The Harm Done By Religion

[Mr Walker]

5 hours ago, quiXilver said:

Modern psychiatry has begun categorizing fundamentalist thinking as a form of mental illness/disorder.

Too many undefined terms there and i also doubt that is true in mainstream psychiatry but it depends what form of fundamentalism you are talking of.

   Religious belief /faith/spirituality, is recognised as not just healthy, but fundamental to human well being, by most modern psychiatrists UNLESS it is especially destructive  in its beliefs. 

quote 

The importance of the relationship between religion and mental health is recognized exists. Patients do have spiritual needs that should be identified and addressed, but psychiatrists and other mental health professionals do not feel comfortable tackling these issues. Adequate training is necessary to integrate spirituality into clinical practice. The professional should have in-depth knowledge of the cultural and religion environment where his/her work is being done.

In the presence of psychopathology, religion may be part of it, contributing to the symptoms (obsessions or delusions for example). Sometimes, religion may become rigid and inflexible, and be associated with magical thinking and resistance. It may be helpful to integrate the patient into society, or motivate him/her to seek treatment (promoting guilt that motivates treatment in a pedophilic for instance). It may hinder treatment if it forbids psychotherapy or the use of medication.[3]

It has been described the elements of a functional theology, present in all religions, which may promote good mental health. They are: Awareness of God, acceptance of the grace and love of God, repentance and social responsibility, faith and trust, involvement in organized religion, fellowship, ethic, and tolerance and openness to the experiences of others.[3]

During assessment, the psychiatrist should be able to determine whether the religion in the life of his patient is important, has a special meaning, is active or inactive, involves values in accordance to his main tradition, is useful or harmful, and promotes autonomy, personal growth, good self-image and interpersonal relationships. Koenig recommendations go beyond listening and respect, appropriate referral, and support of spiritual needs. A brief spiritual history is necessary to become familiar to the patients religious beliefs as they relate to decisions about medical care, understanding the role religion plays in coping with illness or causing stress, and identifying spiritual needs that may require assistance.[3]

Ideas about the relationship between religiousness and mental health have changed over the past few centuries. During much of the 20th century, mental health professionals tended to deny the religious aspects of human life and often considered this dimension as either old-fashioned or pathological, predicting that it would disappear as mankind matured and developed. However, hundreds of epidemiological studies performed during the last decades have shown a different picture. Religiousness remains an important aspect of human life and it usually has a positive association with good mental health. Even though most studies have been conducted in the United States in Christian populations, in the last few years several of the main findings have been replicated in samples from different countries and religions. Two lines of investigation that need to be expanded are cross-cultural studies and application of these findings to clinical practice in different areas of the world.[3]

Considering that religiousness is frequent and has associations with mental health, it should be considered in research and clinical practice. The clinician who truly wishes to consider the bio-psycho-social aspects of a patient needs to assess, understand, and respect his/her religious beliefs, like any other psychosocial dimension. Increasing our knowledge of the religious aspect of human beings will increase our capacity to honor our duty as mental health providers and/or scientists in relieving suffering and helping people to live more fulfilling lives.[3]

Religious methods have often been used to treat the mentally ill. Initially, the priest was the most important counselor because he had the authority of religion along with psychological expertise. Faith and belief systems are very important constituents of psychological well-being and could be fruitfully utilized in psychotherapy. Their usage must be carefully evaluated. Hence, psychiatrists need to study religion vis-a-vis mental health more carefully as it is likely to increase the efficiency and acceptability of psychiatry to the masses. Finally, religion has a great influence in psychiatry including symptoms, phenomenology, and outcome.[1]

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3705681/

https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/view/religion-spirituality-and-mental-health

 

 

Edited November 26, 2021 by Mr Walker

[+Grim Reaper 6]

8 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

But it is NOT that clear or simple 

I know many people who believe that after death your  beliefs and behaviours in this world influence your future 

For them the y want others to "know "understand this so that their behaviours and beliefs in this world don't cause them greater harm in the future one 

Of course it is only belief but its not  hurtful belief.

It comes from   compassion and caring for others.

They think the y are helping others to gain eternal life, free of fear pain suffering and death.

It may hurt them deeply to see others living a life the y believe condemns them to death or even some form of hell. 

The more the y care, the harder the y try and argue to  convert others.   

extremist ?yes

Zealous ? Yes.

But they are  not necessarily negative words 

Anyone who cares deeply and passionately is an extremist and zealous to another person who disagrees with their beliefs

When it comes to real world issues I argue passionately and strongly  to try and get people to live lives which will strength and  empower them, and allow them to be fulfilled and happy even if that makes them cranky with me  . I stop just short of arguing for society /govts   forcing  them  into changes  because every adult is responsible for their own behaviours . .   

there are plenty of  "extremist"  passionate,  zealous environmentalists, who want everyone to live sustainable lives.

Some go so far as to cause  govt.s to make laws which affect other peoples freedoms , and which many  disagree with    but which they see as essential to save the planet  

 

Thanks for the reply Mr. Walker, but my friend you wasted a large number of free electrons typing all that above. In fact I would say all those free electrons may have caused a blockage in Cyberspace!

Sir we will have to agree to disagree on this subject!

[Mr Walker]

58 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

Thanks for the reply Mr. Walker, but my friend you wasted a large number of free electrons typing all that above. In fact I would say all those free electrons may have caused a blockage in Cyberspace!

Sir we will have to agree to disagree on this subject!

Fair enough. That's quite a common   experience in my life  

I admit I am going by the people I know.   I don't know larryp enough to judge his motivations 

Ps (IMO)  writing or giving an opinion is never a waste. and those electrons are free, so it came at no cost .    

[+Grim Reaper 6]

37 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

Fair enough. That's quite a common   experience in my life  

I admit I am going by the people I know.   I don't know larryp enough to judge his motivations 

Ps (IMO)  writing or giving an opinion is never a waste. and those electrons are free, so it came at no cost .    

This quote you made is very true and totally funny Mr. Walker, i didn't know you had a sense of humor!!!!!!!!

writing or giving an opinion is never a waste. and those electrons are free, so it came at no cost .

Thanks for the laugh, and I meant no disrespect previously !!

[Mr Walker]

13 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

This quote you made is very true and totally funny Mr. Walker, i didn't know you had a sense of humor!!!!!!!!

writing or giving an opinion is never a waste. and those electrons are free, so it came at no cost .

Thanks for the laugh, and I meant no disrespect previously !!

None taken. You are one of the nicest, politest,  posters here, and I  appreciate this. 

Part of being a good  teacher is being an entertainer, and I was a story teller, an actor,  and a stand up comedian, perhaps even more often than an imparter of knowledge.    

Apparently my comedy ran to puns, which were not always fully appreciated,  but my stories were enjoyed by students from  5 to 50    I also used mime, charades, and  other forms of Physical Comedy to get attention, and to make a point .

I tend to be serious here, because I am here for several important/serious  reasons, but sometimes I like to indulge myself   in humour.  

Edited November 26, 2021 by Mr Walker

[Mr Walker]

Interesting responses to my post on my academic and professional  expertise in  

 the psychological and cognitive needs and make up of the human mind.   

While it might be hard to access online, both my academic and professional background are a matter of public record and   indisputably true .

So, laughing at my claim means that you disagree with the conclusions I draw from  that training and practice,  not with the fact that my training and practice was genuine 

Fair enough, but laughter is often a defence where argument is lacking 

It is also easy, cheap, and useless in any debate.   

Edited November 26, 2021 by Mr Walker

[+Grim Reaper 6]

30 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

None taken. You are one of the nicest, politest,  posters here, and I  appreciate this. 

Part of being a good  teacher is being an entertainer, and I was a story teller, an actor,  and a stand up comedian, perhaps even more often than an imparter of knowledge.    

Apparently my comedy ran to puns, which were not always fully appreciated,  but my stories were enjoyed by students from  5 to 50    I also used mime, charades, and  other forms of Physical Comedy to get attention, and to make a point .

I tend to be serious here, because I am here for several important/serious  reasons, but sometimes I like to indulge myself   in humour.  

You welcome Mr. walker, and stay safe my friend.

[larryp]

On 11/8/2021 at 6:42 AM, Manwon Lender said:

". . . the cooments made to you by members across this thread it's very obvious no one is taking you serious of listening to you."

 

Hey pal, I have a very unpopular message to announce. So, I don't expect a lot of favorable comments. But, the son of God had the same message, and they killed him for it. Something about the truth that rubs most people the wrong way.

[+Grim Reaper 6]

2 minutes ago, larryp said:

Hey pal, I have a very unpopular message to announce. So, I don't expect a lot of favorable comments. But, the son of God had the same message, and they killed him for it. Something about the truth that rubs most people the wrong way.

I you know I responded to previous with a kind and thoughtful response and you respond with this drivel! Please don't call me Pal or even by my user name until you can respond logically and respectfully. You see you problem is not the message it's how you deliver it. You have a major communication problem and it's able to be corrected but first you must realize it exists.

Do you realize how foolish you sound when you compare yourself in the same breath to Jesus, but unlike you comments above it has nothing to do with the truth rubbing people wrong it's how you deliver what your trying to express and nothing more. 

Send me a PM bad .I will discuss it with you privately.

[larryp]

I think you're afraid of the truth. So you hide behind those words but stay tuned; it gets more revealing. It's going to get hot!

Edited November 26, 2021 by larryp

[larryp]

On 11/8/2021 at 9:22 PM, joc said:

Helpful for what?  Frankly Manwon, I don't give a damn. The church has a long and obsessive abuse cycle with children...there isn't anything else to know.

. . . 

[+Grim Reaper 6]

27 minutes ago, larryp said:

I think you're afraid of the truth. So you hide behind those words but stay tuned; it gets more revealing. It's going to get hot!

Dude you don't know who your dealing with, I am a fully blooded German American my mother and fathe immigrated and I was born in the United States. I am a retired Combat Veteran and I have dropped religious Zealots in both the Middle East and in Somalia Africa. You see it's the Neanderthal DNA I have that kind of makes me invincible to religious Zealots.

You know Neanderthals do to their bone structure and the over muscled body structure they had,were twice strong as a normal humans today. In most cases I use to rip them limb from limb, the only reason I shot them was because even after you ripping their arms and legs off the brain keeps working and they twitch and that's unnerving! 

So afraid of a bible thumper like you impossible, hell you would not even be a good tooth pick!

[+Liquid Gardens]

1 hour ago, larryp said:

Hey pal, I have a very unpopular message to announce.

Haha, yes, you are quite a rebel for sharing those radical teachings from the most popular religion in the world...

1 hour ago, larryp said:

Something about the truth that rubs most people the wrong way.

It's not how your imaginary truth 'rubs' it's how it smells, and right now it smells like the bull it came from.  

[eight bits]

5 hours ago, Mr Walker said:

Interesting responses to my post on my academic and professional  expertise in  

 the psychological and cognitive needs and make up of the human mind.   

While it might be hard to access online, both my academic and professional background are a matter of public record and   indisputably true .

So, laughing at my claim means that you disagree with the conclusions I draw from  that training and practice,  not with the fact that my training and practice was genuine 

Fair enough, but laughter is often a defence where argument is lacking 

It is also easy, cheap, and useless in any debate. 

I laughed. I was going to explain why, but noticed you'd dumped a load of copypasta, and decided to check out your professional expertise as a curator of scholarship. I followed your source link

7 hours ago, Mr Walker said:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3705681/

only to discover

The 2013 article was retracted in 2019.

From time to time, it has been suggested that you don't even read the junk you copy.

Dead mouse on the kitchen floor, you didn't read this.

Edited November 26, 2021 by eight bits

[+Nuclear Wessel]

13 minutes ago, eight bits said:

I laughed. I was going to explain why, but noticed you'd dumped a load of copypasta, and decided to check out your professional expertise as a curator of scholarship. I followed your source link

only to discover

The 2013 article was retracted in 2019.

From time to time, it has been suggested that you don't even read the junk you copy.

Dead mouse on the kitchen floor, you didn't read this.

Shocker. ROFL

Edited November 26, 2021 by Nuclear Wessel

[rashore]

Since folks can't seem to stop with the personal attacks and scrutiny, derogatory commentary, discussing each other, or keep this discussion on topic within the site rules despite multiple thread cleanings and warnings.... 

Thread closed.