jerusalem as Israel's Capital, the movement of the US Embassy to Jerusalem, and the current support America is giving Israel in the Annexation of the West Bank that is currently underway. The connection between these men and President Trump began in 2016, these men were introduced to then Presidential candidate Trump by his Vice Presidential running mate Michael Richard Pence, who had a long association with Reverend Hagee due to his Evangelical Christian Religious Beliefs.

So like I said in a previous post, with President Trumps support of Israel and the gentlemen I have named above it is time to buy lots of popcorn and get ready to watch the coming war between Israel and the Palestinians with Iran sitting on the sideline along with the United States. The sad thing is this War is completely unnecessary and it is being propagated intentionally by Israel, not for Security, not even to gain more lands, this entire situations is a fulfilment of Prophecies in both the Tora and in the Christian Bible and nothing more.

Peace 

[RoofGardener]

Meh.. I don't buy this whole "Christian Zionists control the White House" conspiracy theory. 

In regard Samaria and Judea; sod it, the Palestinians have had 70 years to get around the peace table, and they have refused to do it. To hell with them; they can all go and live in Jordan, and Israeli Mekava tanks can roll into the West Bank AND Gaza and evict them all. 

NOBODY in the region cares about the Palestinians. Most of the surrounding countries hate the Jews, on religious grounds, but NONE of them care about the Palestinians. There are only about 2.7 million of them in Samaria and Judea, and another 2 million or so in Gaza. They could EASILY be absorbed into - say - Egypt, Syria, Lebanon and Jordan. A couple of years after the invasion, most the the surrounding countries will have forgotten about it and moved on. There might be a few thousand former Palestinians around the world who moan about Nakba II. However, there would be peace in the region thereafter for ever more. 

[Setton]

3 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Meh.. I don't buy this whole "Christian Zionists control the White House" conspiracy theory. 

In regard Samaria and Judea; sod it, the Palestinians have had 70 years to get around the peace table, and they have refused to do it. To hell with them; they can all go and live in Jordan, and Israeli Mekava tanks can roll into the West Bank AND Gaza and evict them all. 

NOBODY in the region cares about the Palestinians. Most of the surrounding countries hate the Jews, on religious grounds, but NONE of them care about the Palestinians. There are only about 2.7 million of them in Samaria and Judea, and another 2 million or so in Gaza. They could EASILY be absorbed into - say - Egypt, Syria, Lebanon and Jordan. A couple of years after the invasion, most the the surrounding countries will have forgotten about it and moved on. There might be a few thousand former Palestinians around the world who moan about Nakba II. However, there would be peace in the region thereafter for ever more. 

That might be the most delusional statement in this entire thread.

And @and then has just finished spouting prophecies!

[+OverSword]

Snip.  I'm not getting into this one 

Edited June 30, 2020 by OverSword

[Grim Reaper 6]

9 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Meh.. I don't buy this whole "Christian Zionists control the White House" conspiracy theory. 

In regard Samaria and Judea; sod it, the Palestinians have had 70 years to get around the peace table, and they have refused to do it. To hell with them; they can all go and live in Jordan, and Israeli Mekava tanks can roll into the West Bank AND Gaza and evict them all. 

NOBODY in the region cares about the Palestinians. Most of the surrounding countries hate the Jews, on religious grounds, but NONE of them care about the Palestinians. There are only about 2.7 million of them in Samaria and Judea, and another 2 million or so in Gaza. They could EASILY be absorbed into - say - Egypt, Syria, Lebanon and Jordan. A couple of years after the invasion, most the the surrounding countries will have forgotten about it and moved on. There might be a few thousand former Palestinians around the world who moan about Nakba II. However, there would be peace in the region thereafter for ever more. 

Your lack of belief in Christian Zionist control in the White House isn't important, in fact it doesnt even matter all because it's really outside your wheelhouse in the first place. But if you paid attention to the conversation between myself and Andthen you would have noticed a very obvious fact, he hasn't denied it at all. We both know that if he thought for a moment it wasn't  true, he would certainly say that. Now, what you said in the rest of post, only shows that you are not very well informed on this topic, its not about the Palestinians or which countries like or dislike them, it's all about Israeli expansion in the region. All the attacks against Israel while they come from different organizations, they all still have one thing in common. They are all sponsored by Iran, Iran supplies the financing, the weapons, and they also train the insurgents that carry out the attacks, but there is one thing I do agree with on, the Palestinians are nothing but Pawns on the Chess board. 

So carry on, and have a wonderful day.

Peace

Edited June 30, 2020 by Manwon Lender

[+and-then]

11 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

 The sad thing is this War is completely unnecessary and it is being propagated intentionally by Israel, not for Security, not even to gain more lands, this entire situations is a fulfilment of Prophecies in both the Tora and in the Christian Bible and nothing more.

You've created an unsupported premise and stated it as fact.  Even if you were correct that Hagee and Jeffress had that level of influence on Trump, you are ascribing a motive to Israel that there is no way you can possibly know for sure or prove.  You should at least acknowledge this.  The fact that Israel is moving to finally, officially claim land in Judea and Samaria, may well lead to an outbreak of violence or even a regional war.  Do you believe such a war was ever going to be avoided, ultimately?  If you do, then perhaps you can explain how peace that has proven impossible for 70 years, would ever be possible today?

In 70 years, it has always been Israel that has yielded one compromise of land after another and all they've gotten in return are graves.  This struggle will never end at a negotiating table.  The answer will be the result of some pretty horrific bloodshed.  If you want to blame someone's religious beliefs for that then that is your prerogative.  It doesn't make it accurate, though.  

[RoofGardener]

23 hours ago, OverSword said:

Snip.  I'm not getting into this one 

Coward :D 

[RoofGardener]

17 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

..... its not about the Palestinians or which countries like or dislike them, it's all about Israeli expansion in the region. ....

Yes, and my point is that the nearby countries would not life a finger if Israel annexed all of Samaria and Judea, along with Gaza. 

I mean, they would make HUGE protests about the reconquest of "muslim" territory, but they would not protest about the Palestinians per se.