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Sherapy

Mindfulness

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joc
5 minutes ago, Crazy Horse said:

Yes, it is the way the universe works. Like attracts like.

I guess when there is little or no correlation between, say, helping an old lady cross the road, and someone calling you up to offer some work, then I could call it mystical, although it is just energy.. Intelligent energy and Universal Principles in action.

I like that Napoleon Hill quote, especially the highlighted bit..

"Infinite intelligence" obviously meaning something in harmony. Something that works. Something that up-lifts the Human Spirit.

Especially if one wants to flow in a positive direction freely.

 

 

The quote is actually mine ...paraphrasing the mindset of Napoleon Hill.  So...Infinite Intelligence...just the phrase...it tells our mind that there is no limit to intelligence...so thoughts that we might never have even consider entertaining suddenly are able to basically create themselves through our subconscious. 

Edited to add...just so there is no misunderstanding...Napoleon Hill coined the phrase Infinite Intelligence.

Edited by joc
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Crazy Horse
2 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Christ man! Have you not been following the conversation at all? 

People like you are walls. 

Sherapy gave a good example of the id. The ego is a part of our self regulation system along with the super ego. 

No, people like me use clear langue to make our points and conversation easier.

People like me also don't get upset at the slightest thing.

And people like me don't try to muddy the waters with symbols that are meaningless.

Excuse me for not reading and digesting everything everybody says. But I have a life outside these forums.

 

 

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Xeno-Fish
2 minutes ago, Crazy Horse said:

No, people like me use clear langue to make our points and conversation easier.

People like me also don't get upset at the slightest thing.

And people like me don't try to muddy the waters with symbols that are meaningless.

Excuse me for not reading and digesting everything everybody says. But I have a life outside these forums.

 

 

Maybe start paying attention and learn something. Don't try to fluff up your self esteem by think you've got it all figured out. 

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Desertrat56
16 hours ago, XenoFish said:

My comments in regards to ego are more the acknowledgment of what it is and why we need it. There's another thread where the idea of getting rid of the ego "is a good idea", which I think would only lead to some form of psychosis.

Even in  A Course in Miracles it  asks "Why would you get rid of your ego, you are the one who made it?"  Or something to that effect.  Yet many people who spend hours studying that book still want to "kill their ego"   New age crap - "Ego is bad", but how would you be able to survive on planet earth in a human body without it.  

And I know I just took a detour from the original thread topic.   But in a way not too far off the path, it is a judgement of self, insecurity and need for external input that keeps us from being mindful.  We strive for perfect and fail miserably over and over, in that we are not being  mindful of ourselves or our interactions in the world.

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Crazy Horse
3 minutes ago, joc said:

The quote is actually mine ...paraphrasing the mindset of Napoleon Hill.  So...Infinite Intelligence...just the phrase...it tells our mind that there is no limit to intelligence...so thoughts that we might never have even consider entertaining suddenly are able to basically create themselves through our subconscious. 

Edited to add...just so there is no misunderstanding...Napoleon Hill coined the phrase Infinite Intelligence.

There is no limit to our intelligence, technically speaking.

Yet to access such creativity, one needs to open oneself up to this Infinite Intelligence, wiping away all the nonsense, bad habits, and distractions too.

So love is a prerequisite, mindfulness is the filter, and loving kindness is in fact the pathway to such knowledge.

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Xeno-Fish
1 minute ago, Desertrat56 said:

Even in  A Course in Miracles it  asks "Why would you get rid of your ego, you are the one who made it?"  Or something to that effect.  Yet many people who spend hours studying that book still want to "kill their ego"   New age crap - "Ego is bad", but how would you be able to survive on planet earth in a human body without it.  

And I know I just took a detour from the original thread topic.   But in a way not too far off the path, it is a judgement of self, insecurity and need for external input that keeps us from being mindful.  We strive for perfect and fail miserably over and over, in that we are not being  mindful of ourselves or our interactions in the world.

I think what people mislabel as ego is just the total self. Id, ego, and super-ego. The whole package which makes up our personality.  I figure if someone got rid of their actual ego you'd end up with a hedonistic sociopath.

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Crazy Horse
3 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Maybe start paying attention and learn something. Don't try to fluff up your self esteem by think you've got it all figured out. 

When have I ever said that I think that I have it all figured out?

That's right, I have never said, or intimated such a thing.

It is you who needs to pay attention to anybody who has a good character, (and there are plenty on here) and not that idiotic ego.

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Xeno-Fish
3 minutes ago, Crazy Horse said:

When have I ever said that I think that I have it all figured out?

That's right, I have never said, or intimated such a thing.

It is you who needs to pay attention to anybody who has a good character, (and there are plenty on here) and not that idiotic ego.

You keep painting the "evil ego" picture. As for your character, you are quite judgemental so don't preach to me about your "good character". 

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Crazy Horse
9 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

Even in  A Course in Miracles it  asks "Why would you get rid of your ego, you are the one who made it?"  Or something to that effect.  Yet many people who spend hours studying that book still want to "kill their ego"   New age crap - "Ego is bad", but how would you be able to survive on planet earth in a human body without it.  

And I know I just took a detour from the original thread topic.   But in a way not too far off the path, it is a judgement of self, insecurity and need for external input that keeps us from being mindful.  We strive for perfect and fail miserably over and over, in that we are not being  mindful of ourselves or our interactions in the world.

A Course in Miracles is a New Age book.

And in it, it asks, "Why would you want to get rid of your ego" which is New Age garbage.

The obvious reason being that ego is the selfish aspect of personality the part that brings one into confrontation.

Pretty simple really.

 

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Desertrat56
5 minutes ago, Crazy Horse said:

A Course in Miracles is a New Age book.

And in it, it asks, "Why would you want to get rid of your ego" which is New Age garbage.

The obvious reason being that ego is the selfish aspect of personality the part that brings one into confrontation.

Pretty simple really.

 

Now you are doing what I complained about.   Yes it is a new age book and it says getting rid of your ego is not useful, it actually is impossible.  And you spout a lot of new age garbage if you think the ego is selfish, that is new age garbage.   "Service to self" =wrong  and "Service to others" = right is new age garbage.

P.S.  the reason it is garbage is because it is unbalanced.  Balance in all things, that is mindfulness, not denigrating others and yourself because you think your ego and theirs are wrong.

Edited by Desertrat56
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Crazy Horse
19 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

I think what people mislabel as ego is just the total self. Id, ego, and super-ego. The whole package which makes up our personality.  I figure if someone got rid of their actual ego you'd end up with a hedonistic sociopath.

Dictionary definition of Character.

Noun; The mental and moral qualities distinctive to an individual."

Dictionary definition of Ego

Noun. A person's sense of self esteem and self importance.

Don't you ever get tired of being wrong?

 

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Xeno-Fish
1 minute ago, Crazy Horse said:

Don't you ever get tired of being wrong?

 

Thanks for proving my point. 

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Sherapy
40 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

Even in  A Course in Miracles it  asks "Why would you get rid of your ego, you are the one who made it?"  Or something to that effect.  Yet many people who spend hours studying that book still want to "kill their ego"   New age crap - "Ego is bad", but how would you be able to survive on planet earth in a human body without it.  

And I know I just took a detour from the original thread topic.   But in a way not too far off the path, it is a judgement of self, insecurity and need for external input that keeps us from being mindful.  We strive for perfect and fail miserably over and over, in that we are not being  mindful of ourselves or our interactions in the world.

Great post, Dee. No worries if the thread takes detours.
It is an appropriate detour, to Xeno’s credit ( I didn’t make the connection at first myself) he pointed out that understanding the ego system is on par with mindfulness. 
 

I agree the kill the ego is nonsense and indicates a lack of understanding of the ego system, easily rectified by taking the time to learn as Xeno suggests. The ego system and it’s defenses are a good thing.

“the scope of ego functions can be described as including: 

consciousness; 

sense perception;

the perception and expression of affect;

thought;

the control of motor action;

memory;

language; 

defense mechanisms;

the control, regulation, and binding of instinctual (id) energy;

an integrative and harmonizing function; and 

the capacity to inhibit or suspend the operation of any of the functions mentioned and to regress to a primitive level of functioning (e.g., regression in the service of the ego) (Hartmann, 1939/1986).

Superego” ( Ego Psychology).

Edited by Sherapy
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Crazy Horse
8 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

Now you are doing what I complained about.   Yes it is a new age book and it says getting rid of your ego is not useful, it actually is impossible.  And you spout a lot of new age garbage if you think the ego is selfish, that is new age garbage.   "Service to self" =wrong  and "Service to others" = right is new age garbage.

See the above post.

Ego is full of self importance and self esteem.

Getting rid of ego through a mindfulness practice is not only possible, but practical if one wants to live harmoniously and in peace.

As for, service to self, that depends upon the intent behind the action, eg, do I want to become wiser, so I may help more people, isn't wrong..

 

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Sherapy
1 minute ago, Crazy Horse said:

See the above post.

Ego is full of self importance and self esteem.

Getting rid of ego through a mindfulness practice is not only possible, but practical if one wants to live harmoniously and in peace.

As for, service to self, that depends upon the intent behind the action, eg, do I want to become wiser, so I may help more people, isn't wrong..

 

In the context of mindfulness what do you mean by getting rid of the ego and how would you do this?

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joc

I have never studied psychology.  So, admittedly I don't know the difference between an id and an ego or an ego and a super ego.  

But I think what is important is,  in a nutshell; How we see our own self in relation to how we see other people.  It's kind of like what I heard Dave Ramsey say once...he was describing people as;  They are their car!  It's like, arrogant sniff...Yeah, I am a suped up Corvette...yeah....Get your piece of crap out of my way!    I see those people all the time, especially in this part of the world where everybody drives a pick-up.  You can just feel that attitude as they fly around my little 2000 Toyota Tacoma with 417,000 miles on it, driving their 2018 Silverado 4x4 with dual exhaust and oversized tires.  

Mindfulness...being mindful...being mindful that we are among a lot of other humans who all have their own personal problems and likes and dislikes and understandings and perspectives just like we do...and being mindful of how we feel when other people are arrogant and condescending to us and being mindful that we shouldn't be that way to others because we don't like it our ownselves.

I think that is known as the Golden Rule...do unto others...

So, I try not to get caught up in ego vs id and all that.  I just do me the best I can that's all. And if everyone else would just do their own selves the best they could while being mindful of the rest of us...that would be great.

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Crazy Horse
3 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Thanks for proving my point. 

You attack me personally for things that I never said or implied, yet I point out an objectifiable fact, without emotion, and you think you have scored some kind of victory.

Please, by all means, point to any conversation that we have had, and prove to me that you wasn't wrong in your philosophy.

Then we shall see who proved which point.

 

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Xeno-Fish
Just now, Crazy Horse said:

You attack me personally for things that I never said or implied, yet I point out an objectifiable fact, without emotion, and you think you have scored some kind of victory.

Please, by all means, point to any conversation that we have had, and prove to me that you wasn't wrong in your philosophy.

Then we shall see who proved which point.

 

I would but this ain't my thread. You've been prideful and condescending before. Though you claim to be spiritual, all happy thoughts rainbows and kitty cat farts. So I'm done. Not my thread, turning into a car wreck and I'd rather it not be a train wreck. So just sit back and learn from others, you are in the thunderdome now. 

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Crazy Horse
3 minutes ago, Sherapy said:

In the context of mindfulness what do you mean by getting rid of the ego and how would you do this?

I would regard my actions, see the consequences, and adjust my future behaviour.

From the selfish ego, to the more morally character driven personality.

 

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Crazy Horse
Just now, XenoFish said:

I would but this ain't my thread. You've been prideful and condescending before. Though you claim to be spiritual, all happy thoughts rainbows and kitty cat farts. So I'm done. Not my thread, turning into a car wreck and I'd rather it not be a train wreck. So just sit back and learn from others, you are in the thunderdome now. 

Really?

So just go over this thread and pick one of the many points that you have "scored" over me.

By all means stick to the OP.

And just one last example from the above post.

You attack me personally, "all happy thoughts and kitty cat fart". completely nonsensical, and yet you claim the moral high ground.

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Sherapy
4 minutes ago, Crazy Horse said:

You attack me personally for things that I never said or implied, yet I point out an objectifiable fact, without emotion, and you think you have scored some kind of victory.

Please, by all means, point to any conversation that we have had, and prove to me that you wasn't wrong in your philosophy.

Then we shall see who proved which point.

 

Crazy Horse, please refer to the OP, pay particular attention to the three suggestions I outlined. 
 

At this point you are triggered and reactive instead of reflective.

The problem is not Xeno he was offering feedback and it doesn’t need to be you either there is no harm in not knowing.
 

You have posted in error about the ego system, of course your opinion is welcome, but it isn’t based in fact. You can stand corrected or not, your call, but you cannot derail my thread with drama. 
 

Let this go. Thank you. 

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Sherapy
7 minutes ago, Crazy Horse said:

I would regard my actions, see the consequences, and adjust my future behaviour.

From the selfish ego, to the more morally character driven personality.

 

How would you regard your actions, how do you adjust for the consequences to adjust your behavior. 
 

Can you offer an example? 
 

 

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Crazy Horse
3 minutes ago, Sherapy said:

How would you regard your actions, how do you adjust for the consequences to adjust your behavior. 
 

Can you offer an example? 
 

 

Regard is another word for mindfulness. 

I am aware of my actions of thought, word, and deed. I notice the affect they have upon other folk, and how that makes me feel..

Reflecting upon this whole process, I can make a conscious decision on how, given similar circumstances, how I might act differently to avoid any unnecessary conflict etc.

An example might be road rage. Acting upon ones ego at a perceived wrong, one might explode with anger, and cause all sorts of pain and suffering that would be totally subdued with a good mindfulness practice. So I should add, that mindfulness helps the individual become aware of self, in every aspect and in every situation.

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Crazy Horse
16 minutes ago, Sherapy said:

Crazy Horse, please refer to the OP, pay particular attention to the three suggestions I outlined. 
 

At this point you are triggered and reactive instead of reflective.

The problem is not Xeno he was offering feedback and it doesn’t need to be you either there is no harm in not knowing.
 

You have posted in error about the ego system, of course your opinion is welcome, but it isn’t based in fact. You can stand corrected or not, your call, but you cannot derail my thread with drama. 
 

Let this go. Thank you. 

Why should I let personal insults and harmful ignorance go?

And there was no error concerning the ego.

This is all part of the OPs question on mindfulness, and how one might learn to be better, more wholesome and honest.

Don't worry, this will be my last post here.

 

 

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Sherapy
23 minutes ago, Crazy Horse said:

Regard is another word for mindfulness. 

I am aware of my actions of thought, word, and deed. I notice the affect they have upon other folk, and how that makes me feel..

Reflecting upon this whole process, I can make a conscious decision on how, given similar circumstances, how I might act differently to avoid any unnecessary conflict etc.

An example might be road rage. Acting upon ones ego at a perceived wrong, one might explode with anger, and cause all sorts of pain and suffering that would be totally subdued with a good mindfulness practice. So I should add, that mindfulness helps the individual become aware of self, in every aspect and in every situation.

I would add to this that in the context of mindfulness the ego can also act as the mediating energy depending on the overall expression of a functional or disfunctional ego system. Remember the ego system and it defenses can be pathological or adaptive as they are the major means by which we deal with managing conflict and affect. The ego system is not written in stone pathological responses can be reversed. It’s the same ego system and it’s defense mechanisms that are either reflective or reactive aggressive or assertive, violent or reasonable. This is why trying to “kill the ego” is a misnomer. We are never without our ego. 

Edited by Sherapy
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