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Manwon Lender

The States Following Georgia’s Lead on Voter Suppression

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Manwon Lender

As controversy continues to swirl around Georgia’s new restrictive election law, attention should be paid to what Republicans are doing along the same lines in other states. Republican state legislators are sponsoring a blizzard of new voting restrictions, advancing 55 bills in 24 states. CBS News and FiveThirtyEight have published helpful state-by-state overviews, and the Brennan Center for Justice has all the details you’d want.

The States Following Georgia’s Lead on Voter Suppression (msn.com)

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and then

Not a single aspect of those changes actively disenfranchises anyone.  What they DO accomplish is to make future cheating more difficult.  The idea that the most important civic responsibility AND right is not worth taking the time to show up and vote or that intentionally creating a situation where literally ANYONE could mail in a ballot whether they were qualified to do so or not, is considered "voter suppression" is outrageous.  These steps are pre-emptive because these states are aware that the Democrats are about to ram HR1 through on a single tiebreaker vote if it's at all possible.  

America is on the edge of an abyss and it doesn't MATTER if half the country doesn't believe cheating happened.  It DOES matter if this bill becomes law and creates the perception that one party pulled off a coup THEN uses a tiebreaker vote to consolidate their power, effectively, indefinitely.  Anyone who actually thinks this will end well for the nation is simply  blinded by partisanship.  HR1 and 2A infringement will cause a rebellion of more states who will quickly nullify these laws.  What then?  Would you expect that act to cause DC to send in the troops?  The FBI, DHS together aren't capable of imposing the will of one party on the rest of the nation.  I'm not sure why that concept is so difficult to grasp.  FTM, it's appalling that any citizen would even desire such an outcome. 

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Manwon Lender
2 hours ago, and then said:

Not a single aspect of those changes actively disenfranchises anyone.  What they DO accomplish is to make future cheating more difficult.  The idea that the most important civic responsibility AND right is not worth taking the time to show up and vote or that intentionally creating a situation where literally ANYONE could mail in a ballot whether they were qualified to do so or not, is considered "voter suppression" is outrageous.  These steps are pre-emptive because these states are aware that the Democrats are about to ram HR1 through on a single tiebreaker vote if it's at all possible.  

America is on the edge of an abyss and it doesn't MATTER if half the country doesn't believe cheating happened.  It DOES matter if this bill becomes law and creates the perception that one party pulled off a coup THEN uses a tiebreaker vote to consolidate their power, effectively, indefinitely.  Anyone who actually thinks this will end well for the nation is simply  blinded by partisanship.  HR1 and 2A infringement will cause a rebellion of more states who will quickly nullify these laws.  What then?  Would you expect that act to cause DC to send in the troops?  The FBI, DHS together aren't capable of imposing the will of one party on the rest of the nation.  I'm not sure why that concept is so difficult to grasp.  FTM, it's appalling that any citizen would even desire such an outcome. 

My friend this issue is very complicated and my guess is that a Federal Lawsuits are coming that will take these issues to the Supreme Court. Then a final decision on the Constitutionality of the laws these states are trying to implement will be given. No other body or think tank is more qualified to render a final decision on this subject. This for me will put an end to all the speculation and like it or not we will all have to live with the coming decision.

I thinks that's as fair as an decision can be on this subject.

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preacherman76

So let me get this right, it’s perfectly fine for states like PA to change the rules over night, that effectively allows all kinds of voter fraud, but GA can’t make certain that their voting system has integrity? Making harder to cheat. 
 

There is nothing stopping anyone in Georgia from voting legitimately if they so desire. 

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preacherman76

If history is applied here, the state is fully within its power to run their elections the way they see fit. 

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aztek

Coca-Cola required ID in 2020 shareholder meeting, but slams Georgia for voter ID law

foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/coca-cola-required-id-in-2020-shareholder-meeting

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Tatetopa
2 hours ago, preacherman76 said:

If history is applied here, the state is fully within its power to run their elections the way they see fit. 

Very true as long as they don't violate the US Constitution.   Some of this will probably end up in the Supreme Court, probably a good way to get it settled for the future.

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DieChecker

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/31/opinion/georgia-voting-law.html

Quote

Georgia’s Voter Law Is Called ‘Jim Crow 2.0’ for a Reason

And yet the article doesn't address a single aspect of the law. But just throws out dozens of Appeals to Emotion.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/civil-rights-group-sue-georgia-voting-law/story?id=76775186

Quote

An ACLU representative said the law was "blatant racism."

Quote

the release said. "But rather than act to expand participation in the political process, Georgia leaders responded by doing what they have done many times in the state's history: they placed burdensome, unjustified, and unnecessary restrictions on voters, particularly voters of color and other historically disenfranchised communities."

Which is just more race baiting. Where are the statistics showing that these restrictions will affect blacks most? What is restricting in expanding times, places, and dates, when voting can happen, but at the same time trying to secure the process, so cheating is less likely.

Basically what these people against the law are saying is that black people are so incapable, that they must wait to the last minute, must mail in votes late, must not have to even leave their car to drop votes, must not even have to prove who they are, can't be concerned enough to vote in their own precinct... and on and on.... Stuff every other voting block has any troubles with.

Why do blacks have such a hard time going to vote on time, and in the right place? Other poverty groups do it. Other ethic groups/races do it.

I know the "answer"... Racism. Because if it is NOT racism, then it is a failing in the black community/society/culture, and we can't have that. 

End rant...

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preacherman76
1 hour ago, DieChecker said:

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/31/opinion/georgia-voting-law.html

And yet the article doesn't address a single aspect of the law. But just throws out dozens of Appeals to Emotion.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/civil-rights-group-sue-georgia-voting-law/story?id=76775186

Which is just more race baiting. Where are the statistics showing that these restrictions will affect blacks most? What is restricting in expanding times, places, and dates, when voting can happen, but at the same time trying to secure the process, so cheating is less likely.

Basically what these people against the law are saying is that black people are so incapable, that they must wait to the last minute, must mail in votes late, must not have to even leave their car to drop votes, must not even have to prove who they are, can't be concerned enough to vote in their own precinct... and on and on.... Stuff every other voting block has any troubles with.

Why do blacks have such a hard time going to vote on time, and in the right place? Other poverty groups do it. Other ethic groups/races do it.

I know the "answer"... Racism. Because if it is NOT racism, then it is a failing in the black community/society/culture, and we can't have that. 

End rant...

Well said. This is all about emotion. The only racism here is that of low expectations. 

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spartan max2
On 4/5/2021 at 3:28 AM, DieChecker said:

Basically what these people against the law are saying is that black people are so incapable, that they must wait to the last minute, must mail in votes late, must not have to even leave their car to drop votes, must not even have to prove who they are, can't be concerned enough to vote in their own precinct... and on and on.... Stuff every other voting block has any troubles with.

This is what I've been saying. The idea that having a form of identification for voting uniquely hurts black people is implicitly saying that black people are somehow less capable of getting a form of identification than white people. 

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AstralHorus

This site has become nothing more than a Q-anon help group. 

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aztek
12 minutes ago, AstralHorus said:

This site has become nothing more than a Q-anon help group. 

amen for that lol

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DieChecker
4 hours ago, spartan max2 said:

This is what I've been saying. The idea that having a form of identification for voting uniquely hurts black people is implicitly saying that black people are somehow less capable of getting a form of identification than white people. 

Same logic should apply that applies to getting WIC, Welfare, Food Stamps,, Section 8....

Is it racist for people to prove with an ID who they are to get those benefits? If not then why not? Clearly, if blacks are overrepresented in poverty, and it is too hard to require an ID to vote, then how do they get government benefits?

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Manwon Lender
Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, spartan max2 said:

This is what I've been saying. The idea that having a form of identification for voting uniquely hurts black people is implicitly saying that black people are somehow less capable of getting a form of identification than white people. 

@DieChecker my friend you may want to read what I have written below also, there are legitimate complaints that are not based upon racsim, even though some people posting to this thread are alluding to that fact.

My friend the only ID issue is with absentee voting, not with voting in general. To my knowledge IDs have always been required when you walk in and vote everywhere. However, for absentee ballots IDs have not been required, they have always just compared your signature on the absentee ballot to your signature on the absentee ballot request. What changed is all the additional personal information required, including your driver license number. But, here is where the issues are coming from, if you don't have a state drivers license or a state ID, even though you have valid identification they can Now choose to disqualify a persons absentee ballot without notice.

So please get your facts straight there is no need for misinformation that only confuses thing further.

This use to be the requirement below, however, the any valid state ID has been changed. Now it is at the discretion of the also New Goegia Voting committee. The word discretion is not clearly defined and leaves to much leeway.

WHAT IDS ARE ACCEPTABLE?

  • Any valid state or federal government issued photo ID, including a free ID Card issued by your county registrar's office or the Georgia Department of Driver Services (DDS) 
  • A Georgia Driver's License, even if expired
  • Valid employee photo ID from any branch, department, agency, or entity of the U.S. Government, Georgia, or any county, municipality, board, authority or other entity of this state
  • Valid U.S. passport ID
  • Valid U.S. military photo ID
  • Valid tribal photo ID

https://sos.ga.gov/index.php/elections/georgia_voter_identification_requirements2

Edited by Manwon Lender
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Agent0range
On 4/4/2021 at 11:25 AM, preacherman76 said:

So let me get this right, it’s perfectly fine for states like PA to change the rules over night, that effectively allows all kinds of voter fraud, but GA can’t make certain that their voting system has integrity? Making harder to cheat. 

What rule did PA change overnight?  And how does banning passing out water in a line secure the integrity of an election?

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DarkHunter
3 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

To my knowledge IDs have always been required when you walk in and vote everywhere

That depends heavily on the state.

States requiring photo ID to vote are Georgia, Indiana, Kansas, Kentucky, Mississippi, Tennessee, and Wisconsin.

States that request photo ID to vote are Arkansas, Alabama, Florida, Hawaii, Idaho, Louisiana, Michigan, Rhode Island, South Dakota, and Texas.

States requiring an ID to vote are Arizona, North Dakota, and Ohio.

States that request an ID to vote are Alaska, Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, Iowa, Missouri, Montana, New Hampshire, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Utah, Washington, and West Virginia.

States that require no ID to vote are California, Illinois, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Nebraska, Nevada, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Vermont, Virginia, and Wyoming.

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Manwon Lender
Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

That depends heavily on the state.

States requiring photo ID to vote are Georgia, Indiana, Kansas, Kentucky, Mississippi, Tennessee, and Wisconsin.

States that request photo ID to vote are Arkansas, Alabama, Florida, Hawaii, Idaho, Louisiana, Michigan, Rhode Island, South Dakota, and Texas.

States requiring an ID to vote are Arizona, North Dakota, and Ohio.

States that request an ID to vote are Alaska, Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, Iowa, Missouri, Montana, New Hampshire, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Utah, Washington, and West Virginia.

States that require no ID to vote are California, Illinois, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Nebraska, Nevada, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Vermont, Virginia, and Wyoming.

Thanks for the additional information, I learned something new I thought IDS were required everywhere. However it doesn't change the fact that the law that Georgia just passed has changed the ID requirements you stated above and not for the betterment of the voters in Georgia. The new law gives to much discretion on how the New voting council decision can effect the votes of those using absentee ballots. Like I said below:

 

Edited by Manwon Lender

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spartan max2
Posted (edited)
43 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

What changed is all the additional personal information required, including your driver license number. But, here is where the issues are coming from, if you don't have a state drivers license or a state ID, even though you have valid identification they can Now choose to disqualify a persons absentee ballot without notice.

So please get your facts straight there is no need for misinformation that only confuses thing further.

I'm not finding that anywhere though.

https://www.factcheck.org/2021/04/factchecking-claims-about-the-georgia-voting-law/

I'm not finding that here either

https://www.gpb.org/news/2021/03/27/what-does-georgias-new-voting-law-sb-202-do

Edited by spartan max2

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Manwon Lender
Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

All the information and links are in the post .I made above, but .I will include it here for you also so there is no confusion.

Here you go, read the new state law 

Source Senate Bill 202 : C:\pdf\201498.wpd (ga.gov)

Old state law https://sos.ga.gov/index.php/elections/georgia_voter_identification_requirements2

Then read the old state laws like I did and you will find the answers to your questions, the easy way that you used is not always best. Information directly from the law is always better than using a media article or fact check.

Edited by Manwon Lender

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spartan max2
1 minute ago, Manwon Lender said:

Here you go, read the new state law 

Source Senate Bill 202 : C:\pdf\201498.wpd (ga.gov)

Then read the old state laws like I did and you will find the answers to your questions, the easy way that you used is not always best. Information directly from the law is always better than using a media article or fact check.

Sorry, I'm not reading 98 pages. Did you read all that ? Lol

If so, feel free to quote that part for the rest of us.

Because none of the media links are stating what you said. 

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Manwon Lender
2 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Sorry, I'm not reading 98 pages. Did you read all that ? Lol

If so, feel free to quote that part for the rest of us.

Because none of the media links are stating what you said. 

Media links are second hand information and very very few are non-bias. If you care about the truth you will review the information I supplied or you can continue to spread in accurate information or just go with the flow and never know the truth. That is your decision, but until you can prove me wrong with a source like .I have provided I am not wrong.

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spartan max2
Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

Media links are second hand information and very very few are non-bias. If you care about the truth you will review the information I supplied or you can continue to spread in accurate information or just go with the flow and never know the truth. That is your decision, but until you can prove me wrong with a source like .I have provided I am not wrong.

Honestly, telling someone to read 98 pages of legal text seems like a cop-out.

You are making a claim that isn't supported by any media links and you won't quote the part of the bill that says it.

Why should we believe that your information is accurate? 

Are you not even more second hand than journalist?

Edited by spartan max2
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Manwon Lender
1 minute ago, spartan max2 said:

Honestly, telling someone to read 98 pages of legal text seems like a cop-out.

You are making a claim that isn't supported by any media links and you won't quote the part of the bill that says it.

Why should we believe that your information is accurate? 

Are you not even more second hand than journalist?

The difference between us is I have proven you wrong and supplied you with the necessary sources to verify my comments that's all .I need to do. In addition you have not even found any source to prove my comments are not correct, that is the real cop out, I have done my due diligence you have not. So until you can prove my comments are wrong or inaccurate it doesn't matter what you believe, and your comments are only your opinion.

Like I said your source ( the media ) and mine do not compare, if you want to know the truth you go directly to the source ( laws )

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