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Eldorado

Iran and China sign 25-year cooperation agreement

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Eldorado

"Relations between the two countries have now reached the level of strategic partnership and China seeks to comprehensively improve relations with Iran," Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi was quoted by Iran's state media as telling his Iranian counterpart Mohammad Javad Zarif.

"Our relations with Iran will not be affected by the current situation, but will be permanent and strategic," Wang said ahead of the televised signing ceremony.

"Iran decides independently on its relations with other countries and is not like some countries that change their position with one phone call."

MSN

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and then

Well... that's certainly good news for the world.

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Manwon Lender
30 minutes ago, and then said:

Well... that's certainly good news for the world.

Well it's like the enemy of my enemy is my friend.:(

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TigerBright19
Posted (edited)

Reminds me of the allied and axis pacts of both world wars when various nations signed protection agreements e.g.  France protects Belgium, and Britain protects France, and declaring war on one nation automatically triggers the rest into battle.  Perhaps the pact between Iran and China will take the pressure off the nuclear button, because Iran might now feel they are protected and if they were attacked then China would intervene and protect them with sanctions against its enemies, or even launch a counterattack.  Iran and Russia also have close relations, so it could end up as a coalition.

 

 

Edited by TigerBright19

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Setton

Well now who could have seen that coming?

Oh yeah, everyone show wasn't the previous US administration.

But you killed one general so champagne all round...

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Manwon Lender
18 minutes ago, Setton said:

Well now who could have seen that coming?

Oh yeah, everyone show wasn't the previous US administration.

But you killed one general so champagne all round...

This is exactly what happens when you push one country into a corned, using sanctions and provocations. Like others have said this is not a good combination for the world.

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spartan max2

I feel like this was sort of inevitable.

China's claims to want to continue the nuke deal where Iran can't build nukes but can continue nuclear power. 

All I can say is that I hope that's true. Hopefully China believes it's in their best interest for there to be one less nation with nukes....

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docyabut2
Posted (edited)

 China wants to become the most  powerful country in the world, to over come like  in the bible

 

  Its does says in the Bible in the Revelation it says a view of the future world population of a organized militiamen 6,000,000,000 that takes over the world. 

 

Revelation 9:16 If this is a literal figure, it is no longer incredible, in view of a world population in excess of 6 billion in the near future.

https://classic.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation+9&version=TLB

 

  1. Revelation 9:14 mighty demons, literally, “[fallen] angels.”
  2. Revelation 9:16 If this is a literal figure, it is no longer incredible, in view of a world population in excess of 6 billion in the near future. In China alone, in 1961, there were an “estimated 200 million armed and organized militiamen” (Associated Press Release, April 24, 1964). warriors, literally, “horsemen.”

Edited September 8, 2020 by docyabut2

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Edited by docyabut2

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DarkHunter

Traditionally countries who have signed similar deals with China have come to regret it years later.  

While I dont know the specifics of this deal but going by past deals China has made with other countries they generally go along the lines of China agrees to invest and help build up the host country, the host country is then expected to make payments or keep some kind of condition, the payments or condition are extremely difficult if not impossible to meet, then when host country violates the terms either by not making the payments or not keeping the conditions then China essentially repossess what they built up in the host country and use it to pay back what is owed.

Iran being desperate for any income to keep the regime going would sign almost anything but if China stays true to what they normally negotiate then the Iranian government might have essentially sold large parts of their country to relieve pressure off the regime for a couple of years.

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and then

I wonder if Iran assumes China hates Shia less than Sunnis like the Uyghurs?  Whatever Iran has happen to them they'll deserve, at least their nutty mullah class and its Praetorian.

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Horta
Posted (edited)

Not seeing a problem with this. Hopefully they can help the Iranian people through sanctions. It is a sign of things to come anyway, China basically giving the US the middle finger. As developing economies grow larger and various alliances form there's going to be a lot more countries doing it.

Have people forgotten that Iran's problems began when the US ousted the democratically elected Iranian govt via a coup and installed a puppet dictator (Shah)? After Iran wanted to take control of their own oil from British corporations (to nationalise it). So the US instigated a coup and struck a deal with the Brits re the oil.

Not sure if the nuclear concern is a genuine one, but then again, we shouldn't forget that so far only one country has ever used nukes in anger (on civilian populations at that). Quis custodiet ipsos custodes is relevant.

 

Edited by Horta
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Horta

ps. ^^ It's worth noting that Iran won the legal right to nationalise its oil industry through international courts who ruled in their favour. Before the US led coup.

The current campaigns against places like Syria, Bolivia and Venezuela amount to more of the same. When someone recently pointed out that Bolivia's lithium reserves might have had something to do with US posturing Elon Musk (wonder what he would want with lithium :rolleyes:) simply chimed in to say..."We will coup who we want. Deal with it." Which not only made him look like an arrogant prick at the time, but seems to have backfired somewhat lol.

Trump has made no secret of the fact that US troops took control of Syrain oil fields, or of the fact the US is looting it.

It's also obvious that certain corporate interests (who also fund anti climate change propaganda) want Venezuelan oil, because they need this particular grade of oil for their refineries.

The rest of it is simply "weapons of mass destruction/ gulf of tonkin" propaganda.

Strange how anyone with resources that American corporations would like to control but can't, suddenly are ruled by evil dictators and who need America to save them by bring them democracy (even if it means installing brutal and repressive puppet dictators!) :rolleyes:.

 

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odas
On 4/3/2021 at 5:55 AM, Horta said:

Not seeing a problem with this. Hopefully they can help the Iranian people through sanctions. It is a sign of things to come anyway, China basically giving the US the middle finger. As developing economies grow larger and various alliances form there's going to be a lot more countries doing it.

Have people forgotten that Iran's problems began when the US ousted the democratically elected Iranian govt via a coup and installed a puppet dictator (Shah)? After Iran wanted to take control of their own oil from British corporations (to nationalise it). So the US instigated a coup and struck a deal with the Brits re the oil.

Not sure if the nuclear concern is a genuine one, but then again, we shouldn't forget that so far only one country has ever used nukes in anger (on civilian populations at that). Quis custodiet ipsos custodes is relevant.

 

Horta, I agree with both posts and I wrote about the same before, defending Iran as a nation-but not their leaders. And yes, the west, mainly USA, has screwd up all about Iran. However, at some point we have to stop blameing the west for everything. Obama made a brakethru, Trump screwd it up, Biden could put it back on track. That is politics.

I believe, Iran is making a huge mistake with siding with China/Russia in the long term. That will solve some issues temporaly but in the long run they will lose all. USA, with a normal leader is a safer bet to work with, but the mullahs want to stay in power and that is only they care about.

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Horta
9 hours ago, odas said:

Horta, I agree with both posts and I wrote about the same before, defending Iran as a nation-but not their leaders. And yes, the west, mainly USA, has screwd up all about Iran. However, at some point we have to stop blameing the west for everything. Obama made a brakethru, Trump screwd it up, Biden could put it back on track. That is politics.

I believe, Iran is making a huge mistake with siding with China/Russia in the long term. That will solve some issues temporaly but in the long run they will lose all. USA, with a normal leader is a safer bet to work with, but the mullahs want to stay in power and that is only they care about.

A  balanced and cautionary post odas.

Though as I see it, Iran is being forced into Chinas arms. It doesn't have to be this way but at every turn it seems the US's "bull in a China shop" foreign policy ethos is not only making it easy for China, it's doing the work for the Chinese. There are other countries that the US has traditionally destabilised or tried to control via coup, sanctions and so on, that China are quietly throwing tentative lifelines.

It's surprising that the people of Iran don't absolutely despise the US, but they don't seem to (no doubt some radical elements do). Ever since the late '70's when they overthrew their US installed dictator, it seems the US has either been financing wars against them or staving them with sanctions.

I think it really is understandable why they would side with China, as I think the US is in decline anyway and will be no more than a regional power by mid century. Not wholly because of anything other countries do, the US is doing it to itself. China is well past the US in various important ways already (and even economically if you look at PPP). India will also have well and truly past them by then and together are set to make up around 35% of the worlds economy, while the US steadiluy shrinks from its current 15%. This is unavoidable and there is nothing the US can do about it regardless of their military capability.

There are also non tangibles which will hit the US terribly because they are not preparing for it. Chinese leadership is swayed by science and they have quite obviously been preparing for the effects of climate change, which will still cause them all sorts of problems, but they are preparing. Western politicians aren't taking it seriously enough, many of them don't even believe the science.

Look at the recent pandemic response to get an idea.

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Horta

ps. I should have mentioned also that it probably doesn't matter what the US does now anyway. Iran will realise that they are only a US election away from switching between treaty and cooperation...to blockades and sanctions. They're not the only ones, even some of Americas traditional allies can see the problems and have had a taste of how fickle the US could be.

Love or hate the Chinese model of govt, it at least lends itself to consistency for those entering into trade or strategic agreements.

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RoofGardener

I'm astonished at the people on this forums who seems to support a cruel authoritarian oligarchy, with zero tolerance to dissent ? 

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spartan max2
5 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

I'm astonished at the people on this forums who seems to support a cruel authoritarian oligarchy, with zero tolerance to dissent ? 

Some of them not only support, but seem to idealize. 

Who cares about genocide, am I right? :innocent:

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RoofGardener
21 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Some of them not only support, but seem to idealize. 

Who cares about genocide, am I right? :innocent:

Meh.. what's a little genocide between friends ? 

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Earl.Of.Trumps

What a coup. 

china will find ways to defeat the West. They will be very cozy with Russia going forward, too

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Tatetopa
On 4/6/2021 at 7:24 AM, RoofGardener said:

I'm astonished at the people on this forums who seems to support a cruel authoritarian oligarchy, with zero tolerance to dissent ? 

You don't have to like it to see it coming and do what you can to can to mitigate your circumstances.  Iran has oil, China needs oil. If agreements are made, there could be a pipeline and avoid the risks of tankers.  Iran is desperate for cash, China might like to use Iran's non-state actors here and there, all kinds of mutual agreements are possible.  China does not care who kills who outside their borders, they say it is not in their interest.  Iran may decide brother Muslims take secondary place to the Shia / Sunni divide, very convenient way for them to write off the Uyghurs.  We Western nations have never let genocide stand in the way of political ambition, I don't suspect any other country will either.

Response would be the key thing now and that could take a lot of forms. 

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Tatetopa
On 4/4/2021 at 7:38 PM, odas said:

I believe, Iran is making a huge mistake with siding with China/Russia in the long term. That will solve some issues temporaly but in the long run they will lose all. USA, with a normal leader is a safer bet to work with, but the mullahs want to stay in power and that is only they care about.

There is no guarantee of a normal leader or even a peaceful transition of power in the next decade. Judging by the daily public evidence, few nations would believe they can rely on the US any longer or depend on us as an ally.

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and then
On 4/5/2021 at 8:04 AM, Horta said:

Love or hate the Chinese model of govt, it at least lends itself to consistency for those entering into trade or strategic agreements.

Yeah... the Christians and Muslims under the control of the mullahs would agree with you on this.  I believe the EU is setting everything up for this "GREAT RESET" and it will be nearly impossible to accurately predict the aftermath of that chaos.  If China floats to the top of that particular cesspool then the countries that have looked forward to America's demise with such relish will quickly find that joy to be transient.  Hope you guys enjoy the trip ;) 

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