European Union bans American Travel to Europe

[aztek]

2 hours ago, TigerBright19 said:

  Is it true that Americans have to pretend to be Canadian when they visit Europe just to feel welcome?

 

 

no it is not. 

[Grim Reaper 6]

53 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

It make sense since our numbers are spiking.

But what I don't get is that for example, California was the first state to lockdown on March 19 yet they are spiking.

So can anyone actually give specifics on why Europe isn't spiking?

Or can anyone give me a difference on how California's response was different then Europe?

So did the Europe just delay the inevitable? Or did they actually stop it. When will the last case be ? 

 

Yes because they used lock down procedures like us, however,then they controlled their openings that were set and enforced by the Leaders of their Governments. In our case President Trump allowed each state to make it's own protocol and open as they saw fit, and that is the problem right there. There was no Federal Oversight, we are the only Country in the World Mind you, where the Countries Leader did not implement a plan that would be followed by all states within that country. Their openings were based upon medical guidance and their people followed the plans as they were presented. When the CDC tried to give President Trump for opening up, he threw it away and said he would not follow such a plan.

Now we both know this was not the case in the United States, our President has not taken on the responsibility for our Nation, and that is wrong. As our counties Leader is ultimately responsible for everything that happens that is positive or negative within our Nation, that's what Leadership means. So until the Politics is put aside and the President implements a plan for the Nation and enforces it, things will only get worst, the only way to correct the damage that has been done, is by working together as a Nation, because it is very obvious that what has happened working apart and against each other is not working.

Peace

[spartan max2]

5 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

Yes because they used lock down procedures like us, however,then they controlled their openings that were set and enforced by the Leaders of their Governments. In our case President Trump allowed each state to make it's own protocol and open as they saw fit, and that is the problem right there. There was no Federal Oversight, we are the only Country in the World Mind you, where the Countries Leader did not implement a plan that would be followed by all states within that country. Their openings were based upon medical guidance and their people followed the plans as they were presented. When the CDC tried to give President Trump for opening up, he threw it away and said he would not follow such a plan.

Now we both know this was not the case in the United States, our President has not taken on the responsibility for our Nation, and that is wrong. As our counties Leader is ultimately responsible for everything that happens that is positive or negative within our Nation, that's what Leadership means. So until the Politics is put aside and the President implements a plan for the Nation and enforces it, things will only get worst, the only way to correct the damage that has been done, is by working together as a Nation, because it is very obvious that what has happened working apart and against each other is not working.

Peace

What did California specifically do different though?

They locked down first and eased off like Europe is doing. But California is spiking.

Like Georgia we could say is because they ended lockdown before everyone else, but that isn't true for California.

So why is California spiking when Europe is not ?

 

[Grim Reaper 6]

11 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

What did California specifically do different though?

They locked down first and eased off like Europe is doing. But California is spiking.

Like Georgia we could say is because they ended lockdown before everyone else, but that isn't true for California.

So why is California spiking when Europe is not ?

 

California is spiking because while they open slowly the people refused to wear masks and they did not follow proper social distancing procedures, in other words the Governor didn't use the advise of the Medical community, and worst of all the policies I stated above were not enforced. Lets face it, as things are right now people are doing whatever they please, and basically the President isn't doing anything to lead by example, he will not even wear a mask, and he makes jokes about the Pandemic, so his base follows his lead. This has to stop he needs to step up and show America how to act, if he does people will  continue to follow him, but the reason he doesnt is because getting reelected is sadly more important to him than the consequences of his actions, and this has to stop, our people deserve better than this.

Peace

[spartan max2]

8 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

California is spiking because while they open slowly the people refused to wear masks and they did not follow proper social distancing procedures, in other words the Governor didn't use the advise of the Medical community, and worst of all the policies I stated above were not enforced. Lets face it, as things are right now people are doing whatever they please, and basically the President isn't doing anything to lead by example, he will not even wear a mask, and he makes jokes about the Pandemic, so his base follows his lead. This has to stop he needs to step up and show America how to act, if he does people will  continue to follow him, but the reason he doesnt is because getting reelected is sadly more important to him than the consequences of his actions, and this has to stop, our people deserve better than this.

Peace

The national response is bad, I agree.

But Im talking about specific state responses because those vary alot. Also, to clarify I'm not arguing any I'm just speaking my thoughts. 

Is there any statistical data of California's mask compliance being different then Germany's?

What advice did the California Govenor not follow?

You don't have to answer if you don't want to, I don't expect you to be an expert of California. I'm just asking generally to anyone who knows because these are the thoughts that are popping up on my head.

It just seems weirdly inconsistent. For example, New York was a hot bed but is now doing pretty well yet they are on stage 3 about to be 4 of reopening.

California who originally did good is now spiking despite acting early and reopening in a similar way to New York and Europe.

In Ohio we are relatively calm yet I don't think we are doing anything different then Cali or New York. We locked down sooner then NY but no sooner then California and are also doing a phased reopening.

 

Edited July 1, 2020 by spartan max2

[Grim Reaper 6]

1 minute ago, spartan max2 said:

The national response is bad, I agree.

But Im talking about specific state responses because those vary alot. Also, to clarify I'm not arguing any I'm just speaking my thoughts. 

Is there any statistical data of California's mask compliance being different then Germany's?

What advice did the California not follow?

You don't have to answer if you don't want to, I don't expect you to be an expert of California. I'm just asking generally to anyone who knows because these are the thoughts that are popping up on my head.

It just seems weirdly inconsistent. For example, New York was a hot bed but is now doing pretty well yet they are on stage 3 about to be 4 of reopening.

California who originally did good is now spiking despite acting early and reopening in a similar way to New York and Europe.

In Ohio we are relatively calm yet I don't think we are doing anything different then Cali or New York. We locked down sooner then NY but no sooner then California and are also doing a phased reopening.

 

I don't have enough knowledge to answer your question concerning California any further. But, I do have an idea that you can research, the Virus is the same in New York and most of the East Coast but, it is a different strain on the West Coast, some of what your talking about could be do to mutations, But the difference in New York is the procedures they put in place, they are tracking infections, wearing masks, and practicing good hygiene and social distancing, that is some of the things they are doing differently than other states along with the fact that they are enforcing the standards.

peace hope this helps 

[RAyMO]

1 hour ago, spartan max2 said:

You don't have to answer if you don't want to, I don't expect you to be an expert of California. I'm just asking generally to anyone who knows because these are the thoughts that are popping up on my head.

I don't know enough about CA to comment specifically about it. But as a general observation its not enough to have controls and policies, they have to be implemented by the people, the rules must be honoured, and when they are not penalties must accrue. And off course Borders can not be porous. Was CA still allowing travel from across the US. I Don't know just asking?

Edited July 1, 2020 by RAyMO

[spartan max2]

1 minute ago, RAyMO said:

I don't know enough about CA to comment specifically about it. But as a general observation its not enough to have controls and policies, they have to be implemented by the people, the rules must be honoured, and when they are not penalties most accrue. And off course Borders can not be porous. Was CA still allowing travel from across the US. don't know just asking?

To my knowledge I don't think California has implemented a travel ban, while New York is banning other states.

Idk how easy that is to enforce when touching by land but that does look like a difference. 

[Michelle]

NYC and Orlando, along with many other places, are not allowing contact tracers or doctors to ask if they were at any protests. How can you track a virus not being able to ask the pertinent questions?

[TigerBright19]

4 hours ago, aztek said:

no it is not. 

Article from the Atlantic.

 

 

[Setton]

On 7/1/2020 at 3:01 PM, spartan max2 said:

What did California specifically do different though?

They locked down first and eased off like Europe is doing. But California is spiking.

Like Georgia we could say is because they ended lockdown before everyone else, but that isn't true for California.

So why is California spiking when Europe is not ?

 

Like others, I don't know specifics about California. But the overall trend is that the virus got started in the US several weeks after Europe. Yet you are lifting lockdown at about the same time.

Leaving aside the lack of people following guidance, you just haven't got cases low enough to lift lockdown.

[spartan max2]

3 hours ago, Setton said:

Like others, I don't know specifics about California. But the overall trend is that the virus got started in the US several weeks after Europe. Yet you are lifting lockdown at about the same time.

Leaving aside the lack of people following guidance, you just haven't got cases low enough to lift lockdown.

I have to admit that it does seem I was wrong and lockdowns were effective in places that did them right.

I reserve the right to take that back if in the next 6 months it is shown that they were ultimately useless. 

But so far it does seem that way.

[Rolltide]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Floyd_protests_in_California

I'm sure this did not help the surge in cases..

[odas]

On 6/30/2020 at 10:13 PM, papageorge1 said:

I am going to challenge your assertion that the situation is that bad at all in the U.S. now. I see a trade off between quality of life and the coronavirus deaths that disproportionately effect the elderly and those with already compromised (frail) health.
 

I am thinking the trade off now is about right. 

Like a person with a long term disease. He tries to maintain as much normalcy with his normal activities as possible while ‘managing’ his disease.

Quality of life with a face mask and social distancing rules for a while vs quality of life in a hospital with a deadly outcome, hmmm what to choose???