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Eldorado

Reparations for slave descendants?

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razman

Slavery was over a hundred years ago , get off it.

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Jon the frog
On 2/23/2021 at 8:36 AM, spartan max2 said:

Okay. We will give reparations to anyone still alive who was a slave :innocent:

Well, lets give a pay rise to all people in the US working for the minimum wage of $7.25 per hour... they are slaves. 

Edited by Jon the frog
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Myles
34 minutes ago, Jon the frog said:

Well, lets give a pay rise to all people in the US working for the minimum wage of $7.25 per hour... they are slaves. 

I'm on board with raising the minimum wage gradually.  $1 immediately to get it to $8.25 an hour and $.50 each year going forward.  

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Trelane

Does any amount of money repair the damage that has already been done? I venture to say that some would spin this into a negative narrative. It just seems to be typical socio-political grandstanding. Ultimately it is pointless.

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psyche101
21 hours ago, pallidin said:

I'm not giving any damn "reparations".

My family were Swedish and German immigrants; nothing to do with the slave trade at all.

It's actually nothing to do with where you come from, or who did the attrocities but what you now call home. 

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Hyperionxvii

If we're going to get on the topic of reparations, I want my turn in this racially divisive porkfest. I have Neanderthal DNA and yes, I can prove it.

Just stop already with the caveman jokes, racists. 

I'm talking genocide here, which is many degrees worse than slavery. If the Neanderthals would have only been made slaves, they would have eventually come to America and be great leaders and probably have much stock in Amazon and Twitter.

So, I am demanding reparations, and we're going back 35,000 years here, at least. A trillion dollar down payment would be a good start. I can tell you where to mail that check. 

 

 

 

 

 

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DieChecker
3 hours ago, psyche101 said:

Wether that's right or wrong is another debate altogether, however, that's where the native argument comes from, and why they are pointing fingers at decendants. 

But, eventually you open the can of worms, where every human nation, or society, moved in on another at some point. Theres no way to make it right with everyone. 

I'd argue that slavery is a bit different, as these people weren't just killed, or moved, but were property. Like a dog, or horse. 

I feel bad for their ancestors, but how many generations is it now? Its like still blaming President Carter for current middle eastern issues. There comes a time were you have to move on and get over it. Blame issues on those causing issues.

Racism... Thats another issue, IMHO. Not as bad as advertised in the media, but very real, and needs to be addressed.

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Hyperionxvii
56 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

But, eventually you open the can of worms, where every human nation, or society, moved in on another at some point. Theres no way to make it right with everyone. 

I'd argue that slavery is a bit different, as these people weren't just killed, or moved, but were property. Like a dog, or horse. 

I feel bad for their ancestors, but how many generations is it now? Its like still blaming President Carter for current middle eastern issues. There comes a time were you have to move on and get over it. Blame issues on those causing issues.

Racism... Thats another issue, IMHO. Not as bad as advertised in the media, but very real, and needs to be addressed.

One question is, how far do we go back to correct history? Which is what I just made a play at in my comment above. Some people seem to think that History began around 400 years ago, and that Africans are the only people to ever be made slaves. That is of course, ridiculous. The entire idea of reparations is an incredibly destructive idea because for one, as you said, it opens up an endless can of worms that will only lead to more divisiveness with no end. Good for political power mongers, bad for everyone else. 

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psyche101
15 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

But, eventually you open the can of worms, where every human nation, or society, moved in on another at some point. Theres no way to make it right with everyone. 

I'd argue that slavery is a bit different, as these people weren't just killed, or moved, but were property. Like a dog, or horse. 

I feel bad for their ancestors, but how many generations is it now? Its like still blaming President Carter for current middle eastern issues. There comes a time were you have to move on and get over it. Blame issues on those causing issues.

Racism... Thats another issue, IMHO. Not as bad as advertised in the media, but very real, and needs to be addressed.

Oh yes. 100%. That's why I'm saying it's a different debate. Slavery is pretty bad sure, but so is taking land and killing the inhabitants. I feel bad for them too. But when our people asked for an apology, and got it as mentioned earlier, it made no difference that I can see. I don't think money would either to be perfectly honest. I don't think it's our fault that those things happened, and because society has spread out so far it is unlikely to happen today. Without that, they would have nobody to complain too. Biting the hand that feeds? 

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Golden Duck

North Korea has three generations of punishment.  Who agrees?

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Kismit

Let's not make this personal.  If posters can not post without insults warnings will be issued to help create a reminder.

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Manwon Lender
10 minutes ago, Golden Duck said:

North Korea has three generations of punishment.  Who agrees?

I certainly agree, and to add to your comments they will most likely have another generation of slavery after this one. There is only one way to end it, and that would be an over throw of the Kim family. But, who is going to do it, only the military could attempt to do it. Then, even if it happened the real question is would anything even change, or would another family take power. 

I do not have enough knowledge to see a positive out come unless it happened by an outside source. Now that they have Nuclear Weapons that just doesn't seem realistic or even possible. So I see no end in sight, just history repeating itself again and again.

Do you have a better idea?

JIMO

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DieChecker
32 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

I don't think it's our fault that those things happened, and because society has spread out so far it is unlikely to happen today.

The problem I see is it being used as a political weapon, not as a issue to be healed. If it was healed, forgiven, forgotten... it would lose its power as a weapon.

My dad was a grudge holder till the day he died. He isolated himself from a lot of his friends and family by refusing to let go of the past. Instead, he always insisted the "other guy" kiss his feet first, which didn't happen. 

Quote

Without that, they would have nobody to complain too. Biting the hand that feeds?

Complaining is how they get fed. If the social issues were addressed and healed... There would be no white guilt and thus no handouts. Or, less anyway... at least IMHO. 

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DieChecker
51 minutes ago, Hyperionxvii said:

One question is, how far do we go back to correct history?

If I was forced to give an answer, I'd say to the last living generation. We can help living people. 

Quote

Some people seem to think that History began around 400 years ago, and that Africans are the only people to ever be made slaves.

Most American slaves were SOLD by other Africans. Which is neither here nor there, but is a fact. And slavery is rampant in Africa to this day. 

Quote

That is of course, ridiculous. The entire idea of reparations is an incredibly destructive idea because for one, as you said, it opens up an endless can of worms that will only lead to more divisiveness with no end. Good for political power mongers, bad for everyone else.

Agreed.

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Eldorado

Meanwhile, in the UK....

Councillors in Bristol have called for a parliamentary commission of inquiry to be set up to investigate reparations for the UK’s part in the slave trade.

MSN

 

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Tatetopa

Some very acrobatic arguments going on here, along with the basic logic and standards of society.

Now I would think the best reparation would be equality and equal justice and opportunity, not a cash settlement.  JMO.  We need to build the society today that we say we already have.

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Michelle

Are Native Americans going to have to pay too?

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smithsonian-institution/how-native-american-slaveholders-complicate-trail-tears-narrative-180968339/

Or blacks that owned slaves? This whole thing is so convoluted it can't be resolved and be fair.

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Jon the frog
On 2/26/2021 at 2:05 AM, Manwon Lender said:

I certainly agree, and to add to your comments they will most likely have another generation of slavery after this one. There is only one way to end it, and that would be an over throw of the Kim family. But, who is going to do it, only the military could attempt to do it. Then, even if it happened the real question is would anything even change, or would another family take power. 

I do not have enough knowledge to see a positive out come unless it happened by an outside source. Now that they have Nuclear Weapons that just doesn't seem realistic or even possible. So I see no end in sight, just history repeating itself again and again.

Do you have a better idea?

JIMO

If something more or less peacefully could happen with throwing Kim family in history books, it should be an action from China. The big hurdle it's that everybody else would be against it...

Presently, China like their buffer zone and don't want to to administrate all North Korea problems . 

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Tatetopa
On 2/25/2021 at 10:31 PM, Hyperionxvii said:

One question is, how far do we go back to correct history?

Well that is a good question.  Everything did not get equalized in 1865.  It was not legal for Blacks to marry until after the Civil War.   JIm Crow lasted about another 100 until the1960's.  Blacks were not allowed to go to state funded land grant colleges in many states  until that time, even if they paid taxes in the state.  I went to a private university in Texas that did admit blacks until 1965.  I don't know much about bank loans but I think they were similar.  When I got to Oregon in 1972 there was still a relic sign at the limits of Cottage Grove that said something like, "If you are black, don't let the sun set on you in Cottage Grove."

We are not talking about 150  years, but things that happened in my lifetime.

My dad went to collage before I did,  our family knew the ropes and benefits of a college education, and more importantly, we never doubted it was possible.  I had no doubt that my son would go as well.  His kids can go if they choose.  For a Black man  a few years older than me, he would have been refused after graduating from high school until things changed, his parents would not have gone or likely had jobs that could afford to send him.  It is something that can be overcome, but does not breed confidence.

I have no good answers for this, and I'm afraid we will screw this up.  Throwing money at it is a little like tossing a dollar into the hat of a homeless veteran.   The person that feels obligation or guilt throws a dollar in, feels righteous and keeps walking.   Others walk by complacently and think it is the vets own fault, he must be a drunk or a crack head.  Its a rare individual that actually stops to talk to the person and find out his story and maybe even offer substantive help.

 

 

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Myles
15 hours ago, Michelle said:

Are Native Americans going to have to pay too?

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smithsonian-institution/how-native-american-slaveholders-complicate-trail-tears-narrative-180968339/

Or blacks that owned slaves? This whole thing is so convoluted it can't be resolved and be fair.

The whole idea should be scrapped.    

I may have to find that 1 African American in my family line.

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Desertrat56
2 minutes ago, Myles said:

The whole idea should be scrapped.    

I may have to find that 1 African American in my family line.

Yeah, if you have any scottish ancestors you probably will find one from a few thousand years ago, but it won't be someone who was a slave, it will either be one of Scotia's servants or an egyptian merchants daughter.

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odas

A hundred years ago white men argued about the monetary worth of a black man. Year 2021, white men still argue about the monetary worth of a black man. 

So, what has actually changed?

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preacherman76
5 hours ago, odas said:

A hundred years ago white men argued about the monetary worth of a black man. Year 2021, white men still argue about the monetary worth of a black man. 

So, what has actually changed?

Are you for freaking real?

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Hugh Mungus
16 hours ago, odas said:

A hundred years ago white men argued about the monetary worth of a black man. Year 2021, white men still argue about the monetary worth of a black man. 

So, what has actually changed?

No ones picking my cotton?

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Myles
16 hours ago, odas said:

A hundred years ago white men argued about the monetary worth of a black man. Year 2021, white men still argue about the monetary worth of a black man. 

So, what has actually changed?

Who's doing that?

 

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