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OverSword

The Surprisingly Strong Supreme Court Precedent Supporting Vaccine Mandates

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OverSword
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Henning Jacobson, a 50-year-old minister, put his faith in his own liberty. Back in his native Sweden, he had suffered a bad reaction to a vaccine as an infant, struggling for years with an angry rash. Now he was an American citizen, serving as pastor of the Swedish Lutheran Church in Cambridge, Massachusetts. That gave him the full protections of the U.S. Constitution.

So when the Cambridge board of health decided that all adults must be vaccinated for smallpox, Jacobson sought refuge in the Constitution’s promise that no state shall “deprive any person of life, liberty or property without due process of law.”

The year was 1904, and when his politically charged legal challenge to the $5 fine for failing to get vaccinated made its way to the Supreme Court, the justices had a surprise for Rev. Jacobson. One man’s liberty, they declared in a 7-2 ruling handed down the following February, cannot deprive his neighbors of their own liberty — in this case by allowing the spread of disease. Jacobson, they ruled, must abide by the order of the Cambridge board of health or pay the penalty.

“There are manifold restraints to which every person is necessarily subject for the common good,” read the majority opinion. “On any other basis, organized society could not exist with safety to its members. Society based on the rule that each one is a law unto himself would soon be confronted with disorder and anarchy.”

Jacobson’s claim was essentially the same as that taken for granted by vaccine skeptics today: That they have the personal liberty under the U.S. Constitution to decide for themselves whether to take the shot. Backed by a group called The Anti-Vaccination Society, Jacobson made a formidable case, incorporating many of the same arguments about freedom from government interference that are ricocheting around cable TV this summer, and mouthed by politicians. Donald Trump, after recommending at a rally on Aug. 21 that his supporters get vaccinated, quickly added after a smattering of boos: “But you do have your freedoms you have to keep. You have to maintain that.”

 

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Piney
2 minutes ago, acute said:

Yes.  The freedom to be unvaccinated, not wear a mask, and potentially infect as many others as possible.

:(

Speaking of which......Is Monty dead yet? :unsure2:

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acute
9 minutes ago, Piney said:

Speaking of which......Is Monty dead yet? :unsure2:

Yes.  He was killed by an IRA car-bomb. :(

 

Edited by acute
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Piney
13 minutes ago, acute said:

Yes.  He was killed by an IRA car-bomb. :(

Wrong Monty!!! :o

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joc
30 minutes ago, acute said:

Yes.  The freedom to be unvaccinated, not wear a mask, and potentially infect as many others as possible.

:(

Most people infected with Covid do not die.  Whereas most people infected with small pox did indeed die.  True or False?

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zep73
3 minutes ago, joc said:

Most people infected with Covid do not die.  Whereas most people infected with small pox did indeed die.  True or False?

The Delta variant we are facing these day is 200% more likely to put unvaccinated people in the hospital. Occupying beds that others need.

If not for yourself, then get the jab for others sake. It will not hurt you. I am living proof of that.

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OverSword
4 minutes ago, joc said:

Most people infected with Covid do not die.  Whereas most people infected with small pox did indeed die.  True or False?

Over 80% of infected children died and one in thirteen adults died.

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joc
4 minutes ago, zep73 said:

The Delta variant we are facing these day is 200% more likely to put unvaccinated people in the hospital. Occupying beds that others need.

If not for yourself, then get the jab for others sake. It will not hurt you. I am living proof of that.

 

3 minutes ago, OverSword said:

Over 80% of infected children died and one in thirteen adults died.

See what I did there?  Instead of just stating matter of fact that what I said was fact...I put the disclaimer of True or False on it.

You are both saying it's false...but you are throwing out numbers of percentages that I am just supposed to glom onto and believe are true. 

so...where did you get the numbers ?

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OverSword
1 minute ago, joc said:

 

See what I did there?  Instead of just stating matter of fact that what I said was fact...I put the disclaimer of True or False on it.

You are both saying it's false...but you are throwing out numbers of percentages that I am just supposed to glom onto and believe are true. 

so...where did you get the numbers ?

No, I verified what you said was true.  I wasn't arguing with you.

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acute
10 minutes ago, joc said:

Most people infected with Covid do not die.  Whereas most people infected with small pox did indeed die.  True or False?

I have no idea!

.....but I know that comparing a contemporary pandemic to one that peaked 120 years ago is unhelpful.

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OverSword
Just now, acute said:

I have no idea!

.....but I know that comparing a contemporary pandemic to one that peaked 120 years ago is unhelpful.

I disagree.  Covid is not near the horror which smallpox or the spanish flu was regardless of era.  

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joc
1 minute ago, acute said:

I have no idea!

.....but I know that comparing a contemporary pandemic to one that peaked 120 years ago is unhelpful.

It certainly doesn't help the media narrative

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zep73
29 minutes ago, joc said:

so...where did you get the numbers ?

I read an article, that I am unable to locate. But I found the source!

The original is in danish

https://www.ssi.dk/aktuelt/nyheder/2021/delta-varianten-giver-storre-risiko-for-indlaggelse-blandt-ikke-vaccinerede

So I took the liberty to run it through google translate for you

https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=da&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ssi.dk%2Faktuelt%2Fnyheder%2F2021%2Fdelta-varianten-giver-storre-risiko-for-indlaggelse-blandt-ikke-vaccinerede

The results has also been published in The Lancet

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(21)00580-6/fulltext (but the numbers will not make any sense to you there).

Edited by zep73
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joc
3 minutes ago, zep73 said:

I read an article, that I am unable to locate. But I found the source!

The original is in danish

https://www.ssi.dk/aktuelt/nyheder/2021/delta-varianten-giver-storre-risiko-for-indlaggelse-blandt-ikke-vaccinerede

So I took the liberty to run it through google translate for you

https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=da&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ssi.dk%2Faktuelt%2Fnyheder%2F2021%2Fdelta-varianten-giver-storre-risiko-for-indlaggelse-blandt-ikke-vaccinerede

The results has also been published in The Lancet

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(21)00580-6/fulltext (but the numbers will not make any sense to you there).

and in the article the numbers are all over the place and then they say:

Harder to assess the severity of new variants

SSI estimates that the different risk variables may reflect that the severity of new variants becomes more and more difficult to assess.

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zep73
11 minutes ago, joc said:

and in the article the numbers are all over the place and then they say:

Harder to assess the severity of new variants

SSI estimates that the different risk variables may reflect that the severity of new variants becomes more and more difficult to assess.

Yes, the different results with the lowest being 82% in Scotland and 201% in Denmark shows it's getting harder to access. But the average of all the numbers is still 130%. That says a lot!

Are you going to ignore that and possibly end in a hospital bed, that someone else might need?

 

Edited by zep73

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Agent0range
18 minutes ago, zep73 said:

Yes, the different results with the lowest being 82% in Scotland and 201% in Denmark shows it's getting harder to access. But the average of all the numbers is still 130%. That says a lot!

Are you going to ignore that and possibly end in a hospital bed, that someone else might need?

 

I don't think the unvaccinated should be allowed a hospital bed...

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zep73
8 minutes ago, Agent0range said:

I don't think the unvaccinated should be allowed a hospital bed...

I cannot support that kind of cynicism. We all make mistakes. We all have been mislead at some point. Who gets to live or die is not up to us.

Edited by zep73
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Agent0range
2 minutes ago, zep73 said:

I cannot support that kind of cynicism. We all make mistakes. We all have been mislead at some point. Who gets to live or die is not up to us.

Sure, you can say that from the land of free healthcare, but my premiums are going to skyrocket this year due to people racking up giant hospital bills.

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zep73
6 minutes ago, Agent0range said:

the land of free healthcare

You Americans should try it. You have the economy to support it.

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Agent0range
9 minutes ago, zep73 said:

You Americans should try it. You have the economy to support it.

Don't threaten me with a good time...

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Hammerclaw
1 hour ago, acute said:

I have no idea!

.....but I know that comparing a contemporary pandemic to one that peaked 120 years ago is unhelpful.

It killed Europeans at about the same rate as covid in the States.

Edited by Hammerclaw

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Tatetopa
3 hours ago, OverSword said:

I disagree.  Covid is not near the horror which smallpox or the spanish flu was regardless of era.  

I agree, it may not be as serious. .  If I don't put you at risk of dying, do I have the right to make you sick and miss a couple of paychecks?  

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Paranoid Android
4 hours ago, Agent0range said:

I don't think the unvaccinated should be allowed a hospital bed...

What about smokers? If they get lung cancer should they be denied hospital treatment? What if someone chooses not to wear a seat belt and is admitted to hospital in serious condition because of a car accident? 

And let's not forget that statistically speaking, BIPOC individuals are less likely to be vaccinated than white people, so depending on who you talk to you could argue that denial of medical care on this basis is a racist belief. 

Just a thought to consider :) 

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Piney
4 hours ago, Paranoid Android said:

And let's not forget that statistically speaking, BIPOC individuals are less likely to be vaccinated than white people, so depending on who you talk to you could argue that denial of medical care on this basis is a racist belief. 

There is a lot of misinformation in the Black and Latino communities. Mainly due to Evangelical preachers. I watched a whole Spanish Pentecostal Church sicken themselves. Quite a few died. I saw it as Darwinism and felt no sympathy. The local Assemblies of God Church was selling the same **** but changed their tune after they were hammered. I see it as Darwinism with the junk munching career welfare mooches too. Even my own relatives.

On the other hand. American Indians have the highest vaccination rate

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/article/native-americans-highest-covid-vaccination-rate-us/

So at least we have half a brain.......

 

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