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Hammerclaw

Spiritualism, Secularism, Atheism

406 posts in this topic

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Mr Walker
2 hours ago, Nuclear Wessel said:

 

Yeah, no point. He's just using flowery parlance in an effort to seem profound.

Or he is explaining  concepts and realities   which are simple and self  evident to him through his own life, but are incomprehensible to some one  without similar experiences

Try to appreciate how frustrating that can be.

Imagine you know a great and universal truth, like the power of a vaccine,  but another person simply denies that it is even possible.

Try talking an anti vaxxer into having a vaccine.   

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Mr Walker
36 minutes ago, TashaMarie said:

I do not think I am as deep as some people here are.  I am certainly not religious and wouldn't say I'm spiritual either.  If I'm being totally honest I'm not 100% sure what the difference is.  

Being spiritual is like loving football, while being religious is like playing it :)  

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Guyver
4 hours ago, Guyver said:

I used to be a Christian who believes in God, Jesus, and the Bible.  I don’t believe those things anymore, but my wife still does.  Sometimes we have a little conflict over this, but it’s usually only if I say something.  If I’m just quiet, and nod in approval as she’s telling me something, we don’t have a problem.  But inside my own mind, I’m screaming at myself - SHE GETS To BELIEVE anything she wants just as you do.  But, if I say something in response, like....I don’t believe any of that anymore because it doesn’t actually work....and I provide examples, then I think it hurts her feelings.  So, I try not to do that.  But the fact is, that people who believe in God often believe in the power of prayer, you know, prayer changes things.  But does it?  If you try it for yourself, you will have that answer for yourself, just as I did.  Prayer doesn’t change anything that I can see except for things that a person could change for themselves with the power of their mind. fWIW.

Sorry to quote myself here, but I just remembered an experience I had where prayer actually did work.  So, maybe the guy who prayed had a special gift and there may be some people who do, or there is some other explanation.  It’s just another one of those things for me as an ex-believer that I can’t explain.  If it’s God, that’s just fine with me because I’m sure he’s a much better fellow than the Bible portrays.  But, since I’ve asked him at least a thousand times to speak to me or even join me in the moment of prayer I was in, in some way, and He/She/They - whatever the appropriate title is, has never done so....I have to conclude that God doesn’t want to talk to me, or it doesn’t exist.  So, if God doesn’t want to talk to me, and the Bible is mostly false IMO, then I do what I want to do.  I’m on my own.

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Hammerclaw
1 hour ago, TashaMarie said:

I do not think I am as deep as some people here are.  I am certainly not religious and wouldn't say I'm spiritual either.  If I'm being totally honest I'm not 100% sure what the difference is.  

Still waters run deep. I've read enough of your posts to know you're anything but shallow. Share of yourself what you will. You are among friends here.

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Hammerclaw
1 hour ago, Mr Walker said:

I see tha t as how you think about yourself  It is not how i see myself and my relationship to the real word both physically or spiritually 

There are thousands of human beings alive today who would not have been if not for me There are thousands more who are better educated and perhaps happier, healthier, and more empowered individuals, than the y would have been without me 

That is the power and privilege of being a teacher in a rich prosperous country and having the skills and resources to help others all over the world  and in my local community   

If i am a bug it is viral bug in the system  which strengthens, empowers, protects, and heals.

It isn't strong enough to heal the whole system but it does good work in a small part of the system 

if others also "went viral" then the whole system could be healed 

I give constantly but i leave others free to receive or not receive my gifts 

Of course, those around me often give of themselves in equal measure  (and some are able to give more than i do) and that is what makes a community strong and healthy 

Ps of course we all live breathe age  and die  

But suffer? 

No, suffering is a choice of response.

I choose not to suffer from  fear, pain, disability etc. I embrace life, and enjoy it all 

I will die with no regrets, no guilt, and nothing left undone which i could have done .

 

Forgive us if we take most of that with a grain of salt, maybe even a thimble full. If you want to prove that choice thing, let's engage in a little experiment. Put your hand in the door jam and slam the door as hard as you can. Then, come back to us and let us know if choosing not to suffer works.:unsure:

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Hammerclaw
1 hour ago, Mr Walker said:

Two different things 

one can read in a concrete sense without comprehending abstraction. However, i agree that it seems to be the more complex skills of thinking which humans sometimes lack 

Unless disabled every child has the potential to learn. Ive taken teenagers who couldn't read or write their own name and given them good functional reading skills  (one of the most rewarding times of my career) 

Measuring intelligence is really just measuring how well children have been taught or have learned to fulfil that potential to learn 

Statistically indeed, when it comes to reading i am somewhat exceptional (but so is all my family, and my wife  )  

However,  in  innate /potential intelligence, and abilty to think,  I don't see myself as exceptional, just better trained   by exceptional parents and teachers 

I've taught teenagers who were smarter, more intelligent and quicker, than i was at their age 

(one got perfect scores in all of her pre university entrance courses,  something achieved by only one or two students in each year   ) 

Naturally some went on   to do great things 

On the other hand my niece has a double degree in law and environmental studies, but chose  to be an instructor at a riding school in the Adelaide Hills  for a basic wage, because she   simply loves horses and riding.   My nephew, who has a Phd in nuclear molecular biology, chose a job constructing chemical data sheets for products (a health and safety requirement for all chemical products) in Canberra because his partner , who is a psychiatrist,  got an excellent job there .

Sorry Mr. Walker, but there is no such thing as evolutionary egalitarianism. Some are born with greater or lesser potential, according to their genetics. Foxp2 and other genes contribute to linguistic and literary skills, but have no influence on innate intelligence. In other words, some are born with the potential for greater intelligence than others. I've known adults with perfect language skills who, with 12 years of schooling, can barely write their names. Consider it a sliding scale of intelligence and/or mental abilities. That's why basic, non technical military hardware is designed to be comprehended by sixth grade mentalities.

Edited by Hammerclaw
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Guyver

The train wreck now begins.  Onlookers will slow down to watch.

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Guyver
On 1/30/2021 at 12:00 PM, XenoFish said:

Did going "off road" cost you about $60,000? All because you made one choice and that choice was trust? So a greedy piece of horse feces takes nearly everything from you and still cost you to try and get it back to no avail. One choice and one person, nearly killed my wife. All because I didn't trust my gut. I lost a lot of money, money that might have help catch her cancer faster. Money that might have helped me build a home. Money that could've gone towards me retiring earlier. One choice is all it takes to **** up your life and bear the guilt of what you've done. A choice made when every instinct said "NO". I ruined not only my life but the lives of others. I often wonder if god is just watching me. I asked during those desperate times for help. The court case went better than expected, though I still "lost". Did god help me make it through all this? When I ate myself alive. All that anger and hatred. Faith and trust lost. Guilt and fear. One choice. And on that day a few years ago with that cold gun in my hand, I didn't pull the trigger, was god there to stop me? I don't know. So I am afraid of people, I am afraid to trust them, I am afraid to trust a god that I feel abandoned me. All my faith lost and even now fragile. I can admit I am weak, stupid, powerless. I can admit that. I fought hard with myself for years. My wife is fine now. My life is getting better. Had the best 4 years business wise. Built a small cabin. Sometimes I wonder why Job was my favorite story. I guess it taught me that no matter how horrible life gets keep going. Do I believe in god. Don't know. But may-be some part of me hopes. Though foolish it might be. Maybe I want to hope again. I could be one of those fools who needs it. All irrational, illogical, primitive and stupid, but if it helps so be it.

 

Your willingness to share so deeply of yourself is exemplary IMO.  I believe everything you just said.

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Guyver

The OP has quoted Mr. Walker.  It’s all over but the shouting.  Wait, did I say that out loud?  Oops.  I typed it into the keypad.  Excuse me.

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Guyver

If you check page 5, you’ll see that Mr.Walker took out a full page ad.  He put out the bait, and went fishing.  Got a hit, and that’s the beginning of the end....as Xeno lamented earlier.  Maybe this time take notes?  

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Hammerclaw
39 minutes ago, Guyver said:

The train wreck now begins.  Onlookers will slow down to watch.

I'm sorry, are you attempting to write paragraphs? Drive careful.:yes:

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Hammerclaw
38 minutes ago, Guyver said:

The OP has quoted Mr. Walker.  It’s all over but the shouting.  Wait, did I say that out loud?  Oops.  I typed it into the keypad.  Excuse me.

You wrote over five or six words, too. Control yourself.

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Guyver
11 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

You wrote over five or six words, too. Control yourself.

I’ve been drinking again.  Take no notice of me.

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Hammerclaw
3 minutes ago, Guyver said:

I’ve been drinking again.  Take no notice of me.

Oops. Hate when that happens. I was responding to Will's post.

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Guyver

For me, that’s the problem with making up my own religion.  I get to violate my rules anytime I want to.  By principle, my own of course, I’m not supposed to be posting if I have been drinking.  Sometimes I don’t adhere to that rule.

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Hammerclaw

For me, speaking to the creator, the universe or what may or may not exist responsible for creation is problematical. He/she/it's language of responding may not be that of talking monkeys like myself. The language may be subtle, expansive and non verbal. It may consist of mental imagery and thought, the crackling of a fire the susurration of the wind, the laughter of a child, the dappled light of the sun through trembling leaves. It's language could include luck, providence and coincidence, a thousand, thousand subtle ways we have not the wit to understand. Sometimes I sense a faint presence, the feeling of elation, the emotion of contentment and love for no obvious reason and wonder from were such thoughts spring. God moves in mysterious ways, they say and is there any greater mystery?

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Hammerclaw
17 minutes ago, Guyver said:

For me, that’s the problem with making up my own religion.  I get to violate my rules anytime I want to.  By principle, my own of course, I’m not supposed to be posting if I have been drinking.  Sometimes I don’t adhere to that rule.

It's no bother. In Jesus' time, people drank wine, mostly, instead of water because the water would kill you. I drink whenever the spirit moves me and I have a very salubrious spirit.

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Guyver
14 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

For me, speaking to the creator, the universe or what may or may not exist responsible for creation is problematical. He/she/it's language of responding may not be that of talking monkeys like my self. The language may be subtle, expansive and non verbal. It may consist of mental imagery and thought, the crackling of a fire the susurration of the wind, the laughter of a child, the dappled light of the sun through trembling leaves. It's language could include luck, providence and coincidence, a thousand, thousand subtle ways we have not the wit to understand. Sometimes I sense a faint presence, the feeling of elation, the emotion of contentment and love for no obvious reason and wonder from were such thoughts spring. God moves in mysterious ways, they say and is there any greater mystery?

No.  There is not and it’s damn frustrating.

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Hammerclaw
1 minute ago, Guyver said:

No.  There is not and it’s damn frustrating.

Oh, posh! The universe would be dreadfully boring if all mysterious were answered, all puzzles explained. Relish the chase, my friend, for in that pursuit, unexpected marvels to sate the imaginations of the most inquisitive are often encountered.

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jmccr8
36 minutes ago, Guyver said:

For me, that’s the problem with making up my own religion.  I get to violate my rules anytime I want to.  By principle, my own of course, I’m not supposed to be posting if I have been drinking.  Sometimes I don’t adhere to that rule.

Hi Guyver

There are times I like to got to the billiard hall and play pool by myself to have some wind down time. I play on a 5x9 and use the numbered balls because I play rotation so I have to hit the low number first no matter what shot I take and if you miss the low ball and sink another ball then  the ball goes back on the table. I am playing by myself and yes I could make any choice I want to but my choice is to play the game by the rules so I can be a better player.

I don't create a religion, even though there is a relationship between religion and ethics, ethics are don't exclusive to or dependent of religion so if I apply the same ethic in all things in the same way I play pool then I don't see a problem.

jmccr8

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Guyver
48 minutes ago, jmccr8 said:

Hi Guyver

There are times I like to got to the billiard hall and play pool by myself to have some wind down time. I play on a 5x9 and use the numbered balls because I play rotation so I have to hit the low number first no matter what shot I take and if you miss the low ball and sink another ball then  the ball goes back on the table. I am playing by myself and yes I could make any choice I want to but my choice is to play the game by the rules so I can be a better player.

I don't create a religion, even though there is a relationship between religion and ethics, ethics are don't exclusive to or dependent of religion so if I apply the same ethic in all things in the same way I play pool then I don't see a problem.

jmccr8

I like to play darts, and I respect pool.  But my favorite is shuffleboard.  Good on you.

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jmccr8
7 minutes ago, Guyver said:

I like to play darts, and I respect pool.  But my favorite is shuffleboard.  Good on you.

I like darts too and my garage is to full for me to play in, at one time in my life I played a lot of darts as a distraction while I think same as pool, I relax my way of thinking  although admittedly I have gotten pretty  s**tfaced in the process on some occasions.:lol:

jmccr8

Edited by jmccr8
the usual
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Guyver
56 minutes ago, jmccr8 said:

Hi Guyver

There are times I like to got to the billiard hall and play pool by myself to have some wind down time. I play on a 5x9 and use the numbered balls because I play rotation so I have to hit the low number first no matter what shot I take and if you miss the low ball and sink another ball then  the ball goes back on the table. I am playing by myself and yes I could make any choice I want to but my choice is to play the game by the rules so I can be a better player.

I don't create a religion, even though there is a relationship between religion and ethics, ethics are don't exclusive to or dependent of religion so if I apply the same ethic in all things in the same way I play pool then I don't see a problem.

jmccr8

What you call ethics, I call principle.

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Guyver
Just now, jmccr8 said:

I like darts too and my garage is to full for me to play in, at on time in my life I played a lot of darts as a distraction while I think same as pool, I relax my way of thinking  although admittedly I have gotten pretty  s**tfaced in the process on some occasions.:lol:

jmccr8

It would be so nice to play darts with you.  Too bad the universe doesn’t let that happen.

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jmccr8
Just now, Guyver said:

What you call ethics, I call principle.

Hi Guyver

It doesn't matter what either of us call it but yes it is a principal.

jmccr8

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