Eldorado Posted September 16, 2021 #1 Share Posted September 16, 2021 In June, the US government published a long-awaited report into UFOs. Although the report did not, as many had hoped, admit to the existence of little green men, it did reveal that not only were objects appearing in our skies that the Pentagon – which controls the US military – could not explain, but some clearly pose “a safety of flight issue and may pose a challenge to US national security”. The Pentagon also revealed that it has been taking UFOs so seriously that in 2007 it discreetly set up the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program (AATIP), which has been gathering data on Unexplained Aerial Phenomena (UAPs) ever since. Full article at the UK Guardian 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Posted September 17, 2021 #2 Share Posted September 17, 2021 No, because it can all be explained by known/mundane things and nothing suggests anything ‘alien’. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trelane Posted September 18, 2021 #3 Share Posted September 18, 2021 Until aliens move out of my house and get a real job I will not take them seriously. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Hammerclaw Posted September 19, 2021 #4 Share Posted September 19, 2021 What Aliens? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted September 19, 2021 #5 Share Posted September 19, 2021 (edited) On 9/17/2021 at 12:02 PM, Timothy said: No, because it can all be explained by known/mundane things and nothing suggests anything ‘alien’. Actually, no it can't. MOST can be explained by those things, but an interesting percentage simply cannot be, even after thorough investigation. https://theconversation.com/us-intelligence-report-on-ufos-no-aliens-but-government-transparency-and-desire-for-better-data-might-bring-science-to-the-ufo-world-163059 Edited September 19, 2021 by Mr Walker 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted September 19, 2021 #6 Share Posted September 19, 2021 3 hours ago, Hammerclaw said: What Aliens? Teenagers ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godnodog Posted September 19, 2021 #7 Share Posted September 19, 2021 I've seen UFOs, but never have I claimed aliens, for the simple reason I don't know what I saw. Mixing UFO with aliens is dangerous because it needs such a level of exceptional evidence that by our current technological known capabilities and science framework it's near impossible (IMO) to prove. Having wrote that, obviously the UFO needs to be properly addressed and study, and above all it needs to be treated with respect and with a healthy mindset by part of news outlets, by doing simple things like (for example) NOT putting the xfiles theme song or other weird soundtrack. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrLzs Posted September 19, 2021 #8 Share Posted September 19, 2021 On 9/17/2021 at 7:10 AM, Eldorado said: Although the report did not, as many had hoped, admit to the existence of little green men, it did reveal that not only were objects appearing in our skies that the Pentagon – which controls the US military – could not explain... This is just a daft statement. There will ALWAYS be things just a bit too distant or poorly resolved that do not get identified. If anything our tech nowadays is REDUCING that number.. On 9/17/2021 at 7:10 AM, Eldorado said: but some clearly pose “a safety of flight issue and may pose a challenge to US national security”. As they always have - anything you can't identify could be a safety risk to you or other aircraft. On 9/17/2021 at 7:10 AM, Eldorado said: The Pentagon also revealed that it has been taking UFOs so seriously that in 2007 it discreetly set up the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program (AATIP), which has been gathering data on Unexplained Aerial Phenomena (UAPs) ever since. Yes, there are good reasons to improve our identification abilities. Problem is they ended getting a bunch of money-scammers in to do the work, and those twerps turned it it into a moneymaking venture. Look up Harry Reid, Luis Elizondo, Ron Bigelow, DeLonge.... Note that most of the money dried up by 2012 as NO decent evidence was collected that showed the often falsely alleged 'unexplainable maneuvers'. It's all a big **** and money was thrown away to those idiots, who, after the Defense Dept shut down most of the operation, went chasing public donations for "ToTheStars". Typical USA gov't stupidity combined with greedy scammers. Follow the yellow brick road. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/16/us/politics/pentagon-program-ufo-harry-reid.html https://www.vox.com/22463659/ufo-videos-navy-alien-drone 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Hammerclaw Posted September 19, 2021 #9 Share Posted September 19, 2021 2 hours ago, Mr Walker said: Teenagers ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle98632 Posted September 20, 2021 #10 Share Posted September 20, 2021 There certainly isn't anything new that actually point to aliens that should warrant taking them more seriously than 10-20 years ago. The unknown is not evidence for anything other than something is unknown. Not that we should expect a US government report to tell us anything about UFOs being alien. I would assume they know what most of them are, and just won't admit it to not give away to our enemies we know what they have or things we have being discovered and released by sources that they don't want to release them. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Posted September 21, 2021 #11 Share Posted September 21, 2021 On 9/19/2021 at 6:11 PM, Mr Walker said: Actually, no it can't. MOST can be explained by those things, but an interesting percentage simply cannot be, even after thorough investigation. https://theconversation.com/us-intelligence-report-on-ufos-no-aliens-but-government-transparency-and-desire-for-better-data-might-bring-science-to-the-ufo-world-163059 Can you please provide an example of a piece of evidence which cannot be explained by the mundane? The Pentagon UFO videos all can be, they’ve been done to death in other threads… 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted September 21, 2021 #12 Share Posted September 21, 2021 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Timothy said: Can you please provide an example of a piece of evidence which cannot be explained by the mundane? The Pentagon UFO videos all can be, they’ve been done to death in other threads… The source i gave included this. quote What’s in the UFO report? The No. 1 thing the report focuses on is the lack of high-quality data. Here are the highlights from the slender nine-page report, covering a total of 144 UAP sightings from U.S. government sources between 2004 and 2021: “Limited data and inconsistent reporting are key challenges to evaluating UAP.” Some observations “could be the result of sensor errors, spoofing, or observer misperception.” “UAP clearly pose a safety of flight issue and may pose a challenge to U.S. national security.” Of the 144 sightings, the task force was “able to identify one reported UAP with high confidence. In that case, we identified the object as a large, deflating balloon. The others remain unexplained.” “Some UAP many be technologies deployed by China, Russia, another nation, or non-governmental entity.” end quote So,143 of the 144 sightings could not be explained as mundane GIVEN THE AVAILABLE EVIDENCES. I am sure there are theoretical explanations for mundane causes, eg foreign aircraft, but, without evidences, they are the same as theoretical non mundane theories So, despite thorough examination,143/144 sightings could not be shown to be mundane. They remain unexplained Older investigations such as project blue book found the same thing After thorough investigation, a small but interesting percentage of sightings could not be explained by natural. man made, mundane explanations ANYTHING can theoretically be explained by the mundane, or the non mundane .Take your pick . But that is not what these investigations and reports were doing After examining all possible natural, man made /mundane causes, the y concluded that, no. none of those fit the available evidences (or there was no evidnce for any of those explanations) Edited September 21, 2021 by Mr Walker 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Posted September 21, 2021 #13 Share Posted September 21, 2021 (edited) @Mr Walker, yes unidentifiable due to lack of data, but can still be explained by the mundane. Edit: Eg. I post a photo of a blurry dot in the sky. Not enough data to identify what it is. But it could be a piece of dust, a bug, a bird, a floating bag, an aircraft etc. So while it can’t be identified, it can be likely explained by the mundane. It could also be an alien too, of course. But there’s no evidence to suggest that when there are known possible mundane explanations. Edited September 21, 2021 by Timothy Edit. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dejarma Posted September 21, 2021 #14 Share Posted September 21, 2021 1 hour ago, Mr Walker said: So, despite thorough examination,143/144 sightings could not be shown to be mundane. They remain unexplained yeah stories. how can anyone thoroughly examine a story? ... someone tells someone something- you will NOT know if what you're being told really happened! because it's 'just a story' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dejarma Posted September 21, 2021 #15 Share Posted September 21, 2021 1 hour ago, Timothy said: Edit: Eg. I post a photo of a blurry dot in the sky. yeah & to add= how will i know for sure that the blurry photo is of something actually in the sky? could be a blurry photo of a light at the end of your garden that you're telling everyone is a ufo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Posted September 21, 2021 #16 Share Posted September 21, 2021 47 minutes ago, Dejarma said: yeah & to add= how will i know for sure that the blurry photo is of something actually in the sky? could be a blurry photo of a light at the end of your garden that you're telling everyone is a ufo Exactly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted September 21, 2021 #17 Share Posted September 21, 2021 2 hours ago, Timothy said: @Mr Walker, yes unidentifiable due to lack of data, but can still be explained by the mundane. Edit: Eg. I post a photo of a blurry dot in the sky. Not enough data to identify what it is. But it could be a piece of dust, a bug, a bird, a floating bag, an aircraft etc. So while it can’t be identified, it can be likely explained by the mundane. It could also be an alien too, of course. But there’s no evidence to suggest that when there are known possible mundane explanations. You are using a different definition of explain Sure anything can be explained by a theory or belief, but here the word is used to say wether or not there are evidences for any explanation Ie In those cases there was no EVIDENCE that the things observed were natural/man made ie there is no evidence to suggest the y ARE mundane events Take your photo Suppose it was checked out by a panel of experts who found; It was not a speck of dust It was not a flaw in the film or camera. it was not a bird, insect, floating bag, or aircraft etc ( based perhaps on size, contextual references to other objects etc ) Indeed no logical, mundane explanation could be found to fit the available evidences. This does not make it an alien craft, but it remains an UFO and it remains unexplained and unidentified Until something can be identified, it cant really be explained (only guessed at) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted September 21, 2021 #18 Share Posted September 21, 2021 4 hours ago, Dejarma said: yeah stories. how can anyone thoroughly examine a story? ... someone tells someone something- you will NOT know if what you're being told really happened! because it's 'just a story' I'm assuming there were more to those cases than just stories. Otherwise investigation would not really have been worthwhile. EG a naval pilot's observation is not just "a story" The y are trained observers whose observations are critical in reconnaissance and combat The pilot can be checked out.(for physical and psychological "fitness" ) His/her story can be interrogated. Supporting evidences, such as radar, and gun or other onboard cameras can be checked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Posted September 21, 2021 #19 Share Posted September 21, 2021 34 minutes ago, Mr Walker said: You are using a different definition of explain Sure anything can be explained by a theory or belief, but here the word is used to say wether or not there are evidences for any explanation Ie In those cases there was no EVIDENCE that the things observed were natural/man made (1) ie there is no evidence to suggest the y ARE mundane events Take your photo Suppose it was checked out by a panel of experts who found; It was not a speck of dust It was not a flaw in the film or camera. it was not a bird, insect, floating bag, or aircraft etc ( based perhaps on size, contextual references to other objects etc ) (2) Indeed no logical, mundane explanation could be found to fit the available evidences. This does not make it an alien craft, but it remains an UFO and it remains unexplained and unidentified Until something can be identified, it cant really be explained (only guessed at) My bold. (Except for the evidences and and) (1) Provide a single example where you believe this is the case. One of the Pentagon UFO videos, or something else if you prefer. (2) This may not be possible as there is not enough data in the image to positively identify or to rule out these possible explanations. You are failing to comprehend the simple argument I am making. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted September 21, 2021 #20 Share Posted September 21, 2021 11 minutes ago, Timothy said: My bold. (Except for the evidences and and) (1) Provide a single example where you believe this is the case. One of the Pentagon UFO videos, or something else if you prefer. (2) This may not be possible as there is not enough data in the image to positively identify or to rule out these possible explanations. You are failing to comprehend the simple argument I am making. Not failing to comprehend. I am arguing that your need to disbelieve is clouding the way you are thinking about this Where evidences are lacking two possibilities exist The mundane /the non mundane Which you choose from those two possibilities depends on your biases and perhaps fears . where evidences are lacking, an object remains unidentified Where it is unidentified it is inexplicable Thus its simply not true that ALL sightings are explained by mundane things Potentially they could be but potentially the y could be explained by alien craft Until we have more evidences BOTH explanations are plausible logical and possible This only applies to a small percentage of sightings. The rest HAVE been explained by mundane explanations because there was enough evidence to do so. It is precisely where you cannot rule out alien craft, that you can not present a mundane explanation, as the only answer. Only a person who totally disbelieved in the existence of aliens would think or argue like that Until I check out Roswell for myself, or meet a grey man I cant KNOW if the y exist, . but I can't know they do not, either Hence, anything remains possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Posted September 21, 2021 #21 Share Posted September 21, 2021 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Mr Walker said: *snip* Which you choose from those two possibilities depends on your biases and perhaps fears . *snip* You forgot logic. Do we know that earthly explanations exist for these videos etc.? Yes! Do we know that ET/aliens exist on Earth? No. So I’m happy to lean towards mundane explanations. Occam’s razor is generally a safe bet with this kind of thing. And fear is one of the dumbest arguments you can try to use… Credibility gets lost with that one. Edited September 21, 2021 by Timothy Typo. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dejarma Posted September 21, 2021 #22 Share Posted September 21, 2021 1 hour ago, Mr Walker said: Where evidences are lacking two possibilities exist The mundane /the non mundane this reply proves you ARE failing to comprehend because there are 3. The 3rd is what I put forward in 'post 15' 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toast Posted September 21, 2021 #23 Share Posted September 21, 2021 On 9/19/2021 at 10:11 AM, Mr Walker said: Actually, no it can't. MOST can be explained by those things, but an interesting percentage simply cannot be, even after thorough investigation. https://theconversation.com/us-intelligence-report-on-ufos-no-aliens-but-government-transparency-and-desire-for-better-data-might-bring-science-to-the-ufo-world-163059 Lol, thats the good old 5% claim created years ago by the UFO-heads to put some kind of seriousness. Failed anyway. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toast Posted September 21, 2021 #24 Share Posted September 21, 2021 On 9/18/2021 at 5:20 PM, Trelane said: Until aliens move out of my house and get a real job I will not take them seriously. In my case, 7of9 would be allowed to stay. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobu Posted September 21, 2021 #25 Share Posted September 21, 2021 You guys should be really really friggin worried if you really believe China or Russia has drone technology such as what has been mention. ludicrous. It’s like many here have to just make up something that makes no sense to set their mind at peace. The navy videos cannot be explained by foreign governments technology. Simply not true. Are they aliens? I doubt it…. But I’m not going to assign an asinine reason to a phenomena because it makes me uncomfortable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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