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Are we heading towards disclosure? Summary of recent announcements


Not Invented Here
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Mods: some of the below is referenced in other threads, but it would be helpful to have a thread about whether - taken together - recent announcements (summarised below) are starting to look like the beginnings of 'disclosure'.

Here is the context:

July 2019: Elements of Theodore Roosevelt Carrier Strike Group have repeated close-range encounters with UAP near the site of the 2004 Nimitz encounter. Reports of this encounter originally surfaced in June 2020. A Navy vet who witnessed the Nimitz encounters provided the following tip to Dave Beaty:

Another buddy of mine that was on Chafee with me retired as an OSCS said they had the same kind of stuff happen last year in SOCAL! ... It was in July of 2019 on USS Kidd During the USS Theodore Roosevelt SWATT in SOCAL ... I know he said he could see them with the naked eye and they were almost eye level with the bridge hovering. They were the same tic-tac shaped objects.”

“Calling away the Snoopie Team in US waters is definitely not something normally done and doing so at night is really unusual. The team’s main purpose is to help ID a vessel of interest or document something unusual about a vessel or aircraft. If they were involved in a massive group exercise at the time with OPFOR ships in the exercise then it could be exercise.” BTW Nothing in the logs indicate a training exercise or general quarters…

Beaty then FOIAs the Deck Logs from the USS Kidd for July 2019. He notices several entries that corroborate the hearsay witness testimony, as we will see later. Other news organizations (The Drive, Washington Examiner, The Debrief, George Knapp etc.) begin investigating the case. Ten months later, The Drive releases the results of their investigation (1) (2):

In July of 2019, a truly bizarre series of events unfolded around California’s Channel Islands. Over a number of days, groups of unidentified aircraft, which the U.S. Navy simply refers to as ‘drones’ or 'UAVs,' pursued that service's vessels, prompting a high-level investigation.

During the evening encounters, as many as six aircraft were reported swarming around the ships at once. The drones were described as flying for prolonged periods in low-visibility conditions, and performing brazen maneuvers over the Navy warships near a sensitive military training range less than 100 miles off Los Angeles. The ensuing investigation included elements of the Navy, Coast Guard, and the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI). The incidents received major attention, including from the Chief of Naval Operations—the apex of the Navy's chain of command.

Timeline of events by ship:

USS Kidd

  • July 14, ~10p - SNOOPIE (intel collection) team deployed for two "UAVs", emissions control protocols engaged.

  • July 15, ~9p - SNOOPIE team deployed for "Multiple UAVs around ship". Mk.87 Stations manned.

  • July 23, ~2am - Two "red flares" spotted, followed by two more three mins. later. CO on bridge.

  • July 24, ~7am - SNOOPIE team deployed for unspecified reason, XO on bridge

  • July 25, ~1am - SNOOPIE team deployed for "UAV", CO on bridge

  • July 30, ~2am - SNOOPIE team deployed and aviation assets readied in response to "UAVs", CO on bridge

USS Rafael Peralta

  • July 14, ~10p - Receives report of "UAV overhead" from USS Kidd. Peralta deploys SNOOPIE team. Receives report of "two Drones overhead" from USS John Finn.

  • July 14, ~11:30p - "White light identified hovering over ship's flight deck"

  • July 15, ~8:40p - "UAV flying overhead", SNOOPIE team deployed

  • July 15, ~11:40p - "Two UAVs spotted off starboard wing". "Four UAVs spotted off starboard bridge".

USS Russell

  • July 15, 9p-10p - drones observed maneuvering left/right, forward/backward, up/down for about an hour. Elevations ranging from 700 to 900 ft.

  • July 15, ~11:50p - Drone spotted directly aft of the ship.

USS John Finn

  • July 14, around 10p - signals "two Drones overhead" to USS Rafael Peralta. Ship's transponder is deactivated. Red flashing light spotted moving from port to starboard.

Carnival Imagination

  • July 15, around 9p - signals to Rafael Peralta "5-6 drones within sight"

There are many puzzling and anomalous aspects to these events, as The Drive notes:

  • "The drones were able to locate and catch a destroyer traveling at 16 knots in conditions with less than one nautical mile of visibility."

  • "Their operators appear to have coordinated at least five to six drones simultaneously. Then there is the question of line-of-sight control, and control methods in general, which make the capabilities described all that much more puzzling."

  • "Commercially available drones are not commonly capable of flying for such long durations across great distances with speeds in excess of 45 miles an hour. Based on the pooled data available from the deck logs, we estimate the drones traversed at least 100 nautical miles in the July 14th incident."

  • "It is unclear why anyone would operate drones near Navy warships in such a brazen manner."

  • "The incursions continued after a concerted investigation that reached the highest level of the Navy hierarchy" (which suggests it was not the result of a secret US technology demonstration).

  • "if a foreign state actor was involved, where exactly were the drones launched from?"

  • "It is puzzling that all these sensors, coupled with a likely extensive photographic record, were not sufficient in and of themselves to resolve the matter. This calls into question the “drone” designation. Was there ever even a hard description of these craft beyond lights in the sky?" ...we'll come back to that shortly...

One crucial pattern emerges from the FOIA documents - the Navy has a tremendous wealth of raw data collected at close range from multiple collection platforms and sensor types during this incident - a UAP investigator's dream. That is ultimately what makes this case so historically significant. Almost none of that data has seen the light of day yet. But unlike so many UAP cases where the government can evade researchers by simply claiming to have no records or data, they cannot comfortably do so here, thanks to the deck logs:

the U.S. Navy has a large amount of data on these events. The documents above reflect that multiple independent photographic intelligence teams were deployed. These teams are only a small part of a sophisticated suite of surveillance capabilities and advanced sensors, including the ability to detect radio emissions in the vessels’ vicinity, available to any one of the ships involved. This is on top of the land-based sensors that closely surveil the area.

ONI Investigation

October 2019: Information about the incident is reported up the chain of command on October 19th, reaching the highest levels of government, including the Secretary of the Navy, the Chief of Staff of the Air Force, and the Joint Chiefs. An ONI report containing the briefing slides is widely disseminated on SIPRNet, provoking a broad discussion within the intelligence community. The much-reported Capitol Hill briefings occur days later, on October 21st and 23rd 2019. Via The Debrief:

Two officials with the DoD and one from the U.S. intelligence community were willing to provide details on the contents of the classified report. An additional three other U.S. intelligence officials and a federal law enforcement officer confirmed the report’s existence but were only willing to provide comments on their distribution.

a “list” of possible prosaic explanations for these mysterious airborne encounters was provided, however the report expressly stated that the potential for UAP to be “alien” or “non-human” technology was of legitimate consideration.

One active defense official familiar with the current UAP investigations said the UAPTF has a wealth of photographic evidence, collected from military pilots’ personal devices as well as sophisticated DoD surveillance and reconnaissance platforms. The source also told us some of the best evidence the UAPTF has acquired comes from measurement and signature intelligence (MASINT), rather than from videos or still images.

In April 2021, Investigative journalist George Knapp and filmmaker Jeremy Corbell claim to have obtained a video recorded by the SNOOPIE team aboard the USS Russell, along with one of the slides from the October 19th briefing (along with other materials not yet released). The briefing slide provides the following description of the video:

CCSG-9 Comment: (U) USS RUSSELL observed 3x UNK UAS, seemingly triangular in shape from the angle of observation, hovering approximately 700 ft over RSL's fantail. Two of the UAS are pictured above.

The altitude reported (700 ft) and position (aft) of the UAP are consistent with the Russell's deck logs for the night of July 15th. The reported "seemingly triangular" (or rather pyramidal, as Corbell's sources claim) shape of these craft is itself highly unusual and worth additional comment. This is the only physical descriptions of the craft that we have so far (beyond the heresay account provided to Beaty).

If there was some low-hanging prosaic explanation for the apparent triangular shape, such as a "triangle bokeh" lens artifact, you would expect someone to notice this as the data and analysis works its way up nearly a dozen layers of high-visibility organizational review, collation and vetting on its way to Congress and JCS. Besides requiring a startling degree of incompetence on the part of specially trained photographic intelligence personnel, wouldn't the triangle description have been falsified by many other data points? Is strains credulity to assume that in all of these encounters and excitement across all of the ships involved, that not one person saw these objects with the naked eye, particularly since Corbell's sources and the deck logs both describe the objects emitting white and red visible lights. And even if not one person saw them with the naked eye, what about the myriad other powerful sensor systems available to these ships, such as the Mk. 87 targeting system referenced as being manned in the Kidd's log entries? What of the many other videos presumably taken by the various SNOOPIE teams?

UPDATE: The Pentagon has since confirmed the authenticity of the footage and photos released by Knapp and Corbell, via The Black Vault

May 2020: On May 1 2020, A second ONI report mentioning triangular craft begins making waves in the intelligence community:

Overwhelmingly, everyone The Debrief spoke with said the most striking feature of the recently released UAPTF intelligence position report was the inclusion of a new and “extremely clear” photograph of an unidentifiable triangular aircraft.

The photograph ... depicted an apparent aerospace vehicle described as a large equilateral triangle with rounded or “blunted” edges and large, perfectly spherical white “lights” in each corner. Officials who had seen it said the image was captured in 2019 by an F/A-18 fighter pilot.

Two officials that received the report said the photo was taken after the triangular craft emerged from the ocean and began to ascend straight upwards at a 90-degree angle. It was indicated that this event occurred off the eastern coast of the United States. Several other sources confirmed the photo’s existence; however, they declined to provide any further specifics of the incident.

Officials who read the recent report say it primarily focused on “Unidentified Submersible Phenomena,” or unidentified “transmedium” vehicles capable of operating both underwater and in the air.

“On occasion, there are detections made of non-cavitational, extremely fast-moving objects within the ocean.” The intelligence official declined to elaborate further, citing the high levels of security classification associated with underwater reconnaissance.

Officials who had read the reports say the UAPTF appears particularly interested in “transmedium vehicles.” ... [experts are] unaware of any past or present technologies that are close to being capable of transitioning between air and submersible travel

The Washington Examiner independently confirms the story in The Debrief:

I can confirm the accuracy of McMillan’s story, the previously unreported Navy UFO encounter in late 2019, and his description of task force intelligence reports from 2018 and 2020

According to the report, the Triangle UFO rose out of the Atlantic Ocean and rapidly accelerated out of sight on a vertical axis. I believe, but have been unable to confirm, that the aircrew responsible for the photo were operating off either the USS Dwight D. Eisenhower or the USS John C. Stennis ... the reports reinforce the classified assessment that there is an unknown connection between naval nuclear reactors and proximate UFO activity.

another motive for the government’s secrecy here is the apparent ability of some UFOs to travel underwater at speeds of hundreds of knots or more per hour. Combining that factor with the UFOs' means of and apparent propensity for occasionally closing with nuclear-powered submarines has the Navy reasonably concerned.

December 2020: After a three-year struggle for greater transparency on UAP, the Intelligence Authorization Act passes, mandating that DoD produce "an unclassified, all-source report on the UAP phenomenon" by June 2021.

Public Statements

I think there's a misapprehension among some well-intentioned observers that engagement on UAPs within government is limited to a small number of ground-level, fringe "Men Who Stare at Goats" type figures, people like Hal Puthoff and Eric Davis. There's also a question of cognizant authority. The security bureaucracy is so compartmentalize and stovepiped, the argument goes, that it's next to impossible for the right hand to know what the left is really doing. In that case, isn't it possible some rogue compartmented black project might be testing its latest toys against the US Navy?

While it would be a mistake to dismiss this argument out of hand, there are several reasons why this is unlikely.

  • Military encounters such as this on land, air, and sea have been ocurring regularly since the late 1940s, involving the military forces of many nations. It's hard to imagine such exotic technologies as trans-medium reactionless propulsion drones being operated by the piston-engine air force of the late 1940s. And if we had such technologies 70 years ago, why haven't they gradually been integrated into other capabilities?

  • That just simply isn't how black-budget Skunkworks type aerospace programs operate. They stay as far away from public observation or detection as possible - think Area 51. They don't go hovering pointlessly over hundreds of uncleared military and civilian observers for hours at a time, mere miles from a major urban area.

  • There are small numbers of people of people at the top of the National Security apparatus who have inherent cognizant and oversight authority to reach across all the silos and obtain a complete picture. What do such people have to say about this topic over the past year? Let's take a look:

    Sen. Marco Rubio (R-FL, Ranking Member of Senate Intelligence Committe):

    "There are a lot more sightings then have been made public. Sometimes we wonder whether or not our adversaries have technologies that are a little bit further down the road than we thought or that we realized ... things are flying over military installations, over military exercises and other places ... and we don’t know what it is. It isn’t ours. It isn’t anything that’s registered with the FAA, and in many cases, exhibits attributes of things we’ve never seen - technology, the kinds of technology we haven’t seen before"

    Sen. Mark Warner (D-VA, Chair of Senate Intelligence Committee) after receiving a classified briefing on UAP:

    Some of the press reports [on UAP encounters] are accurate, people are taking this issue much more seriously ... one of the key takeaways is that the military and others are taking this issue seriously, which I think in previous generations may not have been the case.

    Former CIA Director John Brennan:

    “I think some of the phenomena we’re going to be seeing continues to be unexplained, and might, in fact, be some type of phenomenon that is the result of something that we don’t yet understand and that could involve some type of activity that some might say constitutes a different form of life.”

    Former Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe:

    "There are a lot more sightings than have been made public," Ratcliffe said. "Some of those have been declassified. And when we talk about sightings, we are talking about objects that have seen by Navy or Air Force pilots, or have been picked up by satellite imagery that frankly engage in actions that are difficult to explain. Movements that are hard to replicate that we don’t have the technology for. Or traveling at speeds that exceed the sound barrier without a sonic boom."

    Former Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV):

    I’m saying most of [the evidence] hasn’t seen the light of day. We have it — it’s there ... the federal government all these years has covered up, put brake pads on everything, stopped it. I think it’s very, very bad for our country,”

    Former CIA Director James Woolsey:

    “There was one case in which a friend of mine was able to have his aircraft stop at 40,000ft or so and not continue operating as a normal aircraft. What was going on? I don't know ... I’m not as skeptical as I was a few years ago, to put it mildly. But something is going on that is surprising ... to a series of intelligent, experienced pilots ... And we will just have to see what it is.”

    Former Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense for Intelligence Christopher Mellon:

    These things are real, they’re here — this is happening now.

     

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2 hours ago, Not Invented Here said:

recent announcements (summarised below) are starting to look like the beginnings of 'disclosure'.

there's nothing to disclose.....

Edit to add:

sorry, forgot to say= In My Opinion;)

Edited by Dejarma
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16 minutes ago, Not Invented Here said:

These things are real, they’re here — this is happening now.

What are these real things that you claim are here now?

What i have noticed with the whole "day of disclosure" ( meaning aliens ) is true believer will take things out of context, cherry pick subscribe their own biased meanings to it get down right manic even little black dot is the smoking gun, 

The idea of dod has been around a long time and according to true believers its right around the corner like tomorrow or next week but thru all that blustering we never get there.

Unknown does equal alien and unexplained doesnt mean unexplainable.

Oh yeah, just my opinion ;)

 

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2 hours ago, Not Invented Here said:

These things are real, they’re here — this is happening now.

when the likes of the Navy say something is unidentified; I doubt they are suggesting unknown entities (aliens or whatever)

their concerns regarding UAV's/UFO's will be aimed at the tech other countries may have- & rightly so

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Who would act so "brazenly" flying craft in such close proximity to US Naval vessels? How about a nation that has focused on this project and is just a few years ahead of us in development?  What a great way to advertise a possible deterrent to a more physical confrontation.

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19 hours ago, Dejarma said:

when the likes of the Navy say something is unidentified; I doubt they are suggesting unknown entities (aliens or whatever)

their concerns regarding UAV's/UFO's will be aimed at the tech other countries may have- & rightly so

Spot on. They use terms to generalize either due to lack of thorough information or to protect classified information.

 

10 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

Who would act so "brazenly" flying craft in such close proximity to US Naval vessels? How about a nation that has focused on this project and is just a few years ahead of us in development?  What a great way to advertise a possible deterrent to a more physical confrontation.

Or, we were simply testing the items' own capabilities in "force-on-force" scenario training. However due to the sensitive nature of what was being tested, it is highly unlikely that all members assigned to a specific vessel would be briefed on this test. Likely the ship's Top 3 would have been given a primer brief and that's it.

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As long as the Bad Guys faction in the Deep State continue to hold control , there will be no meaningful disclosure until it is 100% guaranteed maximum profitable  . For them .

Do you really imagine , for example , that those making trillions out of current main energy sources would allow a change before they ensured that the existing status quo was retained ?

 NOT A PRAYER .

You would have to convince me that the so called White Hats have either executed their opponents or arranged a deal which could never be reversed .  Highly unlikely imho .

I favour Von Braun's belief that Deep State will only ' disclose'  enough related material to make the final False Flag operation a success -- a  fake  'ET' invasion  .

 Coming our way quite soon .Step one , Covid etc etc 

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Pentagon Confirms Leaked 'UFO' Footage Is Part Of An Investigation

Shocking footage that shows UFOs gathering above a US Navy warship has been confirmed as authentic by the Pentagon.

The video was leaked to Jeremy Corbell, a documentary filmmaker, and is part of an investigation, according to authorities.

Sue Gough, a Department of Defense spokesperson, told Futurism that the video is being used as part of an ongoing investigation.

Gough told the publication: "I can confirm that the referenced photos and videos were taken by Navy personnel.

https://www.ladbible.com/news/weird-pentagon-confirms-leaked-ufo-footage-is-part-of-an-investigation-20210411

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4 hours ago, Luiza22 said:

As long as the Bad Guys faction in the Deep State continue to hold control , there will be no meaningful disclosure until it is 100% guaranteed maximum profitable  . For them .

Do you really imagine , for example , that those making trillions out of current main energy sources would allow a change before they ensured that the existing status quo was retained ?

 NOT A PRAYER .

You would have to convince me that the so called White Hats have either executed their opponents or arranged a deal which could never be reversed .  Highly unlikely imho .

I favour Von Braun's belief that Deep State will only ' disclose'  enough related material to make the final False Flag operation a success -- a  fake  'ET' invasion  .

 Coming our way quite soon .Step one , Covid etc etc 

There is a wonderful CT section on the forum you might really enjoy it, free tin foil hats at the door.

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5 hours ago, Luiza22 said:

As long as the Bad Guys faction in the Deep State continue to hold control , there will be no meaningful disclosure until it is 100% guaranteed maximum profitable  . For them .

Do you really imagine , for example , that those making trillions out of current main energy sources would allow a change before they ensured that the existing status quo was retained ?

 NOT A PRAYER .

You would have to convince me that the so called White Hats have either executed their opponents or arranged a deal which could never be reversed .  Highly unlikely imho .

I favour Von Braun's belief that Deep State will only ' disclose'  enough related material to make the final False Flag operation a success -- a  fake  'ET' invasion  .

 Coming our way quite soon .Step one , Covid etc etc 

Can you elaborate on your comments? Who are the "bad guys"? Please describe what you mean by "Deep State" in the context you are using the term.  Where or how did you come to these conclusions?

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quoted from article:

Quote

Gough told the publication: "I can confirm that the referenced photos and videos were taken by Navy personnel.

how does Gough know that the photos & videos were taken by navy personnel?

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21 hours ago, Trelane said:

Can you elaborate on your comments? Who are the "bad guys"? Please describe what you mean by "Deep State" in the context you are using the term.  Where or how did you come to these conclusions?

The internet said so is my guess.

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Wernher von Braun + Deep State, well, that seems to be quite new. Next: Marshmallow Man + Dyatlov Pass incident.

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  • 7 months later...

 

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3 hours ago, Trelane said:

Any disclosure yet?

Where is Tom DeLonge and TTSA when you need them.

Their smoking gun was more of a wispy fart.

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On 12/6/2021 at 10:33 PM, Trelane said:

Any disclosure yet?

Disclosure...? Not any time soon. Imagine the consequences if there ever was an official statement, something akin to this: "Ladies and gentlemen, citizens of the USA and the World, tonight I'd like to inform you of the fact there are various types of unknown objects operating within our atmosphere. They conduct themselves with disregard to any country's borders and essentially operate with impunity when confronted by our best military jets. We do not know their ultimate intentions or whether their motives are peaceful or hostile. They do show an inordinate amount of interest regarding our military forces and nuclear installations, these incidents we are watching closely. Have a good evening." Imagine the fire storm of questions every elected leader would be confronted with, questions they could not answer. Imagine those elected officials then breathing down the backs of every general and admiral, telling them we've got to have answers.  It would be a lose-lose for all of them. Sure, we would all like to know the truth about this "big question", but dealing with the fall out is not something Washington, the Pentagon, and other governments of the world care to contend with. They are most happy when the typical person is watching NFL football, world cup soccer, or the Kardashians latest shenanigans.

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9 minutes ago, Phantom309 said:

Disclosure...? Not any time soon. Imagine the consequences if there ever was an official statement, something akin to this: "Ladies and gentlemen, citizens of the USA and the World, tonight I'd like to inform you of the fact there are various types of unknown objects operating within our atmosphere. They conduct themselves with disregard to any country's borders and essentially operate with impunity when confronted by our best military jets. We do not know their ultimate intentions or whether their motives are peaceful or hostile. They do show an inordinate amount of interest regarding our military forces and nuclear installations, these incidents we are watching closely. Have a good evening." Imagine the fire storm of questions every elected leader would be confronted with, questions they could not answer. Imagine those elected officials then breathing down the backs of every general and admiral, telling them we've got to have answers.  It would be a lose-lose for all of them. Sure, we would all like to know the truth about this "big question", but dealing with the fall out is not something Washington, the Pentagon, and other governments of the world care to contend with. They are most happy when the typical person is watching NFL football, world cup soccer, or the Kardashians latest shenanigans.

Where have you been?   That is pretty much what they have said.  They have no idea what the phenomena are but they are keeping track of all the incidents.

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2 hours ago, Desertrat56 said:

Where have you been?   That is pretty much what they have said.  They have no idea what the phenomena are but they are keeping track of all the incidents.

No, I'm referring to full disclosure, something they have not done, and for the reasons I've indicated, probably never will. 

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Just now, Phantom309 said:

No, I'm referring to full disclosure, something they have not done, and for the reasons I've indicated, probably never will. 

We all know that.  Or rather the people who pay attention.   Do you think they actually have something to disclose besides all the mind control experiments they have done over the years?

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51 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

We all know that.  Or rather the people who pay attention.   Do you think they actually have something to disclose besides all the mind control experiments they have done over the years?

Without a doubt. Seventy plus years of reports and sightings. Comments from ex military people and DOD personnel that high quality video and High Def pictures exist of objects that have paced Navy FA-18's in flight, but are still classified at the highest levels of government. Testimony from over 150 ex military personnel that UAP's have made dozens of incursions into our defense sites and interfered with our nuclear missle complexes. The fact the government has "exotic" materials acquired from crash retrievals - and have lied about it forever. This just goes on and on. Much is at stake here. We want advanced technology of this nature - we certainly can't afford to have sinister bad actors like China and Russia acquire and perfect it first. However, we can't let a "further disclosure" hinder that objective.

Regarding that DOD report this past June, about the biggest thing it revealed was the fact 143 out of 144 UAP incidents could not be explained.....that is a significant admittance in my book.....and is a radical departure form the old days where everything was just swamp gas, weather balloons and the planets Venus and Jupiter. 

In a recent Martin Willis podcast, he posted this from a listener -  I thought it was quite spot on regarding the perils of further disclosure:

"Rock and a hard place for the DOD. If they say the objects are terrestrial in nature, then it's obvious that the hundreds of billions we have spent on aircraft and weapons systems are hopelessly obsolete. If they say the objects are extraterrestrial, it's the biggest story in human history....and like above, every military system we have is useless junk. The default position the DOD has been pushing - we don't know what it is, and could you all just forget about all of it - just doesn't hang anymore. The situation could develop into the biggest threat ever to the military industrial complex."

Bottom line, its a very convoluted, complex, puzzling enigma, wrapped up in a huge riddle of the unknown....and what is known is far from being a complete picture for us - the public. 

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A very large enigmatic...nothing burger.

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17 hours ago, Phantom309 said:

No, I'm referring to full disclosure, something they have not done, and for the reasons I've indicated, probably never will. 

So, what is different about what you say than some of the rest of us have said.   There is nothing to disclose.  Any one who has real information is not positioned to be considered part of the government.  And all the information floating around is either disinformation to keep people paying attention (watch the hand and ignore the guy behind the curtain), making it up for attention, has mental issues, or is just an ordinary person with strange experiences that can't be classified.   "The Government" does  not have what you want to be disclosed.   And anyone who may, has their reasons not to disclose it, probably, in my opinion, if there are aliens from outerspace, they are the ones keeping the secrets.  How could it be otherwise?

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