The Face Mask Controversy

[TigerBright19]

Went on the bus yesterday and most of the women were not wearing their masks properly.  They covered their mouth, but not their nose.  Kind of defeats the purpose of wearing them.  I think they bought the cheap blue surgical masks that are too tight for many people because quite a few shops are selling infant size to adults without realizing it.  The tightness and thickness of the material makes it too hard for many elderly folk to breath properly, so they expose their noses during the entire bus journey.  One man just held his mask against his face for a few seconds each time someone got on the bus and then removed it when they sat down behind him, and one lady removed her mask repeatedly to have a drink from her bottle.  People seem to think the masks are simply to stop people coughing out germs and are safe to expose their nose without any thought of inhaling the virus through their nose.  I think that makes it worse because the cold air and condensation makes their masks moist which absorbs the virus onto their masks, only for them to breath it directly up their nose.  There should be a basic government rule which tells people how to wear their masks properly.  Everyone seems to be wearing them whatever way they please.

 

Edited July 17, 2020 by TigerBright19

[bee]

 

another aspect of this (what I consider to be draconian under the circumstances) mandatory wearing of masks in shops....
that is going to come in soon... is children (over 10) having to wear them,,,

I just saw this site about children's face masks.... and this picture of a girl on a bike with one on....

 

https://www.hellomagazine.com/healthandbeauty/mother-and-baby/2020061291485/fun-face-masks-for-kids/

Getting kids to wear masks can be tricky - but they will be happier to put on something bright and fun

i know this isn't a pic of a kid in a shop... but why would anyone make a kid wear a mask when they were riding their bike outside...?
I think joggers have been warned not to wear them while exercising so wouldn't this also apply to children riding bikes...
but of course companies SELLING masks probably don't care and would like MORE children to have to wear masks everywhere..??

The rules about mask wearing in shops feels like Mission Creep to me... there is no idea when it might end or if other places will then become part of the mandatory wearing...

I am going along with all the guidelines etc... BUT....in my heart I think this is, in essence a fake pandemic, being hyped up as part of a political agenda... it's a nasty virus that a very small % of population can get complications and die from... but I wonder if this is training for a move into more authoritarian rule...

and preparing children for it will be part of the process...

???

I'm sure many will disagree... indeed violently and passionately disagree... but it all depends on how serious you think it all is...

for example if I thought it was as serious as is made out I wouldn't be saying these things..

(again - it is very serious for a very small % - but to shut down society and the economy was a step too far IMO and we may only see the real effects of that in the months / years to come...)

 

 

[Helen of Annoy]

48 minutes ago, bee said:

 

BUT....in my heart I think this is, in essence a fake pandemic, being hyped up as part of a political agenda... it's a nasty virus that a very small % of population can get complications and die from... but I wonder if this is training for a move into more authoritarian rule...

and preparing children for it will be part of the process...

???

 

So, it's fake because you think you won't die from it? 

I wouldn't be so sure, you know. SARS-2 mostly kills older and immunocompromised, but there were plenty of cases already where younger people with no determinable health issues ended up in ICU and/or dead. 

Also, that selfish logic is additionally stupid because SARS-2 incapacitates a lot of infected people for weeks, even if it doesn't require intensive care. It does affect the holy economy, thus ruining the entitled life style - more than a hairdresser with a mask.  

There's nothing fake about the pandemic, while there's everything fake about the sense of selfish security you feel.     

 

And what do you care what colour of mask that girl chose? You've never met girls who don't prefer pink? Sheesh. 

[toast]

8 hours ago, bee said:

... BUT....in my heart I think this is, in essence a fake pandemic, being hyped up as part of a political agenda... it's a nasty virus that a very small % of population can get complications and die from... but I wonder if this is training for a move into more authoritarian rule...and preparing children for it will be part of the process...

???

I'm sure many will disagree... indeed violently and passionately disagree... but it all depends on how serious you think it all is...

for example if I thought it was as serious as is made out I wouldn't be saying these things..

(again - it is very serious for a very small % - but to shut down society and the economy was a step too far IMO and we may only see the real effects of that in the months / years to come...)

One of the most idiotic comments I ever saw here.

[+Desertrat56]

8 hours ago, bee said:

I'm sure many will disagree... indeed violently and passionately disagree... but it all depends on how serious you think it all is...

for example if I thought it was as serious as is made out I wouldn't be saying these things..

(again - it is very serious for a very small % - but to shut down society and the economy was a step too far IMO and we may only see the real effects of that in the months / years to come...)

You must be lucky not to know anyone who was hospitalized or died from this virus.  It is real, it is worse than any flu we have had.  It is more dangerous because 1. the seasons (temperature) does not seem to affect it so we don't have a break when the weather gets warm, like we do with the flu)  2. It is contagious for longer, and it does more damage if it gets a foothold.  3. we don't have a vaccination for it yet.

I hope you are counting your blessings, because they could change any day.

[Kittens Are Jerks]

9 hours ago, bee said:

i know this isn't a pic of a kid in a shop... but why would anyone make a kid wear a mask when they were riding their bike outside...?
I think joggers have been warned not to wear them while exercising so wouldn't this also apply to children riding bikes...
but of course companies SELLING masks probably don't care and would like MORE children to have to wear masks everywhere..??

What if a child riding a bike rode through someone’s fresh sneeze or cough cloud? Whilst the risk of virus transmissibility in the air outdoors is thought to be low, there's still a risk. Furthermore, outdoor transmissibility has yet to be definitively measured, so better safe than sorry at this stage.

Interesting though, how throughout all this, the ones who have been throwing tantrums and behaving like children, aren't the children.

 

[Kittens Are Jerks]

I volunteer teaching an (outdoor) environmental conservation education program to young children over at the Toronto Islands. The children this morning were all mindful of social distancing and all wore masks. Their attitude about the pandemic was sensible and grounded, and their consideration of each other quite touching. No complaints about having to wear masks, no complaints of government conspiracies, no complaints of a pandemic hoax... indeed, no complaints about anything. They had their acts together better than most adults. 

[bee]

On 7/17/2020 at 10:09 PM, TigerBright19 said:

Went on the bus yesterday and most of the women were not wearing their masks properly.  They covered their mouth, but not their nose.  Kind of defeats the purpose of wearing them.  I think they bought the cheap blue surgical masks that are too tight for many people because quite a few shops are selling infant size to adults without realizing it.  The tightness and thickness of the material makes it too hard for many elderly folk to breath properly, so they expose their noses during the entire bus journey.  One man just held his mask against his face for a few seconds each time someone got on the bus and then removed it when they sat down behind him, and one lady removed her mask repeatedly to have a drink from her bottle.  People seem to think the masks are simply to stop people coughing out germs and are safe to expose their nose without any thought of inhaling the virus through their nose.  I think that makes it worse because the cold air and condensation makes their masks moist which absorbs the virus onto their masks, only for them to breath it directly up their nose.  There should be a basic government rule which tells people how to wear their masks properly.  Everyone seems to be wearing them whatever way they please.

 

not just people on buses... members of the government itself ...

just seen this on another thread and it fits in with your post... (thanks to @Eldorado for link)

source - manchester evening news

Rishi Sunak has received a barrage of criticism for wearing a face mask that has been described as ‘worse than not wearing one’.

The Chancellor has been pictured wearing the mask for a second day despite warnings from doctors and professors that valved masks ‘act like jets’ that can ‘create a plume of infection’.

 

[Grim Reaper 6]

21 hours ago, bee said:

 

another aspect of this (what I consider to be draconian under the circumstances) mandatory wearing of masks in shops....
that is going to come in soon... is children (over 10) having to wear them,,,

I just saw this site about children's face masks.... and this picture of a girl on a bike with one on....

 

https://www.hellomagazine.com/healthandbeauty/mother-and-baby/2020061291485/fun-face-masks-for-kids/

Getting kids to wear masks can be tricky - but they will be happier to put on something bright and fun

i know this isn't a pic of a kid in a shop... but why would anyone make a kid wear a mask when they were riding their bike outside...?
I think joggers have been warned not to wear them while exercising so wouldn't this also apply to children riding bikes...
but of course companies SELLING masks probably don't care and would like MORE children to have to wear masks everywhere..??

The rules about mask wearing in shops feels like Mission Creep to me... there is no idea when it might end or if other places will then become part of the mandatory wearing...

I am going along with all the guidelines etc... BUT....in my heart I think this is, in essence a fake pandemic, being hyped up as part of a political agenda... it's a nasty virus that a very small % of population can get complications and die from... but I wonder if this is training for a move into more authoritarian rule...

and preparing children for it will be part of the process...

???

I'm sure many will disagree... indeed violently and passionately disagree... but it all depends on how serious you think it all is...

for example if I thought it was as serious as is made out I wouldn't be saying these things..

(again - it is very serious for a very small % - but to shut down society and the economy was a step too far IMO and we may only see the real effects of that in the months / years to come...)

 

 

 

[bee]

^^^

actually it IS my station...

oh and by the way have you broken all your fingers so now all you can do is post pictures... 
(the same ones over and over again...)

 

[Grim Reaper 6]

4 minutes ago, bee said:

^^^

actually it IS my station...

oh and by the way have you broken all your fingers so now all you can do is post pictures... 
(the same ones over and over again...)

 

 

[Timothy]

@bee, of course people are going to disagree when you are presenting a textbook example of denialism.
Draconian? Exaggeration of the year award goes to you too!
I know that you feel strongly about your freedoms over there, but on this topic you are being completely ignorant and illogical.

Here in Melbourne from Wednesday 23:59, face masks are mandatory if you leave the house (save for a few exceptions like while exercising if able to distance by 1.5m).
People here generally just accept and understand that it’s a necessary step for now.
I just got back from the supermarket to pick up a few things, and opted to wear a mask for the first time while I was inside. Easily >75% of others were wearing masks too.

I don’t feel like my rights are being stripped. It’s just a bit frustrating, but it’s a pandemic and I’m thankful that I’m in a better place than a lot of people. 

Also on my 10km walk around the Yarra Bend Park area, people are friendly, quick to move off the paths and wait to pass. Plenty of thank yous and nods and smiles from behind masks, better etiquette than in non-pandemic times. Chatted to a few people along the way, nice chats with random strangers, kinda like socializing without socializing. Notably had a nice chat to a woman while watching a pair of tawny frogmouths sleep, and a couple who hadn’t been to that specific area before. 
They were all in a similar mindset, making the best of such a strange time in our lives.

No protests, no rude behaviors. Most people just get it and are simply happy to do the right thing.

Edited July 19, 2020 by Timothy
Typo.

[Grim Reaper 6]

On 7/17/2020 at 1:26 PM, Golden Duck said:

Godwin's law alert.

From the pictures it looks like Walmart hasn't installed clear shields to offer some protection at the checkouts.  No mandatory masks here in Brisbane, but they do have limits on the number of patrons at any one time.  Just like they used to have at pubs, bars and clubs before the pandemic.

I've been back in the office since the beginning of June.  I have caught public twice in the last to months in the middle of winter too.  It mercury barely hit 24C on the days I was on the train.  I haven't worn a mask and I barely see others wearing them.  It not surprising to see them, it's just not common.

While working from home I walked down the street to get some fish and chips.  There was a sign that said I could eat them at the picnic tables, so I suffered the great impost of walking back home and eating them there.

Here in Queensland we had one new case a couple of days ago; but, we're locking out those bloody Victorians who had 400 new case today!  If worse comes to worst I'm scared of wearing a mask.

You need a bit more of that bulldog spirit (Not my Canterbury Bulldogs though - they've only won one game.) 

There's nothing to fear except fear itself.

It ok to use the word Nazi or compare Trump to Adolf Hitler according to Godwins Law, dont forget that!!

In December 2015, Godwin commented on the Nazi and fascist comparisons being made by several articles about Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump, saying: "If you're thoughtful about it and show some real awareness of history, go ahead and refer to Hitler when you talk about Trump, or any other politician."^[12] In August 2017, Godwin made similar remarks on social networking websites Facebook and Twitter with respect to the two previous days' Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, endorsing and encouraging efforts to compare its alt-right organizers to Nazis.^[13][

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

[Timothy]

[+and-then]

On 7/16/2020 at 3:31 AM, Setton said:

Because you can't get a handle on the rest of your country.

You mean to disarm everyone in all 50 states, I take it.  Not that this is even possible but most drugs are illegal and there is an unending flow from the south.  Do we disarm Mexico and Central America as well?

[bee]

 

pic
 

don't laugh... 

it's better than nothing and if someone else is wearing a cabbage leaf you are doubly protected...
(aaaaand you can use a fresh leaf next time you go out )

plus - an added bonus - if someone pees on your face it will just roll off - like water off a ducks back...

 

 

[Setton]

2 hours ago, and then said:

You mean to disarm everyone in all 50 states, I take it.  Not that this is even possible but most drugs are illegal and there is an unending flow from the south.  Do we disarm Mexico and Central America as well?

No, you get a sensible control over your border.

Like almost every mainland European country.

[+Desertrat56]

4 hours ago, Setton said:

No, you get a sensible control over your border.

Like almost every mainland European country.

I think being on an island makes you idealistic about borders.  All your borders (except the North & South of Ireland) are surrounded by sea and I understand you still have plenty of illegal immigrants, drug trafficking and slave trades passing your borders.  I still get irked at how judgmental some of you are about something you know nothing about.  And sure, it was not easy, but somehow your government was able to convince you to give up your guns, so only the criminals have them.  Really makes your kids safer.

Edited July 19, 2020 by Desertrat56

[Setton]

33 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

I think being on an island makes you idealistic about borders.  All your borders (except the North & South of Ireland) are surrounded by sea and I understand you still have plenty of illegal immigrants, drug trafficking and slave trades passing your borders.  I still get irked at how judgmental some of you are about something you know nothing about.  And sure, it was not easy, but somehow your government was able to convince you to give up your guns, so only the criminals have them.  Really makes your kids safer.

As I've previously shown you:

1. The government didn't take our guns, we got rid of them by choice.

2. Our kids are objectively safer as a result.

And in the post you quoted I specifically said mainland European countries. I know American geography is typically laughable but the UK is not on the mainland. 

[Essan]

3 minutes ago, Setton said:

As I've previously shown you:

1. The government didn't take our guns, we got rid of them by choice.

2. Our kids are objectively safer as a result.

And in the post you quoted I specifically said mainland European countries. I know American geography is typically laughable but the UK is not on the mainland. 

Most of us didn't have or want guns anyway.  

And those few - well, over a million people, actually - who do need them have them.    We just don't use them for killing each other.

[+Desertrat56]

1 hour ago, Setton said:

As I've previously shown you:

1. The government didn't take our guns, we got rid of them by choice.

2. Our kids are objectively safer as a result.

And in the post you quoted I specifically said mainland European countries. I know American geography is typically laughable but the UK is not on the mainland. 

I was responding to your observations based on the fact that you say you are in England, so it doesn't matter what borders you were talking about.

[Setton]

4 hours ago, Desertrat56 said:

I was responding to your observations based on the fact that you say you are in England, so it doesn't matter what borders you were talking about.

Well kind of does. As I clearly wasn't talking about England's borders.

[psyche101]

On 7/18/2020 at 5:32 PM, bee said:

 BUT....in my heart I think this is, in essence a fake pandemic, being hyped up as part of a political agenda... it's a nasty virus that a very small % of population can get complications and die from... but I wonder if this is training for a move into more authoritarian rule...

 

Then your heart is colder than ice Bee.

I personally know someone who is from the UK. Her mother lost two sisters to the pandemic. They don't seem to think it's fake. 

When you make cold hearted comments like that, do you spare a thought for those who suffered? 

[+Desertrat56]

4 hours ago, Setton said:

Well kind of does. As I clearly wasn't talking about England's borders.

Which was my point.

[+and-then]

4 hours ago, psyche101 said:

When you make cold hearted comments like that, do you spare a thought for those who suffered? 

One might ask if those who are advising extreme lock-down-type measures, have considered the morbidity and mortality that flows as a consequence of that.  The CFR IS very limited and yes, every life lost too soon is a tragedy for their family but we have to keep things in perspective.  The 1918 Influenza was FAR worse than this and they went about their life normally, as best they could.  No government handouts and few restrictions.

This virus is indeed a scourge and is causing unnecessary suffering and death but life goes on just as it always has done.