jmccr8 Posted April 24, 2021 #1 Share Posted April 24, 2021 I made a comment in another thread and thought maybe some of you would find it a fun exercise, if we become our own creators does god need to exist or will god live in exile? jmccr8 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted April 24, 2021 #2 Share Posted April 24, 2021 God is already in exile. But like with most expatriates, they eventually come home. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted April 24, 2021 Author #3 Share Posted April 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, Will Do said: God is already in exile. But like with most expatriates, they eventually come home. Hi Will Interesting as that may be after 200 years of being cloned or downloaded into a synthetic body or both would they even have a concept of a parent never mind a god? jmccr8 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted April 24, 2021 #4 Share Posted April 24, 2021 1 minute ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Will Interesting as that may be after 200 years of being cloned or downloaded into a synthetic body or both would they even have a concept of a parent never mind a god? jmccr8 To be honest, the topic of the personal continuation of life via cloning, makes no sense at all to me. So I'll bow out at this point and let those who have a different point of view discuss the issues with you. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted April 24, 2021 Author #5 Share Posted April 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Will Do said: To be honest, the topic of the personal continuation of life via cloning, makes no sense at all to me. So I'll bow out at this point and let those who have a different point of view discuss the issues with you. Hi Will You do not have to bow out, each of us has an opinion and it is good to exercise it if one understands that it is an exercise. I may pose questions from several different positions just to see what reaction occurs as a thinking exercise. You are a member as well as a friend whether we agree or not so share your thoughts. jmccr8 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted April 24, 2021 #6 Share Posted April 24, 2021 I’d have to wonder what would be the point in believing in a god if one’s continued existence could be explained without one. cormac 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted April 24, 2021 Author #7 Share Posted April 24, 2021 10 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said: I’d have to wonder what would be the point in believing in a god if one’s continued existence could be explained without one. cormac Hi Cormac That was what I was wondering but we do have some members here that have very different perspectives that we do and am interested in how they would see such a future. My primary source of abstract thinking on this matter is Walker truth be told although I have seen others in different sub forums that are just as adamant given it be AI or aliens or a matrix situation. Would we even know what the human experience is without lose of friends, loves, families or god if we are just a digital copy of what man once was. jmccr8 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted April 24, 2021 #8 Share Posted April 24, 2021 Just now, jmccr8 said: Hi Cormac That was what I was wondering but we do have some members here that have very different perspectives that we do and am interested in how they would see such a future. My primary source of abstract thinking on this matter is Walker truth be told although I have seen others in different sub forums that are just as adamant given it be AI or aliens or a matrix situation. Would we even know what the human experience is without lose of friends, loves, families or god if we are just a digital copy of what man once was. jmccr8 IMO if we were nothing more than a digital copy then we’d have ceased to qualify as human so there would be no point in pretending. cormac 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted April 24, 2021 Author #9 Share Posted April 24, 2021 Just now, cormac mac airt said: IMO if we were nothing more than a digital copy then we’d have ceased to qualify as human so there would be no point in pretending. cormac Hi Cormac Yes, I share your outlook. It is interesting in the sense that at some time in the future they may say yes you are 4% human and make it sound like our mixed evolution with Neandertals and Denisovans. jmccr8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted April 24, 2021 #10 Share Posted April 24, 2021 I think the central point to this discussion is, personality. What is personality exactly? And can it ever really be copied? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted April 24, 2021 Author #11 Share Posted April 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said: IMO if we were nothing more than a digital copy then we’d have ceased to qualify as human so there would be no point in pretending. cormac Hi Cormac I should ad that your participation as a rational person will be greatly appreciated as over the years I have enjoyed your mentorship. jmccr8 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted April 24, 2021 #12 Share Posted April 24, 2021 IMO, in an ever changing universe, personality is sonething that will forever remain changeless. Eventhough personality can grow, IMO it can't ever be cloned nor copied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted April 24, 2021 #13 Share Posted April 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Cormac Yes, I share your outlook. It is interesting in the sense that at some time in the future they may say yes you are 4% human and make it sound like our mixed evolution with Neandertals and Denisovans. jmccr8 An android would have nothing physical in which to be considered human and a human has never been cloned. Could a clone even understand the concept of “god”? cormac 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted April 24, 2021 Author #14 Share Posted April 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, Will Do said: I think the central point to this discussion is, personality. What is personality exactly? And can it ever really be copied? Hi Will Personality, is it the sum of our experience or did we come into the world with a predisposed personality, a father's son sort of thing? Every generation thinks they are the romantics and their forbearers Victorian. My dad told me he saw the rise and fall of the mini skirt during his lifetime fashion wise. jmccr8 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted April 24, 2021 Author #15 Share Posted April 24, 2021 1 minute ago, cormac mac airt said: An android would have nothing physical in which to be considered human and a human has never been cloned. Could a clone even understand the concept of “god”? cormac Hi Cormac Exactly, to me it is like someone telling me that they astral travel and sit on pyramids. What resemblance to being human is left? jmccr8 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted April 24, 2021 #16 Share Posted April 24, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said: An android would have nothing physical in which to be considered human and a human has never been cloned. Could a clone even understand the concept of “god”? A question about the latter, “if” a human could be cloned and the clone believed the opposite of the original person can it still qualify as being the same person? cormac Edited April 24, 2021 by cormac mac airt 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted April 24, 2021 #17 Share Posted April 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Will Personality, is it the sum of our experience or did we come into the world with a predisposed personality, a father's son sort of thing? Every generation thinks they are the romantics and their forbearers Victorian. My dad told me he saw the rise and fall of the mini skirt during his lifetime fashion wise. jmccr8 Yes, I think that's what personality is. It's a bestowal from father to son that is forever unique. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted April 24, 2021 #18 Share Posted April 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said: A question about the latter, “if” a human could be cloned and the clone believed the opposite of the original person can it still qualify as being the same person? cormac IMO the scenario you brought up is the same kind of impossible paradox as time travel. Even identical twins don't share the same personality. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted April 24, 2021 #19 Share Posted April 24, 2021 Just now, Will Do said: IMO the scenario you brought up is the same kind of impossible paradox as time travel. Even identical twins don't share the same personality. I know that but there are quacks here that claim to know differently. cormac 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted April 24, 2021 Author #20 Share Posted April 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said: A question about the latter, “if” a human could be cloned and the clone believed the opposite of the original person can it still qualify as being the same person? cormac Hi Cormac Closest reference I can think of is my wife(hypothetical wife) asks me to move the piano to 7 different points of reference in the piano room then settles on the first point of reference is somewhat different than if a client asks me then I am happy because each time I move that sucker I am charging 50 bucks and go home with $350 and take my girl out for steaks and have change. Individuals change their minds all the time that is how we progress, am I the same person I was when I was a child and had no choice? jmccr8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted April 24, 2021 Author #21 Share Posted April 24, 2021 9 minutes ago, Will Do said: Yes, I think that's what personality is. It's a bestowal from father to son that is forever unique. Hi Will If after a time of having no father other than the choice to be what influence do you think will arise? Will god matter? jmccr8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted April 24, 2021 #22 Share Posted April 24, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Cormac Closest reference I can think of is my wife(hypothetical wife) asks me to move the piano to 7 different points of reference in the piano room then settles on the first point of reference is somewhat different than if a client asks me then I am happy because each time I move that sucker I am charging 50 bucks and go home with $350 and take my girl out for steaks and have change. Individuals change their minds all the time that is how we progress, am I the same person I was when I was a child and had no choice? jmccr8 Biologically you’re still you and that covers thoughts but your actions also help define you, so could a clone of you that believes the exact opposite still be considered you? I would say no because its beliefs were never originally yours. cormac Edited April 24, 2021 by cormac mac airt 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jethrofloyd Posted April 24, 2021 #23 Share Posted April 24, 2021 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hankenhunter Posted April 24, 2021 #24 Share Posted April 24, 2021 (edited) Guess I'll jump in within the set parameters. If we're allowing God into it, I'll say that if a mind, and a brain, and emotions that are organic, souls will still be able to incarnate. When the brain becomes almost digital, God won't be interested anymore because it's our soul/body interaction and the lessons, and experiences we learn for ourselves, and him, won't be human anymore. God will probably abandon humans then, because humans are a transitory illusion created to expedite experiences, and learning. And if we're not longer human, we wouldn't fit the criteria for soul incarnations. God would simply shift souls/spirits to another world to continue the journeys. So in a nutshell, I don't think that we will ever get even close to the scenario you invisioned. It would be anathema to what God built to house our souls/spirits. Robots don't have souls. Cyborgs on the other hand would. Until the brain becomes silicone in nature, God will always be with us. To add to Will's statement, I think the word he was searching for was traits, instead of personality. Traits travel with spirit/souls. Spirit also retains personality, and traits. Otherwise, spirit/souls would simply be automatons. We are not automatons. We have free will, and choice. Would souls/spirit be any different? If you allow God into it, you have to allow soul/spirit as well. Great thread. Good to see more free thinking. Spruces the place up a bit, it does. Edited April 24, 2021 by Hankenhunter Clarity 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted April 24, 2021 Author #25 Share Posted April 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said: Biologically you’re still you and that covers thoughts but your actions also help define you, so could a clone of you that believes the exact opposite still be considered you? I would say no because its beliefs were never originally yours. cormac Hi Cormac That poses an interesting position, have I never had a conflicting thought before I was cloned and would I remember it or would it affect me sublimibinaly? Do I remember every thought I have had or do I have impressions left by them? jmccr8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts