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Contacting ET is 'reckless', say astronomers

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Tom1200
12 hours ago, Brandy333 said:

While it would be exciting to actually communicate with an alien, assuming they are friendly and want to help, the fact of the matter is while some are friendly not all are.   

 

1 hour ago, Brandy333 said:

Experts claim there are 3 hostile Alien species visiting Earth | Ancient Code (ancient-code.com)

Have you met nice aliens?   I found this article, may be fact, fiction or a combination of both.   There have been stories of abductees who report their experience was not very pleasant.   I for one don't care to be abducted.

Oh.

Dear.

10 hours ago, Rlyeh said:

They may perceive humans as a threat.

WHY?  That's not an argument.  Flip this around - suppose we detect a species exists at the next nearest star.  It will be centuries before we can reach them, or vice versa.  So how exactly are they able to threaten us?

11 hours ago, Rlyeh said:

By not broadcasting our location.

By the time we are expanding to explore beyond our tiny little solar system we'll be building self-replicating probes to inspect and analyse every star, planet and grain of dust in every direction.  If there's life out there we'll find it, whether it wants to be noticed or not.  And the reciprocal is undoubtedly true - if aliens are out there looking they will find us.  

8 hours ago, naughtynick said:

Well said but I think you have missed the point. All you say makes sense to us with what intelligence and facts we have. The problem is that an intelligent alien life form is something that we cannot comprehend. We do know that not all human actions/reactions are logical.  We know that religion has had a strong influence on war like behaviour. We can all see what race differences can generate illogical hatred and acts of violance. We further know how different human thinking was 10,000 years ago ... just think what it might be in the year 3,000. We don't know. Hence, why would you presume to be so advanced that you can predict what the social norms would be of an entity so advanced that they can travel the universe? Hence to try and let them know where we are is risky and has benefits and consequences beyond our current comprehension.

Thanks - good points, well expressed.  Even if humanity's collective thinking is growing more tolerant and humane we still have ideologies and individuals that are extremely violent and dangerous.  Extrapolate this to the distant future and, no matter how progressive and enlightened most of us are, there will still be the meatheads who think it's funny to hunt, kill or destroy. 

Or will there?  With advances in science, medicine and technology will we decide to remove such negative traits from our genes?  When AR is fed straight into our brains, bypassing our sense organs, will future humans be idle slobs forever plugged into machines, able to 'visit' and 'experience' anything, anywhere at will?  When we can transmit our thoughts electronically, and AI can (and will) read everyone's minds, will any hostile or violent ideas be tolerated?

It's probable that the distances between intelligent species will prove insurmountable, and that even if we know about alien civilisations our contact with them will be 100% by remote communication.  Even at the speed of light it takes 4 years to send a message to the next nearest star, and realistically we're looking at many thousands of years for any 'conversation' between such isolated species.  I suspect the sci-fi notion of multiple species interacting in real time is but a fanciful dream.

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Abramelin
3 hours ago, Brandy333 said:

Experts claim there are 3 hostile Alien species visiting Earth | Ancient Code (ancient-code.com)

Have you met nice aliens?   I found this article, may be fact, fiction or a combination of both.   There have been stories of abductees who report their experience was not very pleasant.   I for one don't care to be abducted.

Glad to see that the article is followed by several comments that give us hope not everybody believes crap.

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Rlyeh
2 hours ago, Tom1200 said:

WHY?  That's not an argument.  Flip this around - suppose we detect a species exists at the next nearest star.  It will be centuries before we can reach them, or vice versa.  So how exactly are they able to threaten us?

Sure it is, here on Earth the superpowers try to keep the smaller nations in check.  Imagine if hypothetical aliens thought in a similar way, eliminate a potential threat before they become a real threat.

 

2 hours ago, Tom1200 said:

By the time we are expanding to explore beyond our tiny little solar system we'll be building self-replicating probes to inspect and analyse every star, planet and grain of dust in every direction.  If there's life out there we'll find it, whether it wants to be noticed or not.  And the reciprocal is undoubtedly true - if aliens are out there looking they will find us.

Would we have found Jimmy Hoffa by then?

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Tom1200
2 hours ago, Rlyeh said:

Sure it is, here on Earth the superpowers try to keep the smaller nations in check.  Imagine if hypothetical aliens thought in a similar way, eliminate a potential threat before they become a real threat.

There are many orders of magnitude of difference.  We can't apply Earth-scale thinking and problems at a galactic scale.  

Suppose there's an intelligent species on a planet orbiting Proxima Centauri, just 4.2 light-years from us.  They detect a signal from Earth that worries them enough to consider us a threat.  How does it play out?

  • They mobilise their space fleets, StarWars-style.
  • They start the journey to attack us...
  • Years pass... then decades... generations... centuries...
  • Meanwhile human technology is expanding exponentially, and our sensors detect this fleet half way.
  • We beam urgent messages to Proxima Centauri.  8.4 years later we get the first reply.  It says:

"Wot you talkin' 'bout?  Wot star fleet?  Nowt to do with us.  Oh hang on... just reading our ancient history here...  YES!  There was a civilisation here called the Piney - nasty, aggressive sods, that lot.  They've been extinct 500 years.  Must be theirs.  Here's some blueprints for a giant antimatter weapon.  Build it some time in the next thousand years and shoot them down when they reach you."  8.4 years later they get our reply:

"Cheers."

But that's just the nearest star.  Statistically it's probable that the distances and timescales are hundreds of times these.  By the time any alien poses a genuine threat to us we'll be spreading throughout space, with our own tech that far outstrips anything the Piney can throw at us.  We'll survive.

2 hours ago, Rlyeh said:

Would we have found Jimmy Hoffa by then?

If he's dead now we're gonna struggle to detect signs of life then.  But thanks for reminding us that the universe revolves around the USA.

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XenoFish

I figure humans are really the threat. We are a hostile, tribal, and territorial species. If we ever successfully spread out into space, we'll probably attack first. Then you have to take evolution into account. With each human colony changing due to environmental differences.

Our own species would become alien to us. Even if we never find life on other worlds. If we terraform and evolve for those environments, we become the alien. 

Considering we can't really get along with ourselves. Should we expect to with some thing so different from us?

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Manwon Lender
Posted (edited)
51 minutes ago, Tom1200 said:

There are many orders of magnitude of difference.  We can't apply Earth-scale thinking and problems at a galactic scale.  

Suppose there's an intelligent species on a planet orbiting Proxima Centauri, just 4.2 light-years from us.  They detect a signal from Earth that worries them enough to consider us a threat.  How does it play out?

  • They mobilise their space fleets, StarWars-style.
  • They start the journey to attack us...
  • Years pass... then decades... generations... centuries...
  • Meanwhile human technology is expanding exponentially, and our sensors detect this fleet half way.
  • We beam urgent messages to Proxima Centauri.  8.4 years later we get the first reply.  It says:

"Wot you talkin' 'bout?  Wot star fleet?  Nowt to do with us.  Oh hang on... just reading our ancient history here...  YES!  There was a civilisation here called the Piney - nasty, aggressive sods, that lot.  They've been extinct 500 years.  Must be theirs.  Here's some blueprints for a giant antimatter weapon.  Build it some time in the next thousand years and shoot them down when they reach you."  8.4 years later they get our reply:

"Cheers."

But that's just the nearest star.  Statistically it's probable that the distances and timescales are hundreds of times these.  By the time any alien poses a genuine threat to us we'll be spreading throughout space, with our own tech that far outstrips anything the Piney can throw at us.  We'll survive.

If he's dead now we're gonna struggle to detect signs of life then.  But thanks for reminding us that the universe revolves around the USA.

There are many possibilities that could take shape, Professor Hawking and other academics don't see things in the manner you describe them. Theoretically speaking let's say that an advanced intelligent Species that could be a Billion years older than ours also has Technology that matches their age. They could have easily solved the problems that currently exist with our current lack of knowledge of Astrophysics and the technological problems in creating an Einstein-Rosen Bridge. 

Since we are speaking in a theoretical manner here and that's all thread is about, so anything is possible or could happen. 

JIMO

Edited by Manwon Lender

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XenoFish
24 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

There are many possibilities that could take shape, Professor Hawking and other academics don't see things in the manner you describe them. Theoretically speaking let's say that an advanced intelligent Species that could be a Billion years older than ours also has Technology that matches their age. They could have easily solved the problems that currently exist with our current knowledge of Astrophysics and the technological problems in creating an Einstein-Rosen Bridge. 

Since we are speaking in a theoretical manner here and that's all thread is about, so anything is possible or could happen. 

JIMO

If they got to an extremely advanced point, would we even be of interest? For all we know humans and all life on earth are one of their experiments. They could be indifferent to us.

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Manwon Lender
Just now, XenoFish said:

If they got to an extremely advanced point, would we even be of interest? For all we know humans and all life on earth are one of their experiments. They could be indifferent to us.

I don't believe that we are an experiment, but as far as interest goes an advanced race my be concerned of what we evolve into and if we could pose a threat to others in the Universe at a later date. Outside of that, I doubt they would have any interest in us at all. The Earth has nothing of value when you consider all the other worlds they would have access to.

JIMO

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XenoFish
2 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

The Earth has nothing of value when you consider all the other worlds they would have access to.

This right here is why I don't support some of the alien theories. When there is a whole universe of resources, why even bother with a planet and species such as ours. 

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Manwon Lender
9 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

This right here is why I don't support some of the alien theories. When there is a whole universe of resources, why even bother with a planet and species such as ours. 

Like I said, to me it would be important to assess us as a possible future threat, and not much more.

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XenoFish
1 minute ago, Manwon Lender said:

Like I said, to me it would be important to assess us as a possible future threat, and not much more.

I think we'll nuke ourselves to oblivion before we do anything to threaten the cosmos. 

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Manwon Lender
Just now, XenoFish said:

I think we'll nuke ourselves to oblivion before we do anything to threaten the cosmos. 

I don't see that happening, I think we will continue to kill our fellow man. But even mankind as a whole doesn't see a path to extinction.

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XenoFish
1 hour ago, Manwon Lender said:

But even mankind as a whole doesn't see a path to extinction.

I don't share your optimism.

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Manwon Lender
Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

I don't share your optimism.

That's ok, I am a Buddhist, being optimistic is part of the philosophy.

Peace. 

Edited by Manwon Lender

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Rlyeh
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Tom1200 said:

There are many orders of magnitude of difference.  We can't apply Earth-scale thinking and problems at a galactic scale.

And yet here you are attempting to apply your thinking to aliens.

 

Quote

Suppose there's an intelligent species on a planet orbiting Proxima Centauri, just 4.2 light-years from us.  They detect a signal from Earth that worries them enough to consider us a threat.  How does it play out?

  • They mobilise their space fleets, StarWars-style.

There is your first problem, you've been watching too much science fiction.  There is absolutely no reason to travel in person to a place you intend to wipe out. 

Suppose there is an intelligent species for what ever the reason decides Earth could be a threat.  They don't travel here, they monitor Earth and collect data about it's life.  If any direct conflict occurs, they're prepared.

 

Quote
  • Years pass... then decades... generations... centuries...

Centuries?  We've got plans for probes that could take decades to reach the nearest star.

 

Quote
  • Meanwhile human technology is expanding exponentially, and our sensors detect this fleet half way.

Wait.. why would their technology come to a stand still?

It seems like you think any kind of attack means dropping everything and running head on into battle.

 

2 hours ago, Tom1200 said:

If he's dead now we're gonna struggle to detect signs of life then.  But thanks for reminding us that the universe revolves around the USA.

Dead or not.  If we can't find him, what's the chance of finding anyone light years away who wants to remain hidden as long as possible?

Edited by Rlyeh

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Raptor Witness

1) “They” are already aware of our presence.

2) “They” are already interfering in our culture and our lives.

3) “They” are hiding in plain sight.

4) “They” do mean U.S. harm.

5) “They” cannot be wished away or driven out, without help.

6) “They” will be defeated by Jesus Christ, and this is why He spoke about the “Days of Noah,” reoccurring.

We can argue the motive for why a man might “lie” about His own origins;,but only if we are willing to argue a motive for helping U.S. defeat an invasion force that we are just now acknowledging might exist.

Why warn U.S. two thousand years ago, long before the telescope was even invented, unless You too are from an advanced culture, who knew this Day would come?

It would seem far more reckless, not to take a side, before it’s too late to imagine the reason why we were notified in antiquity.

Perhaps a war over turf is easier to imagine than a battle for the hearts and minds of men.

 

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Rlyeh
5 minutes ago, Raptor Witness said:

1) “They” are already aware of our presence.

2) “They” are already interfering in our culture and our lives.

3) “They” are hiding in plain sight.

4) “They” do mean U.S. harm.

5) “They” cannot be wished away or driven out, without help.

6) “They” will be defeated by Jesus Christ, and this is why He spoke about the “Days of Noah,” reoccurring.

We can argue the motive for why a man might “lie” about His own origins;,but only if we are willing to argue a motive for helping U.S. defeat an invasion force that we are just now acknowledging might exist.

Why warn U.S. two thousand years ago, long before the telescope was even invented, unless You too are from an advanced culture, who knew this Day would come?

It would seem far more reckless, not to take a side, before it’s too late to imagine the reason why we were notified in antiquity.

Why are you lying then?  Jesus didn't say anything about the US or alien life.

 

5 minutes ago, Raptor Witness said:

Perhaps a war over turf is easier to imagine than a battle for the hearts and minds of men.

Are you trying to win yours back?

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XenoFish
15 minutes ago, Raptor Witness said:

1) “They” are already aware of our presence.

2) “They” are already interfering in our culture and our lives.

3) “They” are hiding in plain sight.

4) “They” do mean U.S. harm.

5) “They” cannot be wished away or driven out, without help.

6) “They” will be defeated by Jesus Christ, and this is why He spoke about the “Days of Noah,” reoccurring.

We can argue the motive for why a man might “lie” about His own origins;,but only if we are willing to argue a motive for helping U.S. defeat an invasion force that we are just now acknowledging might exist.

Why warn U.S. two thousand years ago, long before the telescope was even invented, unless You too are from an advanced culture, who knew this Day would come?

It would seem far more reckless, not to take a side, before it’s too late to imagine the reason why we were notified in antiquity.

Perhaps a war over turf is easier to imagine than a battle for the hearts and minds of men.

 

This reminds me of those satanic reptilian alien stories where they want to destroy the earth. Enslaving all those good christians in the process.:lol:

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Brandy333
Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Abramelin said:

Glad to see that the article is followed by several comments that give us hope not everybody believes crap.

I think in the comment section of the article that Breglia came up with an interesting theory.   While in the hospital I tried a new medication which gave me some very bizarre hallucinations, of which I quit the medication quickly, but I think it also opened my mind to another dimension, as Breglia said, because I saw aliens no one else could see.   I don't know if I was "worthy" see to them, one in particular, but it was up close and personal.   I don't expect some to believe me, but it happened.   The question about if aliens are among us has been asked, and I can say positively yes.   You may not see them, but they are here.   Some appear very human, and carry on like humans.

Edited by Brandy333

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Abramelin
Posted (edited)

You'd be amazed about what you can 'see' with the help of 'magic shrooms'. Or LSD.

 

 

5a740e553c3f40a30747793a134652c6.jpg

Edited by Abramelin
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Abramelin
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Manwon Lender said:

That's ok, I am a Buddhist, being optimistic is part of the philosophy.

Peace. 

Woody Allen most certainly isn't either...

Quote: “We stand at a crossroads. One path leads to despair, the other to destruction. Let's hope we make the right choice.”

:lol:

Edited by Abramelin
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Brandy333
36 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

You'd be amazed about what you can 'see' with the help of 'magic shrooms'. Or LSD.

 

 

5a740e553c3f40a30747793a134652c6.jpg

That may be, but after I was put back on my former medication I no longer saw the aliens.   

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Abramelin
Just now, Brandy333 said:

That may be, but after I was put back on my former medication I no longer saw the aliens.   

I rest my case.

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Brandy333
5 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

I rest my case.

Why is it when animals hear and see things humans can't we say it is because they have a sixth sense.   But when humans hear and see things others can't we call it mental illness or hallucinations.   A person can develop ESP abilities so they hear and see things others don't.

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Abramelin
1 minute ago, Brandy333 said:

Why is it when animals hear and see things humans can't we say it is because they have a sixth sense.   But when humans hear and see things others can't we call it mental illness or hallucinations.   A person can develop ESP abilities so they hear and see things others don't.

Because many animals have sharper sense of smell, sight  hearing, and taste then us humans. All that can create the impression of animals having a sixth sense.

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