Family who live in the Conjuring House say it's still haunted

[OrdinaryClay]

Just now, Xeno-Fish said:

Not my job to prove a ghost story. It's up to the storyteller to provide that. Too many frauds, fakers, and scam artist to take this stuff seriously. How about you pony up something worth while? Instead of getting all upset. 

I'm not asking you to prove a ghost story. I asked if you accept the legal rules of evidence https://www.law.cornell.edu/rules/fre

You are afraid to answer.

[XenoFish]

Just now, OrdinaryClay said:

If your claim is that every supernatural claim is covered by this list then please provide proof.

just because you offer a possible explanation certainly does not disprove the existence of the supernatural. I mean really. Come on.

I still waiting on you to provide something worth my time. I think you're only here to antagonize people. As you've yet to offer anything of real substance. 

[OrdinaryClay]

Just now, Xeno-Fish said:

I still waiting on you to provide something worth my time. I think you're only here to antagonize people. As you've yet to offer anything of real substance. 

I'm still waiting on you to answer if you accept the legal rules of evidence https://www.law.cornell.edu/rules/fre

Simple questions are not antagonizing.

[XenoFish]

Just now, OrdinaryClay said:

I'm not asking you to prove a ghost story. I asked if you accept the legal rules of evidence https://www.law.cornell.edu/rules/fre

You are afraid to answer.

I don't accept the legal rules of evidence on the grounds that eye witness testimony can lead to false positives. As human memory is faulty and any tale told become more and more exaggerated as time goes by. So no. Give me scientific proof of the paranormal that has pass scrutiny. If you can not do that, then do not bother me against. 

[XenoFish]

Yeah, I remember you now. I'm not going to waste my time with the likes of you. 

Edited June 7, 2021 by Xeno-Fish

[OrdinaryClay]

Just now, Xeno-Fish said:

I don't accept the legal rules of evidence on the grounds that eye witness testimony can lead to false positives. As human memory is faulty and any tale told become more and more exaggerated as time goes by. So no. Give me scientific proof of the paranormal that has pass scrutiny. If you can not do that, then do not bother me against. 

Thank you.

1) So you don't accept any verdict in the US legal system based on witness testimony?

2) Please provide empirical evidence that multiple corroborating testimonies from multile psychologically well adjusted individuals consistently results in false positives.

3) I know for a fact you live your life contrary of what you just stated above. You live your life based on the assumption that most testimony, including your own personal memories, are reliable. All humans do. Society would break down if this were not true. Your position is internet nonsense.

4) You have confirmed what I knew to be true. You believe the fallacy that all truth is derived from the empirical method. You live with the cognitive dissonance that the position entails. The claim that all truth is derived from the empirical methods itself can not be proven with the empirical methods.

[OrdinaryClay]

7 minutes ago, Xeno-Fish said:

Yeah, I remember you now. I'm not going to waste my time with the likes of you. 

You remember me? How do you know your memory is not a false memory?

[the13bats]

7 hours ago, OrdinaryClay said:

Doesn't matter. It only takes one to be real.

Yet with all the countless claims and stories not once has a haunted anything any ghost story been proven, eye witness testimony by itself is weak even in a court.

I watched you troll hard to antagonize to trigger xeno, he answered your every baiting question very well, you have beyond any doubt proven you are only here to troll to trigger.

if im wrong you would have proven even one haunting or ghost story but of course you didnt you just kept on flaming, typical of your type very predictable and gin clear transparent, you are furious you have nothing but your blind beliefs placating your hugh fragile ego.

Hey i get it its how you get your kicks and thats fine its a you problem i would like to welcome you to my illustrious "ignore list" so go ahead further prove my point about you by getting in your must have last word telling me how it is, of course with you on ignore ill miss it.

 

[OrdinaryClay]

4 hours ago, the13bats said:

Yet with all the countless claims and stories not once has a haunted anything any ghost story been proven, eye witness testimony by itself is weak even in a court.

What proof do you have that "not once has a haunted anything any ghost story been proven"?

Not all eye witness testimony is the same. That is why there are rules of evidence. In any case, there are cases with multiple vetted witnesses which make the case very strong.

Do you believe Napoleon Bonaparte existed? I hope so. Why? Based on what evidence?

 

 

[XenoFish]

12 hours ago, OrdinaryClay said:

You remember me? How do you know your memory is not a false memory?

I checked your post history. You've used the same tactic to troll before. 

[moonman]

Applying "legal rules of evidence" to the paranormal is....pretty goddamn stupid. This isn't court TV.

Believers can't prove they exist and skeptics can't prove a negative. However, it's on the believers to provide the evidence, not the other way around - can't prove a negative and all that.

Edited June 8, 2021 by moonman

[OrdinaryClay]

3 hours ago, moonman said:

Applying "legal rules of evidence" to the paranormal is....pretty goddamn stupid. This isn't court TV.

Believers can't prove they exist and skeptics can't prove a negative. However, it's on the believers to provide the evidence, not the other way around - can't prove a negative and all that.

Claiming all truth is derived from the empirical method is demonstrably invalid.

Do you believe Napoleon Bonaparte existed? Why? Based on what evidence?

[rashore]

Let's not derail the topic with Napoleon and legal rules of evidence please. Let's keep it to the OP topic and the story the current family has going on from the OP article. 

[XenoFish]

39 minutes ago, rashore said:

Let's not derail the topic with Napoleon and legal rules of evidence please. Let's keep it to the OP topic and the story the current family has going on from the OP article. 

There's another Conjuring movie coming out. So it isn't too far a stretch to say it's just a "cash in" on the movie buzz. As for Napoleon and legal nonsense, I fully agree. Same person who started it did it before in a different thread. Just check their post history and you should find it. 

[rashore]

20 minutes ago, Xeno-Fish said:

There's another Conjuring movie coming out. So it isn't too far a stretch to say it's just a "cash in" on the movie buzz. As for Napoleon and legal nonsense, I fully agree. Same person who started it did it before in a different thread. Just check their post history and you should find it. 

I had forgotten that there was a new movie coming out. I guess after a while a lot of movies now seem to kind of blend together for me. It's a shame, I think there are a great many fun spooky stories that haven't been tapped yet and here we are with the same few getting hashed and rehashed. But I digress and don't want to derail the thread with my own musings. 

I do think you might have a good point about the new movie and it's relation to the OP story. Though I do also wonder at how much influence the media and it's attention to the house might have over the family and their experiences as well. 

[XenoFish]

13 minutes ago, rashore said:

I do think you might have a good point about the new movie and it's relation to the OP story. Though I do also wonder at how much influence the media and it's attention to the house might have over the family and their experiences as well. 

Between the ghost stories, movies, books and other entertainment. I have a lot of trouble taking any of these "ghost stories" seriously. I do think the media plays a huge role in "hauntings". I think you might remember the wave of haunt doll threads we had around the times those Anabelle movies came out. 

[the13bats]

41 minutes ago, Xeno-Fish said:

There's another Conjuring movie coming out. So it isn't too far a stretch to say it's just a "cash in" on the movie buzz. As for Napoleon and legal nonsense, I fully agree. Same person who started it did it before in a different thread. Just check their post history and you should find it. 

 

16 minutes ago, rashore said:

I had forgotten that there was a new movie coming out. I guess after a while a lot of movies now seem to kind of blend together for me. It's a shame, I think there are a great many fun spooky stories that haven't been tapped yet and here we are with the same few getting hashed and rehashed. But I digress and don't want to derail the thread with my own musings. 

I do think you might have a good point about the new movie and it's relation to the OP story. Though I do also wonder at how much influence the media and it's attention to the house might have over the family and their experiences as well. 

Perception , suggestion what a person wants to believe mixed in with easy profits.

When we moved into this joint about 4.5 years back the seller who had bought it years back to fix and flip was so convinced it was haunted she lived in a garage on the lot behind it all tent style, no plumbing and  electical was on cord.

So she was an adamant believer, neighbors were divided, some thought the place is haunted others thought her a loon,

We have had zero experences, spookies never mess with cynical skeptics, i also debunked her major claims within a few weeks,

I had an appliance delivery guy ask me if it was a haunted B&B, i hadnt even decorated much and didnt understand it, perceptions, i grew up loving horror mostly campy stuff like Munsters and Addams family, my career which i still do was in the dark goth alternative mysic scene, so i do see spooky sells in many ways.

Imagine you have a famous movie house where it would be easyo to turn a buck from looky lous, that sells better if you claim the joint really is haunted, on this forum not long back a cheap yard sale baby buggy goes to like 700 bucks on feebay do to claims it was haunted.

It works perfectly too because the claims are never proven and believers require no proof faith is enough so you bet if a movie about a haunted  whatever just popped up with good press we would be inundated with stories from people who have the same haunted object,  people like feeling special so they jump that bandwagon, too bad i dont like people much or i could be cashing in on that b&b idea.

[rashore]

18 minutes ago, Xeno-Fish said:

Between the ghost stories, movies, books and other entertainment. I have a lot of trouble taking any of these "ghost stories" seriously. I do think the media plays a huge role in "hauntings". I think you might remember the wave of haunt doll threads we had around the times those Anabelle movies came out. 

Oh my, I'm so old I remember when Amityville threads were still fairly popular around here. Ronald DeFeo Jr. died a couple months ago.

I think the Heinzen's might be having a better time of it with the conjuring house. Looks like they are booked solid into Feb, and almost solid into the end of next year for their weekend investigations. At $125 bucks a head with a 6 person minimum that's not a bad weekends pay. 

[the13bats]

18 minutes ago, rashore said:

At $125 bucks a head with a 6 person minimum that's not a bad weekends pay. 

Lucky dogs!

I want to make money off fraud and make believe...wait, no i dont.

[moonman]

Oh, so they are charging for "ghost hunts" in the house. Color me surprised. Total money grubbing scheme if I ever saw one.

[XenoFish]

41 minutes ago, the13bats said:

I want to make money off fraud and make believe

Just write a book.

[Grim Reaper 6]

1 hour ago, rashore said:

Oh my, I'm so old I remember when Amityville threads were still fairly popular around here. Ronald DeFeo Jr. died a couple months ago.

I think the Heinzen's might be having a better time of it with the conjuring house. Looks like they are booked solid into Feb, and almost solid into the end of next year for their weekend investigations. At $125 bucks a head with a 6 person minimum that's not a bad weekends pay. 

Here is the thread I recently started  about the new movie.

I know what you mean about feeling old, I Feel more and more like that every day!

Take careCare

[rashore]

1 hour ago, the13bats said:

Lucky dogs!

I want to make money off fraud and make believe...wait, no i dont.

See, now I don't think they are doing fraud and make believe unto themselves. I think they really do believe in the existence of the haunt as much as you seem to believe it does not exist. Since they are of the mind that the haunt exists, why not make some bucks off it too to help pay the bills? They keep trying to get proof, others get to try to find it too.. it's a win/win from the belief in haunt standpoint.

It also gives them much better control over what folks come around to check things out. A previous owner was so fed up with the curious they sued over it. If one goes into buying the house believing the haunt, and wants to embrace the haunt and share it... that's a  bit more akin to if someone bought a murder house then it popping up in lore and attracting a lot of not welcome curious folks vs a murder house embracing it's lore and selling souvenir axes to the curious. 

I think they do believe in haunts... and are also completely embracing the fiscal aspects of such a place like other folks do with other legend promoting. 

[the13bats]

11 minutes ago, rashore said:

See, now I don't think they are doing fraud and make believe unto themselves. I think they really do believe in the existence of the haunt as much as you seem to believe it does not exist. Since they are of the mind that the haunt exists, why not make some bucks off it too to help pay the bills? They keep trying to get proof, others get to try to find it too.. it's a win/win from the belief in haunt standpoint.

It also gives them much better control over what folks come around to check things out. A previous owner was so fed up with the curious they sued over it. If one goes into buying the house believing the haunt, and wants to embrace the haunt and share it... that's a  bit more akin to if someone bought a murder house then it popping up in lore and attracting a lot of not welcome curious folks vs a murder house embracing it's lore and selling souvenir axes to the curious. 

I think they do believe in haunts... and are also completely embracing the fiscal aspects of such a place like other folks do with other legend promoting. 

Its cool we can have very different opinions on a subject, like others in this thread im skeptical.

You base yours on believing that the people honestly had the alleged experences and believe in turn the joints haunted so no harm in making a buck off it, i get that but do not share it.

Sadly i dont believe in paranormal based on stories, people make all sorts of claims yet dont try to proof it, are they also having in an unbiased team to investigate the alleged haunting? I dont know but doubt it, 

I dont know if they believe in spookies or not but i do see they believe in profiteering off the idea of it, so i guess we half agree and at least we have that.

[rashore]

9 minutes ago, the13bats said:

Its cool we can have very different opinions on a subject, like others in this thread im skeptical.

You base yours on believing that the people honestly had the alleged experences and believe in turn the joints haunted so no harm in making a buck off it, i get that but do not share it.

Sadly i dont believe in paranormal based on stories, people make all sorts of claims yet dont try to proof it, are they also having in an unbiased team to investigate the alleged haunting? I dont know but doubt it, 

I dont know if they believe in spookies or not but i do see they believe in profiteering off the idea of it, so i guess we half agree and at least we have that.

I didn't say anything about my beliefs on the paranormal or the experiences in my commentary. I said I think they believe in the haunt, and likely they believe in whatever experiences happened. I think it's likely from their belief stance they are not trying to be fraudulent or working from a basis of make believe. 

I do think they are making the buck, and know they are doing it. Just like other profiteers do with murder houses and other legends.