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Self Esteem and Religion


Sherapy
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12 hours ago, docyabut2 said:

just wonder if heaven does exist:( 

What I'm about to write I mean in the nicest way. Docy make a decision. I've seen you flip flop on this a lot. If the idea of some type of heaven gives you comfort, embrace it. If the idea of heaven doesn't appeal to you, don't worry about it. Seems this stress you more than needed. 

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The good news is..  Existence IS.       There is no ISN'T.    :).   

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17 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

Hey I hope all is well, but you idea of how the subconscious minds works isn't based upon neuroscience. Here is a quote from a good source that explains the process far better than I am able to. 

How does the subconscious work?

""Our subconscious functions as a kind of emitter of messages or stimuli that we process at a conscious level and that activate certain patterns of behavior without our being aware of it. That is to say, the decisions we make every day, even if it seems that we make them consciously, are really highly influenced by our own subconscious.""

https://neurotray.com/is-the-subconscious-mind-scientifically-proven/

Peace 

 

An add to, there is a concept in Neuroscience called cognitive entrenchment, this is when our prior knowledge is ingrained and incredibly difficult to change, aka the stuff on auto pilot, habitual (or subconscious). As humans we are geared towards looping our beliefs (about the world) to our personal and social personas, namely our own experiences. For ex: . when ones beliefs are challenged and we see this a lot on UM, even when that challenge comes in the form of concrete facts, to the person it comes off like a personal attack. This is a huge mountain to climb and overcome by way of arguing or debate with facts, more often than not it is completely unsuccessful. The brain has basically two operating modes anxious and safe, for ex: a person needing to be right all the time isn’t feeling “brain”safe the position needed to activate the curiosity of the learning brain.  The chances of learning anything new with an anxious brain is limited at best, learning is better served with a brain that feels safe a safe brain is curious and change (learning) starts there. 
 

An alternative approach is empathy or validation a genuine interest in getting to know the person from their own personal and social foundation, their triggers, behaviors, thoughts, influences, and then strategizing from there. etc. etc. etc., yet, this takes a lot of time and patience and help in the way of quality data.

 I think a good book to start with is “The Art of The Changing Brain” James Zull any kind of cognitive change involves learning. Also, CBT Cognitive Behavioral Therapy techniques allow one to get a good picture of the current issues and includes getting a good baseline or understanding of how it all started (ones history). And, there are 3 components at play all the time, ones behaviors, ones emotions and ones cognitions. For me, I prefer the guidance, input, and expertise of a CBT therapist, but one could get a really quality book on the subject and go from there too. I would also offer getting an easy to understand book on how the brain works. The Neurologist I work for stated “Neuroscience for Dummies” is a great way to get a basic understanding for everyday use, 

 

Thanks for your post and the link. 
 

Edited by Sherapy
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1 hour ago, XenoFish said:

What I'm about to write I mean in the nicest way. Docy make a decision. I've seen you flip flop on this a lot. If the idea of some type of heaven gives you comfort, embrace it. If the idea of heaven doesn't appeal to you, don't worry about it. Seems this stress you more than needed. 

I'm not convinced that she is looking to make a decision, in a strict sense. IMO, it seems that it's her way of processing her grief, a cathartic outlet if you will... and I see absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Edited by Nuclear Wessel
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8 minutes ago, Nuclear Wessel said:

I'm not convinced that she is looking to make a decision, in a strict sense. IMO, it seems that it's her way of processing her grief, a cathartic outlet if you will... and I see absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Ultimately it is her decision.

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1 minute ago, XenoFish said:

Ultimately it is her decision.

Yes, but I don't think that's her goal.

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2 minutes ago, Nuclear Wessel said:

Yes, but I don't think that's her goal.

Neither one of us nor anyone to my knowledge know her intention.

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Just now, XenoFish said:

Neither one of us nor anyone to my knowledge know her intention.

You're correct--I don't have any knowledge as to her intention, which is why I prefaced what I said with "in my opinion". I am just making a guess based on the nature of her posts. @jmccr8 knows her a lot better than I do.

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2 minutes ago, Nuclear Wessel said:

You're correct--I don't have any knowledge as to her intention, which is why I prefaced what I said with "in my opinion". I am just making a guess based on the nature of her posts. @jmccr8 knows her a lot better than I do.

And all I want is for her to find a "comfort zone". 

Edit: I know, big surprise, I can be sympathetic to others. I feel bad for the poor gal.

Edited by XenoFish
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43 minutes ago, Nuclear Wessel said:

I'm not convinced that she is looking to make a decision, in a strict sense. IMO, it seems that it's her way of processing her grief, a cathartic outlet if you will... and I see absolutely nothing wrong with that.

My two cents is she is grieving and it is a long process that takes what it takes. 

Edited by Sherapy
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26 minutes ago, Nuclear Wessel said:

You're correct--I don't have any knowledge as to her intention, which is why I prefaced what I said with "in my opinion". I am just making a guess based on the nature of her posts. @jmccr8 knows her a lot better than I do.

 

34 minutes ago, Nuclear Wessel said:

Yes, but I don't think that's her goal.

Grieving is a process and hers is complicated by unbearable loss in a short time. My heart goes out to her and that she is sharing is a good thing. I am glad she feels safe with us.

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Life's a battlefield, where everyone's a casualty and no one ever walks away unscathed.

Edited by Hammerclaw
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6 hours ago, Sherapy said:

An add to, there is a concept in Neuroscience called cognitive entrenchment, this is when our prior knowledge is ingrained and incredibly difficult to change, aka the stuff on auto pilot, habitual (or subconscious). As humans we are geared towards looping our beliefs (about the world) to our personal and social personas, namely our own experiences. For ex: . when ones beliefs are challenged and we see this a lot on UM, even when that challenge comes in the form of concrete facts, to the person it comes off like a personal attack. This is a huge mountain to climb and overcome by way of arguing or debate with facts, more often than not it is completely unsuccessful. The brain has basically two operating modes anxious and safe, for ex: a person needing to be right all the time isn’t feeling “brain”safe the position needed to activate the curiosity of the learning brain.  The chances of learning anything new with an anxious brain is limited at best, learning is better served with a brain that feels safe a safe brain is curious and change (learning) starts there. 
 

An alternative approach is empathy or validation a genuine interest in getting to know the person from their own personal and social foundation, their triggers, behaviors, thoughts, influences, and then strategizing from there. etc. etc. etc., yet, this takes a lot of time and patience and help in the way of quality data.

 I think a good book to start with is “The Art of The Changing Brain” James Zull any kind of cognitive change involves learning. Also, CBT Cognitive Behavioral Therapy techniques allow one to get a good picture of the current issues and includes getting a good baseline or understanding of how it all started (ones history). And, there are 3 components at play all the time, ones behaviors, ones emotions and ones cognitions. For me, I prefer the guidance, input, and expertise of a CBT therapist, but one could get a really quality book on the subject and go from there too. I would also offer getting an easy to understand book on how the brain works. The Neurologist I work for stated “Neuroscience for Dummies” is a great way to get a basic understanding for everyday use, 

 

Thanks for your post and the link. 
 

Thanks for your response and I agree that Neuroscience for Dummies is the best place to start!:tu:

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Time to begin a new chapter... 

Quote
 
Richard Bryan McDaniel  2012 · Religion
It happened that the attendant took to imitating his master; when someone would ask ... Lingyou poked among the ashes with a pair of tongs then announced, ...
Andy Ferguson  2011 · Religion
One cold night as he sat up alone, Foyan poked deep in the ashes of a dwindled fire and saw ... He inquired to Foyan aboutZen master Qinglin's“hauling soil...

~

 

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11 hours ago, Nuclear Wessel said:

I'm not convinced that she is looking to make a decision, in a strict sense. IMO, it seems that it's her way of processing her grief, a cathartic outlet if you will... and I see absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Again very well said and I totally agree with you, it frustrates me at times how people respond to her. She is just like us, the only issue is that she had some serious health problems that she is dealing with, and she is doing the best she is able!:tu:

I wish that in general people would lighten up on her and others on the forum.

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On 10/20/2021 at 12:25 AM, Desertrat56 said:

I have a higher self esteem now that I have figured out that no one knows who or where god is nor what god wants or even if there is a god.   The bible even has a lot of indication that there are multiple gods, and none of them have ever talked to me about anything.   I don't need some "higher power" to scare me into being a good person and I also don't have to worry about burning in hell.

Well I've replied several times to some of your comments but you didn't replied back:innocent::innocent:

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I do have a hard time in what to believe. If reincarnation is true  there is no heaven and my loves ones that died on  one day and born again the same day ,life on earth is just a recycling."(   

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55 minutes ago, docyabut2 said:

I do have a hard time in what to believe. If reincarnation is true  there is no heaven and my loves ones that died on  one day and born again the same day ,life on earth is just a recycling."(   

What if your loved ones were born into a better life? One of greater potential and happiness? 

Just a thought. 

(I need to be careful. That borders close to optimism)

Edited by XenoFish
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27 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

(I need to be careful. That borders close to optimism)

Yes, stop that--no positivity here. 

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1 minute ago, Nuclear Wessel said:

Yes, stop that--no positivity here. 

Yeah, the day I'm the optimistic one is the day hell freezes over. Oh, how frightening would that be. I tried it for awhile, and some complained about. Weird. Guess I've no choice but to play the character I created here. Should just change my screen name to GrumpyFish.

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On 10/23/2021 at 9:49 AM, Nuclear Wessel said:

You're correct--I don't have any knowledge as to her intention, which is why I prefaced what I said with "in my opinion". I am just making a guess based on the nature of her posts. @jmccr8 knows her a lot better than I do.

Hi Nuke

I really don't know her personally all that well but she has been a member here since I joined the forum and am familiar with her input as a contributor. The last few years she has gone through a difficult time and for the most part I see that she feels alone and comes here to be a part of a community because we are familiar to her. I like her because she is not the kind of person that is unkind or abrasive in nature. 

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11 hours ago, docyabut2 said:

I do have a hard time in what to believe. If reincarnation is true  there is no heaven and my loves ones that died on  one day and born again the same day ,life on earth is just a recycling."(   

I think your present beliefs are what you should continue to follow, you have believed in Jesus as your Saviour all your life. No one knows until we meet death what will happen, so whatever form of spirituality that fills the void in your heart and gives you comfort should never be disregarded. 

Your are a kind and good person Docy, I sincerely wish you peace and happiness so never let go of your beliefs because nothing else matters.

Peace my friend!:tu:

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On 10/22/2021 at 4:04 PM, docyabut2 said:

My mom died jan 6 and her son was born  jan 26 my dad died  may 30 by birthday the 27  i`m wondering if i `m going to die around my dad `s oct  26 birthday

No man in my direct family before me has lived to be 70 years old, mostly heart disease and accidents.  My dad was far healthier than I am and collapsed on his way to play racket ball, not quite 70.  Grandfathers and uncles in their 50's and 60's.   I did not expect to beat his record since I developed some serious lung issues at work.    But here I am still kicking and nearing 72.  Keep going Docy.  There is beauty in the fall leaves and the spring robin's song.  Rest a little bit and get stronger. 

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9 hours ago, XenoFish said:

Yeah, the day I'm the optimistic one is the day hell freezes over. Oh, how frightening would that be. I tried it for awhile, and some complained about. Weird. Guess I've no choice but to play the character I created here. Should just change my screen name to GrumpyFish.

I think you were on the right tract with your post to Docy, I understand how depression feels and can effect us. In truth when you posted those comments to Docy, I know it made you feel better. It's a simply fact that when we share that little piece of human connection with others, it also has a positive effect on us. I know from personal experience that when my PTSD has me down in that dark place by reaching out to others bring a little light into my own sad day, no matter if you agree with me or not opening up and trying to be kind to others when we feel our worst is better the any drug that a doctor can prescribe.

Peace Dude. 

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4 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

I know it made you feel better.

:lol:

Most of the time I find you annoying. Just being honest. There is something about you that grinds my gears. So do me a favor and do not attribute any form of optimism or positive reinforcement that I might post to something you pretend you've done. Okay, are we clear? Good, back on ignore you go. 

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