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SeekTruth

I Want To Believe

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Xeno-Fish
6 minutes ago, onlookerofmayhem said:

I've never been taught to not pay attention to certain things. Whatever my senses pick up is what I pay attention to. Sight. Smell. Hearing. Tasting. Feeling. All the physical senses I have provide the information I am able to go off of.

You'd think that. But you do not conscious absorb all that information. The bulk of it is a subconscious (automatic process). If it is something of interest or a threat you get a head click about it.

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onlookerofmayhem
43 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

Any time a child perceives something subtle that adults can't or won't perceive, they are told "that is not real, it is just your imagination".  That is the teaching I am talking about, and we do have the ability to sense subtle input, but if we don't pay attention to it we don't perceive it.   Do you know anyone who has "hunches" that tend to be correct?  Hunches that seemingly have no basis in physical reality?

So all "imaginary" things children conjure up are real?

A few years ago my buddy's kid was convinced there was a skeleton in his bedroom wall. Before the kid was born we tore down all the walls down to the studs. We insulated the walls and put up new sheet rock. No skeleton. No bones. Nothing of the sort was anywhere in the entire house.

So was it anything other than the kid's imagination?

When I told the kid's mother, she explained how they were watching Halloween cartoons a few days prior and the kid was enthralled with the skeletons. 

So what is most likely in this scenario?

Imagination is in my opinion the explanation.

No. I've never met anyone who has any unexplainable hunch abilities. 

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onlookerofmayhem
43 minutes ago, papageorge1 said:

Well, then continue in denial that any paranormal encounters experienced by normal sane people ever happen. 'It's all in their heads" as I believe you put it earlier.

I most certainly will. Until there is some sort of empirical evidence to suggest otherwise, I will go with the logical, rational and least presumptuous explanation.

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GlitterRose
15 hours ago, onlookerofmayhem said:

Detected with what method? What type of instrumentation?

It would depend on whatever mechanism caused it.

It seems like it would be easy if you had someone who could present phenomena on demand, but that's the snafu, isn't it? 

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Desertrat56
7 minutes ago, onlookerofmayhem said:

So all "imaginary" things children conjure up are real?

A few years ago my buddy's kid was convinced there was a skeleton in his bedroom wall. Before the kid was born we tore down all the walls down to the studs. We insulated the walls and put up new sheet rock. No skeleton. No bones. Nothing of the sort was anywhere in the entire house.

So was it anything other than the kid's imagination?

When I told the kid's mother, she explained how they were watching Halloween cartoons a few days prior and the kid was enthralled with the skeletons. 

So what is most likely in this scenario?

Imagination is in my opinion the explanation.

No. I've never met anyone who has any unexplainable hunch abilities. 

No, not everything kids say that is attributed to imagination is "real", but not all of it is imagination either.  You want to be right go ahead.  I don't care what you think and am not arguing with you.

 

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papageorge1
2 minutes ago, onlookerofmayhem said:

I most certainly will. Until there is some sort of empirical evidence to suggest otherwise, I will go with the logical, rational and least presumptuous explanation.

Remember a whole lot of denial of seemingly strong phenomena is required, pictures and videos all faked, multiple witnesses wrong or lying, physical objects never affected, etc.. Have at it but I don't envy you. As for me, I am sure mayhem happens.

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onlookerofmayhem
3 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

No, not everything kids say that is attributed to imagination is "real", but not all of it is imagination either.

How would we go about determining which is the scenario then?

4 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

You want to be right go ahead.

Of course I want to be right. Who wants to be wrong? 

 

6 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

I don't care what you think and am not arguing with you.

Obviously you do or you wouldn't have responded. 

Why are you being so p***y? I'm trying to have a civil conversation with you.

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onlookerofmayhem
13 minutes ago, GlitterRose said:

It would depend on whatever mechanism caused it.

It seems like it would be easy if you had someone who could present phenomena on demand, but that's the snafu, isn't it? 

Isn't that the claim of people who say they can do things through telekinesis?

Yet when put to any kind of scientific scrutiny they fail miserably.

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Xeno-Fish
20 minutes ago, onlookerofmayhem said:

So all "imaginary" things children conjure up are real?

A few years ago my buddy's kid was convinced there was a skeleton in his bedroom wall. Before the kid was born we tore down all the walls down to the studs. We insulated the walls and put up new sheet rock. No skeleton. No bones. Nothing of the sort was anywhere in the entire house.

So was it anything other than the kid's imagination?

When I told the kid's mother, she explained how they were watching Halloween cartoons a few days prior and the kid was enthralled with the skeletons. 

So what is most likely in this scenario?

Imagination is in my opinion the explanation.

No. I've never met anyone who has any unexplainable hunch abilities. 

Objectively there were no skeletons. But within that kids mind they were real. 

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GlitterRose
Just now, onlookerofmayhem said:

Isn't that the claim of people who say they can do things through telekinesis?

Yet when put to any kind of scientific scrutiny they fail miserably.

Well, yeah, because they're obviously full of ****.

But there could be some things that happen very rarely and are not controllable.

You might be able to catch something like that once if you were lucky enough, but replicating would be difficult.

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onlookerofmayhem
Just now, XenoFish said:

Objectively there were no skeletons. But within that kids mind they were real. 

Cool. 

In my mind, I'm picturing a 400 foot tall hamster. 

The only place it is real is in my mind.

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Xeno-Fish
1 minute ago, onlookerofmayhem said:

Cool. 

In my mind, I'm picturing a 400 foot tall hamster. 

The only place it is real is in my mind.

To a kid those imaginary monsters can create fear and anxiety. Do you have any kids?

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GlitterRose
10 minutes ago, onlookerofmayhem said:

Cool. 

In my mind, I'm picturing a 400 foot tall hamster. 

The only place it is real is in my mind.

Weird things do happen, though. 

Suppose it's not 400 ft. tall. 

Suppose it's just...a 6 ft. tall hamster...that you saw during a sleep paralysis type episode while you were under a lot of stress.

Of course, you don't tell your partner, because who sees a 6 ft. tall hamster, ffs?

Next night...you're partner wakes you up and says they just saw a 6 ft. tall hamster. 

Something like that happened to me. That's part of the reason I think there is some woo floating around that we don't yet understand. 

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Xeno-Fish

The forms we see in those twilight experience of consciousness are real to us. We share those experience and memetic entities are created. The hat man, a witch sitting on your chest, hell even alien abduction. 

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onlookerofmayhem
29 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

To a kid those imaginary monsters can create fear and anxiety.

You don't have to be a kid for that to happen. Plenty of adults exhibit the same behavior. 

30 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Do you have any kids?

Not personally, but my parents have been fostering for over thirty years and I've been around dozens of kids from when they were babies until their teen years.

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Xeno-Fish
1 minute ago, onlookerofmayhem said:

You don't have to be a kid for that to happen. Plenty of adults exhibit the same behavior. 

I know. It's the same mental mechanism. We never out grow it. People see "ghost", bigfoot, etc. Same process. Most people aren't fully conscious half the time anyway. No one really is. We're always floating between different mental states. Objectively though, there isn't proof only stories. So we are arguing stories. 

As for the OP of this thread, if you want to believe, just believe. Assume the possibility. Doesn't mean it is true though. 

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psyche101
10 hours ago, papageorge1 said:

I was thinking more like honest and serious people honestly trying to understand a deep complex universe.

They are called scientists.

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psyche101
6 hours ago, papageorge1 said:

Remember a whole lot of denial of seemingly strong phenomena is required, pictures and videos all faked, multiple witnesses wrong or lying, physical objects never affected, etc.. Have at it but I don't envy you. As for me, I am sure mayhem happens.

Scientific denial is what makes your arguments empty.

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papageorge1
11 hours ago, psyche101 said:

Scientific denial is what makes your arguments empty.

I am pro-science but I don't think it is the end all of knowledge. It is limited in its reach and I don't follow scientism but I do follow science.

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Hazzard
4 hours ago, papageorge1 said:

I am pro-science but I don't think it is the end all of knowledge. It is limited in its reach and I don't follow scientism but I do follow science.

Still, it is the best tool we have when examining and trying to understand the world we live in.

Look around you, most of the things you have and use daily are because of science... like it or not.

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papageorge1
Just now, Hazzard said:

Still, it is the best tool we have when examining and trying to understand the world we live in.

Look around you, most of the things you have and use daily are because of science... like it or not.

Science is the best for the physical world for sure and I like it. But my paranormal interests tell me the physical is not all there is and science is not good at telling is of the 'more' as it is not in the range of our physical senses and instruments. I believe there are those with psychic/clairvoyant/inspired insight into this 'more' and I give them fair consideration too.

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psyche101
6 hours ago, papageorge1 said:

I am pro-science but I don't think it is the end all of knowledge. It is limited in its reach and I don't follow scientism but I do follow science.

Why do you say things like this?

We all know it is not true. I'm not sure who you are trying to convince, others or yourself? 

It's not limited in regards to the paranormal. That's a weak cop out. 

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papageorge1
3 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

Why do you say things like this?

Because it's actually true.

4 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

 

We all know it is not true. I'm not sure who you are trying to convince, others or yourself? 

 

I know it to be true.

4 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

It's not limited in regards to the paranormal. That's a weak cop out. 

Sorry, that's also very true.

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psyche101
1 minute ago, papageorge1 said:

Because it's actually true.

I know it to be true.

Sorry, that's also very true.

No, none of those things are true. That's common knowledge on this forum. I doubt anyone would support your claim based in your posting history.

All you have offered here is a 'am not' childish response. That seems to be the extent of your alleged esoteric knowledge. You are an enemy of reason. 

So don't be sorry. Be honest. It would make for a refreshing change. 

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