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OverSword

Americas Middle Class Will All Be Renters in the Near Future

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OverSword
Posted (edited)

And how does this kind of thing happen I wonder?

Quote

Biden Names BlackRock's Brian Deese As His Top Economic Aide

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The time is fast coming in which the USA will have to create a new government and a new reality.  Either that or live in a serfdom class forever.  We will have to take our nation back from big business and the corrupt government enabling this.

Edited by OverSword
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Desertrat56
4 minutes ago, OverSword said:

And how does this kind of thing happen I wonder?

Link

The time is fast coming in which the USA will have to create a new government and a new reality.  Either that or live in a serfdom class forever.  We will have to take our nation back from big business and the corrupt government enabling this.

No we don't need a new government, we need to get the corporations out of our government.

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OverSword
Just now, Desertrat56 said:

No we don't need a new government, we need to get the corporations out of our government.

You're not going to do that with the current oligarchs running things and the idiots that elect them time after time. 

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Desertrat56
6 minutes ago, OverSword said:

You're not going to do that with the current oligarchs running things and the idiots that elect them time after time. 

What do you propose?  Dismantle it all and let something new form out of the chaos?  Mad Max style?

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aztek

there is no way in hell voting will fix any of that,  picking up arms also wont do much good either,  we need something completely different, radically different

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spartan max2

Increase the housing supply. Remove zoning. Limit the amount of property or the type of single family homes that investment companies can buy. 

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OverSword
9 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

What do you propose?  Dismantle it all and let something new form out of the chaos?  Mad Max style?

Guillotines :D

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OverSword
8 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Increase the housing supply. Remove zoning. Limit the amount of property or the type of single family homes that investment companies can buy. 

Why remove zoning?

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Desertrat56
5 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Increase the housing supply. Remove zoning. Limit the amount of property or the type of single family homes that investment companies can buy. 

That really is the crux of the housing "shortage", coporations buying up rental property, raising rents and evicting people.   The actual housing market for individuals who want to buy a house is dependent on other things and in some areas those corporations are buying what would be considered "starter homes" and renting them so that people who want to buy their first house have very little choice but to keep renting.   Money and big companies being allowed to "rape and pillage" any place they want are the problem.  The government catering to those big companies which include the big 3 media companies that are trying to buy up all the television stations and newspapers, as well as the big three investment companies buying up buildings and rental property.  Not to mention the oil and gas companies that are doing everything they can to gouge us, and pollute the whole planet.   Our government is a corporate democracy, meaning one step away from big brother, which will be when Amazon or Google buys out all the companies that Zuckerberg owns.  By then it will be one huge monopoly and we will be seeing Max Headroom type crp.

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spartan max2
Just now, OverSword said:

Why remove zoning?

*To an extent 

Lol. Obviously don't remove all zoning.

But zoning limits housing supplies. NIMBYISM and all that. Things like only single family homes in certain areas. Or even the size single family homes have to be and such. 

Demand has outpaced supply for a long time with housing and will probably only get worse. So idk. Seems like allowing more houses to be built would increase supply some.

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Desertrat56
1 minute ago, spartan max2 said:

*To an extent 

Lol. Obviously don't remove all zoning.

But zoning limits housing supplies. NIMBYISM and all that. Things like only single family homes in certain areas. Or even the size single family homes have to be and such. 

Demand has outpaced supply for a long time with housing and will probably only get worse. So idk. Seems like allowing more houses to be built would increase supply some.

We still need open space, we need parks, we need to be sure bars are not close to school,  etc.  what zoning are you talking about? 

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spartan max2
1 minute ago, Desertrat56 said:

That really is the crux of the housing "shortage", coporations buying up rental property, raising rents and evicting people.   The actual housing market for individuals who want to buy a house is dependent on other things and in some areas those corporations are buying what would be considered "starter homes" and renting them so that people who want to buy their first house have very little choice but to keep renting.   Money and big companies being allowed to "rape and pillage" any place they want are the problem.  The government catering to those big companies which include the big 3 media companies that are trying to buy up all the television stations and newspapers, as well as the big three investment companies buying up buildings and rental property.  Not to mention the oil and gas companies that are doing everything they can to gouge us, and pollute the whole planet.   Our government is a corporate democracy, meaning one step away from big brother, which will be when Amazon or Google buys out all the companies that Zuckerberg owns.  By then it will be one huge monopoly and we will be seeing Max Headroom type crp.

As I probably mentioned elsewhere before, we successfully bought a house earlier this year.

And I can say that what you say is true. 

With already such a limited supply and historic demand. We had to compete with investment companies sometimes. Who would just offer cash and win, and then rent the house out.

There would be like 5+ offers on a house of regular people wanting to buy to live in. And then a rental company would show up and take it. 

Really seems like a problem.

Like investment companies are healthy for the economy when they are buying up housing that no one wants to flip them. But not when they are just buying houses that many people are trying to live in.

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Desertrat56
1 minute ago, spartan max2 said:

As I probably mentioned elsewhere before, we successfully bought a house earlier this year.

And I can say that what you say is true. 

With already such a limited supply and historic demand. We had to compete with investment companies sometimes. Who would just offer cash and win, and then rent the house out.

There would be like 5+ offers on a house of regular people wanting to buy to live in. And then a rental company would show up and take it. 

Really seems like a problem.

Like investment companies are healthy for the economy when they are buying up housing that no one wants to flip them. But not when they are just buying houses that many people are trying to live in.

The house I live in is the 4th house I have bought since the 80's.   It was easy in the 80's.  I lived in Midland, TX right after an oil bust where jobs disappeared and people just walked away from their houses.   The house I bought was empty for 3 years and the bank was desperate to get rid of it.   This house is the one I grew up in.  I had to get a mortgage to pay off my brother's half of the house and the mortgage is the reason I am not retired yet.   I got a better interest rate in 2017 than any other property I bought though.   My daughter has been told because of her student loans she will probably never be able to buy a house, but it is what she dreams of, no landlord or lease.

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spartan max2
3 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

We still need open space, we need parks, we need to be sure bars are not close to school,  etc.  what zoning are you talking about? 

Nonething that extreme.

Here is an opinion piece that goes into some.

https://www.marylandmatters.org/2021/05/26/opinion-ending-single-family-detached-zoning-benefits-everyone/

Pretty much many suburbs are zoned to only allow single family detached homes to be built. 

Suburbs are also often in highly sought after areas.

But single family detached homes can't house as many people as duplexes, townhomes, connected houses, etc.

Removing some zoning would just mean that types of housing could be built in suburbs along with the single family detached homes.

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Dark_Grey

I was just about to start a new thread about BlackRock buying up neighborhoods. If you thought the housing bubble was bad before...

Decent WSJ article RE BlackRock in the housing market

Quote

“You now have permanent capital competing with a young couple trying to buy a house,” said John Burns, whose eponymous real estate consulting firm estimates that in many of the nation’s top markets, roughly one in every five houses sold is bought by someone who never moves in. “That’s going to make U.S. housing permanently more expensive,” he said.

 

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Desertrat56
4 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Nonething that extreme.

Here is an opinion piece that goes into some.

https://www.marylandmatters.org/2021/05/26/opinion-ending-single-family-detached-zoning-benefits-everyone/

Pretty much many suburbs are zoned to only allow single family detached homes to be built. 

Suburbs are also often in highly sought after areas.

But single family detached homes can't house as many people as duplexes, townhomes, connected houses, etc.

Removing some zoning would just mean that types of housing could be built in suburbs along with the single family detached homes.

Suburbs being built nowadays put 6 houses on 1/2 acre so that is almost like living in an apartment.   Depending on where you are maybe your point is valid but not in the west where we have water shortages and other issues relating to the terrain and climate that make cramming more people into less space disastrous.  

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aztek
2 hours ago, spartan max2 said:

Nonething that extreme.

Here is an opinion piece that goes into some.

https://www.marylandmatters.org/2021/05/26/opinion-ending-single-family-detached-zoning-benefits-everyone/

Pretty much many suburbs are zoned to only allow single family detached homes to be built. 

Suburbs are also often in highly sought after areas.

But single family detached homes can't house as many people as duplexes, townhomes, connected houses, etc.

Removing some zoning would just mean that types of housing could be built in suburbs along with the single family detached homes.

yes, but when a developer pays a politician (donates to campaign) millions, the politician will change zoning, they will set up a public hearing, picking the time when the least amount of people can attend, do something else for the show, and change anyway,  there is nothing stopping them from doing it,  they are the ones making laws, and in the last 30 or so years basically every law was made to benefit those who politicians are benefiting from.  in reality we are not a constitutional republic, not even democracy, but an oligarchy, we had a thread about it a while back, 

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F3SS

I've been thinking a lot about moving lately. If I stay in PA it'll be in a more rural, more red area. Alternatively I consider Florida. As if competing with buyers isn't bad enough right now competing with Blackrock and Berkshire makes me feel like I'm stuck ntm the cost of lumber making me wish I finished my current renovations years ago. 

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spartan max2
6 minutes ago, F3SS said:

I've been thinking a lot about moving lately. If I stay in PA it'll be in a more rural, more red area. Alternatively I consider Florida. As if competing with buyers isn't bad enough right now competing with Blackrock and Berkshire makes me feel like I'm stuck ntm the cost of lumber making me wish I finished my current renovations years ago. 

Yeah. Cost of lumber making new builds more expensive isnt helping anything either 

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F3SS
44 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Yeah. Cost of lumber making new builds more expensive isnt helping anything either 

Yea and you have to decide quick too. I hear home builders won't guarantee pricing longer than 30 days out and even then they're still taking hits. I haven't kept track but it seems that every 3 to 4 weeks lumber goes up and it seems to be around +10% each time. About $9 for a 2x4 and $54 for a sheet of 7/16" plywood right now. It's madness. 

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Tatetopa
7 hours ago, spartan max2 said:

Increase the housing supply. Remove zoning. Limit the amount of property or the type of single family homes that investment companies can buy. 

There might be some problems with that.  The housing supply would increase if builders could make money building houses,  You need customers that can afford what you build.  Right now, Blackrock is sitting on cash, way more cash than any single family can muster.  They can outbid any individual and convert it to a rental  or hold it for resale at a higher price.  

That is capitalism.  That is what built our country.  It is a great thing until it runs away. Conservatives say that  if capitalists were restricted or regulated that would be the death of America. 

Blackrock and others have a lot of free cash partly because of 2017 tax cuts.  It did not get passed to workers, it got invested to increase their size and control.   Check out historic tax rates some time and see when the American middle class grew and flourished.  It was not during eras of low corporate taxes.

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Likely Guy
14 minutes ago, F3SS said:

7/16" plywood

?

We never heard of that in Canada. In that range we get 3/8", 1/2" or 5/8".

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Tatetopa
7 hours ago, OverSword said:

You're not going to do that with the current oligarchs running things and the idiots that elect them time after time. 

You must be talking about Republicans and Trumpers.

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Likely Guy
7 hours ago, OverSword said:

You're not going to do that with the current oligarchs running things and the idiots that elect them time after time. 

You are, of course, talking about a much more expanded time frame rather than about the last few months?

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F3SS
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Likely Guy said:

?

We never heard of that in Canada. In that range we get 3/8", 1/2" or 5/8".

We have true half inch also but for whatever reason they mostly manufacture 7/16, 19/32 and 23/32. Shaving that fraction probably saves a ton of raw material (trees) and has equal strength. We call it ½, ⅝ and ¾ though. I think ⅜ just goes by ⅜ though and the even thinner plywoods are often listed in mm's.

Edit,  maybe ⅜ does go by 11/32 now that I think about it. I usually can just eye it up and grab what I need without even looking at the tag though so I'm not always paying attention.

Edited by F3SS
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