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the13bats

The Presidential Debates

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Sir Wearer of Hats
On 10/26/2020 at 10:49 PM, Setton said:

And yet anyone who doesn't back Trump is apparently a fifth columnist/socialist/communist/anarchist etc.

Just going to leave this here:

 

unnamed.jpg

Except, Sith don’t actually deal in absolutes, Jedi do. Jedi say “you cannot love” whereas Sith say “sure, love someone. It’s a weakness someone might exploit, but if it empowers you do it”. Jedi say “don’t kill” but happily cut off arms and kill “whenever necessary” while Sith say “whatever floats your boat”. Jedi have loads of rules, the Sith one - if you are not the Predator, you are prey. No Sith are prey”. 

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Sir Wearer of Hats
On 10/27/2020 at 1:50 AM, joc said:

Maybe it would help if you explain how 'the rich' have gotten too powerful...and what is 'too' powerful?  Define 'too powerful'.  And what would a 'fairer' system look like?

Well, a good start would be “if you are found guilty of rape, you go to gaol not be told “don’t be a naughty boy” and have no conviction recorded because “it might negatively impact his future career””. 

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lightly
7 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Umm.. the 'effort' to protect South Korea from North Korea failed ???

Oops,  no, I guess not....a $talemate...after people got sick enough of it.   It was a huge money maker for the military industrial complex investors for a long as possible.    ... Luckily  the Vietnam War came along shortly thereafter.     Now that was a glowing success for it's investors..just ask Kissinger. And probably Nixon.

      We didn't win in Korea, or Vietnam , (military Failures) .... but that wasn't the real 'objective' anyway !

 

Edited by lightly
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joc
11 hours ago, lightly said:

:lol:.   .. Well, maybe yor right, and everything is just fine and dandy.   I don't think so.    Your likely to think I'm nuts...but here is what I actually think.   I think the Korean War, the Vietnam War, and the escapades in the Middle East during the Bush years ,we're ALL, primarily staged to make money from 'defence' contracts. .     We were told that it was absolutely imperative that S. Korea be defended from N. Korea.     We were told that it was equally crucial to our national interests that S. Vietnam be defended from N. Vietnam.   Both 'efforts' failed of course, But....the amounts of money spent/made was astronomical!  

During the Vietnam war, for example, millions of tons of shells were poured into the jungles from 'fire bases' to 'soften' the invisible enemy.  ..Remember the illegal bombings of adjoining Cambodia?    Once again, millions of tons of bombs were poured out on the jungles ,even though everyone involved already knew a withdrawal from the war was eminent.

To make a long story short...look at the amounts of money spent/made,on jets,armaments,ammo,fuel,and EVERYTHING else, to supply and carry out all of the Mid East escapades. Look alone at the amounts of PETROLEUM bought and sold.  Remember who was in charge?  G.W. Bush...Dick Cheney...Donald Rumsfeld..   Who just happened to be Heavily invested in PETROLEUM.

They must have made BILLIONS.... most of it probably stashed away in 'offshore' accounts.     Ok, that's just a small taste of the sorts of 'policy' influence I'm talking about.    

Even the war in Afghanistan...which of course had to be waged ,in large part, to crush the opium/heroin trade... Accomplished what?  Other than a much increased and flourishing opium/heroin trade.    ???

Any groups which formed to defend their lands from the Invasions were labeled TERRORISTS.    Ok, I'll stop now..I told you you'd think I was nuts.  :P  I'm perfectly serious however.

Strength through Peace !  :lol:

 

I understand your cynicism; however, there are very sound reasons for Korea and Vietnam and I think you err  by glossing over them...actually, not even mentioning them.  But thank you for the thought process.  No doubt...a lot of people made a LOT of money.   But lets take a look at the underlying reason for the mindset of the military and government officials at that time.

We came out of WWII and almost immediately into a cold war with Russia...and very heated up Nuclear Arms Race.  Meanwhile...the Berlin Wall, Soviet Union coming online, and the subsequent blitz of the Russianesque version of Hitler was quite alarming.  Especially with the rhetoric coming from the Russian side.   They were empowering countries like North Korea and North Vietnam to stage an invasion of South Korea and later South Vietnam...and you cannot forget that the United States had treaties with these two countries basically guaranteeing them protection against such an invasion.   And later...the Soviets were still playing the same game in South America.  Most probably had we not had the intervention of Reagan...we would all be under Soviet Control today.

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joc
4 hours ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Well, a good start would be “if you are found guilty of rape, you go to gaol not be told “don’t be a naughty boy” and have no conviction recorded because “it might negatively impact his future career””. 

who was found guilty of rape?  You lost me...

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Hankenhunter
On 10/25/2020 at 9:10 PM, RavenHawk said:

Yes, we ask ourselves this.  It would never happen to Joe, but it has happened with Obama.  And there is a big difference between Obama and Trump.  I think one could argue that a certain level of narcissism is shared between the two as well as a strong charisma.  But the main difference is character.  Obama’s character is bad and Trump’s is good.  That’s in the simplest terms.  Now that doesn’t mean that if you have good character that you are without flaw.  That’s not what character is. 

 

 

 

Obama had a lifetime to try to mask his character through being highly articulate and convincing himself and others that this community organizer was working for the people.  Obama has other ideas of grandeur.  Obama would speak out of both sides of his mouth.  One side would say “you didn’t build that” which doesn’t build people up; it degrades them.  And on the other side “if you see something, say something”, trying to zombie-ize his followers to point out Conservative thought to eradicate.  And then there was the big lie, “if you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor”.  How many lost their insurance and their doctor with that one?  Under the ACA, doctors have been retiring in droves.  The rationing had begun.  Under Obama, Hilary, Biden, and Kerry (at least) were making money while serving.  All of these things are due to bad character.  These are not gaffs or fumbles, they are as intended.  It is corruption at the highest levels.

 

 

 

Trump has been losing money while serving.  He donates his salary.  He builds people up.  He’s made the economy stronger and robust.  He has gotten our allies to pull their weight.  He’s brought peace to the Middle East (or at least a shot at it) and getting us out of endless wars.  He has taken on the foreign and domestic enemies of this country.  The man has abundant energy and he pours that into making this country greater.  That is good character.

 

 

 

With Obama, you could hear the chants of “O-Ba-ma, O-Ba-ma…”  Very reminiscent of “Im-Ho-Tep”.  It was hypnotic and devilishly mindlessness.  It was uber-serious; calling the army together.  It’s not the same with Trump.  It is true affection, not mindless obedience.  The crowd is not hypnotized.  It’s more like a rock concert or tailgate party.  Everyone is there having fun.  It’s free, it’s loose.  Trump raises the people’s awareness, not as minions to do his bidding, but for individual prosperity.  He inspires the individual.  Obama is a negative force and Trump is a positive force.  Which one do you think will win out?  Trump has us on the road to success.  And success will remove division.

 

 

Pure whargarble, pure, and simple. The same tripe you've been repeating for years. None of it true, and proven so time, and time again. 

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Hankenhunter
11 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Umm.. the 'effort' to protect South Korea from North Korea failed ???

Do you history much? Sad, low energy. I'd definitely call North Korea a failure, and continues to be a failure to this day.

Edited by Hankenhunter
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Sir Wearer of Hats
48 minutes ago, joc said:

who was found guilty of rape?  You lost me...

Quite a few American (rich) teenagers found Guilty but no charge recorded because “of their good character” or “the judge didn’t want this to impact upon their future unduly”.

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Arbenol
5 hours ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Quite a few American (rich) teenagers found Guilty but no charge recorded because “of their good character” or “the judge didn’t want this to impact upon their future unduly”.

I thought you were referring to some NRL players.;)

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bee
On 10/25/2020 at 8:07 AM, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

People screaming ‘I love you’ at politicians scare me, not fill me with a feeling of love.

 

what about chanting about LIKING a politician..... is that ok in your book...... :cat:

 

 

from July 2016..

At the Republican National Convention, the crowd chants "We like Mike" while Donald Trump's running mate, Mike Pence, criticizes the Obama administration and recites the pledge of allegiance.

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Hankenhunter
8 hours ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Quite a few American (rich) teenagers found Guilty but no charge recorded because “of their good character” or “the judge didn’t want this to impact upon their future. 

It's a pretty graphic description of the assaults, so be prepared. A prime example of the affluence rapes you're posting about. :(

https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/judge-james-troiano-brock-turner-sexual-assault-855415/

 

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lightly
13 hours ago, joc said:

I understand your cynicism; however, there are very sound reasons for Korea and Vietnam and I think you err  by glossing over them...actually, not even mentioning them.  But thank you for the thought process.  No doubt...a lot of people made a LOT of money.   But lets take a look at the underlying reason for the mindset of the military and government officials at that time.

We came out of WWII and almost immediately into a cold war with Russia...and very heated up Nuclear Arms Race.  Meanwhile...the Berlin Wall, Soviet Union coming online, and the subsequent blitz of the Russianesque version of Hitler was quite alarming.  Especially with the rhetoric coming from the Russian side.   They were empowering countries like North Korea and North Vietnam to stage an invasion of South Korea and later South Vietnam...and you cannot forget that the United States had treaties with these two countries basically guaranteeing them protection against such an invasion.   And later...the Soviets were still playing the same game in South America.  Most probably had we not had the intervention of Reagan...we would all be under Soviet Control today.

Thanks joc,   I hear ya, ^ that is the general 'understanding' of that situation , and made for excellent 'reasons'.  it's fascinating how completely differently we view 'things'.      I suspect ,the truth of the matters lies somewhere in between.     

     maybe the immense wealth amassed by some ,due to those sorts of events, was (and IS) just a 'fortunate'  and natural result.        maybe my conspiracy theory is wacko, but there seems to be some sort of History of such things. ?.  you know, people getting rich off wars. ???   It's almost enough to make me suspicious . !  :P

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joc
On 10/28/2020 at 8:34 PM, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Quite a few American (rich) teenagers found Guilty but no charge recorded because “of their good character” or “the judge didn’t want this to impact upon their future unduly”.

 Irrelevant to the discussion.  

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Sir Wearer of Hats
27 minutes ago, joc said:

 Irrelevant to the discussion.  

You said to define how the rich had gotten too powerful, I said “they get let off rape charges”. If that’s irrelevant, than so is your question.

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joc
58 minutes ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

You said to define how the rich had gotten too powerful, I said “they get let off rape charges”. If that’s irrelevant, than so is your question.

alrighty then...if that's the best you got....

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joc
On 10/29/2020 at 8:56 AM, lightly said:

Thanks joc,   I hear ya, ^ that is the general 'understanding' of that situation , and made for excellent 'reasons'.  it's fascinating how completely differently we view 'things'.      I suspect ,the truth of the matters lies somewhere in between.     

     maybe the immense wealth amassed by some ,due to those sorts of events, was (and IS) just a 'fortunate'  and natural result.        maybe my conspiracy theory is wacko, but there seems to be some sort of History of such things. ?.  you know, people getting rich off wars. ???   It's almost enough to make me suspicious . !  :P

Well actually...you do have a point.  Some might say...The 'real' wealth was acquired by the Knights Templar.  Once the King of France executed the top members, the rest went into hiding along with their wealth.   Some might say... The Shriners, The Masons, Rotary Club, etc.  are remnants of the Templars...and the 'real' money...old...money is there and those entities are controlled by the elite...

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Sir Wearer of Hats
21 minutes ago, joc said:

alrighty then...if that's the best you got....

The best what? Piece of evidence that the rich are literally treated differently by the law? Yeap, that’s a pretty solid one.

not the best ‘comeback’ though. I’m Australian, those tend to involve more profanity and directions to do physically impossible things, most usually involving anuses. 

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Golden Duck
On 10/31/2020 at 11:41 AM, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

The best what? Piece of evidence that the rich are literally treated differently by the law? Yeap, that’s a pretty solid one.

not the best ‘comeback’ though. I’m Australian, those tend to involve more profanity and directions to do physically impossible things, most usually involving anuses. 

XVZfcHuVoHe_fwuMqmBGCYIxdpA4GmQzi_ZvbePhBS9__gaHnPyjEwK7qn-FxIVEnhAhKUJLbDFiOCSW_fBlzWoRdWSLdaXKzxNd21BaQINwXL-IjlUVUgaOlFmf_73UIw73GmLNvZ5ofnu3wvms6rvbkc3ETUsquxiABz-okHHKhLPtJ_V4kZem37Cfe0dBuV8RWZBGgssaLZPitS0VpXbxFSmk1LqQdRVBnBPLdqkhq0bOiXSP6HtWNJqyBS5ghDlMM6gBUJ62FFuJYASNZPQlZFTxghMug6Q5C_hkcoFcKmgL-2Truyf2QQsQTmMtLlst4ENBbYpkzFSe5GPn7H-ZNz6nL9KeR0LSCNOZsM0uF0jty4nm82h4431f9q5TYsE67isJbycX06udrm-MsW8DOjKQJGMFSJzMb17_386o10MaWvFDJxO4RczUEKLtUTzSpLkfpvjMzFYJ0XurUwTOolP-qzEKs6N08qcBy9B6yAdCRkSyEChUClukITyqtG3qu3gLcKH777qJwiezePka07IdG7sZ0G3mdEeRh9Cdu3IoDCjKVsuBikhV1RzxN3Z2kuAhvH2RoJGUJt5zKZJbLN5t-rDm-iQArV9vicov-P9VNKHtgnb6NkLclNWnQD6UGdsYJX-AvD5wsSlrUgaEmE1MiMRi9ILt5twBgPYTUqy3c9k8E1dc4Gct=w300-h394-no?authuser=0

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