jmccr8 Posted January 21, 2021 Author #101 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) 28 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said: To postulate something exists, without a shred of direct evidence, is an argument or rationalization without proof. It is not falsifiable. In dealing with the concept of something that creates universes we stray beyond human experience, beyond human comprehension. We are, thus, reduced to the same status of our primitive ancestors, huddled around campfires, anthropomorphizing deities to explain lightning, rain and thunder, the sun, moon and stars and all other natural phenomena that surrounded and bewildered them. In this thread I see the same thing happening, gods created in our own image, not so much the image of our flesh, but in the image of our own minds. Hi Hammer We will see how things go this topic has derailed and closed dozens of threads and never been resolved so this is the pit and we aren't peeing in anyone else's pool so It seems to be a reasonable resolution for fair discussion. I gave the OP specifically tailored to Walker's claims and defensives of primarily Christians and the attributes of the god of that religion as an comparative for requirements that his alien needs to satisfy to validate his position edited to include all of the Abrahamic religions jmccr8 Edited January 21, 2021 by jmccr8 added context 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Hammerclaw Posted January 21, 2021 #102 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Mr Walker said: There may well be other beings out there which are so unrecognisable to us that we cant relate to them, or them to us. Thus they cant be gods to us. It is the connection and similarity which enables one being to be a god to/for another being. Likewise with constructs. Not much point in constructing a god who cant speak your language or hear you. We have no more evidence for aliens than we do the gods of Olympus. All we have are stories and the desire to believe and human beings are capable of convincing themselves of the realty of pretty much anything. Edited January 21, 2021 by Hammerclaw 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted January 21, 2021 #103 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 hour ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Psyche Yes as a reading form of entertainment sci-fi has been a big seller for the last 100 years and in film more than 50 so people are well indoctrinated in fictional thinking then we have people like Dankin and ilk that put biased speculation into new dimensions then throw in a little astral travel and lucid dreaming and you get Walker. jmccr8 No Walker is a bloke who grew up living in this world, where he was reading aged 2, lucid dreaming aged 3, beginning to control his mind by age 4 etc. Who was flying around his neighbourhood in dreams while a pre schooler and building dreamscapes and lands to live in every night in his dreams, and travelling the world with projection of consciousness before high school Yep i can identify some things i read as a child which i incorporated in some of my dreams etc but mostly it was matter of learning about my mind and what it was capable of doing What I am is what i am Those abilities and qualities and interactions are real and have been all my llfe Inever knew anything theoretical about them until i was middle aged and the internet arrived Ijust developed all those abilities by myself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted January 21, 2021 Author #104 Share Posted January 21, 2021 10 minutes ago, Mr Walker said: Ok so simply being human makes you a god? Hi Walker i do not think I am god I am inclined that the ability to think is god jmccr8 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Nuclear Wessel Posted January 21, 2021 #105 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Just now, Mr Walker said: No Walker is a bloke who grew up living in this world, where he was reading aged 2, lucid dreaming aged 3, beginning to control his mind by age 4 etc. Who was flying around his neighbourhood in dreams while a pre schooler and building dreamscapes and lands to live in every night in his dreams, and travelling the world with projection of consciousness before high school Yep i can identify some things i read as a child which i incorporated in some of my dreams etc but mostly it was matter of learning about my mind and what it was capable of doing What I am is what i am Those abilities and qualities and interactions are real and have been all my llfe Inever knew anything theoretical about them until i was middle aged and the internet arrived Ijust developed all those abilities by myself What was the make/model of the radio? 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Hammerclaw Posted January 21, 2021 #106 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Walker i do not think I am god I am inclined that the ability to think is god jmccr8 I thought you were an avatar of Dionysus. Edited January 21, 2021 by Hammerclaw 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted January 21, 2021 #107 Share Posted January 21, 2021 2 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said: We have no more evidence for aliens than we do the gods of Olympus. All we have are stories and the desire to believe and human beings are capable of convincing themselves of the realty pretty much anything. again with the we. What is true for you is not true for me I have personal experience based evidences. My wife and i would be dead if the y did NOT exist, and did not intervene in this world All YOU have is stories. Ive lived with these beings/entities for almost 60 years, although when i was young i didn't understand what the y were or how the y could intervene physically. I thought the y were a part of the cosmic consciousness which connected all consciousness in the galaxy This was way before the internet but think of an internet of minds where communication is mind to mind, and can exist across the galaxy perhaps as a form of quantum entanglement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Hammerclaw Posted January 21, 2021 #108 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 minute ago, Mr Walker said: again with the we. What is true for you is not true for me I have personal experience based evidences. My wife and i would be dead if the y did NOT exist, and did not intervene in this world All YOU have is stories. Ive lived with these beings/entities for almost 60 years, although when i was young i didn't understand what the y were or how the y could intervene physically. I thought the y were a part of the cosmic consciousness which connected all consciousness in the galaxy This was way before the internet but think of an internet of minds where communication is mind to mind, and can exist across the galaxy perhaps as a form of quantum entanglement. Define quantum entanglement--in your own words, no cut-and-paste. If you can't do that, you're just dropping big words. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted January 21, 2021 Author #109 Share Posted January 21, 2021 3 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said: I thought you were an avatar of Dionysus. Hi Hammer More like a centaur with big hooves jmccr8 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Hammerclaw Posted January 21, 2021 #110 Share Posted January 21, 2021 3 minutes ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Hammer More like a centaur with big hooves jmccr8 I'm more like the progeny of Shub Niggurath, myself. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted January 21, 2021 Author #111 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 minute ago, Hammerclaw said: I'm more like the progeny of Shub Niggurath, myself. Hi Hammer What handsome travel companions we are jmccr8 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted January 21, 2021 Author #112 Share Posted January 21, 2021 21 minutes ago, Mr Walker said: No Walker is a bloke who grew up living in this world, where he was reading aged 2, lucid dreaming aged 3, beginning to control his mind by age 4 etc. Who was flying around his neighbourhood in dreams while a pre schooler and building dreamscapes and lands to live in every night in his dreams, and travelling the world with projection of consciousness before high school Yep i can identify some things i read as a child which i incorporated in some of my dreams etc but mostly it was matter of learning about my mind and what it was capable of doing What I am is what i am Those abilities and qualities and interactions are real and have been all my llfe Inever knew anything theoretical about them until i was middle aged and the internet arrived Ijust developed all those abilities by myself Hi Walker That's nice when I was 16 I thought I invented sex. jmccr8 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted January 21, 2021 #113 Share Posted January 21, 2021 5 minutes ago, Nuclear Wessel said: What was the make/model of the radio? Got burned in the fire I think a National brand. It had the abilty to hear am fm and pull in broadcasts from across the world It did NOT have the capacity to run for a couple of minutes when the power had been out for several hours It had no batteries in it and worked from mains power although it might also have been able to operate from batteries it looked a bit like this or this We were on the end of a SWER line on a farm and the power often went off. The radio NEVER worked, even for a second, without power, let alone a couple of minutes It came on and operated only, and exactly, as the radio warning was being broadcast that the fire was bearing down on our house, and was only a few miles away As the broadcast finished the radio stopped operating Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted January 21, 2021 #114 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said: Define quantum entanglement--in your own words, no cut-and-paste. If you can't do that, you're just dropping big words. basically instantaneous communication via entangled photons or similar where one photon no mater how far away responds instantly to manipulation of the other photon Eventually it may be used for matter transmission and communication. Presently the Chinese are capable of this from earth to orbiting satellites and return This is old news now 2017 who knows how far they have progressed Quantum entanglement—physics at its strangest—has moved out of this world and into space. In a study that shows China's growing mastery of both the quantum world and space science, a team of physicists reports that it sent eerily intertwined quantum particles from a satellite to ground stations separated by 1200 kilometers, smashing the previous world record. The result is a stepping stone to ultrasecure communication networks and, eventually, a space-based quantum internet. "It's a huge, major achievement," says Thomas Jennewein, a physicist at the University of Waterloo in Canada. "They started with this bold idea and managed to do it." Entanglement involves putting objects in the peculiar limbo of quantum superposition, in which an object's quantum properties occupy multiple states at once: like Schrödinger's cat, dead and alive at the same time. Then those quantum states are shared among multiple objects. Physicists have entangled particles such as electrons and photons, as well as larger objects such as superconducting electric circuits. https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/06/china-s-quantum-satellite-achieves-spooky-action-record-distance at the moment i dont think its instantaneous or faster than light, but that is coming, as we master quantum communications and the technologies required quote Nevertheless, research continues on this subject and some physicists believe that faster-than-light communication might be possible with some intricate manipulation of entangled particles. For now, we know that the interaction between entangled quantum particles is faster than the speed of light. In fact, Chinese physicists have measured the speed. We know that quantum entanglement can be used to realize quantum teleportation experimentally. We know that entanglement has applications in the emerging technologies of quantum computing and quantum cryptography. With a fiber optic network that can carry conventional data and quantum data, a quantum internet is becoming more of a possibility. The real hurdle to overcome, though is being able to communicate data through quantum entanglement – that’s when we might be able to communicate faster than the speed of light. https://quantumxc.com/is-quantum-communication-faster-than-the-speed-of-light/#:~:text=Although these entangled particles are,basis for the premise that Edited January 21, 2021 by Mr Walker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted January 21, 2021 Author #115 Share Posted January 21, 2021 38 minutes ago, Mr Walker said: Ps do you honestly think i dont see myself and my world in this same way? Hi Walker Not inferring that at all what I am saying is we don't live in the same world in the same sense nor do we see the world the same we argue about everything it's not a defect or bad thing just what it is and in discussions like this I am mostly trying to get you to define what you are saying because at time I'm not sure what you are arguing or why it's relevant and here we can take those sidetracks and not offend anyone. 46 minutes ago, Mr Walker said: I was raised to be like you describe here. "god" is simply an optional extra It is not a crutch for the weak or a support for the needy. It is a tutor, a protector, a mentor and a guide. Its a mix of father/mother , older brother, uncle, wife etc. I see it as a unique aspect of evolution that is ore of a necessity rather than an extra part people don't use 49 minutes ago, Mr Walker said: You can take to or leave it, (i managed very well without it for a long time,) but you are much more powerful when you learn to live with it, and adapt it to your own purposes ) It will protect you from harm, as well, when you can't protect yourself Yes I would say that thinkers are more powerful when they use it and it has never failed to protect me so long as I used think/adapt/modify and engage jmccr8 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted January 21, 2021 #116 Share Posted January 21, 2021 15 minutes ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Walker That's nice when I was 16 I thought I invented sex. jmccr8 lol nup I'd been reading about it for years by then and was just beginning personal experimentation I had a pretty good understanding of the biology etc but little idea about girls I only had much younger sisters and little understanding pf the female psyche Young women changed during my adolescence, with the advent of the pill, and sexual liberation 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted January 21, 2021 #117 Share Posted January 21, 2021 2 minutes ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Walker Not inferring that at all what I am saying is we don't live in the same world in the same sense nor do we see the world the same we argue about everything it's not a defect or bad thing just what it is and in discussions like this I am mostly trying to get you to define what you are saying because at time I'm not sure what you are arguing or why it's relevant and here we can take those sidetracks and not offend anyone. I see it as a unique aspect of evolution that is ore of a necessity rather than an extra part people don't use Yes I would say that thinkers are more powerful when they use it and it has never failed to protect me so long as I used think/adapt/modify and engage jmccr8 Nice to be in agreement for once. i appreciate the effort it took to find those areas of agreement 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted January 21, 2021 Author #118 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Just now, Mr Walker said: lol nup I'd been reading about it for years by then and was just beginning personal experimentation I had a pretty good understanding of the biology etc but little idea about girls I only had much younger sisters and little understanding pf the female psyche Young women changed during my adolescence, with the advent of the pill, and sexual liberation Hi Walker It was JOKE jmccr8 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted January 21, 2021 #119 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Just now, jmccr8 said: Hi Walker It was JOKE jmccr8 yep so was my reply, but i dont think we get each other's humour 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted January 21, 2021 Author #120 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 minute ago, Mr Walker said: yep so was my reply, but i dont think we get each other's humour Hi Walker Do you think that was a crying emoji like I gave you? jmccr8 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted January 21, 2021 Author #121 Share Posted January 21, 2021 26 minutes ago, Mr Walker said: Nice to be in agreement for once. i appreciate the effort it took to find those areas of agreement Hi Walker So then do you understand why I do not need an "entity" human like or alien then? jmccr8 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godnodog Posted January 21, 2021 #122 Share Posted January 21, 2021 6 hours ago, jmccr8 said: Hi godnodog Yes but can you prove that they have been here or had any influence in our development? jmccr8 of course not, and I didn't said that or quoted you on that. also I do think there's a pretty good chance of Earth been visited at some point in the last millions of years, either by explorers or probes. and then we gave the mass witnessed events like the one in my country that happened in Fátima (Portugal), which even had reporters present for the 'upcoming scheduled" event that ended up happening (what happened remains unexplained). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted January 21, 2021 Author #123 Share Posted January 21, 2021 3 minutes ago, godnodog said: of course not, and I didn't said that or quoted you on that. also I do think there's a pretty good chance of Earth been visited at some point in the last millions of years, either by explorers or probes. and then we gave the mass witnessed events like the one in my country that happened in Fátima (Portugal), which even had reporters present for the 'upcoming scheduled" event that ended up happening (what happened remains unexplained). Hi godnodog I wasn't challenging you just trying to get a better understanding jmccr8 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godnodog Posted January 21, 2021 #124 Share Posted January 21, 2021 15 minutes ago, jmccr8 said: Hi godnodog I wasn't challenging you just trying to get a better understanding jmccr8 I know mate, alls gud. I just decided to add a few more things. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eight bits Posted January 21, 2021 #125 Share Posted January 21, 2021 5 hours ago, Mr Walker said: Nup thats the facts I didn.t mention the intervention of god to a "parliamentary commision" Would you have done ? I would say what happened. If the commission then wished to have, in addition to the objective facts, my interpretation of the religious significance of those events (as well they might if I held a youth leadership position in the local SDA church), then they could ask about that and I would answer. But based on the direct quotes in the article, having raised the point that fortunate circumstances were fundamental to your wife's survival, it would be natural enough to add "... and even then, it was a lucky break that our radio worked just long enough that I heard the newly revised official warning which told me that the fire had changed course and was headed our way." There is no earthly reason why I would have had the slightest reluctance to testify that way, if that was what happened. 5 hours ago, Mr Walker said: My point was tha t god should not have needed to warn us. Yes, that comes through in what is quoted: your wife's survival ought not to have depended on a quirky combination of circumstances. The radio business continues that theme nicely. There's simply no problem with your testifying in a way that would dramatically reinforce the point you were obviously making. On a different matter: 5 hours ago, Mr Walker said: Christians generally dont see god as a human being or from this planet Chrisitans generally define their faith as seeing a human being (Jesus of Galilee) as God ("the Son" in the Trinity). Now, some Christians see that same human being as having been an angel (Michael) instead of God ... for example, Seventh Day Adventists. But you know that better than I do. You have lots of experience teaching it to young people. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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