Top 11 Reasons for COVID-19 Vaccine Hesitancy – First: Mistrust of Government

[psyche101]

Just now, Gummug said:

Well, your replies are kinda funny at least, ha ha. Doesn't Australia have crocodiles and/or alligators? What would you do if one of those or some other nasty beast was after you? Baseball bat?

Lol. Crocodiles and in the top end. 99% of Aussies will never see one in the wild. They don't come down far enough to reach most of the population. Too cold for them.

[Gummug]

2 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

Lol. Crocodiles and in the top end. 99% of Aussies will never see one in the wild. They don't come down far enough to reach most of the population. Too cold for them.

Okay you;re safe from them then, that's good...gonna make a late night snack now, (it's 2:56 am here) probably back tomorrow...gotta address some of Manwon's questions...okay bye have a nice day/afternoon/night....

[psyche101]

1 minute ago, Gummug said:

Okay you;re safe from them then, that's good...gonna make a late night snack now, (it's 2:56 am here) probably back tomorrow...gotta address some of Manwon's questions...okay bye have a nice day/afternoon/night....

Lol you're funny.

Hope it's delicious. Have a good day. It's 6pm here. Days just finishing.

[Grim Reaper 6]

13 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

Have you read this.

https://ebm.bmj.com/content/early/2021/05/26/bmjebm-2021-111678

 

This part is specifically referring to the meta analysis above isn't it?

Up to February 2021, the PAHO identified twenty two ivermectin randomised clinical trials through a rapid review of current available literature.34 There is considerable heterogeneity in the population receiving ivermectin, with studies administering it to family contacts of confirmed COVID-19 cases as a prophylactic measure29 and other studies using ivermectin for treatment of mild and moderate infected cases28 or even severe hospitalised patients.30 Applied dosis and outcomes of interest were also highly variable. Additionally, patients also received various cointerventions, and control groups received different kinds of comparators ranging from placebo or no intervention to standard care or even hydroxychloroquine. The authors claim that pooled estimates suggest beneficial effects with ivermectin, but the certainty of the evidence was very low due to high risk of bias and small number of events throughout the included studies. Most study results have been made publicly available as preprints or unpublished, with no peer review or formal editorial process. Others incorporated their results only in the clinical trial register, but nearly half of these randomised clinical trials had not been registered. Registering clinical trials before they begin and making results available fulfils a large number of purposes, like reducing publication and selective outcome reporting biases, promoting more efficient allocation of research funds and facilitating evidence syntheses that will inform stakeholders and decision-makers in the future.

Yes I have read this when it first came out, however this information has been revised do to new research studies. The document I sent you was the result of actual fundamental research findings as 5 Oct 2021. My friend new information is coming out monthly and sometimes weekly I know it's very hard to keep up. However, what I did was join a pay site that automatically sends me updated Peer Reviewed Journals on SARS-Cov-2  and all associated information as it is published and released that is how I stay up to date.

Now that we are 21 months into this Pandemic much research that has occurred is being updated or changed. I believe that this will only become more frequent since the Scientific Medical Community has now had time to finally complete many research studies that could not be properly carried out because there was not enough time to combine studies for a better picture of the studied topics. As I get updated information I would be glad to share it with you, if I am able. The site that sends me the Journals will not let me download some of the new peer reviewed papers and journals. 

I am not trying to tell you what to believe, I am only passing along new information that I see people discussing that has changed. I would hope if you see me making a mistake you would also pass new information along to me or correct me on any subject I have made a mistake discussing. I respect your opinion, and you know I have often ask you for advise or to review my comments in the past. This is because .I respect your and trust your judgement.

Hope were good my friend!

[Grim Reaper 6]

50 minutes ago, Gummug said:

Fair enough. I thank you again and I try to be honest. I had typed you a fairly long response on another post and somehow it didn't get sent....grrrr! because I was typing it on my phone and it probably took me ten minutes to type and now it's gone. So anyway, I am actually piggy backing on my neighbor's wifi, so for now, I can actually use my computer, which makes typing 100 times easier. So I will try and go back to your other post and put the reply I tried to post earlier and somehow bungled it, using my phone. Sometimes wants to make me want to throw my phone through the window but I am not rich enough to pay for a new window and phone lol.

I prefer using  my computer at a coffeeshop or at my neighbor Sue's, because the wi-fi is much more reliable there...

Just curious, what time is it there? I am in Kansas and  it is 2:32 am. Having a bit of insomnia, ugh...plus I have been fighting a sinus infection....okay Peace!

Here it is the 26th of October and its 5:23 Pm.

Take careCare 

[psyche101]

22 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

Yes I have read this when it first came out, however this information has been revised do to new research studies. The document I sent you was the result of actual fundamental research findings as 5 Oct 2021. My friend new information is coming out monthly and sometimes weekly I know it's very hard to keep up. However, what I did was join a pay site that automatically sends me updated Peer Reviewed Journals on SARS-Cov-2  and all associated information as it is published and released that is how I stay up to date.

Now that we are 21 months into this Pandemic much research that has occurred is being updated or changed. I believe that this will only become more frequent since the Scientific Medical Community has now had time to finally complete many research studies that could not be properly carried out because there was not enough time to combine studies for a better picture of the studied topics. As I get updated information I would be glad to share it with you, if I am able. The site that sends me the Journals will not let me download some of the new peer reviewed papers and journals. 

I am not trying to tell you what to believe, I am only passing along new information that I see people discussing that has changed. I would hope if you see me making a mistake you would also pass new information along to me or correct me on any subject I have made a mistake discussing. I respect your opinion, and you know I have often ask you for advise or to review my comments in the past. This is because .I respect your and trust your judgement.

Hope were good my friend!

Lol yeah all good. I understood the paper to indicate transmission is still a problem. It helps some people with symptoms but transmission is still a problem. 

[Grim Reaper 6]

5 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

Lol yeah all good. I understood the paper to indicate transmission is still a problem. It helps some people with symptoms but transmission is still a problem. 

Yes the drug is ineffective in preventing infection, however it is now being shown to save lives and cut down the length infected indivuals are actual sick. So far during this Pandemic there have been few drugs that can easy the symptoms and decrease the length of infection so thus drug can be very valuable. 

Peace my friend 

Edited October 27, 2021 by Manwon Lender

[psyche101]

7 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

Yes the drug is ineffective in preventing infection, however it is now being shown to save lives and cut down the length infected indivuals are actual sick. So far during this Pandemic there have been few drugs that can easy the symptoms and decrease the length of infection so thus drug can be very valuable. 

Peace my friend 

Ah yes.

That's exactly where I was going with that

 

[Gummug]

Manwon, I have a question... do you accept information from Infowars (Alex Jones) as being accurate? Because if you do, and if I can figure out how to do it, I can send you a link showing the harmfulness of covid jabs. Thanks. Peace out...

[+and-then]

19 hours ago, simplybill said:

Regarding the vaccine debate: the citizens who prefer to trust their own immune systems to provide adequate protection against Covid, and/or produce strong antibodies against future infections, should be given as much respect as those citizens who choose a vaccine for protection. Without that mutual respect, we’re handing over our future healthcare decisions to politicians, unelected government officials, and Corporate CEOs. 

Those who make it their quest to "educate" their lessers about the vaccines do so for reasons of their own.  Oh, they wrap them in a blanket of concern, but in truth, they've shown they'll cheerfully watch them being segregated from society, forced to have an injection they don't trust, and in many cases even mock those who die.   I have respect for anyone who makes their choice and is willing to allow others the same freedom.  The rest, really just need to move on and let others live their lives, too.  Someday maybe it will dawn on them that there has NEVER BEFORE been a vaccine so widely distrusted that governments are having to FORCE compliance for injection.  Maybe, anyway.  The tribal hate has become so base that it's a little disturbing how far these kind souls are willing to go to make their neighbors comply, or else.

[+and-then]

17 hours ago, thedutchiedutch said:

No real scientist ever said that the vaccine will prevent you from getting infected and sick from covid19 but it does protect and gives you a kinda head start for your immune system to fight this ugly virus.

Which truth always brings me back around to my BIGGEST concern over how the government is using this pandemic to put chains on the freedoms of their people.  Seeing that, as you say, the scientists agree that the vaccines do not stop transmission... What, exactly, are the "passports" meant to accomplish in furtherance of public health?  Surely, the idea is that those who congregate in large groups out in public are supposedly protected from getting sick?  These vaccines lower the chance that the virus will be spread in those settings but even in the countries with the highest % of vaccinated citizens, surges are still occurring and CDC has admitted that the protection offered by these vaccines tails off over months.  

Perhaps one of my betters here can explain that to me.  They should remember to type S L O W L Y, though, 'cause I'm not very bright...

[+Liquid Gardens]

17 hours ago, simplybill said:

According to some Chinese dissidents, there are resort areas in China that cater only to Communist Party devotees and elites.

There are resort areas in the US that are also restricted only to certain members. There are resort areas that a large number of Americans will never be able to afford, so not sure what the difference is.

17 hours ago, simplybill said:

separate the population that resists government intrusion into personal healthcare decisions from the government-compliant citizenry, and you’ve created a government-imposed double standard that punishes those who choose liberty over authoritarianism.

That's quite a spin on the situation, you are of course also 'government-compliant' in countless ways and I'm sure expect and encourage people to obey laws and regulations that you like, and I doubt you frame those as a battle between liberty and authoritarianism.  Besides, you were just praising our Representative Republic which is responsible for our vaccine-related restrictions so it's not really 'authoritarianism'.  Liberty without responsibility isn't really 'liberty' in the political sense.

17 hours ago, simplybill said:

And, I’m willing to extend mercy to politicians, scientists and medical professionals who got it wrong in the opening days of the Covid pandemic.

Perhaps for politicians that makes sense, they'll say anything, but this to me just doesn't apply to scientists and medical professionals.  I would need to see a quote from a scientist or doctor from the early days, hell even now, that expressed something with absolute certainty.  "We are in a pandemic that we are still studying and responding to but will provide you our best recommendations based on what we know" is background so basic to anyone who has some common sense, and definitely for anyone who paid attention in science class, that it shouldn't need to be stated when an expert speaks about this topic. This isn't directed at you at all Bill, I just get frustrated with the whole, 'a doctor/scientist said something that turned out to be wrong' attack; it's so hypocritical, isn't a person making that criticism who hasn't also been wrong and they usually don't have the excuse that they are scientists conducting research so of course their findings are going to be tentative and could change.

[+Liquid Gardens]

9 minutes ago, and then said:

Seeing that, as you say, the scientists agree that the vaccines do not stop transmission.

As has been noted before, "stop" is not the bar that needs to be cleared.  Just like with almost all things, 'reduce' is sufficient.

[+and-then]

https://hotair.com/allahpundit/2021/09/27/gallup-dems-still-wildly-overestimate-the-share-of-unvaxxed-covid-patients-who-end-up-in-the-hospital-n418574

A little perspective is often a good thing:

"They first polled this topic in March, when vaccines were still rolling out. What percentage of people infected with COVID land in the ER, Gallup asked? The correct answer was one to five percent. More than a quarter of Republicans got it right — but less than 10 percent of Democrats did. Instead, 41 percent of Dems believed that half or more COVID patients end up needing hospital care after contracting the virus.:

 

 

We’ve had more than 43 million confirmed cases in the U.S. Apparently, some people are operating on the assumption that 22 million people (or more!) have been hospitalized for COVID.

No doubt this source will be mocked and ignored but it doesn't make the reality of it, less.  >5% wind up in hospital.  

[+and-then]

3 minutes ago, Liquid Gardens said:

As has been noted before, "stop" is not the bar that needs to be cleared.  Just like with almost all things, 'reduce' is sufficient.

Okay, I can live with that.  In the greater context, what is proven among those who are vaccinated and who are required to have their "papers" on them?  Surely you understand that in any SINGLE vaccinated person there can be no guarantee that they haven't contracted it or that their viral load isn't sufficient to keep others around them, safe?  Why, then, the demand for proof of vaccination?

[+ouija ouija]

I don't think anyone has mentioned this yet, but is it possible that some 'hesitant' people simply don't care if they die from covid? Is it possible that some people want to leave this world and it's horrors behind, and playing Russian roulette with vaccinations is a possible way to do that?

[+Liquid Gardens]

1 hour ago, and then said:

Okay, I can live with that.  In the greater context, what is proven among those who are vaccinated and who are required to have their "papers" on them?  Surely you understand that in any SINGLE vaccinated person there can be no guarantee that they haven't contracted it or that their viral load isn't sufficient to keep others around them, safe?  Why, then, the demand for proof of vaccination?

Whoops, there are those absolute words again, like 'proven' and 'guarantee', that in my view just don't belong.  I am not aware of any guarantees in the world of medicine even for things we understand far more thoroughly, at least as you are using the word 'guarantee' here.

What has been shown/'proven' is that vaccinations reduce your risk of becoming infected.  If your chance of getting infected is reduced, then the chance of you generating a viral load and spreading the virus is reduced. By reducing the risk of the virus spreading we not only reduce the risk of sickening other people, we reduce the risk of another variant emerging and potentially having to start this all over again. Yes I think you are correct that an infected vaccinated person has roughly the same viral load as an infected unvaccinated person, but even in that case the vaccinated person is less likely to need hospitalization and less likely to die from it, and there seem to be some preliminary findings that suggest that even in this case the vaccinated infected person is less likely to spread the virus compared to the unvaccinated infected, although I'm not sure why exactly.  

So the immediate 'why' is to reduce the spread of the disease and risk of mutation and hopefully more people suffering. To me an equally as important 'why', one that to me circumvents all political nonsense, is to reduce the strain on our health care system and personnel.  It is a fact that for the last year and a half many of these people have been vastly overloaded and overworked, so to me we owe it to them to do what we can to combat the spread of the virus even if our approaches are imperfect, or even only partly effective like with masks.

In general I don't have a problem with 'papers' being required in this situation (which I think is changing and cases are going down, so this 'situation' could and hopefully does change), outside of using the phrase 'papers' at all as if this bears any meaningful resemblance to what 'papers' implies with reference to other oppressive countries historically.  I think it's a good thing that restaurants have to have their 'papers' showing the health dept is regularly certifying them, that drivers require drivers licenses, that doctors have to be certified to practice, etc.

[Grim Reaper 6]

5 hours ago, Gummug said:

Manwon, I have a question... do you accept information from Infowars (Alex Jones) as being accurate? Because if you do, and if I can figure out how to do it, I can send you a link showing the harmfulness of covid jabs. Thanks. Peace out...

No my friend I don't except anything that Alex Jones says as a fact.

Let me ask you a question if you were really sick would you go to a mailman for medical advise or for medication?

What I don't understand is why people listen to people like him and others like him or Politicians or anyone else who isn't medically qualified to speak. If you want medical information about SARS-Cov-2 the only place you will find unbiased information is from the Medical Community, Are they always right, no their not but they will correct their mistakes as information becomes available will Alex Jones, I say no.

The only way to find unbiased information about this Pandemic is to do the research yourself. I am not saying trust a single source. When I want to check out updated information I will go to the CDC, the WHO, the Lancet and numerous health organizations across the world to compare what's being reported. By combining all these sources of information you get a clear picture so you see what's really going on.

What I am trying to say is that why go to some non medical individual for information when you can go to the actual source. Like I said before my young friend I don't believe that Politics should be part of this Pandemic and people Alex Jones always spin everything to match their political agenda just like many forum members here also do.

Hope I am clear, and sincerely I mean no disrespect to you. I think your an intelligent individual and also that you don't need to rely upon someone like Alex Jones or a political party to tell you what's right and wrong like far to many Americans on this forum and back in the US do. I believe that your capable of thinking for yourself and if your really concerned about something your capable of doing a little research to fine the answers for yourself. If I didn't believe that I would not respond to your comments.

Peace my friend!

[+and-then]

5 hours ago, Liquid Gardens said:

Yes I think you are correct that an infected vaccinated person has roughly the same viral load as an infected unvaccinated person, but even in that case the vaccinated person is less likely to need hospitalization and less likely to die from it, and there seem to be some preliminary findings that suggest that even in this case the vaccinated infected person is less likely to spread the virus compared to the unvaccinated infected, although I'm not sure why exactly.  

Do you agree that the level of restrictions and loss of freedoms undertaken over this pandemic are justified?  Are you at all concerned that these documents will morph into a common means for an overreaching government to set limits on other freedoms?  What I see happening in the U.S. is a reaction to a virus that kills fewer than 2% who contract it, as though it were Ebola.  It's a clear overreaction and millions of Americans have lost trust in media or government and are bridling at the force.

[thedutchiedutch]

10 hours ago, and then said:

Which truth always brings me back around to my BIGGEST concern over how the government is using this pandemic to put chains on the freedoms of their people.  Seeing that, as you say, the scientists agree that the vaccines do not stop transmission... What, exactly, are the "passports" meant to accomplish in furtherance of public health?  Surely, the idea is that those who congregate in large groups out in public are supposedly protected from getting sick?  These vaccines lower the chance that the virus will be spread in those settings but even in the countries with the highest % of vaccinated citizens, surges are still occurring and CDC has admitted that the protection offered by these vaccines tails off over months.  

Perhaps one of my betters here can explain that to me.  They should remember to type S L O W L Y, though, 'cause I'm not very bright...

I think today It's not so much about stopping the transmission anymore but more so about protecting people from getting seriously sick and possibly dying.
It's a huge strain on healthcare systems worldwide so to reduce and control the strain the goal is to get as much people vaccinated as possible and vaccine passports
are a helping tool in reaching this goal. I also think that governments are scared of a possible new variant/strain of covid19 popping up some day that might start this 
whole pandemic all over again with worldwide disastrous economic collapses. To avoid this what better then having as much of the population as possible vaccinated
to give ourselves a head start in fighting this new strain. 

[psyche101]

5 minutes ago, thedutchiedutch said:

I think today It's not so much about stopping the transmission anymore but more so about protecting people from getting seriously sick and possibly dying.
 

As the majority of people don't have underlying conditions that make covid fatal, so it's definitely about transmission.

If the majority don't take measures to stop the transmission, a lot of people at risk will die. They are preventable. It's always been, and will be about transmission. 

Comparing vaccine passports to Nazi papers is irrational and very silly. It's just an paranoid excuse to wind people up and escape community responsibility. Don't fall for it. 

[Gummug]

7 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

No my friend I don't except anything that Alex Jones says as a fact.

Let me ask you a question if you were really sick would you go to a mailman for medical advise or for medication?

What I don't understand is why people listen to people like him and others like him or Politicians or anyone else who isn't medically qualified to speak. If you want medical information about SARS-Cov-2 the only place you will find unbiased information is from the Medical Community, Are they always right, no their not but they will correct their mistakes as information becomes available will Alex Jones, I say no.

The only way to find unbiased information about this Pandemic is to do the research yourself. I am not saying trust a single source. When I want to check out updated information I will go to the CDC, the WHO, the Lancet and numerous health organizations across the world to compare what's being reported. By combining all these sources of information you get a clear picture so you see what's really going on.

What I am trying to say is that why go to some non medical individual for information when you can go to the actual source. Like I said before my young friend I don't believe that Politics should be part of this Pandemic and people Alex Jones always spin everything to match their political agenda just like many forum members here also do.

Hope I am clear, and sincerely I mean no disrespect to you. I think your an intelligent individual and also that you don't need to rely upon someone like Alex Jones or a political party to tell you what's right and wrong like far to many Americans on this forum and back in the US do. I believe that your capable of thinking for yourself and if your really concerned about something your capable of doing a little research to fine the answers for yourself. If I didn't believe that I would not respond to your comments.

Peace my friend!

Hi Manwon, and peace  well it's 11:34 pm here so I'm thinking it's roughly 2:34 pm where you live? Maybe in India or Australia? Not my business  I guess but anyway...

Okay, you don't accept Alex Jones, fair enough. I will try and find some other sources. I know I am slow getting on to this and my excuse is I am fighting a sinus infection, plus I have limited internet access. Anyhow that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

No I definitely would not go to a mailman for medical advice (unless he had been a doctor at one time lol) but if the mailman brings me a prescription (and has done) I surely would not send it back saying "I am not taking this! The mailman brought it and he is not a doctor!" So yeah, Alex Jones is not a doctor, but the things he talks about he supports with literature that is from doctors, so therefore, imo, it is valid.

In any case, would you accept information from America's Frontline Doctors? Or Truthforhealth? I'm pretty sure some here wouldn't because they think they are quacks or charlatans or some such but I don't think they are.  Okay anxiously awaiting your reply,  

 

[Grim Reaper 6]

1 hour ago, psyche101 said:

As the majority of people don't have underlying conditions that make covid fatal, so it's definitely about transmission.

If the majority don't take measures to stop the transmission, a lot of people at risk will die. They are preventable. It's always been, and will be about transmission. 

Comparing vaccine passports to Nazi papers is irrational and very silly. It's just an paranoid excuse to wind people up and escape community responsibility. Don't fall for it. 

Your certainly right that underlying conditions or being unvaccinated are the two biggest causes of Death from Covid 19. Your also correct that transmission is the biggest issue at this time, and for people who fall into the two groups above in my first paragraph they face serious problems just trying to carry on with their lives because if they are smart their movement can become very restricted.

But here is an issue that is becoming very very serious for many many of  those who catch COVID 19 and do not die and this problem doesn't have any known treatment that is even really effective at this time. It also effected people who survived the SARS outbreak in 2002, and the major MERS outbreak in 2015 and this situation and illness is effecting people who were normal before they became infected by Covid 19. Last at this time it is effecting people from all age groups worldwide. 

SARS-CoV-2/COVID-19 infection to brain microvascular injury and neuroinflammation in dementia / Alzheimer’s like cognitive impairment:

Background

""Dementia-like cognitive impairment is an increasingly reported complication of SARS-CoV-2 infection. However, the underlying mechanisms responsible for this complication remain unclear. A better understanding of causative processes by which COVID-19 may lead to cognitive impairment is essential for developing preventive and therapeutic interventions.""

 Conclusion 

""Our results suggest significant mechanistic overlap between AD and COVID-19, centered on neuroinflammation and microvascular injury. These results help improve our understanding of COVID-19-associated neurological manifestations and provide guidance for future development of preventive or treatment interventions, although causal relationship and mechanistic pathways between COVID-19 and AD need future investigations.""

Introduction

""Patients with COVID-19 commonly develop neurologic symptoms and/or complications, such as a loss of taste or smell, stroke, delirium, and rarely new onset seizures [1, 2]. Based on the experience with other coronaviruses, it was predicted early on that COVID-19 patients might also be at risk for cognitive dysfunction. For example, after the severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS-CoV-1) outbreak in 2002 and the Middle East respiratory syndrome (MERS) outbreak in 2012, both caused by human coronaviruses (HCoVs), 20% of recovered patients reported ongoing memory impairment [3]. Evidence now supports similar complications after COVID-19, which due to the global pandemic, is poised to potentially lead to a surge in cases of Alzheimer’s-like dementia or other forms of neurocognitive impairment in the near future.""

""In a recent study of a large cohort of more than 236,000 COVID-19 survivors, it was shown that the survivors who required hospitalization, ICU admission, or had encephalopathy during COVID-19 had elevated risks of neurological and psychiatric disorders [8]. Another study using 73,000 non-hospitalized COVID-19 survivors shows various incident sequalae, such as mental health disorders and neurocognitive disorders.  Jaywant et al. reported that of 57 recovering COVID-19 patients referred for neuropsychological evaluation before hospital discharge, 81% had cognitive impairment, including mild, moderate, and severe cognitive impairment ""

https://alzres.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13195-021-00850-3

2 hours ago, thedutchiedutch said:

I think today It's not so much about stopping the transmission anymore but more so about protecting people from getting seriously sick and possibly dying.
It's a huge strain on healthcare systems worldwide so to reduce and control the strain the goal is to get as much people vaccinated as possible and vaccine passports
are a helping tool in reaching this goal. I also think that governments are scared of a possible new variant/strain of covid19 popping up some day that might start this 
whole pandemic all over again with worldwide disastrous economic collapses. To avoid this what better then having as much of the population as possible vaccinated
to give ourselves a head start in fighting this new strain. 

 

13 hours ago, Gummug said:

Manwon, I have a question... do you accept information from Infowars (Alex Jones) as being accurate? Because if you do, and if I can figure out how to do it, I can send you a link showing the harmfulness of covid jabs. Thanks. Peace out...

 

[Grim Reaper 6]

26 minutes ago, Gummug said:

Hi Manwon, and peace  well it's 11:34 pm here so I'm thinking it's roughly 2:34 pm where you live? Maybe in India or Australia? Not my business  I guess but anyway...

Okay, you don't accept Alex Jones, fair enough. I will try and find some other sources. I know I am slow getting on to this and my excuse is I am fighting a sinus infection, plus I have limited internet access. Anyhow that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

No I definitely would not go to a mailman for medical advice (unless he had been a doctor at one time lol) but if the mailman brings me a prescription (and has done) I surely would not send it back saying "I am not taking this! The mailman brought it and he is not a doctor!" So yeah, Alex Jones is not a doctor, but the things he talks about he supports with literature that is from doctors, so therefore, imo, it is valid.

In any case, would you accept information from America's Frontline Doctors? Or Truthforhealth? I'm pretty sure some here wouldn't because they think they are quacks or charlatans or some such but I don't think they are.  Okay anxiously awaiting your reply,  

 

Here is something you should read about Americas Frontline Doctor, and the other site Truth for Health is no better see below. I am not trying to give you a hard time I am just being honest, hope you can understand that.

Sources in the Conspiracy-Pseudoscience category may publish unverifiable information that is not always supported by evidence. In addition, these sources may be untrustworthy for credible/verifiable information; therefore, fact-checking and further investigation is recommended on a per article basis when obtaining information from these sources. See all Conspiracy-Pseudoscience sources.

 

• Overall, we rate America’s Frontline Doctors a quackery level pseudoscience website based on promoting false or misleading information regarding Coronavirus that does not align with the scientific consensus. We also rate them Low for factual reporting due to a lack of transparency and using known pseudoscience sources to draw their conclusions.

---

Detailed Report

Bias Rating: PSEUDOSCIENCE RIGHT BIASED
Factual Reporting: LOW
Country: USA (44/180 Press Freedom)
Media Type: Website
Traffic/Popularity: Medium Traffic
MBFC Credibility Rating: LOW CREDIBILITY

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/americas-frontline-doctors/

 

 

 

 

[Golden Duck]

14 hours ago, and then said:

Which truth always brings me back around to my BIGGEST concern over how the government is using this pandemic to put chains on the freedoms of their people.  Seeing that, as you say, the scientists agree that the vaccines do not stop transmission... What, exactly, are the "passports" meant to accomplish in furtherance of public health?  Surely, the idea is that those who congregate in large groups out in public are supposedly protected from getting sick?  These vaccines lower the chance that the virus will be spread in those settings but even in the countries with the highest % of vaccinated citizens, surges are still occurring and CDC has admitted that the protection offered by these vaccines tails off over months.  

Perhaps one of my betters here can explain that to me.  They should remember to type S L O W L Y, though, 'cause I'm not very bright...

It goes something like that few vaccines provide neutralising antibodies or sterilising immunity. But, even vaccines that don't are effective at controlling spread.

You talk about vast majorities and surges, it always sounds like you're rhetorically minimising an effect.  Those tolerance levels I guess are unacceptably high in this day and age.

We can do better.

Edited October 28, 2021 by Golden Duck