Alexei Navalny ill from suspected poisoning

[Setton]

4 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:

An election isn`t corrupt simply because the media says it is. 

Evidence is required. I am not pro-Putin, but I understand the geopolitical games which go one. The EU wants Belarus aligned to them so without actual evidence of a corrupt election we need to take their claims with a pinch of salt. If there is evidence, then let it be set out. If it shows beyond a reasonable doubt that the election was corrupt then action should be taken.

Until then I just see media bickering from a media well known to always have an agenda.

So instead we should take the word of Belarus, a dictatorship closely allied with Putin, on the condition of a patient who is nowhere near Belarus?

Yeah, seems about standard for you.

[Setton]

@Cookie Monster Out of interest, who would you believe if they told you Putin was having opponents poisoned?

Alexander Litvenyenko? Sergei and Julia Skripal? Dawn Sturgess? DS Bailey? Boris Johnson? The government?

Because all of them are either telling you that, hiding from that or dead from that.

[aztek]

strange thing is, belarus has higher standards off living than russia, or ukraine, its factories, farms are working their roads are envy of russians,  free education, free medicine, free kindergartens.  gvmnt corruption is nowhere near level like in russia or ukraine,  i do not believe lukashenko got 80%, but i do not believe change of regime would be an improvement, just look at ukraine,  as strange as it sounds, they were much better off under tyrant yanukovych. be careful what you wish for,  however the way belarus omon treats porotesters, it is pretty bad,  appalling actually.  they are trying to install fear in people's minds, but that is for an entire different topic, i'm surprised it was not opened yet, even thou it has been going on for weeks now

Edited August 21, 2020 by aztek

[LV-426]

2 hours ago, Setton said:

Belarus is actively cozying up to Russia. They want Russia to help them uphold the corrupt election that just kept the incumbent president in power.

 

Exactly.

Not really the surprise of the century that Putin gets the backing of "Belarussian doctors" on one hand, while offering military aid to quash the demonstrations with the other

[Setton]

1 hour ago, aztek said:

strange thing is, belarus has higher standards off living than russia, or ukraine, its factories, farms are working their roads are envy of russians,  free education, free medicine, free kindergartens.  gvmnt corruption is nowhere near level like in russia or ukraine,  i do not believe lukashenko got 80%, but i do not believe change of regime would be an improvement, just look at ukraine,  as strange as it sounds, they were much better off under tyrant yanukovych. be careful what you wish for,  however the way belarus omon treats porotesters, it is pretty bad,  appalling actually.  they are trying to install fear in people's minds, but that is for an entire different topic, i'm surprised it was not opened yet, even thou it has been going on for weeks now

Never thought I'd see an American republican argue for an effective tyrant over an ineffective elected representative 

[Still Waters]

Update:

Quote

Russian doctors have agreed to allow the country's opposition leader Alexei Navalny, who is in a coma after a suspected poisoning, to leave the country for treatment.

He said Mr Navalny's condition had "stabilised" but that his wife and brother "took the risks on themselves" for his transfer.

The Putin critic's supporters say delays to his transfer were designed to allow enough time for any poison to leave his system.

https://news.sky.com/story/alexei-navalny-poisoned-russian-opposition-leader-allowed-to-travel-abroad-for-treatment-doctor-says-12054005

 

[+and-then]

On 8/20/2020 at 11:49 AM, Cookie Monster said:

I mean the news, it says he was.

My guess is that it's generally understood that those who poke the little bear are apt to meet with disagreeable outcomes.  He DOES seem to have a weird affection for poisoning his opponents.

[Helen of Annoy]

1 hour ago, and then said:

My guess is that it's generally understood that those who poke the little bear are apt to meet with disagreeable outcomes.  He DOES seem to have a weird affection for poisoning his opponents.

And you are on his side. Ew.  

 

https://www.businessinsider.com/revealed-donald-trump-letters-to-vladimir-putin-miss-universe-russia-2020-8
 

Quote

 

Years before becoming president, Donald Trump told Russian President Vladimir Putin that "I'm a big fan of yours" and pleaded with him to be guest of honor at a Miss Universe pageant.

"Congratulations on being named Time magazine's 'Man of the Year' — you definitely deserve it. As you have probably heard, I'm a big fan of yours!" Trump wrote.

 

 

 

Congratulations to German doctors who did not give up. Navalny was brought to Berlin today, he's alive and I hope he will outlive the one who poisoned him and all his allies too.  

https://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/andrej-nawalny-flieger-mit-krankem-kremlkritiker-an-bord-in-berlin-gelandet-a-56d1e29a-00ee-495e-99fa-0b1ab66ca3c4

(link in German, contains the photo of Navalny's transfer from the plane)

Edited August 22, 2020 by Helen of Annoy

[+susieice]

He's in Berlin now.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-53871617

[Duke Wellington]

19 hours ago, Setton said:

So instead we should take the word of Belarus, a dictatorship closely allied with Putin, on the condition of a patient who is nowhere near Belarus?

Yeah, seems about standard for you.

And look at your attitudes towards Trump, they just hi-light how you never require actual evidence on anything.

[Duke Wellington]

2 hours ago, and then said:

My guess is that it's generally understood that those who poke the little bear are apt to meet with disagreeable outcomes.  He DOES seem to have a weird affection for poisoning his opponents.

We are quick to judge though when the evidence isn`t yet in.

[Setton]

2 hours ago, Helen of Annoy said:

And you are on his side. Ew.  

 

https://www.businessinsider.com/revealed-donald-trump-letters-to-vladimir-putin-miss-universe-russia-2020-8
 

 

 

Congratulations to German doctors who did not give up. Navalny was brought to Berlin today, he's alive and I hope he will outlive the one who poisoned him and all his allies too.  

https://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/andrej-nawalny-flieger-mit-krankem-kremlkritiker-an-bord-in-berlin-gelandet-a-56d1e29a-00ee-495e-99fa-0b1ab66ca3c4

(link in German, contains the photo of Navalny's transfer from the plane)

No doubt @Cookie Monster will soon be turning to the very best Mongolian doctors for the latest updates on his condition.

[Setton]

1 hour ago, Cookie Monster said:

And look at your attitudes towards Trump, they just hi-light how you never require actual evidence on anything.

And Trump fits into this little fantasy how, exactly?

I ask again, who would you believe if they told you Putin is having opponents poisoned?

[Duke Wellington]

1 hour ago, Setton said:

And Trump fits into this little fantasy how, exactly?

I ask again, who would you believe if they told you Putin is having opponents poisoned?

Your fantasy world you mean.

You need to learn that facts and evidence are required for an argument. Until then we speculate.

[Setton]

20 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:

Your fantasy world you mean.

You need to learn that facts and evidence are required for an argument. Until then we speculate.

But we speculate based on available evidence and reliability of sources.

In the question of did Russia poison an opposition leader, Russia is not a reliable source. Neither is Belarus. 

His family is slightly more reliable.

Ergo, they are the ones we believe for now.

[Still Waters]

Quote

British foreign secretary Dominic Raab has called for a "full and transparent investigation" into the suspected poisoning of Russian activist Alexei Navalny.

Mr Navalny, a prominent critic of Russian president Vladimir Putin, is in a coma after drinking a cup of tea reportedly laced with poison.

https://news.sky.com/story/alexei-navalny-raab-calls-for-full-and-transparent-investigation-into-poisoning-of-putin-critic-12054762

 

[aztek]

they say  the tea he drank last was given to him by his staff,  but if he was poisoned the poison could have been ingested  days before, and now no traces left,  i have little doubts they will find anything. he'll be lucky if he makes it and still in sound mnd.

[Tatetopa]

On 8/22/2020 at 2:38 AM, Cookie Monster said:

And look at your attitudes towards Trump, they just hi-light how you never require actual evidence on anything.

Maybe our attitude will improve when:

On 8/21/2020 at 7:35 AM, aztek said:

factories, farms are working their roads are envy of russians,  free education, free medicine, free kindergartens.  gvmnt corruption is nowhere near level like in russia or ukraine, 

That would be some actual evidence that he is doing a terrific job.

[aztek]

On 8/22/2020 at 5:40 AM, Cookie Monster said:

We are quick to judge though when the evidence isn`t yet in.

i almost never agree with this this guy, but i think he is more right in this case than wrong.  i do not think traces of poison will ever be found,  but for now we do not know, hopefully german labs will have sensitive enough equipment and experienced people operating them,   what we know so far, there was nothing found in his system that can send a healthy young men into a coma, and given putin record of murdering his opponents, critics, including using poison, this theory has more grounds to exist than no

 

[aztek]

@Cookie Monster   

https://docjournals.com/shirtstories/?ignore_ids=4379,11263

Edited August 23, 2020 by aztek

[Still Waters]

Update:

Quote

Alexei Navalny: Tests indicate Russian dissident was poisoned, German doctors say

German doctors treating Russian dissident Alexei Navalny say tests indicate he was poisoned.

Doctors at Charite-Universitatsmedizin Berlin, where the Putin critic has been since being transferred from Siberia on Saturday, said: "The clinical findings indicate intoxication by a substance from the cholinesterase inhibitor group.

"The specific substance has not been identified so far and a further wide-ranging analysis has been initiated. The effect of the toxin, i.e. the cholinesterase inhibition in the organism, has been proven several times and in independent laboratories."

They said Mr Navalny remains in an artificial coma and is in a serious condition "but there is currently no acute danger to his life".

https://news.sky.com/story/alexei-navalny-tests-indicate-russian-dissident-was-poisoned-german-doctors-say-12055768

 

[aztek]

wow, you do not say, who knew?

[Duke Wellington]

3 hours ago, Still Waters said:

Update:

 

Thats something similar to nerve gas.

[Setton]

33 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:

Thats something similar to nerve gas.

Oh, so now he was poisoned?

[Duke Wellington]

3 minutes ago, Setton said:

Oh, so now he was poisoned?

I never said he wasn`t, I said slow down until we know.