Shoplifting and looting becoming more common

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

6 hours ago, Edumakated said:

There are legitimate food deserts in Chicago, but as you note, the issue is the associated cost of running a large grocery store in those areas is not sustainable due to the associated crime, poverty of residents, etc.  Stores are not going to willingly lose millions of dollars just because it makes them feel good...

No, generally speaking, stores are not willing to lose millions of dollars to make them feel good, but some will for a short while. 
Take a look at disney. They can't keep losing guests at disney world and disney land forever. 

[pellinore]

On 9/16/2023 at 4:28 AM, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Portland is once again, star of the day.

Retail Theft Forces Nike to Permanently Close Beloved Portland Location; The Portland location had the second-highest rate of shoplifting incidents in the city since 2019.

"Last week, Nike announced that it would permanently close its factory store in Portland, Oregon, due to ongoing theft. The Portland factory store first closed in October 2022, with no official statement aside from a message on the store's website stating "closed for the next 7 days." However, the store has remained closed and now, the company said it will shut its doors permanently."

People from that section of Portland will now be laid off. 

I have seen on Twitter videos of US stores being openly looted, either by large groups who intimidate staff, or singletons who just fill up rucksacks with perfumes etc.

Is this really what is going on or just a bit of hype?

If it is genuine, it shouldn't be conflated with racism or cops being too ready to shoot to kill. It is just a breakdown in law and order. It's connected with Populism. Populism is not the Will of the People, it is just "we can do what we want because we want it". Trump and Boris Johnson are prime exponents. When criminality is legitimized at the head of government, how are you going to expect crack heads and real losers to respect the law?

[DieChecker]

22 hours ago, Edumakated said:

There are legitimate food deserts in Chicago, but as you note, the issue is the associated cost of running a large grocery store in those areas is not sustainable due to the associated crime, poverty of residents, etc.  Stores are not going to willingly lose millions of dollars just because it makes them feel good...

I was simply pointing out if the stores are city operated, it's the taxpayer funding any stolen products.

I agree there are real food deserts in some major metro areas. A fact of the local populations own doing.

I don't know the answer, maybe tax funded is the way to go??

[DieChecker]

15 hours ago, pellinore said:

I have seen on Twitter videos of US stores being openly looted, either by large groups who intimidate staff, or singletons who just fill up rucksacks with perfumes etc.

Is this really what is going on or just a bit of hype?

Oh, it's real. Stores came out with "Don't confront" rules for their employees, because there's been so many lawsuits of shoplifters getting hurt when restrained, and winning millions in damages.

It's cheaper to let them steal, then face lawsuits because a robber got grabbed.

Thus, the robbers (not really shoplifters anymore) are brazen and just walk in with huge sacks and take whatever they think they can sell. 

Quote

If it is genuine, it shouldn't be conflated with racism or cops being too ready to shoot to kill. It is just a breakdown in law and order. It's connected with Populism. Populism is not the Will of the People, it is just "we can do what we want because we want it". Trump and Boris Johnson are prime exponents. When criminality is legitimized at the head of government, how are you going to expect crack heads and real losers to respect the law?

Does it need fixed from the top down, or bottom up? When we can't even stop people from stealing large screen TVs, what hope is there to stop a national level demagogue?

[DieChecker]

16 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Exactly.

This is the slow way for government to start taking over businesses. 
These fools will run the store(s) with no regard for how much it costs. Half the merchandise will be given away, they don't give a damm.

Which will... Drive MORE business from the area. Making things worse. So, they take over the hardware store, and the electronics store, and the car lots. And run them all into the ground. Massively raising taxes, and driving everyone in the middle class out into the suburbs. Horrible idea, if you ask me.

But what choice do the politicians have? The doom loop is closing, but they want to retain their government jobs, and perks.

[Edumakated]

8 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

I was simply pointing out if the stores are city operated, it's the taxpayer funding any stolen products.

I agree there are real food deserts in some major metro areas. A fact of the local populations own doing.

I don't know the answer, maybe tax funded is the way to go??

Long term the answer is to change the culture of dysfunction and crime that is prevalent in those neighborhoods.  

There is a market there for grocery stores, but none of the major chains have figured out how to operate one profitably.  I think a smaller store with more focused products along with strict security could possibly work.

[DieChecker]

12 minutes ago, Edumakated said:

Long term the answer is to change the culture of dysfunction and crime that is prevalent in those neighborhoods.  

There is a market there for grocery stores, but none of the major chains have figured out how to operate one profitably.  I think a smaller store with more focused products along with strict security could possibly work.

I've said in the past, I'm not a racist, but the inner city poverty subculture is out of control. It romanticizes drugs, crime, and violence. It's been getting worse slowly, but the pandemic shot the antisocial elements involved into overdrive. 

Not sure what can be done, but it's definitely a cultural issue.

Edit: Changing "black" to "poverty", because we see this everywhere, not just in black neighborhoods, though they seem to get the most media coverage.

Edited September 21 by DieChecker

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

On 9/20/2023 at 7:48 PM, pellinore said:

f it is genuine, it shouldn't be conflated with racism or cops being too ready to shoot to kill.

Agreed, and it is certainly not why I posted it. Crime is crime, and we have a lot of it.

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

9 hours ago, DieChecker said:

Which will... Drive MORE business from the area. Making things worse. So, they take over the hardware store, and the electronics store, and the car lots. And run them all into the ground. Massively raising taxes, and driving everyone in the middle class out into the suburbs. Horrible idea, if you ask me.

But what choice do the politicians have? The doom loop is closing, but they want to retain their government jobs, and perks.

I think you are right. The government can cover up the failure by doing the "rob peter to pay paul" but someday will be a day of reckoning, the way the Soviet Union had.

[itsnotoutthere]

 

[simplybill]

It’d be interesting to see estimates of the number of Cartel employees that are operating inside our US borders. It takes a lot of infrastructure to market and move that much product.

From therecoveryvillage.com, dated July 19, 2023:

“Illegal drugs in the United States create a huge black market industry, an estimated $200-$750 Billion a year, with the current decade seeing the largest per person drug usage per year in American history.”

https://www.therecoveryvillage.com/drug-addiction/drug-trafficking-by-the-numbers/

From news.yahoo.com, dated September 21, 2023:

“But how many people are on the payrolls of the Mexican cartels? Now researchers have come up with an estimate: 175,000. That figure, which would make the cartels the country’s fifth-largest employer, has steadily risen during the last decade, according to their study, which was published Thursday in the journal Science and relied on a variety of data to build a mathematical model of the workforce.”

https://news.yahoo.com/many-people-mexican-drug-cartels-180057725.html

[itsnotoutthere]

 

[itsnotoutthere]

 

[+Desertrat56]

On 9/22/2023 at 10:04 AM, simplybill said:

It’d be interesting to see estimates of the number of Cartel employees that are operating inside our US borders. It takes a lot of infrastructure to market and move that much product.

From therecoveryvillage.com, dated July 19, 2023:

“Illegal drugs in the United States create a huge black market industry, an estimated $200-$750 Billion a year, with the current decade seeing the largest per person drug usage per year in American history.”

https://www.therecoveryvillage.com/drug-addiction/drug-trafficking-by-the-numbers/

From news.yahoo.com, dated September 21, 2023:

“But how many people are on the payrolls of the Mexican cartels? Now researchers have come up with an estimate: 175,000. That figure, which would make the cartels the country’s fifth-largest employer, has steadily risen during the last decade, according to their study, which was published Thursday in the journal Science and relied on a variety of data to build a mathematical model of the workforce.”

https://news.yahoo.com/many-people-mexican-drug-cartels-180057725.html

It seems to me someone it trying to blame the cartels for ALL the illegal drugs in the country.  There are many non-cartel illegal drugs groups all over, local meth labs, prescription drugs that are stolen and sold on "the street", etc.   Not to mention, not all the cartels are based in Mexico.  There are south american drug and gun cartels operating all over the world as well.   Also, some illegal drugs come in from overseas.  I have read about certain drugs coming from china.    This issue is not as simple as we are led to believe.   

[WVK]

Target to close nine stores across four states because of theft and crime

https://www.startribune.com/theft-crime-spur-target-close-nine-stores-four-states-minneapols-san-francisco-portland-seattle-nyc/600307683/

[+and-then]

TODAY in Philly

Nothing counteracts injustice more than some new shoes.

Edited September 27 by and-then

[itsnotoutthere]

 

[DieChecker]

17 hours ago, WVK said:

Target to close nine stores across four states because of theft and crime

https://www.startribune.com/theft-crime-spur-target-close-nine-stores-four-states-minneapols-san-francisco-portland-seattle-nyc/600307683/

Apparently three in Portland.

https://katu.com/renderer/katu/amp/news/local/target-to-close-3-portland-stores-citing-ongoing-theft-safety-problems

Quote

Target is closing three of its locations in Portland, saying that theft and organized retail crime are “threatening the safety of our team and guests.”

Idiot city government let things get so out of control, because they wanted to be "tolerant", and "equitable".

[Bed of chaos]

14 hours ago, and-then said:

TODAY in Philly

Nothing counteracts injustice more than some new shoes.

I just watched similar videos (Twitter). The iPhone and liquor store were looted. Unsure what else.

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

7 hours ago, Bed of chaos said:

I just watched similar videos (Twitter). The iPhone and liquor store were looted. Unsure what else.

I saw that. There was an influencer called Meatball, and she called it all - shopping without money. Uh huh, 

LINK:  THEFT WOES Major retail CEOs warn of ‘dire’ shoplifting epidemic after $112b in losses causing chains to take drastic measures

The 2023 National Retail Security Survey found that theft-related losses increased from $93.9billion in 2021 to $112.1billion in 2022.

[F3SS]

3 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

shopping without money.

I heard somebody refer to it as social justice shopping. Thought that was funny and fitting.

[+and-then]

On 9/23/2023 at 12:35 PM, itsnotoutthere said:

 

When the day inevitably comes that Americans finally accept that there is no justice to be expected any longer, vigilantism will rise.  Those governments that caused it will try the hardest to suddenly crack down on the "law breakers".  IMO, they're going to get a damned stiff wake-up call on their delusions of control.

[pellinore]

21 minutes ago, and-then said:

When the day inevitably comes that Americans finally accept that there is no justice to be expected any longer, vigilantism will rise.  Those governments that caused it will try the hardest to suddenly crack down on the "law breakers".  IMO, they're going to get a damned stiff wake-up call on their delusions of control.

I think we in the UK watch your stores being looted (I find it hard to believe some of the videos on X where people openly fill up sacks with perfumes etc) in the same way as we allow thousands of asylum seekers to cross the Channel every month and land on our shores.

The thing is, no one, no one at all, has a solution to either problem. If there was a solution, we would use it.

Edited September 28 by pellinore

[DieChecker]

5 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

I saw that. There was an influencer called Meatball, and she called it all - shopping without money. Uh huh, 

LINK:  THEFT WOES Major retail CEOs warn of ‘dire’ shoplifting epidemic after $112b in losses causing chains to take drastic measures

The 2023 National Retail Security Survey found that theft-related losses increased from $93.9billion in 2021 to $112.1billion in 2022.

Apparently "meatball" was arrested and charged for inciting the robberies.

https://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/influencer-arrested-for-encouraging-looting-philly-mayor-said/3655312/

Quote

Dayjia Blackwell, known as "Meatball" online, was "livestreaming the whole thing, wound up with 12,000 followers and created, basically incited the riot," the mayor said. "She's in jail."

Blackwell was charged Wednesday with criminal conspiracy, criminal mischief, riot, and disorderly conduct among other charges, according to police.

 

[DieChecker]

Apparently 50+ were arrested, including some juveniles. 

https://www.fox29.com/news/philadelphia-looting-dozens-arrested-including-juveniles-after-stores-ransacked-across-the-city

Quote

Stanford estimated that the crowd of unruly crowd of looters in Center City grew to as many as 100 people. As of Wednesday afternoon, police say at least 52 people have been arrested, including three juveniles, in connection to the looting. Two firearms were also recovered during the arrests. 

Authorities on Wednesday shared a list of 30 people, including three juveniles, who were booked on charges related to Tuesday night riots:

Good. Catch and prosecute these idiots.