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Guyver

A Life Without Religion

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Guyver
Just now, ant0n said:

What makes it "particular"?

Particular denotes which type.  There are many organized religions, to choose from.  

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Guyver

Learn something important each day, and remember it.  That is what I would put in my religion if I had one.

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Guyver

Today I learned that it’s not broken if it can’t be fixed and that patience is a virtue.  I also recognize that I could really stand to do a better job with that latter part.  FWIW.

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docyabut2
Posted (edited)
On ‎5‎/‎24‎/‎2021 at 11:03 PM, Guyver said:

Can you imagine a life without religion or do you have one?  I do.  I have chosen to live my life without religion - unless it’s a religion that I make up for myself.  So, I’m going for it.  I’m making up my own religion and choosing what to believe in.  Have you ever thought of making up your own religion?  I bet you could get really crazy with it…..but, I’m trying to keep it really simple, so for now, I like Math, Science, Natural Observation, Contemplation and Study, plus the Eleven Rules of the Earth.  I’m not saying I am a Satanist, but I like some of the rules they made better than the Ten Commandments.  

if the Ten Commandments ever come back do not killed  steal ,cheat or  lie will heal our nations .

Edited by docyabut2

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Guyver
Just now, docyabut2 said:

if the Ten Commandments ever  come back will heal our nations .

Are you going to keep the sabbath?

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Guyver
1 minute ago, docyabut2 said:

if the Ten Commandments ever  come back will heal our nations .

Would you be willing to sacrifice a goat if you failed one of the Ten Commandments?  I’m just asking.

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docyabut2
1 minute ago, Guyver said:

Would you be willing to sacrifice a goat if you failed one of the Ten Commandments?  I’m just asking.

the do not killed, steal ,cheat or lie in the Ten Commandments is the basic laws of our countries  

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Guyver
3 minutes ago, docyabut2 said:

the do not killed, steal ,cheat or lie in the Ten Commandments is the basic laws of our countries  

Yes, those are good, but that’s only three out of ten and some of the others are effed up, so I don’t think that would work. Just my opinion though.  There was a guy in the Bible who was killed for picking up sticks on the Sabbath.

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Guyver
Posted (edited)

I wouldn’t be able to willingly join a religion that would kill me if I made a mistake or violated on of the laws.

Edited by Guyver
Typo
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Will Due

 

Regarding something not being able to be fixed because of it not being broken in the first place and the Ten Commandments being "basic law", picking up sticks LOL, I came across this:

 

"The planetary creatures of God’s spirit indwelling, scattered hither and yon throughout the universes of space, are so nearly infinite in number and order, their intellects are so diverse, their minds are so limited and sometimes so gross, their vision is so curtailed and localized, that it is almost impossible to formulate generalizations of law adequately expressive of the Father’s infinite attributes and at the same time to any degree comprehensible to these created intelligences. Therefore, to you the creature, many of the acts of the all-powerful Creator seem to be arbitrary, detached, and not infrequently heartless and cruel. But again I assure you that this is not true. God’s doings are all purposeful, intelligent, wise, kind, and eternally considerate of the best good, not always of an individual being, an individual race, an individual planet, or even an individual universe; but they are for the welfare and best good of all concerned, from the lowest to the highest. In the epochs of time the welfare of the part may sometimes appear to differ from the welfare of the whole; in the circle of eternity such apparent differences are nonexistent.

3:2.9

"We are all a part of the family of God, and we must therefore sometimes share in the family discipline. Many of the acts of God which so disturb and confuse us are the result of the decisions and final rulings of all-wisdom, empowering the Conjoint Actor to execute the choosing of the infallible will of the infinite mind, to enforce the decisions of the personality of perfection, whose survey, vision, and solicitude embrace the highest and eternal welfare of all his vast and far-flung creation.

3:2.10

"Thus it is that your detached, sectional, finite, gross, and highly materialistic viewpoint and the limitations inherent in the nature of your being constitute such a handicap that you are unable to see, comprehend, or know the wisdom and kindness of many of the divine acts which to you seem fraught with such crushing cruelty, and which seem to be characterized by such utter indifference to the comfort and welfare, to the planetary happiness and personal prosperity, of your fellow creatures. It is because of the limits of human vision, it is because of your circumscribed understanding and finite comprehension, that you misunderstand the motives, and pervert the purposes, of God. But many things occur on the evolutionary worlds which are not the personal doings of the Universal Father.

 

"The only evolutionary world without error (the possibility of unwise judgment) would be a world without free intelligence. The possibility of mistaken judgment (evil) becomes sin only when the human will consciously endorses and knowingly embraces a deliberate immoral judgment.

 

Source

 

FWIW :)

 

 

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docyabut2
Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, Guyver said:

Yes, those are good, but that’s only three out of ten and some of the others are effed up, so I don’t think that would work. Just my opinion though.  There was a guy in the Bible who was killed for picking up sticks on the Sabbath.

https://www.learnreligions.com/ten-commandments-basis-for-american-law-250894

the Ten Commandments  are taken away in my country  

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=the+ten+commandments+are+taken+away+in+america&qpvt=the+ten+commandments+are+taken+away+in+america&form=IGRE&first=1&tsc=ImageHoverTitle

 

https://onthe.rocks/why-the-10-commandments-are-being-removed-from-public-places/

Edited by docyabut2
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docyabut2
Posted (edited)

Sorry all but  its started in my life, in the sixties, when women were allowed for abortions killing their children :( my country took a away the Ten Commandments :(

Edited by docyabut2

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Mr Walker
1 hour ago, Guyver said:

Are you going to keep the sabbath?

yes ;) 

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Guyver
3 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

yes ;) 

Well, if you do any work, cook any meals, go anywhere but church or use your computer on Saturday; you’re not keeping the Sabbath.  

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Mr Walker
1 hour ago, Guyver said:

Would you be willing to sacrifice a goat if you failed one of the Ten Commandments?  I’m just asking.

IN Christianity such sacrifice is no longer  necessary or  applicable.

Christ died for all humans becoming our 'sacrificial lamb' His blood, in Christian theology, washed away our sins and made us 'new men'  without original sin.

 

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Mr Walker
Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, Guyver said:

Well, if you do any work, cook any meals, go anywhere but church or use your computer on Saturday; you’re not keeping the Sabbath.  

Not entirely correct but basically yes, that's how we live. My wife more strictly than I

The  laws were made for us, not we for the law, and so we should obey them with love.  

A loving god wouldn't expect you to to go hungry on Sabbath or to leave your kitchen unsanitary.

Care of/for self and others is allowed on the Sabbath and indeed is encouraged a t all times. In those groups who keep the Sabbath, and among individuals, there are varying degrees of strictness

Its true that a few try to do meal preparation and cleaning up before Sabbath, but most would not , especially in a modern age with both partners working full time 

Basically allowable things  include care of self  and others, and time spent with god (praying  reading/studying singing etc)  however, rest and relaxation are an important part of the Sabbath, and spending time with nature, or with others, is important .

It is a time to rest and recharge batteries, and separate  yourself from  the material world you live in during the week and all  it's worries and stressors. 

Basically we approach it like this 

No work related matters ( from sundown on Friday to sundown on Saturday) 

No purely pleasurable matters, like entertainment or sport

No commercial activities where you make or spend money Eg no shopping or take away meals    

However, if  I want to come on UM on Sabbath, and debate religious topics, that is part of the purpose of Sabbath.

You could do the same  at a church or a meeting in real life.

We use to spend the Sabbath out in nature, or visiting family  and friends.

Today, with less mobility, my wife   uses her computer /phone for bible study lessons, listening to a variety of sites with streamed hymns and religious music , and with staying connected to family and friends 

I am not so strict.

I dont watch tv or listen to the radio, but i do watch a movie or two.

I try to avoid any commercial activities, but if we badly need a commodity like milk or butter  i will go and buy  it.  

 

 

Edited by Mr Walker
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DieChecker
Posted (edited)

Breaking the Sabbath isn't any worse then using God's name in vain, or getting angry at a neighbor. You just add it to your list of sins to be forgiveness for. 

I tend to believe we (Christians) don't have to live by the OT laws. We live by the laws as outlined by Jesus and Paul. Dont do what you feel is sinful. Love your neighbor. Thus the Sabbath doesn't have to apply to Christians.

If keeping the Sabbath strictly brings you closer to God, all for the good. If you dont need to keep the Sabbath to stay close to God, all for the good.

That's the point of Paul's "everything is allowable" scripture. Do what works for you, other then the obvious Evil acts. What isn't "loving" to a "neighbor", isn't good. You can't go killing your neighbors camels just because it doesn't bother you...

Edited by DieChecker
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Guyver

To Mr Walker and DieChecker, I understand that as Christians you are no longer required to keep the Sabbath, as you believe Christ’s sacrifice completes the law for you and puts you under grace.  It’s just that I don’t see the Law as coming from Loving God, I believe it came right from the mind of Moses directly because some of it was borrowed from the earlier Code of Hammurabi.  Anyway, I have no criticism for your beliefs because I once shared those same beliefs and it would be hypocritical of me to criticize you for something I used to do myself.

PS.  I believe in resting one day a week as well, I think it’s good for a person to recharge the batteries as Mr. Walker said, it’s just that I don’t make laws about it…..I just usually kick back, relax, watch the golf matches and take a nap.  :)

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ant0n
18 hours ago, Guyver said:

Particular denotes which type.  There are many organized religions, to choose from.  

How has this whole discussion/thread helped you progress?

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Guyver
1 hour ago, ant0n said:

How has this whole discussion/thread helped you progress?

Well, the thread hasn’t died yet, so maybe there’s more to learn?  I’d say that this thread has helped me come to terms with things as they are, and make the adjustment of switching from believing in religion as a primary means of living, to one where I live whether I have religion or not, and it’s up to me to decide how I wish to live my life rather than relying on religion to instruct me.

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Will Due
Posted (edited)

 

Instead of looking to religion on the outside, since it's said that his "kingdom" and by definition, God himself is "within you" isn't it possible then, to look to him there primarily as a means of living? 

 

 

 

Edited by Will Due

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Guyver
1 hour ago, Will Due said:

 

Instead of looking to religion on the outside, since it's said that his "kingdom" and by definition, God himself is "within you" isn't it possible then, to look to him there primarily as a means of living? 

 

 

 

Many things are possible Will, but that doesn’t make them likely or actual.  When you say the kingdom is inside you, you are quoting Jesus from the Gospel of Luke if memory serves.  To say that by definition God is within you is a belief and not necessarily a fact.  What would you hope to find if God is inside you?  Wouldn’t you expect to see God there?  I’ve looked inside myself and I don’t find God there.  I find good things and things that are not good within me.  I suspect this is the same for all people.  I know that there are many people who meditate frequently, and search within themselves often, like many Buddhists and they don’t even believe in God.  In any event, since you are free to believe as you wish, it is possible for you to live any way you want to.

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Will Due
22 minutes ago, Guyver said:

Many things are possible Will, but that doesn’t make them likely or actual.  When you say the kingdom is inside you, you are quoting Jesus from the Gospel of Luke if memory serves.  To say that by definition God is within you is a belief and not necessarily a fact.  What would you hope to find if God is inside you?  Wouldn’t you expect to see God there?  I’ve looked inside myself and I don’t find God there.  I find good things and things that are not good within me.  I suspect this is the same for all people.  I know that there are many people who meditate frequently, and search within themselves often, like many Buddhists and they don’t even believe in God.  In any event, since you are free to believe as you wish, it is possible for you to live any way you want to.

 

I know you're familiar with how Jesus lived his life. 

Do you think Jesus live any way he wanted to?

 

 

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XenoFish
19 hours ago, Guyver said:

Learn something important each day, and remember it.  That is what I would put in my religion if I had one.

Wouldn't that be a part of a life philosophy though?

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Guyver
21 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

I know you're familiar with how Jesus lived his life. 

Do you think Jesus live any way he wanted to?

 

 

What would you expect if God was within you? Would you live forever as he does?  Would you heal the sick and raise the dead as Jesus did?

Jesus is said to have lived his life not as he wished, but as an example of living a life of faith and love for his Father, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.  In any event, I’m not even certain that Jesus actually existed the way the Bible claims, so… I’m not sure why you’re asking me.  I also do not appreciate that you ask questions but don’t answer them.  So, do me a favor.  If you’d like to ask me a question, please be sure that you have answered questions that I have asked you.  Alright?

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