Dr. Stephen Braude, The Veil of Stupidity

[rashore]

Quote

Dr. Stephen Braude, has seen science’s veil of stupidity descend on the study of PK.

https://skeptiko.com/stephen-braude-the-veil-of-stupidity-485/

Podcast is about an hour long, some talking points are transcribed below. 

[+ouija ouija]

What is PK? I googled it but the answers didn't seem to make sense.

[rashore]

4 minutes ago, ouija ouija said:

What is PK? I googled it but the answers didn't seem to make sense.

Psychokinesis. 

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

Usually, people who are long on words are short on substance.

Can Braude demonstrate any of this? Is the CIA interested in shutting him up? Oh, well. Just another publicity seeker. 

 

Edited February 18, 2021 by Earl.Of.Trumps

[papageorge1]

This subject is SO up my alley. Braude calls it a 'Veil of Stupidity' against the paranormal where I call it more an emotional wall of defense against people and things they have formed a passionate dislike. Allow me to present once again one of the better quotes on the subject I can find from a prominent parapsychologist Dr. Dean Radin:

 

“After a century of increasingly sophisticated investigations and more than a thousand controlled studies with combined odds against chance of 10 to the 104th power to 1, there is now strong evidence that psi phenomena exist. While this is an impressive statistic, all it means is that the outcomes of these experiments are definitely not due to coincidence. We’ve considered other common explanations like selective reporting and variations in experimental quality, and while those factors do moderate the overall results, there can be no little doubt that overall something interesting is going on. It seems increasingly likely that as physics continues to redefine our understanding of the fabric of reality, a theoretical outlook for a rational explanation for psi will eventually be established 

Dr. Dean Radin

 

OK, 10 to the 104th power to 1 against chance results in repeatable studies done across 5 continents and dozens of labs he has gone on to say in talks I watched on the internet. Then the U.S. government hired statistical analyst Dr. Jessica Utts who had no involvement in parapsychology but was a prominent Professor of Applied Statistics at the University of California to analyze the statistical basis for controlled parapsychological experiments. Basically she confirmed that by all statistical reckoning some factor(s) are involved that is not yet understood.

At this point I am comfortable calling opponents to parapsychology's relevance science deniers. And then comes the 'Veil of Ignorance' and 'Wall of Emotional Resistance' that is also unscientific in attitude. More testing and more debating will not conquer any of those factors. Perhaps the current generation of denialists just needs to pass on through attrition and time. And there it sits.

[+OverSword]

1 hour ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Usually, people who are long on words are short on substance.

Can Braude demonstrate any of this? Is the CIA interested in shutting him up? Oh, well. Just another publicity seeker. 

 

I can.  Put a paperclip down on the table in front of you and stare at it for one hour without blinking and I will make it move with my mind all the way from here.

[bison]

An interesting interview. Thanks for sharing it, Rashore. If the Universe is essentially an idea, it stands to reason that our own ideas might influence it directly, hence psychokinesis. 

They speak about the importance of intention in the video. It occurs to me that this could be unconscious intention, especially where repeated spontaneous psychokinesis is concerned, hence 'poltergeists'.  

I seriously doubt the scientific claim, made at least by some physiologists, that consciousness is an illusion, created by the brain. The brain may be more a mediator between consciousness and the what we think of as the physical. But that takes beyond the realm of science, and into other forms of philosophy.

The idea that controlled PK might be a dangerous thing, a weapon, is scarcely new. Charles Fort thought and wrote about this idea at least as early as 1932, in his book 'Wild Talents', I believe. If PK could be practically developed, it seems that the world would be in a far more chaotic state than it is already. Just why this doesn't appear to be possible, at least on a large scale, is an interesting question, in itself.   

[+joc]

On 2/18/2021 at 11:35 AM, bison said:

If the Universe is essentially an idea

If the Universe is essentially an idea...then...we don't really have to look any further into the Veil of Stupidity do we?

[ChrLzs]

PK is pretty easy to test for...  But you do need to enlist a decent magician who can tell you all the tricks used, so you can properly design the tests.

[papageorge1]

15 hours ago, ChrLzs said:

PK is pretty easy to test for...  But you do need to enlist a decent magician who can tell you all the tricks used, so you can properly design the tests.

That's happened before and there's no way the dug-in anti-paranormal types will ever admit they're wrong. More testing and more debates will not change that.

Remember one of the arch targets of these anti-paranormal types, Uri Gellar.

Uri bent a spoon for me, the first time he did it, I thought there must be a trick. The second time I was stunned, completely, completely stunned and amazed. It just bent in my hand. I’ve never seen anything like it. It takes a lot to impress me. Uri Geller is for real and anyone who doesn’t recognise that is either deluding himself, or is a very sad person.

David Blaine

 

“There is no way, based on my knowledge as a magician, that any method of trickery could have been used to produce the effects under the conditions to which Geller was subjected.”
Arthur Zorka (US, member Society of American Magicians – U.S.A.)

Edited February 22, 2021 by papageorge1

[XenoFish]

PK would be pretty boring. I'd rather be able to teleport things to me. 

[papageorge1]

4 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

PK would be pretty boring. I'd rather be able to teleport things to me. 

PK's philosophical contribution to the questions of mind intention and consciousness is enormous, which is why those supporting a materialist view of consciousness are obstinate beyond reason.

Teleports do happen too to liberate you from your boredom.

[XenoFish]

8 minutes ago, papageorge1 said:

PK's philosophical contribution to the questions of mind intention and consciousness is enormous, which is why those supporting a materialist view of consciousness are obstinate beyond reason.

Teleports do happen too to liberate you from your boredom.

No, still bored. 

[ChrLzs]

On 2/23/2021 at 1:04 AM, papageorge1 said:

PK's philosophical contribution to the questions of mind intention and consciousness is enormous, which is why those supporting a materialist view of consciousness are obstinate beyond reason.

Teleports do happen too to liberate you from your boredom.

And the best example is...?  Feel free to support your claims about PK or teleporting.  (It would make a pleasant change from the incessant handwaving.)

[ChrLzs]

Can someone please use PK to transfer the request into papageorge that we'd all like to see his best example of an evidenced teleport or PK event?

You might want to warn him though, that we are quite good at recognising things moved or movable by quiet breaths, off-camera fans, static electricity, magnets, and of course CGI.  But I'm really keen to see one, and it's not that difficult to create a genuine (and thus unarguable) video of a genuine event.  I'll even explain how you can do it, if asked nicely.

 

As I've pointed out before, both PK and teleportation would be of immense benefit to the wider wrold, and to quote Hiccup "This changes everything!!".

It would be criminally selfish and immoral, imo, if anyone could do it and didn't help others to learn how.  Now, with the Internet there is the perfect way to spread the knowledge anonymously, so what excuse is there?   

Edited March 7, 2021 by ChrLzs

[papageorge1]

5 hours ago, ChrLzs said:

Can someone please use PK to transfer the request into papageorge that we'd all like to see his best example of an evidenced teleport or PK event?

 

Apparently my quotes just above regarding Uri Geller and PK testing left you speechless.

 

[XenoFish]

Oh boy! Let's all repeat the Uri Geller argument. That'll be fun. We've never done that before.

[ChrLzs]

Oh, dam, I didn't see that the dreaded Uri Geller was mentioned.  Like Hitler and Nazis, that surely ends the thread.

Uri Geller is strictly for the terminally gullible.  Con artist, liar.  His tricks were often clumsy and obvious, and all have been explained by magicians.