"We become what we hate".

[markdohle]

 

"We become what we hate".

 

There is an old saying "We become what we hate". It is a paradox, absurd, yet when I attack someone on whatever grounds, I tend to become the very thing I am fighting.

 

It is as if we have seeds laying within, more or less dormant, and they only take root when watered by someone who is out front with their opinions that I do not agree with You have to fight fire with fire, which only makes a very big bonfire.

 

It is all very intimate, yet based on something other than love.

 

I do not always like my reactions to others, especially when I am looking at some injustice being done. I tend to want to take 'vengeance', which is not justice at all, so I become what I am fighting if I allow that to take deep root. I just add to the bonfire.

 

The more I seek to live the Gospel, the more the Lord allows me to see that there is a lot I have to bring to the light before I can move deeper in that direction. I don't do it, but self-knowledge allows me to be open to my need for inner healing and grace.

 

One day a woman asked me what our lives are about. I had to say I do not know, I doubt there is some simple answer. However I added when you look at the world, and our part in it, we can see that our emotions and passions cause a great deal of havoc. Just look at what 'greed' does to the world.

 

Sin is self-destruction, short sidedness, and it flows from not understanding what our lives are about. Jesus says that how we treat others, love others, love ourselves, is central, and perhaps the only thing important. All else flows from that. Love and do what you will, is not as easy as it sounds. We have layers of instinct to deal with, as well as past events that can make anyone angry, distrustful, and lead to having relationships that in the end are based on manipulation and oppression.

 

Sartre was right up to a point: "Hell is other people". Yes, but only if we are clueless about our own interior lives, and what we actually want, and how we treat others the way that we want to be treated. None of us is a commodity, but unconsciously we can live on that premise. We do inherit the whirlwind, and it seems to be getting worse from generation to generation.

 

Healing comes from not running away from ourselves, and allow our souls to be naked before God, just as Adam and Eve were in the Garden. Not as easy as it sounds, but important for developing a loving relationship with God and others. Compassion and empathy are essential, they are learned through suffering, not running away from it.--Br.MD

[Jon the frog]

It was all good before:

24 minutes ago, markdohle said:

Healing comes from not running away from ourselves, and allow our souls to be naked before God, just as Adam and Eve were in the Garden. Not as easy as it sounds, but important for developing a loving relationship with God and others. Compassion and empathy are essential, they are learned through suffering, not running away from it.--Br.MD

Why bringing ''god'' into this ?

Edited October 23, 2020 by Jon the frog

[Helen of Annoy]

53 minutes ago, Jon the frog said:

It was all good before:

Why bringing ''god'' into this ?

Why not? There's a lot of people who are religious. And even more people who might not be sure about the exact existence and nature of God, but they use the words from religious vocabulary to explain things without too many complications. 

God, higher power, universal something, or your own ethics. Vocabulary doesn't matter, in my humble opinion. The intentions do. 

 

It's always very bad idea to push religion on everyone, but it's equally bad idea to not let religious people express their faith in peace. 

So, to cut myself short - tolerance? 

 

[markdohle]

55 minutes ago, Jon the frog said:

It was all good before:

Why bringing ''god'' into this ?

Can't help myself on this issue......God for me is not a concept, but the basis of reality.  For others, God is a wasted concept. 

peace
Mark

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

GOOD LORD OHH HOW I HATE FIT HANDSOME PEOPLE!!

HATE THEM!!

Edited October 23, 2020 by Sir Wearer of Hats

[the13bats]

I was 16 maybe 17 at the central fl fair, we were goofing off heading to the sideshows i wanted to chat with Melvin Burkhart a hero of mine we were walking down the asle where all the venders were flipping ginsu knifes and trying to sell their schemes.

A guy who seemed so old then ( about 40 ) asked me to look in a little box and tell him what i saw, it was a halloween skull, he went into a proselytizing and damnation sermon,

my friend kevin was rudly trying to blow him off as a loon and get me to move on but i heard him out how that skull was me and would be me for all eternity unless of course i gave my heart ( through him ) right then and their to the lord and was saved, he struck me as a kid who sells plant seeds to win a free pony.

I thanked him and moved on but it did have an impact look how long ive remembered the event and i went on to notice that religion or rather to put a fine point on it some who are "Christians" seem to want to recruit new additions and force people to do as they say, ( not as they do, because i dont see any christians who live up to the standard they set for themselves and bestow on others )

I just dont see the draw to a religion based on fearmongering and never ending thowing in my face what a failure of a human being i am, im not perfect but i try to do right by others but through the years ive seen that skull in a nox repackaged and reworded to push compliance through fear.

Mark, im not picking on you, as you might know i never got in the religious sections of the forum to me they are sacrosanct, religion is different to me not like claims of ghosts , paranormal powers or alien abductions etc where i will yell for proof i stay away from religious people.

i give religions people respect in their beliefs and more room until they get a bit too in my space with judgemental and zealot of their beliefs and i end up on some long winded soap box like this, sorry.

I will say you seem like a super great fellow and i wish you luck in reaching the spiritual goals you have set for yourself please dont damn folks like me who dont archive that same status.

[Helen of Annoy]

@the13bats I don't think you have to worry about any damning by actual Christians. Christians don't damn anyone and they try not to judge anyone. Only God truly knows what is each person like and why.

(Personally, I'm a judgmental machine and my attempts to curb it are not particularly successful. I always end up concluding that the damn idiot should have known better. There's obviously a lot of work for me to do with my own self  )

True Christians do talk about their faith, because they truly wish you'd find your faith too. But they read the New Testament and each of them knows they must remove the plank out of their eye first if they want to remove the speck from yours, which is why I think your response to that angry preacher you encountered was immensely more Christian than his attempt to scare you into compliance with his idea of god.    

  

Edited October 24, 2020 by Helen of Annoy
grammar and speling. speeling. sppeling. ah, spelling.

[Grim Reaper 6]

16 hours ago, markdohle said:

Can't help myself on this issue......God for me is not a concept, but the basis of reality.  For others, God is a wasted concept. 

peace
Mark

Mark if you have found something to live by, and truly beleive in, that is what all people are searching for. In my opinion nothing is more important than that, and while I am not a believer I would never try to take that away from anyone else. 

I wish you and yours the best.

[Grim Reaper 6]

17 hours ago, markdohle said:

Can't help myself on this issue......God for me is not a concept, but the basis of reality.  For others, God is a wasted concept. 

peace
Mark

All that we are is the result of what we have thought: it is founded on our thoughts and made up of our thoughts. If a man speak or act with an evil thought, suffering follows him as the wheel follows the hoof of the beast that draws the wagon…. If a man speak or act with a good thought, happiness follows him like a shadow that never leaves him.”

Buddha

[Duke Wellington]

22 hours ago, markdohle said:

 

"We become what we hate".

 

There is an old saying "We become what we hate". It is a paradox, absurd, yet when I attack someone on whatever grounds, I tend to become the very thing I am fighting.

 

It is as if we have seeds laying within, more or less dormant, and they only take root when watered by someone who is out front with their opinions that I do not agree with You have to fight fire with fire, which only makes a very big bonfire.

 

It is all very intimate, yet based on something other than love.

 

I do not always like my reactions to others, especially when I am looking at some injustice being done. I tend to want to take 'vengeance', which is not justice at all, so I become what I am fighting if I allow that to take deep root. I just add to the bonfire.

 

The more I seek to live the Gospel, the more the Lord allows me to see that there is a lot I have to bring to the light before I can move deeper in that direction. I don't do it, but self-knowledge allows me to be open to my need for inner healing and grace.

 

One day a woman asked me what our lives are about. I had to say I do not know, I doubt there is some simple answer. However I added when you look at the world, and our part in it, we can see that our emotions and passions cause a great deal of havoc. Just look at what 'greed' does to the world.

 

Sin is self-destruction, short sidedness, and it flows from not understanding what our lives are about. Jesus says that how we treat others, love others, love ourselves, is central, and perhaps the only thing important. All else flows from that. Love and do what you will, is not as easy as it sounds. We have layers of instinct to deal with, as well as past events that can make anyone angry, distrustful, and lead to having relationships that in the end are based on manipulation and oppression.

 

Sartre was right up to a point: "Hell is other people". Yes, but only if we are clueless about our own interior lives, and what we actually want, and how we treat others the way that we want to be treated. None of us is a commodity, but unconsciously we can live on that premise. We do inherit the whirlwind, and it seems to be getting worse from generation to generation.

 

Healing comes from not running away from ourselves, and allow our souls to be naked before God, just as Adam and Eve were in the Garden. Not as easy as it sounds, but important for developing a loving relationship with God and others. Compassion and empathy are essential, they are learned through suffering, not running away from it.--Br.MD

As time goes on and I learn more about religion (and I mean its schools of mysticism, not the scripture) then the more I realise all is not what it seems.

If we are prone to getting angry about something it appears more and more in our lives. If we become distrustful of others, we get an increasing number of experiences to make us distrustful. The same with greed, hate, envy, lust, etc.

For someone locked into their state of mind they cannot see it until they change their state of mind. Then the experiences they get change. As soon as a person makes such a switch they click something odd is going on with reality.

If God keeps sending people that make you angry in your life, what he is trying to teach you is compassion and forgiveness. If that person doesnt learn they get more angry, get more people come into their lives to make them angry, and this is God turning the screws. God either breaks them (if they keep failing to learn the lesson) or lets up on them once they have learned it.

[markdohle]

On 10/23/2020 at 9:58 PM, the13bats said:

I was 16 maybe 17 at the central fl fair, we were goofing off heading to the sideshows i wanted to chat with Melvin Burkhart a hero of mine we were walking down the asle where all the venders were flipping ginsu knifes and trying to sell their schemes.

A guy who seemed so old then ( about 40 ) asked me to look in a little box and tell him what i saw, it was a halloween skull, he went into a proselytizing and damnation sermon,

my friend kevin was rudly trying to blow him off as a loon and get me to move on but i heard him out how that skull was me and would be me for all eternity unless of course i gave my heart ( through him ) right then and their to the lord and was saved, he struck me as a kid who sells plant seeds to win a free pony.

I thanked him and moved on but it did have an impact look how long ive remembered the event and i went on to notice that religion or rather to put a fine point on it some who are "Christians" seem to want to recruit new additions and force people to do as they say, ( not as they do, because i dont see any christians who live up to the standard they set for themselves and bestow on others )

I just dont see the draw to a religion based on fearmongering and never ending thowing in my face what a failure of a human being i am, im not perfect but i try to do right by others but through the years ive seen that skull in a nox repackaged and reworded to push compliance through fear.

Mark, im not picking on you, as you might know i never got in the religious sections of the forum to me they are sacrosanct, religion is different to me not like claims of ghosts , paranormal powers or alien abductions etc where i will yell for proof i stay away from religious people.

i give religions people respect in their beliefs and more room until they get a bit too in my space with judgemental and zealot of their beliefs and i end up on some long winded soap box like this, sorry.

I will say you seem like a super great fellow and i wish you luck in reaching the spiritual goals you have set for yourself please dont damn folks like me who dont archive that same status.

No offense taken my friend.  Thanks for you comment.

 

peace
Mark

[markdohle]

On 10/24/2020 at 3:57 AM, Helen of Annoy said:

@the13bats I don't think you have to worry about any damning by actual Christians. Christians don't damn anyone and they try not to judge anyone. Only God truly knows what is each person like and why.

(Personally, I'm a judgmental machine and my attempts to curb it are not particularly successful. I always end up concluding that the damn idiot should have known better. There's obviously a lot of work for me to do with my own self  )

True Christians do talk about their faith, because they truly wish you'd find your faith too. But they read the New Testament and each of them knows they must remove the plank out of their eye first if they want to remove the speck from yours, which is why I think your response to that angry preacher you encountered was immensely more Christian than his attempt to scare you into compliance with his idea of god.    

  

You are very wise my friend, a a true peacemaker as well.

 

peace
Mark

[markdohle]

23 hours ago, Cookie Monster said:

As time goes on and I learn more about religion (and I mean its schools of mysticism, not the scripture) then the more I realise all is not what it seems.

If we are prone to getting angry about something it appears more and more in our lives. If we become distrustful of others, we get an increasing number of experiences to make us distrustful. The same with greed, hate, envy, lust, etc.

For someone locked into their state of mind they cannot see it until they change their state of mind. Then the experiences they get change. As soon as a person makes such a switch they click something odd is going on with reality.

If God keeps sending people that make you angry in your life, what he is trying to teach you is compassion and forgiveness. If that person doesnt learn they get more angry, get more people come into their lives to make them angry, and this is God turning the screws. God either breaks them (if they keep failing to learn the lesson) or lets up on them once they have learned it.

Yes, until we learn, the cycle continues and gets worse.

Peace
Mark

[the13bats]

I dont hate anyone and those who do things to me i dont like i just avoid.

Life is hard enough just living so I doubt i will ever "get it" as far a god who wants to turn screws to force lessons on me or break me if i dont become Reek from GOT or Evey from V.

Job did very well, i would fail.

I guess im doomed for hell for placing compasion ahead of persecution

I guess if i did take anything away from this thread its leave others alone, let them have their opinions its their path dont try to change them as you are no better than them when you judge that deem in your mind that they need repairs and attack from you,

This thread made me think the thread and a really nasty thing im going through and its a glaring fact a people cant play both sides nor should they play "God".

Anyway, i will run out by saying i respect and like this thread more than any ive seen in a very long time.

 

 

[aztek]

Quote

There is an old saying "We become what we hate". It is a paradox, absurd, yet when I attack someone on whatever grounds, I tend to become the very thing I am fighting.

that is totally backwards,  he does not become the thing he hates, he was always that thing,  he just never realized, hate does not make you anything,  it only brings out what you always had inside.