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The Harm Done By Religion


Doug1066
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1 hour ago, Mr Walker said:

First, a bit I added to my last post, but left too long to be able to resave it. 

......................

Ps ive always had a strong healthy ego and self  esteem.

I was raised to believe it was an essential part of a humanist  and needed, not only to empower slef  to be the best  one can be  but  required in order to have the confidence and skills to help others.  I made myself a successful respected and lovable human being, without any helpusing  intelligent applicationand discipline of mind and body 

None of us are alone on this planet and we all have a duty of care to every other being and thing  

I don't need a "god"/powerful alien  to boost me, and I  never asked for its company  It took years to adjust to it's presence and to learn how to work with it   

Then :

I  don't take offence.

First your tone is neutral and reasonable, and second, previous posts show you have a good heart, if a sometimes irascible nature. 

All I can say is that your reaction is wrong, but natural until you have some experience in these things yourself . 

Tell me, do you think ALL humans who claim these encounters and connectors are full of crap, or is it just me :)  

If I was a Tibetan monk who had spent 6 decades meditating on these things, studying and practicing them,   would you take me more seriously, or is it all just impossible in your mind? 

Nope. If I'm going to indulge in mystical nonsense, I'd as soon stick with the kind I was raised on. Never was much into false prophets--or any other kind. I can do a better job of fooling myself, than they ever could. You're pretty good at that, yourself.

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8 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

Nope. If I'm going to indulge in mystical nonsense, I'd as soon stick with the kind I was raised on. Never was much into false prophets--or any other kind. I can do a better job of fooling myself, than they ever could. You're pretty good at that, yourself.

I understand where you are coming from.

However, I am one of the more introspective, self aware, and self  analysing,  people you will encounter.

I know my strengths and weaknesses.  

I understand both theoretically/academically,  and practically, the psychological and cognitive needs and make up of the human mind   

But it is good to see that your disbelief is universal, rather than personal. 

People raised  religious, who "grow out of it,"  often develop a mistrust in any  form of "out there"  experience  (and often of self declared authority figures) The more strictly they are raised, often  the stronger their rebellion and aversion to it all.

   I was raised secular humanist and taught to think ;logically and rationally, using evidence bases,   and thus I had to  grow INTO  knowledge and understanding of these things. 

 (generically) I would argue that it is important all your life to keep an open mind to new experiences, new knowledge and new understandings, and not close your mind off once you  think you know all you need to know,  or are comfortable in your current knowledge and beliefs. 

It is  a wonderful, but sometimes weird, world .

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16 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

First its important to understand that the Eastern Orthodox, which Georgia is part of have split and is no longer part of the Roman Catholic Faith. 

""The word "orthodox" means "right believing" and was adopted to signify the true religion that faithfully followed the beliefs and practices defined by the first seven ecumenical councils (dating back to the first ten centuries). Eastern Orthodoxy claims to have fully preserved, without any deviation, the traditions, and doctrines of the early Christian church established by the apostles. Adherents believe themselves to be the only true and "right believing" Christian faith."" 

Eastern Orthodox Beliefs Vs. Roman Catholic

The primary dispute that led to the split between Eastern Orthodoxy and Roman Catholicism centered around Rome's deviation from the original conclusions of the seven ecumenical councils, such as the claim to a universal papal supremacy.

Eastern Orthodox Church Beliefs

 

Baptism: Baptism is the initiator of the salvation experience. Eastern Orthodox practice baptism by full immersion.

TOP 10 Eastern Orthodox Heresies of the Eastern Orthodox Catholic ( Georgia )

Triple Baptism of Infants:  
Both triple baptism, and the baptism of infants, are found nowhere in the new testament. In Orthodoxy the baptism of adults and infants is by immersion in water three times in the name of the Trinity and is both the initiation into the Church and a sign of forgiveness of sins. To them triple infant baptism also removes their idea of "original sin".
the words spoken in the triple baptism are: “The servant of God (name) is baptised in the name of the Father. Amen. And of the Son, Amen. And of the Holy Spirit, Amen”. At each "invocation" the Priest immerses and then raises the infant up again. After the Baptism the Priest places the child in a new linen sheet held by the Godparent.

The reason the Eastern Orthodox Catholics go through the strange method of Baptism, is explained above. They call their method below a Triple Baptism and that's what they are doing  in the gif files below, its 3 dunks and done.

See the source image

 

Image result for strange eastern orthodox catholic baptism practices gif

 

 

Peace to you both, hope the information above  is helpful!:tu:

 

Helpful for what?  Frankly Manwon, I don't give a damn.   The church has a long and obsessive abuse cycle with children...there isn't anything else to know.

No offense, but I don't read much, and I don't care what anyone else has to say to be honest...not that I don't care what you think...I'm talking about them...the annonymous people in cyberland that I've never met or had a conversation with.  I just don't care.  I know what I think.  And I think Peter and friends stole the body of Christ and everything that happened in the church after that is a lie.  I didn't read what you posted because I don't care.  No offense to you my friend.  I just don't care.  What's going on in that video is sick...I don't care what anyone else thinks or says about it.  Peace dude! 

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21 minutes ago, joc said:

Helpful for what?  Frankly Manwon, I don't give a damn.   The church has a long and obsessive abuse cycle with children...there isn't anything else to know.

No offense, but I don't read much, and I don't care what anyone else has to say to be honest...not that I don't care what you think...I'm talking about them...the annonymous people in cyberland that I've never met or had a conversation with.  I just don't care.  I know what I think.  And I think Peter and friends stole the body of Christ and everything that happened in the church after that is a lie.  I didn't read what you posted because I don't care.  No offense to you my friend.  I just don't care.  What's going on in that video is sick...I don't care what anyone else thinks or says about it.  Peace dude! 

Helpful for what, oh I suspect you can figure that out without asking me a question!:D

My friend the reason I really like and most of all Respect you, is because you say what you truly feel and honestly that is rare these days. You dont bend the knee for anyone and more than anything else in my opinion that is what makes man and nothing else. You could have all the money you could ever spend, you can have people to carry out anything you desire, you could make people stand up and clap when you enter room, but noting matters if you bend the knee, even if it is only do it Once:yes:. Standing up for what you truly believe is the entire foundation of what freedom truly is and its the biggest and most valuable thing that the Constitution of the United States of America offers it citizens, While its not really talked about these days, this why so many people will do ANYTHING ( including give their lives freely to ensure their families have this opportunity ) to immigrate and  become United States Citizens .

Most Americans these days have forgotten that freedom is NEVER EVER TRULY FREE, and until recently during our lifetimes, Americans did understand this, and were willing to make the ultimate sacrifice without hesitation for this. But, at some point during the last 50 plus years people began to become far to complacent and in opinion lazy, instead of the interest all Americans once had their complacencies' have replaced their concern. We have both watched these sacred principles first become dusty, and then weather worn, and finally to develop cracks in our National Brotherhood, and in our principles. A great example of this is what's happening during the biggest National crisis our Nation has ever faced to knowledge. The SARS-Cov-2 Pandemic is horrific and totally out of control, and almost none of the events that have occurred  have been beyond our Nations ability to control this pathogen and that fact is what makes me very angry and sad.

A National health Crisis of this magnitude should NEVER be allowed to be weaponized for political purposes. Before the election in November it was both the Democrats and the Republicans both who were inventing false narratives, The Democrats ( Biden was leading the way ) were making negative comments about Operation Warp Speed and the safety of the vaccines being developed, and our Republican President was down rating the serious nature of the Pathogen, the use of masks, and the vary necessary practice of Social Distancing. Now our Nation is divided along the unbelievable and completely  blurred lines of politically motivated actions and even complacencies. JOC, I believe completely that each American should have a voice and the choice when it comes to the Individuals opinion concerning vaccination among many other important issues concerning this Pandemic along with the effect it has on the lives of Americans and the lives of their families. While I dont see the problems, concerns, and opinions that make vaccine hesitancy the problem it has become, I would still standup side by side with any American who wish's not to participate in SARS-Cov-2 vaccination programs that are operational Nationwide today.

But, here is the caveat JOC, all the support I offered above must come with the following disclaimer.

Which is very fair and nothing any Parotitic  American should not want to do in the first place. My personal support hinges solely on a simple frame work of equal checks and balances which are - that peoples decisions have no impact upon those who wish to wear a mask, practice social distancing, and receive vaccinations, boosters, and any other issue that these people feel is medically necssary!!

While to me this is all a very vary fair and simple trade off, I am not certain that all Americans will see things from perceptive!!:yes:

Its fine with me that you didn't read the Peer reviewed article I posted, and that will not stop me from posting other in the future when I feel they are appropriate. So simply put I take no offense at all to anything you said above and I hope you feel the same way when I continue to respond to  you and post others with newly updated Journals, Papers and articles!!!:D

Peace Bro!:tu:

  

 

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On 11/5/2021 at 4:17 AM, Manwon Lender said:

Can you prove without any doubt that anything you just said above is accurate??

Thanks Larry and I will wait for your response!

Can you do the same?

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On 11/7/2021 at 9:25 PM, XenoFish said:

You're trying to shoehorn this into a god thing. I think most of us know that the rain is real. If one get's wet from the rain, how do they feel about that? 

No, I was trying to make a point between opinion, and an experience.

Why is my experience, of THAT, different from your experience of rain?

Even if I cannot scientifically prove anything!

And how folk feel about getting wet has nothing to do with the point I was trying to make..

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1 minute ago, Crazy Horse said:

No, I was trying to make a point between opinion, and an experience.

Why is my experience, of THAT, different from your experience of rain?

Even if I cannot scientifically prove anything!

And how folk feel about getting wet has nothing to do with the point I was trying to make..

Your experience of "that" is probably a form of self induced psychosis. With you labeling your experiences as "God" further fueling imaginary associations. 

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On 11/7/2021 at 9:42 PM, joc said:

The real question is...if one get's wet in the rain...what is their opinion concerning their wetness?   Fact...you are wet.  Opinion...what you think about being wet.

Why is my experience, of THAT, not a fact, and only an opinion as Sheri, and Fish seem to think?

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49 minutes ago, larryp said:

Can you do the same?

Larry first let me explain something to you, I understand completely how my spiritual beliefs are viewed by others, and I release that the important view when it comes to personal spirituality of any kind its that person's persons, nothing else matters!:yes: So please take some advice, from someone who is a hell of a lot older than you!!!

I was born a Catholic, and Baptized into the faith and given a God Father. However, even though my mother and father were devote Catholics it never gained any traction in my heart or in my mind. So I pretended to care for the sake of my Mother, but in reality she was aware that my beliefs did not lay with Catholicism, so when I reached 14 years old my parents gave me a choice, to continue following a faith I never believed in or to walk away.

Needless to say I walked away it was the only way in clear conscience that an honest person could handle the situation and I never looked back at any form of Christianity, or any other organized religion for that matter. I married Korean women in 1986 who was Buddhist, and we are still happily Married today. Over the years by participating in Buddhist traditions with my wife I became interested in the Buddhist Philosophy as a foundation to build my spirituality upon. This Philosophy did not include the things I disliked most about all organized religious practices, and that is the omnipotent deify ( Creator Figure ) that all organized religions place their faith in

In Buddhism these creator deities doesnt exist, Buddha was a normal man, who was born under no special circumstances, Buddha live his life also like a normal man, without performing any miracles, and finally Buddha also died just like every mortal man has since the beginning of Space Time. Now getting back to my advice to you, while you may not agree with others, there is no reason to attempt to change their beliefs or views because simply put its impossible unless they choose to change all by themselves. In place of trying to push changes upon others, its best to wish them and their beliefs well and move along.

This way you will not offend anyone, and the door will remain open so that at some later date they may ask you about your beliefs and then you can expand upon them. However, if you try to push or force your beliefs upon others, that door will slam in your face and it will not never open again for your. Buddhist believe one very simple principle when it concerns the Buddhist Philosophy, never bring your spiritual beliefs conversation unless you are using them as an analogy like I have here, or unless someone asks you about something concerning the Buddhist Philosophy. 

Peace my Larry and I am happy you have found the path that suits you belief's and your faith!:tu:

Namaste: All things we need can be found with us. If we are not satisfied with ourselves it will also be impossible to help others and its the destiny of all men to help the less fortunate and lost have taken a path that leads to a DEAD END!!!

See related image detail

Image result for small buddhist emoji

 

 

See the source image 

 

See the source image

Edited by Manwon Lender
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On 11/7/2021 at 9:48 PM, joc said:

That is what we be talkin' bout....that is an opinion of yours...but yet you relate it is though it was the actual factual truth.  (did I just really say 'actual factual'?  wow...good one!)

There is no 'factual evidence' that Christ was even a man.  Nor that he was shining in the dark.  Now, Edison was indeed a man and he was truly 'shining' in the dark!

Next time what?  Next time.  What does that mean?  What is love and what's love got to do with it?   

Nothing wrong with anything  you are saying...per say...except you say it as though it were truth and it isn't. It is your opinion. ..and that's okay...we all have one about almost anything you want to throw out there...

That was my belief, about the future.

A belief/opinion based upon certain personal experiences, and other insights and intuition.

You may take it any way you want - as an opinion only.

I don't care.

Your life, your decision, your present, your peace..

BTW, Edison lit-up a room, Christ lit-up the hearts and minds of men, and the peace is real.

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On 11/7/2021 at 10:12 PM, XenoFish said:

So you went in to a trance state, la de dah.

Why are you trying to belittle me?

"Condemnation before investigation is the highest form of ignorance" Albert Einstein.

No, it wasn't a trace state but the exact opposite.

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Just now, Crazy Horse said:

Why are you trying to belittle me?

Just giving back to you what you give others. 

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On 11/7/2021 at 10:37 PM, Sherapy said:

You are describing being awestruck and it seems you are amazed at feeling awestruck, it is a fun emotion too, and I am pleased you are getting some quiet time, everyone needs time for themselves, or maybe this is a new emotional experience for you. In life, awe struck is part and parcel of the human condition everyone at one time or another in the course of a lifetime has been or will be awestruck to varying degrees over something or someone and this can include a fascination with ones ego too. A feature of awestruck is one tends to oversell things.
 

To me, It sounds like you are finally getting some much needed you time and you are loving it.   All the best to you. 

That's for the thoughtful reply Sheri..

And one does have to be careful not to oversell things, that's true.

And there are feelings of awe, wonderment, love and gratitude too. But they come after this sense of non-attachment.

It is hard to explain, better if one experiences THAT for themselves, but..

Meditating, in the present moment, without any thoughts, one may feel the Presence of GOD, or Source, or the Absolute, Supreme Real (give THAT a name, right) in any event, a Presence is felt, a presence that is renewed moment by moment. Then and I am not sure why, but a shift happens and one becomes detached from the world, in it, but no longer of it. And it is in this detached state of being, that one may feel a sense of at-one-ment, all this without a thought. Without an ego.

All the best.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Crazy Horse said:

"Condemnation before investigation is the highest form of ignorance"

Source?

It is entirely possible that Albert Einstein said it at some point, even more likely he said "something like it," since a version of it is in the Hebrew Bible and Einstein was a past master of Jewish scholarship.

Proverbs 18:13 (King James Version)

Quote

He that answereth a matter before he heareth it, it is folly and shame unto him.

So, why tag Einstein with it? Because that, too, is a harm done by religion - misrepresenting famous people's state of belief. Einstein has been an especially common victim of this, presumably because he was so smart and everybody admires him for that. In fairness, atheists, too, have fudged Einstein. For example Richard Dawkins was a big booster of the notorious fake Guardian translation of Einstein's thank-you letter to Eric Gutkind.

As to the merits, a proverb is a heuristic, and like most heursitics, there is also a counterheuristic, often of equal validity. In this case, Christopher Hitchens's Razor (He declined credit for originating it, but that's what the heuristic has come to be called; a suitable memorial to an outstanding mind):

What can be proposed without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.

Which heuristic better applies to a given situation is a judgment call.

Like everybody else who shares their unsupported personal opinions in the public forum, you need to accept that some readers' judgments will go against you. May you and your THAT find happiness together.

Edited by eight bits
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5 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

Helpful for what, oh I suspect you can figure that out without asking me a question!:D

My friend the reason I really like and most of all Respect you, is because you say what you truly feel and honestly that is rare these days. You dont bend the knee for anyone and more than anything else in my opinion that is what makes man and nothing else. You could have all the money you could ever spend, you can have people to carry out anything you desire, you could make people stand up and clap when you enter room, but noting matters if you bend the knee, even if it is only do it Once:yes:. Standing up for what you truly believe is the entire foundation of what freedom truly is and its the biggest and most valuable thing that the Constitution of the United States of America offers it citizens, While its not really talked about these days, this why so many people will do ANYTHING ( including give their lives freely to ensure their families have this opportunity ) to immigrate and  become United States Citizens .

Most Americans these days have forgotten that freedom is NEVER EVER TRULY FREE, and until recently during our lifetimes, Americans did understand this, and were willing to make the ultimate sacrifice without hesitation for this. But, at some point during the last 50 plus years people began to become far to complacent and in opinion lazy, instead of the interest all Americans once had their complacencies' have replaced their concern. We have both watched these sacred principles first become dusty, and then weather worn, and finally to develop cracks in our National Brotherhood, and in our principles. A great example of this is what's happening during the biggest National crisis our Nation has ever faced to knowledge. The SARS-Cov-2 Pandemic is horrific and totally out of control, and almost none of the events that have occurred  have been beyond our Nations ability to control this pathogen and that fact is what makes me very angry and sad.

A National health Crisis of this magnitude should NEVER be allowed to be weaponized for political purposes. Before the election in November it was both the Democrats and the Republicans both who were inventing false narratives, The Democrats ( Biden was leading the way ) were making negative comments about Operation Warp Speed and the safety of the vaccines being developed, and our Republican President was down rating the serious nature of the Pathogen, the use of masks, and the vary necessary practice of Social Distancing. Now our Nation is divided along the unbelievable and completely  blurred lines of politically motivated actions and even complacencies. JOC, I believe completely that each American should have a voice and the choice when it comes to the Individuals opinion concerning vaccination among many other important issues concerning this Pandemic along with the effect it has on the lives of Americans and the lives of their families. While I dont see the problems, concerns, and opinions that make vaccine hesitancy the problem it has become, I would still standup side by side with any American who wish's not to participate in SARS-Cov-2 vaccination programs that are operational Nationwide today.

But, here is the caveat JOC, all the support I offered above must come with the following disclaimer.

Which is very fair and nothing any Parotitic  American should not want to do in the first place. My personal support hinges solely on a simple frame work of equal checks and balances which are - that peoples decisions have no impact upon those who wish to wear a mask, practice social distancing, and receive vaccinations, boosters, and any other issue that these people feel is medically necssary!!

While to me this is all a very vary fair and simple trade off, I am not certain that all Americans will see things from perceptive!!:yes:

Its fine with me that you didn't read the Peer reviewed article I posted, and that will not stop me from posting other in the future when I feel they are appropriate. So simply put I take no offense at all to anything you said above and I hope you feel the same way when I continue to respond to  you and post others with newly updated Journals, Papers and articles!!!:D

Peace Bro!:tu:

  

 

I think maybe you are confusing two different posts.  I was talking about the priest and the baby.  :)

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15 minutes ago, joc said:

I think maybe you are confusing two different posts.  I was talking about the priest and the baby.  :)

No I didn't confuse anything I quoted you post below.

Helpful for what?  Frankly Manwon, I don't give a damn.   The church has a long and obsessive abuse cycle with children...there isn't anything else to know.

No offense, but I don't read much, and I don't care what anyone else has to say to be honest...not that I don't care what you think...I'm talking about them...the annonymous people in cyberland that I've never met or had a conversation with.  I just don't care.  I know what I think.  And I think Peter and friends stole the body of Christ and everything that happened in the church after that is a lie.  I didn't read what you posted because I don't care.  No offense to you my friend.  I just don't care.  What's going on in that video is sick...I don't care what anyone else thinks or says about it.  Peace dude! 

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4 hours ago, Crazy Horse said:

Why is my experience, of THAT, not a fact, and only an opinion as Sheri, and Fish seem to think?

Let me break it down for you brother:

I have experienced walking in the rain, in different situations, in different times.  Every time I walked in the rain I got wet.  How that experience made me feel is how that experience made me feel...the experience itself was...being wet.

 The experiences you have had are very real.  All experiences are.  The 'experience' is real.  What you experienced is all mental.  And everything mentally experienced is The Experience.  And when you experience something mentally...it has a lot of meaning for you...and you alone.   And that's cool.  Flow with it!  But just keep in mind that the moment you begin to share your own personal mental experiences...your own personal 'knowing' based on those experiences...in that moment, your 'sharing of experience' becomes  'opinion'. 

So, while your experiences have great meaning to you, meh, not so much to everyone else.

It's kind of like when my daughter was  young and we were driving listening to the Disney Channel and the announcer said...if you know who just sang that song call in and win a prize...so she called, and called, and called, and called and it was always busy, busy, busy....and she started crying and she said, But I know the answer!  I know the answer!  

I told her, But honey, so do millions of other little girls and they are all trying to call in too...but only a couple are going to get through.

Hey, I hear you man.  I wish people would listen to me too.  I have ALL of the answers.  But what good is having all the answers, any of the answers, if no one is interested in listening?  

Further breaking downage:

God is a concept.  No one can put their finger on it but everyone seems to have a different opinion about what God is.  But because everyone has an opinion, no one really cares much about the opinions of anyone else.  If you could Mind Melt your experience into someone else's brain maybe.....   But you cannot.  And so it just enters the vast domain of opinion. 

 

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2 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

No I didn't confuse anything I quoted you post below.

Helpful for what?  Frankly Manwon, I don't give a damn.   The church has a long and obsessive abuse cycle with children...there isn't anything else to know.

No offense, but I don't read much, and I don't care what anyone else has to say to be honest...not that I don't care what you think...I'm talking about them...the annonymous people in cyberland that I've never met or had a conversation with.  I just don't care.  I know what I think.  And I think Peter and friends stole the body of Christ and everything that happened in the church after that is a lie.  I didn't read what you posted because I don't care.  No offense to you my friend.  I just don't care.  What's going on in that video is sick...I don't care what anyone else thinks or says about it.  Peace dude! 

Cool.  I thought you were talking about Covid...my bad.  I told you I don't read much...B)

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4 hours ago, Crazy Horse said:

Edison lit-up a room, Christ lit-up the hearts and minds of men, and the peace is real.

Edison lit up all the rooms!   Following the tenants of Christianity is one thing.  Dogma is another.  Napoleon Hill lit up the hearts and minds of men as well...and that peace is also real.  But Napoleon Hill was a real guy...like Edison.  HE wrote a real book.  Edison actually created real light.  Christ died. And his teachings have been abandoned by the Church. So, pardon me if I don't care what Christ said or did or what the freaking church believes or what you believe for that matter.  Believing is something that people do when they don't know! So, if  you really 'knew' you wouldn't believe a damn thing!  You're welcome

Edited by joc
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9 minutes ago, joc said:

Cool.  I thought you were talking about Covid...my bad.  I told you I don't read much...B)

I am very aware of that my friend, so there is no surprise here!:lol:

Well, it time to go off to La La land, it 10:45 PM here in South Korea on the o the 10th of Nov 2021. Peace Bro

Gute Nacht :tu:

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4 hours ago, Crazy Horse said:

That's for the thoughtful reply Sheri..

And one does have to be careful not to oversell things, that's true.

And there are feelings of awe, wonderment, love and gratitude too. But they come after this sense of non-attachment.

It is hard to explain, better if one experiences THAT for themselves, but..

Meditating, in the present moment, without any thoughts, one may feel the Presence of GOD, or Source, or the Absolute, Supreme Real (give THAT a name, right) in any event, a Presence is felt, a presence that is renewed moment by moment. Then and I am not sure why, but a shift happens and one becomes detached from the world, in it, but no longer of it. And it is in this detached state of being, that one may feel a sense of at-one-ment, all this without a thought. Without an ego.

All the best.

 

 

Of course you will have times of feeling awe, love and gratitude through the course of your life. If I remember correctly, you are a father aren’t you? I am certain you feel joy, gratitude and awe about your kids.
 

Just some feedback: non-attachment is open awareness which means one does not cling to any thought or experience. It sounds to me you are attached to the idea (opinion)that you have connected to god, (in no uncertain terms) a non attached person would not defend or oversell their experience to the degree you are as hard as this is to hear, keep in mind this is your ego. 

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6 hours ago, XenoFish said:

Your experience of "that" is probably a form of self induced psychosis. With you labeling your experiences as "God" further fueling imaginary associations. 

When one feels happy, or sad, or lonely, is that experience unreal?

Psychosis includes confusion, hallucinations, a lack of self awareness...

None of which are present. in this altered state of awareness.

But if you want to keep on telling us what one is feeling in this altered state of awareness, without even trying to understasnd it, not investigating the phenomena for themselves, then feel free, you might even hit upon the truth one day.

Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance..

But you know that already.

 

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4 minutes ago, Crazy Horse said:

When one feels happy, or sad, or lonely, is that experience unreal?

Psychosis includes confusion, hallucinations, a lack of self awareness...

None of which are present. in this altered state of awareness.

But if you want to keep on telling us what one is feeling in this altered state of awareness, without even trying to understasnd it, not investigating the phenomena for themselves, then feel free, you might even hit upon the truth one day.

Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance..

But you know that already.

 

Who said I hadn't investigated it? Only you. Happiness is just a chemical in the brain. How you trigger it is up to you. 

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1 hour ago, Crazy Horse said:

When one feels happy, or sad, or lonely, is that experience unreal?

Psychosis includes confusion, hallucinations, a lack of self awareness...

None of which are present. in this altered state of awareness.

But if you want to keep on telling us what one is feeling in this altered state of awareness, without even trying to understasnd it, not investigating the phenomena for themselves, then feel free, you might even hit upon the truth one day.

Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance..

But you know that already.

 

CH, there is no condemnation towards you. Anyone can have a psychotic split. Long term chronic stress can bring it on, easily.  
They sound worse than they are.  There is a lot of stigma around “psychotic.”

Remember altered states of consciousness can include delusions and hallucinations,  a common one is claiming a connection to god.
 

At best one can reach a state of thoughtless silence here and there as a result of meditation which simply put is altering ones consciousness by focusing ones attention. 
 

No serious meditation practitioner makes claims that they have connected to god and if they do it is their ego talking. It is not rocket science. Rule of thumb exercise caution when someone is trying to sell you hubris, and it helps to know the difference. 
 


As always, all the best to you. 

 

 

Edited by Sherapy
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6 minutes ago, Sherapy said:

It is not rocket science. 

Might as well be.

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