The Argument for kids going to School in Fall

[+joc]

15 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

Nope... he said idea, not opponent.

Can a smart person come up with and communicate a stupid idea?

pffft....it's basically all I hear on here!  

[Golden Duck]

1 minute ago, joc said:

pffft....it's basically all I hear on here!  

Are you attacking me now?

[+joc]

49 minutes ago, Golden Duck said:

Are you attacking me now?

Oh yeah....you are on my hit list now for sure!

No...actually...I haven't attacked anyone...I am the one being attacked...but, I understand why and I'm a big boy...I can handle it...

 

[Free99]

I have put to much thought into this. Both as a parent and someone who services 6 to 8 public schools a day.

At first it seemed crazy to me why force the virus to spread? Children and teens will not wear a mask. But then it dawned on me, With children back in school this limits parents from loading them up and traveling. This alone will force the virus to run its course where it’s at. Instead of jumping around,

[+joc]

4 hours ago, Free99 said:

I have put to much thought into this. Both as a parent and someone who services 6 to 8 public schools a day.

At first it seemed crazy to me why force the virus to spread? Children and teens will not wear a mask. But then it dawned on me, With children back in school this limits parents from loading them up and traveling. This alone will force the virus to run its course where it’s at. Instead of jumping around,

What about the buses?  All those kiddos...and yeah, they are wearing masks...I see them in the morning with their little masks on...waiting for the bus.  It's all ridiculous...imho.

[Setton]

1 hour ago, joc said:

What about the buses?  All those kiddos...and yeah, they are wearing masks...I see them in the morning with their little masks on...waiting for the bus.  It's all ridiculous...imho.

Because... children... don't... breathe..?

[Setton]

10 hours ago, joc said:

pffft....it's basically all I hear on here!  

If you get it from so many different people, you might want to look at the one thing all those exchanges have in common...

[stereologist]

On 8/18/2020 at 6:53 AM, joc said:

 

https://www.mendeley.com/catalogue/bcd5bc47-e010-3af6-8ef7-
Background: Ebola and Marburg virus diseases are said to occur at a low prevalence, but are very severe diseases with high lethalities. The fatality rates reported in different outbreaks ranged from 24-100%. In addition, sero-surveys conducted have shown different seropositivity for both Ebola and Marburg viruses. We aimed to use a meta-analysis approach to estimate the case fatality and seroprevalence rates of these filoviruses, providing vital information for epidemic response and preparedness in countries affected by these diseases. Methods: Published literature was retrieved through a search of databases. Articles were included if they reported number of deaths, cases, and seropositivity. We further cross-referenced with ministries of health, WHO and CDC databases. The effect size was proportion represented by case fatality rate (CFR) and seroprevalence. Analysis was done using the metaprop command in STATA. Results: The weighted average CFR of Ebola virus disease was estimated to be 65.0%

Conversley:
 

https://www.the-scientist.com/news-opinion/largest-seroprevalence-study-in-us-shows-vast-covid-19-undercount-67762

The number of COVID-19 infections nationwide is 6 to 24 times higher than the 3.9 million confirmed cases, according to new data from the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

The results of the new study, published this week (July 21) in JAMA Internal Medicine by CDC researchers and state health officials, represent the largest antibody survey of its kind. Even accounting for these hidden cases detected in 10 cities across the US, the findings suggest that many of the cities are nowhere near the antibody prevalence required for herd immunity. Additionally, scientists are unsure just how long people retain their antibodies after being infected, and what that means for immunity to the disease.

“These data continue to show that the number of people who have been infected with the virus that causes Covid-19 far exceeds the number of reported cases,” Fiona Havers, a CDC researcher who led the study, tells The New York Times. “Many of these people likely had no symptoms or mild illness and may have had no idea that they were infected.”

 

I can readily understand why the world would be in such a hysteria over Ebola.  With a CFR of 65% .    It seems to be the case however that with the Covid 19 virus...the vast majority of people didn't even know they were infected.

In Texas in 2018 3600 people died in traffic accidents.   I'm more concerned about dying on the road than I am of contracting a virus that...for all I know...I have already contracted and gotten over. 

 

Thanks for showing I was correct.

 

[the1truebat]

There will be spikes, where I live just last week we had a big spike in Covid cases. They shut down 3 bars for not following proper cleaning practices.

The school issue has been worrisome, your kid goes to school in one mask then comes home in another because they traded. And if you don’t think there won’t be at least one kid who licks his hand and starts chasing everyone around while screaming “COVID!!!!”, then you may be mentally deficient. The school system announced that they were going online, with exceptions for those who have IEP’s Online only school is great for those parents who are home all day, sadly, my wife and I are not. We have to work for a living. We’re exploring our options.

[Gromdor]

Finally got notification four our school district on what they are planning to do-  1 day in person and 4 online.

[Susanc241]

I confess to not reading all the posts so if duplicating anyone, apologies in advance.

I doubt there are any teachers in their 80s still teaching in schools and it is those of this higher age group who are the majority of those dying.  They already have other underlying medical conditions and maybe general frailty.  The average teacher in their 20s to 50s with no other medical problems are considerably less likely to die from the virus, even if they get it pretty bad.  Children are even less likely to die or even have severe symptoms.  We all know who is most vulnerable by now.  We all (should) know what we must do - wear masks, keep our distance, wash our hands frequently and so on.  Children do not usually have parents older than 55, say, and it should be the responsibility of the family to keep children away from elderly relatives, especially those with underlying medical conditions.

I think this far in we ought to be taking more responsibility for ourselves with all this.  I am 72, no grandchildren in this country, but I am more than prepared to self regulate my movements and behaviour to reduce as much as possible getting ill myself and adding to the health services work load, and also to reduce the possibility I might pass it on to anyone else, so that the workers can get back to work and the children can get back to school.  The working masses can’t live shuttered away like this for much longer and they don’t need to, if the majority follow the rules.  We live with ‘normal’ flu every year and thousands of old people die from it but countries don’t shut down and go into a tail spin.  We live with the flu - we need to learn to live with Covid.  Admittedly, that will be easier once we have a safe and effective vaccine.  Life is never risk free, and can’t be made to be.  Unrealistic.

[+Desertrat56]

2 hours ago, the1truebat said:

There will be spikes, where I live just last week we had a big spike in Covid cases. They shut down 3 bars for not following proper cleaning practices.

The school issue has been worrisome, your kid goes to school in one mask then comes home in another because they traded. And if you don’t think there won’t be at least one kid who licks his hand and starts chasing everyone around while screaming “COVID!!!!”, then you may be mentally deficient. The school system announced that they were going online, with exceptions for those who have IEP’s Online only school is great for those parents who are home all day, sadly, my wife and I are not. We have to work for a living. We’re exploring our options.

In New Mexico all public shcools are online, most charter schools are as well and that includes students with IEPs.  Private schools get to decide how they will handle it.  My neice's daughter is going to school, but she must wear a mask and face sheild all day, no one is allow to swap  masks, parents are not allowed in the school, each child is taken from the car and escorted to the class room.  It is a small private school so their method is manageable.

My grandson  has an IEP, is in 4th grade and all his classes are online.  He had violin lessons on line all summer.  The teacher emails the lessons in the morning to all the parents, then at 8:30 they all get online and the teacher explains the lessons.  The charter school he goes to also has a music teacher that teaches each class once a week, and an arabic teacher who teaches 3 days a week.  Most of the school work is done in spanish but some is done in english.

Tomorrow will be Monday of the 3rd week of school and I think my grandson and daughter have a handle on it, but the first 2 weeks were hard because it was new for the teachers as well as the students.

[TigerBright19]

Two main age groups get on the over crowded buses.  The elderly and school children.  Most of the elderly folk I see don't wear masks due to health issues and I doubt school children (fooling around on the bus and pulling each other's masks) will keep themselves protected for long.  Resuming schools is a recipe for disaster.  Half the people I see don't even wear their masks properly because they don't cover their nose.  The other day on the bus I watched a passenger (young guy who works for the council) remove his mask and sneezed loudly and then put his mask back on.  The handle rails in the seat in front of him were covered in his spit.  I turned away in disgust.  I wanted to say something to him, but what can you say after it has been done.  Fortunately nobody sat in the seat in front of him.

 

 

[stereologist]

6 hours ago, Susanc241 said:

I confess to not reading all the posts so if duplicating anyone, apologies in advance.

I doubt there are any teachers in their 80s still teaching in schools and it is those of this higher age group who are the majority of those dying.  They already have other underlying medical conditions and maybe general frailty.  The average teacher in their 20s to 50s with no other medical problems are considerably less likely to die from the virus, even if they get it pretty bad.  Children are even less likely to die or even have severe symptoms.  We all know who is most vulnerable by now.  We all (should) know what we must do - wear masks, keep our distance, wash our hands frequently and so on.  Children do not usually have parents older than 55, say, and it should be the responsibility of the family to keep children away from elderly relatives, especially those with underlying medical conditions.

I think this far in we ought to be taking more responsibility for ourselves with all this.  I am 72, no grandchildren in this country, but I am more than prepared to self regulate my movements and behaviour to reduce as much as possible getting ill myself and adding to the health services work load, and also to reduce the possibility I might pass it on to anyone else, so that the workers can get back to work and the children can get back to school.  The working masses can’t live shuttered away like this for much longer and they don’t need to, if the majority follow the rules.  We live with ‘normal’ flu every year and thousands of old people die from it but countries don’t shut down and go into a tail spin.  We live with the flu - we need to learn to live with Covid.  Admittedly, that will be easier once we have a safe and effective vaccine.  Life is never risk free, and can’t be made to be.  Unrealistic.

There problems comparing this with the flu. First off COVID-19 kills more people. There are just under 180,000 US dead today and a typical flu season kills up to 60,000. We are triple the flu death toll despite having 1/3 of a year to go. Also, the flu does not typically leave the body after inflicting permanent organ damage. There is plenty of evidence that even those with no symptoms endure permanent organ damage.

Whether or not this pandemic kills is not the end of the story. There are other issues to consider.