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janesix

There was no advanced ancient civilization

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Thanos5150
2 hours ago, cormac mac airt said:

It depends on what you’re using as the definition of “modern”. If it’s “anatomically modern” then your talking about the last 200,000 - 300,000 years but if you’re talking about cranio-morphologically or behaviorally modern then the timeframe is reduced to the last circa 100,000 years. Speculations would have to adjust from the latter. 

Can you please give examples with links if possible to modern "cranio-morphology" prior to 50,000BP? 

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OverSword
8 minutes ago, janesix said:

Show you how? All you need to do is study history. The first civilizations even SAY everything was given to them/shown to them. 

Hi janesix.  Here is a pretty good explanation about what it takes for a civilization to develop and the different things that happen to accommodate that.

https://www.khanacademy.org/humanities/world-history/world-history-beginnings/birth-agriculture-neolithic-revolution/a/introduction-what-is-civilization

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janesix
7 minutes ago, OverSword said:

Hi janesix.  Here is a pretty good explanation about what it takes for a civilization to develop and the different things that happen to accommodate that.

https://www.khanacademy.org/humanities/world-history/world-history-beginnings/birth-agriculture-neolithic-revolution/a/introduction-what-is-civilization

I will read it later and respond. I have to do some work soon.

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jethrofloyd
24 minutes ago, OverSword said:

Each and every one with a river leading to the sea and with coastal cities.

Yes, but every coastal city is almost always a youngest part of civilization. Take for example Egypt: The city of Alexandria(on Mediterranean Sea) is the youngest city in Egypt. The simple question would be, why Great Pyramids are not build on the shores of the Mediterranean Sea, but rather in the inland of Egypt? Civilizations first developed inland in a valleys of large rivers, only to gradually spread to the shores as well.

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janesix
19 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

We are idiots. Show us links to prove your point.

Ok. I probably won't be able to do that until tomorrow. 

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Abramelin

We will thus be awaiting the light that will brighten our spirits.

Sigh...

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Xeno-Fish

5042838544.jpg

You'll need it.

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jaylemurph
3 hours ago, papageorge1 said:

 I'm still listening to the Graham Hancock types too.

And as long as you continue to throw down $24.95 a pop for the chance to do so, they’ll continue to create prodigies for you to marvel at. Funny, that.

—Jaylemurph 

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cladking

Of course there was an advanced ancient civilization.  Somebody had to invent agriculture and cities. To do this requires knowledge of anatomy. biology. zoology, botany, and mathematics not to mention psychology, forensics, architecture, and materials handling.

Modern people want to ascribe their success to trial and error or superstition but the real world doesn't work this way.  

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jaylemurph
1 hour ago, jethrofloyd said:

Yes, but every coastal city is almost always a youngest part of civilization.

Kinda falls apart in the New World...

—Jaylemurph 

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Essan
15 minutes ago, cladking said:

Of course there was an advanced ancient civilization.  Somebody had to invent agriculture and cities. To do this requires knowledge of anatomy. biology. zoology, botany, and mathematics not to mention psychology, forensics, architecture, and materials handling.

Modern people want to ascribe their success to trial and error or superstition but the real world doesn't work this way.  

So how did this hypothetical advanced civilisation invent agriculture and cities?

Let me guess.  It's turtles all the way down ;)  

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Essan
18 minutes ago, jaylemurph said:

Kinda falls apart in the New World...

—Jaylemurph 

You mean they never advanced to the stage of having coastal cities?

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jaylemurph
5 minutes ago, Essan said:

You mean they never advanced to the stage of having coastal cities?

No, I was thinking more along the lines of “New York and Los Angeles are older than (say) Memphis or Boulder.”

—Jaylemurph 

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Essan
1 minute ago, jaylemurph said:

No, I was thinking more along the lines of “New York and Los Angeles are older than (say) Memphis or Boulder.”

—Jaylemurph 

But are NY and LA evidence of advanced civilisations?   I think not ...... ;)  

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Tom1200
2 hours ago, cormac mac airt said:

No, it actually didn’t and if you studied the cultures that existed in any given area prior to a civilizations start you would know this. No civilization started fully fledged. 
 

cormac

Not true.  The Irish popped into existence overnight in 1759, complete with all the essentials of civilisation - beer, pubs, poitin, crisps, breweries, pigs trotters, distilleries, pickled eggs, taverns and stills.  And folk songs.  Lots and lots of folk songs.

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Tom1200
1 hour ago, cladking said:

Of course there was an advanced ancient civilization.  Somebody had to invent agriculture and cities. To do this requires knowledge of anatomy. biology. zoology, botany, and mathematics not to mention psychology, forensics, architecture, and materials handling.

Modern people want to ascribe their success to trial and error or superstition but the real world doesn't work this way.  

Have you ever written anything that remotely makes sense?

But please elucidate further - how exactly is a knowledge of anatomy necessary to plant some seeds and hope they grow?  Exactly how crucial is forensics to constructing a collection of buildings and hoping they don't fall down too quickly?

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cladking
1 hour ago, Essan said:

So how did this hypothetical advanced civilisation invent agriculture and cities?

Let me guess.  It's turtles all the way down ;)  

I'd love to talk about my theory but that seems to be off-topic by definition.  

Why don't you tell me what YOUR theory is and we can talk about that.  Just remember the idea that they were ignorant and superstitious or worked by trial and error is a non-starter.  

 

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Hanslune
1 hour ago, jaylemurph said:

And as long as you continue to throw down $24.95 a pop for the chance to do so, they’ll continue to create prodigies for you to marvel at. Funny, that.

—Jaylemurph 

I'm looking forward to where he will put his lost civilization next, he keeps moving it around, abandoning that idea and putting it somewhere else, started with Antarctic and lately has it pinned down to 'North America' or was it the Americas?

 

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cladking
20 minutes ago, Tom1200 said:

Have you ever written anything that remotely makes sense?

But please elucidate further - how exactly is a knowledge of anatomy necessary to plant some seeds and hope they grow?  Exactly how crucial is forensics to constructing a collection of buildings and hoping they don't fall down too quickly?

Well... ...for starters you'll need to know the males from the females.  In practice most things are far more complex than this but that's hard to see when you're born into a culture that has grocery stores and power plants.  

You'll need some knowledge of how things work to figure out who burned down the barn or murdered the farmer but this is easy to forget when all you have to do is call 911.

 

Peopple have the crazy idea that things are easier when it's simple and you don't know anything.  This is not how the real world operates.  

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Hanslune
1 hour ago, cladking said:

Of course there was an advanced ancient civilization.  Somebody had to invent agriculture and cities. To do this requires knowledge of anatomy. biology. zoology, botany, and mathematics not to mention psychology, forensics, architecture, and materials handling.

Modern people want to ascribe their success to trial and error or superstition but the real world doesn't work this way.  

Cladking if you want to discuss YOUR ideas (again) start your own thread, you're a big boy you can do it instead of trying to hijack this one.

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Tom1200
3 minutes ago, cladking said:

Just remember the idea that they were ignorant and superstitious or worked by trial and error is a non-starter.  

C'mon Claddy - you can do better than that.

2 minutes ago, cladking said:

Well... ...for starters you'll need to know the males from the females.  In practice most things are far more complex than this but that's hard to see when you're born into a culture that has grocery stores and power plants.  You'll need some knowledge of how things work to figure out who burned down the barn or murdered the farmer but this is easy to forget when all you have to do is call 911.  Peopple have the crazy idea that things are easier when it's simple and you don't know anything.  This is not how the real world operates.  

... or maybe not.

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Hanslune
1 hour ago, jaylemurph said:

Kinda falls apart in the New World...

—Jaylemurph 

The earliest one was Norte Chico and while near the coast they were also inland on rivers. Everybody else was mainly inland with some having contact with the Caribbean and a few having actual communities on the sea - Maya

 

norte-chico-map_color.jpg?w=502&h=613

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Hanslune
1 minute ago, Tom1200 said:

C'mon Claddy - you can do better than that.

... or maybe not.

Hey Tom Cladking will often take a ridiculous position as a tactic to harass people, he has been doing so since 2007 and has admitted to doing it.

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Hanslune
12 minutes ago, cladking said:

I'd love to talk about my theory but that seems to be off-topic by definition.  

Why don't you tell me what YOUR theory is and we can talk about that.  Just remember the idea that they were ignorant and superstitious or worked by trial and error is a non-starter. 

Cladking if you try to hijack this thread you will not be successful.

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cladking
8 minutes ago, Tom1200 said:

C'mon Claddy - you can do better than that.

... or maybe not.

Why don't you try this as a thought experiment.

Say your an ignorant caveman with no scientific knowledge and little more than the ability to make fire and simple tools which are passed down father to son through demonstration.  Remember you have no idea why flint breaks the way it does or what the nature of fire is.  You have no science and no scientific language or knowledge.  You believe your fate is controlled by unseen gods and you exist in a culture that forages and gathers food from myriad sources.  You can never be too far away from water and shelter so you must carry tools wand weapons with you.  OK, now start inventing a city.   Tell me how you're going to settle down and farm.  

Modern ideas simply don't work.  They don't explain how things work or how they evolved.  

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