Begum loses Fight

[Silver]

Shamima Begum, who fled Britain as a schoolgirl to join Islamic State in Syria, has failed to restore her British citizenship after the supreme court ruled she had lost her case.

The judgment on Friday from the UK’s highest court is a critical – and controversial – test case of the UK’s policy to strip the citizenship of Britons who went to join Isis and are being detained by Syrian Kurdish groups without trial.

Lord Reed, the president of the court, said its judges had decided unanimously to rule in favour of the home secretary and against Begum on all counts before it. That means the 21-year-old will not be able to re-enter the UK to fight her case in person and will not be able to have her citizenship restored while she is being detained in Syria.

Shamima Begum loses fight to restore UK citizenship after supreme court ruling | Shamima Begum | The Guardian

Edited February 26, 2021 by ted hughes

[+OverSword]

As it should be.  Were she to return she would give birth to and raise people who hate the nation in which they live and who would do their best to disrupt and overthrow the government in favor of a caliphate.

[spartan max2]

I fill like it's pretty normal to lose your citizenship when you leave and join the military of the literal people you nation is at war with.

Also if it was a male and not a female I doubt this would of made it as high as the supreme court.

[Duke Wellington]

She was trying to use legal technicalities to come to the UK to fight her case.

Knowing that once here she cannot be deported without citizenship of another state.

[Setton]

2 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:

She was trying to use legal technicalities to come to the UK to fight her case.

Knowing that once here she cannot be deported without citizenship of another state.

She already has citizenship of another state - Bangladesh. She hasn't claimed it but under Bangladeshi law, she doesn't have to - it's automatic.

That's the entire foundation of the government's argument. If she was solely a British national, there's absolutely nothing they can do to stop her coming back.

[Setton]

6 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

I fill like it's pretty normal to lose your citizenship when you leave and join the military of the literal people you nation is at war with.

Also if it was a male and not a female I doubt this would of made it as high as the supreme court.

Not as common as you'd think. A person can only be stripped of their citizenship if they are a dual national.

[spartan max2]

2 minutes ago, Setton said:

Not as common as you'd think. A person can only be stripped of their citizenship if they are a dual national.

That's interesting. I suppose the logic is to not make someone "citizenless". 

[+and-then]

Offer to let her come back for a life term in prison for her actions.  Problem solved...

[godnodog]

She got what she deserves, went in (retard) thinking she´d get a princess life now is a refugee unwanted anywhere

[acute]

3 hours ago, spartan max2 said:

That's interesting. I suppose the logic is to not make someone "citizenless". 

Yep.  United Nations conventions bar countries from making someone Stateless.

[Setton]

3 hours ago, and then said:

Offer to let her come back for a life term in prison for her actions.  Problem solved...

On what evidence?

Don't get me wrong, it's definitely the right idea but what hard evidence do we have to give her a life sentence?

[itsnotoutthere]

Shamima Begum has said she was a “dumb kid” when she fled the UK to join Isis as a 15-year-old and would love to help others rehabilitate if she was allowed to return home.

The 21-year-old former Bethnal Green schoolgirl was speaking during an interview at al-Roj prison camp in Syria, where she remains stripped of her British citizenship.

She told journalist Andrew Drury in the Daily Mail: “I don’t think I was a terrorist. I think I was just a dumb kid who made one mistake.

“I personally don’t think that I need to be rehabilitated, but I would want to help other people be rehabilitated. I would love to help.”

 

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/shamima-begum-isis-interview-children-uk-citizenship-b940636.html

[stevewinn]

Bull crap, tough. 

 

[Golden Duck]

On 2/27/2021 at 4:32 AM, Setton said:

She already has citizenship of another state - Bangladesh. She hasn't claimed it but under Bangladeshi law, she doesn't have to - it's automatic.

That's the entire foundation of the government's argument. If she was solely a British national, there's absolutely nothing they can do to stop her coming back.

But the legal opinion from Bangladesh is that she is not Bangladeshi. 

[Duke Wellington]

On 2/26/2021 at 5:23 PM, ted hughes said:

Shamima Begum, who fled Britain as a schoolgirl to join Islamic State in Syria, has failed to restore her British citizenship after the supreme court ruled she had lost her case.

The judgment on Friday from the UK’s highest court is a critical – and controversial – test case of the UK’s policy to strip the citizenship of Britons who went to join Isis and are being detained by Syrian Kurdish groups without trial.

Lord Reed, the president of the court, said its judges had decided unanimously to rule in favour of the home secretary and against Begum on all counts before it. That means the 21-year-old will not be able to re-enter the UK to fight her case in person and will not be able to have her citizenship restored while she is being detained in Syria.

Shamima Begum loses fight to restore UK citizenship after supreme court ruling | Shamima Begum | The Guardian

Its not controversial.

She made herself an enemy of the people and state when she went off to fight against them. We dont want that kind of person wondering around our society. It is right to leave her in limbo. Its not our problem, its hers and serves her right. Leave her to it.

[Duke Wellington]

2 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

But the legal opinion from Bangladesh is that she is not Bangladeshi. 

Good, why would they want her either?

The UN charter we have all signed up to needs revising so those incompatible with civilization and have all citizenships stripped from them. Dump them in limbo.

[acute]

10 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:

Dump them in limbo.

On the Isle of Man?

[Duke Wellington]

Just now, acute said:

On the Isle of Man?

No, and we should take no concern as to where she ends up either.

Not our problem.

[Jon the frog]

3 minutes ago, acute said:

On the Isle of Man?

No, just give her a North Sentinal Island citizenship and drop her on the beach.

[Golden Duck]

20 minutes ago, Jon the frog said:

No, just give her a North Sentinal Island citizenship and drop her on the beach.

She's not Indian either

[Golden Duck]

21 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:

No, and we should take no concern as to where she ends up either.

Not our problem.

Laws, you know.

[Silver]

5 hours ago, Cookie Monster said:

No, and we should take no concern as to where she ends up either.

Not our problem.

If it is not our problem, why did we discuss her in our highest court?

I mean I agree with you morally, but it is a problem for the UK as we claim she had dual citizenship, but the Bangladeshis are denying this.

Edited June 17, 2021 by ted hughes

[Silver]

On 2/26/2021 at 6:27 PM, spartan max2 said:

I fill like it's pretty normal to lose your citizenship when you leave and join the military of the literal people you nation is at war with.

Also if it was a male and not a female I doubt this would of made it as high as the supreme court.

I think you are on both counts wrong. Legally, not morally I mean.  People can't be made stateless.  I think with Begum the UK argued she had dual citizenship so they could strip her on one of them.

And I think the legal principles would be argued equally whether male or female. It is a big deal case.

My personal view is that anyone who even condoned those crimes, much less took part in them, should be just executed without a trial, so maybe it is a good thing I'm not a lawyer.

[Setton]

10 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

But the legal opinion from Bangladesh is that she is not Bangladeshi. 

Their law is black and white. She was perfectly entitled to claim Bangladeshi citizenship when we deprived her, which makes that action legal.

The fact that the Bangladeshi government have now realised how flawed their law is is another matter. They are now the ones trying to make her stateless, not us.

[Golden Duck]

Just now, Setton said:

Their law is black and white. She was perfectly entitled to claim Bangladeshi citizenship when we deprived her, which makes that action legal.

The fact that the Bangladeshi government have now realised how flawed their law is is another matter. They are now the ones trying to make her stateless, not us.

There's a thing called sovereignty.  Maybe leave the interpretation of Bangladeshi law to their courts.

It would have been prudent for the UK to have that sorted first.  As it turns out the UK.Gov interpretation has been made as part of an adversarial process and they can’t hold themselves to be disinterested.