The Eclipse of Europe

[godnodog]

3 hours ago, Cookie Monster said:

Sure I mean the common agricultural policy is capitalist.

So is preventing any nation getting an advantage over the others in an area of industry lol.

The agricultural policy is in place to try and provide a framework to allow farmers around europe to survive. 

Its not all about competition, its about balance amd sustainability.

https://ec.europa.eu/info/food-farming-fisheries/key-policies/common-agricultural-policy/cap-glance_en

[L.A.T.1961]

23 hours ago, Helen of Annoy said:

 

 

So... with how much more your farmers are supported now when you're thank god out?

 

It will be down to the UK gov and famers to sort out what's needed. UK Farmers will be naturally cautious about what the new system might bring but it is now within the gift of UK politicians who get's what. As apposed to sending money to the EU and then waiting to see what happens and how much comes back.

Let us remember these EU CAP payments could change at any time. -

 

Sinn Féin MEP Matt Carthy has hit out at European Commission proposals to slash the CAP budget in 2021. 

He said: This will see Irish Farmers lose €97 million in payments and will impact severely on the rural communities that depend on them.  Every farm family will be affected and every rural community will pay the price.

This proposal must be rejected by the Irish government.

 “Leo Varadkar previously committed to the EU that Ireland would increase payments to the next European budget; he did this without securing any guarantee on the programmes that are essential for Ireland such as the CAP.  The Commission in return proposed an increased overall EU budget for the period 2021-2027 but with a 15% cut to CAP in order to allow for massive increases in military expenditure.

https://www.sinnfein.ie/ga/contents/55264

 

What can the Irish do about this ? just about the square root of nothing. 

[Silver]

The Express lists all the countries about to leave the EU ( and it really is all of them) Click on Leonardo Carella:

 

 

Edited October 4, 2021 by The Silver Shroud

[godnodog]

10 hours ago, L.A.T.1961 said:

It will be down to the UK gov and famers to sort out what's needed. UK Farmers will be naturally cautious about what the new system might bring but it is now within the gift of UK politicians who get's what. As apposed to sending money to the EU and then waiting to see what happens and how much comes back.

Let us remember these EU CAP payments could change at any time. -

 

Sinn Féin MEP Matt Carthy has hit out at European Commission proposals to slash the CAP budget in 2021. 

He said: This will see Irish Farmers lose €97 million in payments and will impact severely on the rural communities that depend on them.  Every farm family will be affected and every rural community will pay the price.

This proposal must be rejected by the Irish government.

 “Leo Varadkar previously committed to the EU that Ireland would increase payments to the next European budget; he did this without securing any guarantee on the programmes that are essential for Ireland such as the CAP.  The Commission in return proposed an increased overall EU budget for the period 2021-2027 but with a 15% cut to CAP in order to allow for massive increases in military expenditure.

https://www.sinnfein.ie/ga/contents/55264

 

What can the Irish do about this ? just about the square root of nothing. 

Actually Ireland can do much more than you think, everything is negotiated, Ireland may loose in some fields and win in others. If Ireland refuses the CAP budget the all thing may get delayed.

It's a budget, frequently countries do not all of the allocated budget fot them.

The EU Commission has not enforcement power, they can present proposals, no EU member state has to comply. TheEU Commission can open procedures against countries that di not comply with stuff that that country agreed upon but ildo not apply within the agreed framework.

This is why you procedures against Poland and Hungary in respect to judicial issues and human rights.

My own country has been several times on the verge if seeing procedures opened due budget deficit, this is prior to the IMF/ECB intervention.

[godnodog]

6 minutes ago, The Silver Shroud said:

The Express lists all the countries about to leave the EU ( and it really is all of them) Click on Leonardo Carella:

 

 

Did he mention Portugal?

We could provide some headlines as well.

[Silver]

28 minutes ago, godnodog said:

Did he mention Portugal?

We could provide some headlines as well.

I exaggerated. The Express seems to have missed Germany as well.  A couple of times a week they report on the complete  disintergration of the EU (caused by Brexit) so I guess they think Germany is covered that way. 

[Helen of Annoy]

18 hours ago, L.A.T.1961 said:

 

I didn't ask what you can imagine about Ireland, or what you think CAP is. 

I asked you how much more than the EU is your government giving to your farmers? 

[+OverSword]

On 10/2/2021 at 2:54 AM, Br Cornelius said:

The article I linked to gives an interesting perspective on that. But in objective terms he is a Social Democrat not a socialist as such.

 

Br Cornelius

If the definition of a social democrat is he wants to spend all of your money on other people then that's what he is.  

[+OverSword]

On 10/2/2021 at 4:52 AM, Helen of Annoy said:

I think sane, humane communists are desirable in political life of a country. 

I agree.  As long as they are a small minority.  I don't know how many times I have posted here that what America needs is a large increase in libertarian and socialists in congress to break the duopoly currently terrorizing us.

[L.A.T.1961]

39 minutes ago, Helen of Annoy said:

I didn't ask what you can imagine about Ireland, or what you think CAP is. 

I asked you how much more than the EU is your government giving to your farmers? 

From what I am aware farmers have received the same as the previous EU arrangements as a stop gap and the new UK system is still to be agreed and will take effect in a year or two. 

But I can see why you want to avoid talking about the Irish situation.  

 

[Helen of Annoy]

14 minutes ago, L.A.T.1961 said:

From what I am aware farmers have received the same as the previous EU arrangements as a stop gap and the new UK system is still to be agreed and will take effect in a year or two. 

But I can see why you want to avoid talking about the Irish situation.  

 

Quite contrary, I wanted you to stop avoiding talking about UK farming situation. 

Aaah, a stop gap. Nice newspeak. For whatever another stop-something means, Brexiters had no plan and they've still got no plan. Except importing everything from New Zealand. 

Meanwhile, your farmers can either hope for indefinite prolongation of EU subsidies, either take a crystal ball to divine what or when they can expect from their oh so very sovereign government. 

 

Regarding Ireland, what's to talk about? They'll make their decisions on state level, it's natural that different parties have different opinions, and all EU member states will achieve an agreement that is acceptable for every member.   

The EU won't crash and burn over 15%, even if turns out to be so. Agriculture doesn't crash because of 15%, it crashes when an irresponsible demagogue leaves it for the free market to do its magic.

[Guest Br Cornelius]

1 hour ago, OverSword said:

If the definition of a social democrat is he wants to spend all of your money on other people then that's what he is.  

Snide tripe comments like that add nothing to the conversation.

Br Cotrnelius

[Guest Br Cornelius]

The Tory government have expressed admiration for a zero subsidy farm policy such as followed by New Zealand. This is likely the policy they will attempt to transition to if it isn't to damaging electorally. However I don't think it will fly as a substantial number of the small farms would inevitably go to the wall under such a scenario.

And whats to talk about with regard to Ireland and the CAP ?

Br Cornelius

[Autochthon1990]

On 9/29/2021 at 8:51 AM, aztek said:

give it 50 years, European Islamic federation  will replace it, and looking at what new progressive values are, Islam will be the salvation. 

Dude the Muslim population of England, a country freaking out that they are being swarmed by Arabs is...five percent. 

 

That's not exactly the makings of a demographic flip, there. 

[+OverSword]

11 minutes ago, Br Cornelius said:

Snide tripe comments like that add nothing to the conversation.

Br Cotrnelius

Then by all means feel free to tell me why he is not a socialist.  

[Guest Br Cornelius]

29 minutes ago, OverSword said:

Then by all means feel free to tell me why he is not a socialist.  

Not repeating myself. He's a social democrat who doesn't want to nationalise Industry - fairly much the defining policy of socialist.

Br Cornelius

[+OverSword]

32 minutes ago, Br Cornelius said:

Not repeating myself. He's a social democrat who doesn't want to nationalise Industry - fairly much the defining policy of socialist.

Br Cornelius

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/bernie-sanderss-radical-plan-to-nationalize-the-internet

https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/14/politics/kfile-bernie-nationalization/index.html

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/02/02/bernie-sanders-climate-federal-electricity-production-110117

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/bernie-sanders-wants-to-nationalize-at-least-30-of-the-american-economy

You really know zip about Sanders.   He is and has always been a socialist.

[Duke Wellington]

The EU watches Brexit, and knows its death is coming.

Italy, France, Spain, Portugal, Greece, it wont be long.

Britain once again has led the way for the free world, and others will soon follow our example.

[Helen of Annoy]

10 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:

The EU watches Brexit, and knows its death is coming.

Italy, France, Spain, Portugal, Greece, it wont be long.

Britain once again has led the way for the free world, and others will soon follow our example.

 

I knew it!

I knew you were trolling all these years!

 

Professional or just a hobby? 

[Duke Wellington]

2 minutes ago, Helen of Annoy said:

 

I knew it!

I knew you were trolling all these years!

Professional or just a hobby? 

Unable to undermine my views any further you are now trying the troll label route.

Let me guess, 35 million Brits are Brexit trolls? Its the only rational answer left, well except the obvious one, we are actually for Brexit.

Edited October 4, 2021 by Cookie Monster

[Helen of Annoy]

9 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:

Unable to undermine my views any further you are now trying the troll label route.

Let me guess, 35 million Brits are Brexit trolls?

 

Don't worry, even if you came out these patients wouldn't want to believe you've been leading them by their noses all this time   

 

All right, I'll play: 

35 million?   

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/politics/eu_referendum/results

leave 17,410,742

remain 16,141,241

Is it some exceptionally British mathematics I can't understand with my feeble female and European mutt brain? 

 

[Silver]

Lord Frost admits openly that the Northern Ireland Protocol "must go" because it facilitates trade between NI and the EU in a way that shows the deal between Britain and the EU is a very poor one for the UK:

 

 

[Wepwawet]

15 hours ago, Autochthon1990 said:

Dude the Muslim population of England, a country freaking out that they are being swarmed by Arabs is...five percent. 

 

That's not exactly the makings of a demographic flip, there. 

In overall terms not a huge demographic flip, but it's an ongoing process. The link is to the demographics for Luton in 2011. It shows that only 54.7% of the population is white and 50.4 Christian. Considering that those figures in the 1960s would be about 100% on each, this is a huge demographic flip in that town, and it has happened in other towns, and continues to do so. Luton demographics 2011

[Silver]

18 hours ago, Cookie Monster said:

Unable to undermine my views any further you are now trying the troll label route.

Let me guess, 35 million Brits are Brexit trolls? Its the only rational answer left, well except the obvious one, we are actually for Brexit.

Johnson says "It's not my job" to "sort out UK's problems".

To be fair to him, who would have imagined so many people would be stupid enough to vote for Brexit?

PM's astonishing claim as he denies nation is in 'crisis' and DISMISSES inflation spike fears, fuel shortages and empty supermarket shelves as 'just part of his new approach'

Boris Johnson has been giving a series of interviews from the Conservative Party conference in Manchester  

The PM blamed the wave of supply chain chaos on Covid and Britain changing from a 'low wage' economy

He insisted the disruption was like a 'giant waking' up and 'creaking' after the pandemic stalled activity

Mr Johnson said 'not the job of government to come in and fix every problem' amid fears of Christmas misery

He admitted that just 127 foreign lorry drivers have applied for emergency visas under government scheme 

Boris denies claims supply chain chaos just part of ending UK's 'low wage' economy | Daily Mail Online

Edited October 5, 2021 by The Silver Shroud

[Duke Wellington]

49 minutes ago, The Silver Shroud said:

Johnson says "It's not my job" to "sort out UK's problems".

To be fair to him, who would have imagined so many people would be stupid enough to vote for Brexit?

PM's astonishing claim as he denies nation is in 'crisis' and DISMISSES inflation spike fears, fuel shortages and empty supermarket shelves as 'just part of his new approach'

Boris Johnson has been giving a series of interviews from the Conservative Party conference in Manchester  

The PM blamed the wave of supply chain chaos on Covid and Britain changing from a 'low wage' economy

He insisted the disruption was like a 'giant waking' up and 'creaking' after the pandemic stalled activity

Mr Johnson said 'not the job of government to come in and fix every problem' amid fears of Christmas misery

He admitted that just 127 foreign lorry drivers have applied for emergency visas under government scheme 

Boris denies claims supply chain chaos just part of ending UK's 'low wage' economy | Daily Mail Online

What the Daily Mail are really saying is that they want Keynesian policies to manage the UK post corona rebound.

As Boris has already shown himself to be quite Keynesian, I think he will be going that way regardless of the article. But it adds extra pressure I suppose.