Will Due Posted December 8, 2021 #26 Share Posted December 8, 2021 (edited) 40 minutes ago, The_Phantom_Stranger said: That is the actual scripture Yes it is. Why it is believed to be true is why there's such a thing as the Urantia Book. Not that it shouldn't be hard to tell on your own that such statements about God in the Bible are patently untrue. "never permit yourself for one moment to believe the Scripture records which tell you that the God of love directed your forefathers to go forth in battle to slay all their enemies—men, women, and children. Such records are the words of men, not very holy men, and they are not the word of God. The Scriptures always have, and always will, reflect the intellectual, moral, and spiritual status of those who create them. “The thing most deplorable is not merely this erroneous idea of the absolute perfection of the Scripture record and the infallibility of its teachings, but rather the confusing misinterpretation of these sacred writings by the tradition-enslaved Edited December 8, 2021 by Will Due Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatetopa Posted December 8, 2021 #27 Share Posted December 8, 2021 1 hour ago, The_Phantom_Stranger said: The God of the Bible is actually a God of War: Thanks for clearing that up with both old and new testament verses. Back to his roots of Yahweh the volcano god I guess. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted December 8, 2021 #28 Share Posted December 8, 2021 15 hours ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Phantom So all that love and forgiveness preaching is a hoax then nope, all true, just applies to different people. some deserve love and forgives, other extermination, that is how god works, remember the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted December 8, 2021 #29 Share Posted December 8, 2021 (edited) 17 minutes ago, aztek said: nope, all true, just applies to different people. some deserve love and forgives, other extermination, that is how god works, remember the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah? The flood, Sodom and Gomorrah? Then you'll need to explain how some who deserve love and forgiveness ended up being exterminated in the flood and during whatever happened at Sodom and Gomorrah. Edited December 8, 2021 by Will Due Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Autochthon1990 Posted December 8, 2021 #30 Share Posted December 8, 2021 This is why we really need to regulate who's allowed to start, found, and operate a religious organization. Best case they get involved in politics or horde a boatload of cash in their walls, worst case they either are a doomsday cult or the whole thing is an excuse to **** children. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted December 8, 2021 #31 Share Posted December 8, 2021 7 minutes ago, Will Due said: The flood, Sodom and Gomorrah? Then you'll need to explain how some who deserve love and forgiveness ended up being exterminated in the flood and during whatever happened at Sodom and Gomorrah. what makes you think they deserve it?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted December 8, 2021 #32 Share Posted December 8, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, aztek said: what makes you think they deserve it?? Well unless a person has not made a final decision to reject God's mercy what makes you think that everyone else isn't extended love and forgiveness? Edited December 8, 2021 by Will Due Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted December 8, 2021 #33 Share Posted December 8, 2021 21 minutes ago, Will Due said: The flood, Sodom and Gomorrah? Then you'll need to explain how some who deserve love and forgiveness ended up being exterminated in the flood and during whatever happened at Sodom and Gomorrah. Hi Will Likely one of those friendly fire kind of deals like collateral damage. No big deal the good guys go to heaven anyway. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug1066 Posted December 8, 2021 #34 Share Posted December 8, 2021 On 12/4/2021 at 4:44 PM, Tatetopa said: If they claim to be a church, I would suggest that they come out and worship Baal or Mars or some god of war rather than disguising themselves as a part of Christianity. Christianity IS a religion of war. Take the US (a "Christian" nature). We have not had troops on foreign soil only four years out of the 245 years we've been around. Not a very good record. Then there are the Crusades, the 30 years war, the Gulf War, Afghanistan and others. This nation will never be at peace until we abolish Christianity. Doug 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted December 8, 2021 #35 Share Posted December 8, 2021 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Will Due said: Well unless a person has not made a final decision to reject God's mercy what makes you think that everyone else isn't extended love and forgiveness? something i've read in a book of Job many years ago, Quote Yet our wisdom comes only from God, so we cannot outsmart God with wisdom of our own. In fact, he has implanted in us only a small fraction of his wisdom, so we will never have the capacity to comprehend all his ways. Edited December 8, 2021 by aztek 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted December 8, 2021 #36 Share Posted December 8, 2021 On 10/30/2021 at 10:39 AM, Eldorado said: The Rod of Iron Ministries, a gun-worshipping church, has been making alliances with far-right figures in the US. The Pennsylvania-based pro-Trump sect, also known as The World of Peace and Unification Sanctuary, is led by Pastor Hyung Jin ‘Sean’ Moon. A conspiracy theorist who often sports a gold AR-15 and crown of bullets, he’s also the son of the late Reverend Sun Myung Moon, an evangelist, self-proclaimed messiah and accused cult leader. Reports emerged recently that the group had purchased a 130-acre property in Tennessee as a ‘training centre’ and retreat equatable to Cheongpyeong, where the ‘Moonies’ earlier gathered in South Korea. As part of its expansions, the church has also been reaching out to key far-right figures. https://www.unilad.co.uk/news/american-church-that-worships-guns-makes-alliances-with-far-right-figures/ as Long as they do not molest little boys, they can drive tanks to church for all i care. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wistman Posted December 8, 2021 #37 Share Posted December 8, 2021 On 12/4/2021 at 5:44 PM, Tatetopa said: If they claim to be a church, I would suggest that they come out and worship Baal or Mars or some god of war rather than disguising themselves as a part of Christianity. Rod of Iron Ministries? Priapus. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatetopa Posted December 8, 2021 #38 Share Posted December 8, 2021 1 hour ago, Doug1066 said: Then there are the Crusades, the 30 years war, the Gulf War, Afghanistan and others. This nation will never be at peace until we abolish Christianity. Yes, true facts but I think it lead you to a questionable conclusion. Belief is something that cannot be abolished. Believers can change their minds or beliefs can become less relevant over time as the world changes. Abolishing belief only leads to repression and violence. The nation will never be at peace while enough of our leaders and a significant number of our citizens believe force is necessary to protect our place in the world. An old religion can be morphed into a martial one if the need arises, or a new one like "Stop the Steal" can arise almost overnight to feed the needs of the power hungry with willing soldiers. 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatetopa Posted December 8, 2021 #39 Share Posted December 8, 2021 2 hours ago, Autochthon1990 said: This is why we really need to regulate who's allowed to start, found, and operate a religious organization. Best case they get involved in politics or horde a boatload of cash in their walls, worst case they either are a doomsday cult or the whole thing is an excuse to **** children. You can't do that Auto in a partially free society that values individual thought and creativity. It leads to state-controlled thought police who enforce what belief is allowed. Look at China or NK for examples of what you suggest. It does not end well or stop with religion. States can stifle change and diversity and seek to perpetuate themselves when they also have the power to control what citizens think. We can have a code of laws that protects every citizen and defends the powerless, but as a human institution, it is neither perfectly applied nor all -seeing. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug1066 Posted December 8, 2021 #40 Share Posted December 8, 2021 2 hours ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Will Likely one of those friendly fire kind of deals like collateral damage. No big deal the good guys go to heaven anyway. "Kill them all. God will know his own." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug1066 Posted December 8, 2021 #41 Share Posted December 8, 2021 2 hours ago, Will Due said: Well unless a person has not made a final decision to reject God's mercy what makes you think that everyone else isn't extended love and forgiveness? Sounds like a good topic for a future post. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug1066 Posted December 8, 2021 #42 Share Posted December 8, 2021 18 hours ago, Will Due said: How sad to think of God as a man. Let alone to stoop so low to think of him as a "man of war". Exodus 15:3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted December 8, 2021 #43 Share Posted December 8, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, aztek said: nope, all true, just applies to different people. some deserve love and forgives, other extermination, that is how god works, remember the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah? Hi Aztek Yes I do remember them and the odd thing is only the people that followed that god were affected and the rest of the world was fine during and after those events. Edited December 8, 2021 by jmccr8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Desertrat56 Posted December 8, 2021 #44 Share Posted December 8, 2021 3 hours ago, Autochthon1990 said: This is why we really need to regulate who's allowed to start, found, and operate a religious organization. Best case they get involved in politics or horde a boatload of cash in their walls, worst case they either are a doomsday cult or the whole thing is an excuse to **** children. But that would take away freedom of religion and that would need a change to the constitution. The **** children is illegal no matter who does it so children need to be taught at a young age what is inappropriate and that they must always tell their parents if an adult tells them not to tell their parents. If these things were taught to preschoolers there would be a lot more pedophiles in jail. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted December 8, 2021 #45 Share Posted December 8, 2021 2 hours ago, aztek said: as Long as they do not molest little boys, they can drive tanks to church for all i care. Hi Aztek So will you still be fine with them when they start spraying god's leaden word? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Desertrat56 Posted December 8, 2021 #46 Share Posted December 8, 2021 2 hours ago, Doug1066 said: Christianity IS a religion of war. Take the US (a "Christian" nature). We have not had troops on foreign soil only four years out of the 245 years we've been around. Not a very good record. Then there are the Crusades, the 30 years war, the Gulf War, Afghanistan and others. This nation will never be at peace until we abolish Christianity. Doug I think China and Russia both tried to abolish religion ( or a specific religion) and look how that played out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted December 8, 2021 #47 Share Posted December 8, 2021 10 minutes ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Aztek So will you still be fine with them when they start spraying god's leaden word? will discuss it when they do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug1066 Posted December 8, 2021 #48 Share Posted December 8, 2021 3 hours ago, Will Due said: The flood, Sodom and Gomorrah? Then you'll need to explain how some who deserve love and forgiveness ended up being exterminated in the flood and during whatever happened at Sodom and Gomorrah. The Flood: there were four floods in the Tigris-Euphrates valley since the last ice age. While any one of them could have been "Noah's Flood," the most-likely candidate occurred about 2800 BC. The "Epic of Gilgamesh" is another account of this flood. Sodom and Gomorrah: There is a hypothesis that Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed by a glancing blow by a meteor. It seems like a good hypothesis, but I would want some more evidence. Bitumen was used as water-proofing for rooves and walls. It is extremely flammable. Maybe somebody just over-turned a cooking fire. At any rate, one has to wonder how these natural disasters could have destroyed the bad while saving the good. I have never known a flood to be so selective. BTW: There is a salt pillar known as "Lot's Wife" near the Dead Sea. When you have an unusual natural formation, you need an explanation for how it came to be. The biblical account makes a much-more-interesting story than "it was created by the evaporation of water from a salt spring." Doug 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug1066 Posted December 8, 2021 #49 Share Posted December 8, 2021 3 hours ago, Autochthon1990 said: This is why we really need to regulate who's allowed to start, found, and operate a religious organization. Best case they get involved in politics or horde a boatload of cash in their walls, worst case they either are a doomsday cult or the whole thing is an excuse to **** children. The IRS already decides who is a church and who isn't. If you're not, you don't get the tax benefits that "separation of church and state" is supposed to prevent. The current deal with churches is that they will refrain from politics in exchange for the tax benefits. But many decry that as a violation of free speech. That's fine with me. A church can exercise its free speech rights, but then it should lose its tax benefits. They should not have it both ways. Doug 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted December 8, 2021 #50 Share Posted December 8, 2021 20 minutes ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Aztek Yes I do remember them and the odd thing is only the people that followed that god were affected and the rest of the world was fine during and after those events. maybe they were not supposed to, maybe it was a test, and they failed. book of job says Quote we will never have the capacity to comprehend all his ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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