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Can the Sun’s 11-Year Cycle Explain Global Warming?


Manwon Lender
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The Earth’s global climate system fluctuates in 11-year and 3,5-year cycles find Yizhak Feliks, Justin Small, and Michael Ghil. The study was published in Climate Dynamics on July 15th. The 11-year near-periodicity recalls that of the solar cycle, which climate-skeptics for decades have argued plays a major role in global warming. But the fluctuations between the Earth’s climate system and the sun are out of sync, the study finds. The work, which is part of the European TiPES project coordinated from the University of Copenhagen thus refutes the climate skeptics’ claim of major solar effects on recent climate evolution.

Can the Sun’s 11-Year Cycle Explain Global Warming? (scitechdaily.com)

Global oscillatory modes in high-end climate modeling and reanalyzes was published 15 July 2021 below is the link to this Peer  Reviewed scientific journal: Global oscillatory modes in high-end climate modeling and reanalyses | SpringerLink

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It's more likely caused by much longer cycles. We are still in an ice age, which has about ninety thousand years of ice age periods, punctuated by 10,000 year warm interglacial periods like the one we are currently in.

The main cause of ice ages is connected to something called the Milankovitch cycle. The Milankovitch cycle refers to the collective effects of changes in the Earth’s movements on its climate over thousands of years. Very small changes in the Earth’s orbit shift the angle at which the Sun’s rays hit the Earth. While this may seem like a small thing, it actually has a huge impact.

 

Even small tilt changes of the Earth can change the planet’s temperature by several degrees. When the tilt is low, ice sheets grow and snow continues to accumulate. When the tilt is high, the ice sheets melt away. Since then the tilt has reached a maximum of 24.2 degrees (10,000 years ago), current the Earth’s tilt measures approximately 23.5 degrees — and as a result, large ice sheets are restricted to the polar areas.

Milankovitch_Variations.png Relationship of Earth’s orbit to periods of glaciation.

It’s not just the tilt — other factors about the Earth’s orbit can play a role. The three main orbital parameters are:

  • eccentricity (how circular the Earth’s orbit around the Sun); this varies with periods between 400,000 and 100,000 years.
  • obliquity (how tilted the Earth is with respect to its orbit); this varies with a period of around 40,000 years.
  • precession (changes between the distance of the Sun and the Earth in over the same season); this varies with a period of around 23,000 years and is particularly important.      ZME SCIENCE
Edited by Hammerclaw
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Short answer: No

Long answer: Folks need to stop making excuses to avoid doing what we all know we have to do but some people decide it's haaaaard and might require lifestyle changes and minor inconveniences and listening to people objectively smarter then the average republican. 

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12 minutes ago, Autochthon1990 said:

Short answer: No

Long answer: Folks need to stop making excuses to avoid doing what we all know we have to do but some people decide it's haaaaard and might require lifestyle changes and minor inconveniences and listening to people objectively smarter then the average republican. 

Well you can start doing your part today.

https://www.ovoenergy.com/blog/green/the-carbon-footprint-of-the-internet

Get off the internet and some on UM will be grateful.

Your whole existence is dependent on petroleum products and coal. So stop the f'n whining and remove your carbon footprint today.

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1 minute ago, Buzz_Light_Year said:

Well you can start doing your part today.

https://www.ovoenergy.com/blog/green/the-carbon-footprint-of-the-internet

Get off the internet and some on UM will be grateful.

Your whole existence is dependent on petroleum products and coal. So stop the f'n whining and remove your carbon footprint today.

Apple AirPods cost $159, but they can't pay taxes or decent wages to their Chinese factory workers! .. you SAID ON AN iPHONE.)GoTCHA. HEH POST CARS SHOULD HAVE SEAT BELTS YET YOU BOUGHT ONE. HYPOCRITE MUCH? OWNED. WE SHOULD IMPROVE SOCIETY SOMEWHAT. YET you PARTICIPATE IN SOCIETY. CURIOUS! I AM VERY INTELLIGENT BORS Matt Bors AirPods comics people cartoon text human behavior fiction comic book communication fictional character

 

Sit down, the adults are talking. 

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1 minute ago, Autochthon1990 said:

Apple AirPods cost $159, but they can't pay taxes or decent wages to their Chinese factory workers! .. you SAID ON AN iPHONE.)GoTCHA. HEH POST CARS SHOULD HAVE SEAT BELTS YET YOU BOUGHT ONE. HYPOCRITE MUCH? OWNED. WE SHOULD IMPROVE SOCIETY SOMEWHAT. YET you PARTICIPATE IN SOCIETY. CURIOUS! I AM VERY INTELLIGENT BORS Matt Bors AirPods comics people cartoon text human behavior fiction comic book communication fictional character

 

Sit down, the adults are talking. 

Nah all I see is your constant whining. Put up or shut up.

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1 minute ago, Hammerclaw said:

It's more likely caused by much longer cycles. We are still in an ice age, which has about ninety thousand years of ice age periods, punctuated by 10,000 year interglacial periods like the we are currently in.

The main cause of ice ages is connected to something called the Milankovitch cycle. The Milankovitch cycle refers to the collective effects of changes in the Earth’s movements on its climate over thousands of years. Very small changes in the Earth’s orbit shift the angle at which the Sun’s rays hit the Earth. While this may seem like a small thing, it actually has a huge impact.

 

Even small tilt changes of the Earth can change the planet’s temperature by several degrees. When the tilt is low, ice sheets grow and snow continues to accumulate. When the tilt is high, the ice sheets melt away. Since then the tilt has reached a maximum of 24.2 degrees (10,000 years ago), current the Earth’s tilt measures approximately 23.5 degrees — and as a result, large ice sheets are restricted to the polar areas.

Milankovitch_Variations.png Relationship of Earth’s orbit to periods of glaciation.

It’s not just the tilt — other factors about the Earth’s orbit can play a role. The three main orbital parameters are:

  • eccentricity (how circular the Earth’s orbit around the Sun); this varies with periods between 400,000 and 100,000 years.
  • obliquity (how tilted the Earth is with respect to its orbit); this varies with a period of around 40,000 years.
  • precession (changes between the distance of the Sun and the Earth in over the same season); this varies with a period of around 23,000 years and is particularly important.      ZME SCIENCE

Great post and I totally agree that the Earth axis tilt is a major fact in creating an ice or depending upon the angle of the shift a increase in global temperature gradient. You completely identified how the Earths rotational tilt effects global weather patterns and here is the fundamental theory that tilts like this occur.

""Earth’s latest ice age may have been caused by changes deep inside the planet. Based on evidence from the Pacific Ocean, including the position of the Hawaiian Islands, Rice University geophysicists have determined Earth shifted relative to its spin axis within the past 12 million years, which caused Greenland to move far enough toward the north pole to kick off the ice age that began about 3.2 million years ago. Their study in the journal Geophysical Research Letters is based on an analysis of fossil signatures from deep ocean sediments, the magnetic signature of oceanic crust and the position of the mantle “hot spot” that created the Hawaiian Islands. Co-authors Richard Gordon and Daniel Woodworth said the evidence suggests Earth spun steadily for millions of years before shifting relative to its spin axis, an effect geophysicists refer to as “true polar wander.”

""By volume, Earth is mostly mantle, a thick layer of solid rock that flows under intense pressure and heat. The mantle is covered by an interlocking puzzle of rocky tectonic plates that ride atop it, bumping and slipping against one another at seismically active boundaries. Hot spots, like the one beneath Hawaii, are plumes of hot solid rock that rise from deep within the mantle. Like any spinning object, Earth is subject to centrifugal force, which tugs on the planet’s fluid interior. At the equator, where this force is strongest, Earth is more than 26 miles larger in diameter than at the poles. Gordon said true polar wander may occur when dense, highly viscous bumps of mantle build up at latitudes away from the equator.""

""We think the dense anomalies in the mantle are like that little temporary pile, only the viscosities are much higher in the lower mantle. Like the syrup, it will eventually deform, but it takes a really, really long time to do so.”  Woodworth said the hot spot data from Hawaii provides some of the best evidence that true polar wander was what caused Earth’s poles to start moving 12 million years ago. Islands chains like the Hawaiians are formed when a tectonic plate moves across a hot spot. Gordon said, “It was only about a 3 degree shift, but it had the effect of taking the mantle under the tropical Pacific and moving it to the south, and at the same time, it was shifting Greenland and parts of Europe and North America to the north. That may have triggered what we call the ice age.”

""Earth is still in an ice age that began about 3.2 million years ago. Earth’s poles have been covered with ice throughout the age, and thick ice sheets periodically grow and recede from poles in cycles that have occurred more than 100 times. During these glacial cycles, ice has extended as far south as New York and Yellowstone National Park. Earth today is in an interglacial period in which ice has receded toward the poles. Gordon said true polar wander is not merely a change in the location of Earth’s magnetic poles. As the planet spins, it’s iron core produces a magnetic field with “north” and “south” poles near the spin axis. The polarity of this field flips several times every million years, and these changes in polarity are recorded in the magnetic signatures of rocks the world over.""

""The paleomagnetic record, which is often used to study the movement of tectonic plates across Earth’s surface, contains many instances of “apparent polar wander,” which tracks the motion of the spin axis and which includes the effects of both plate motion and true polar wander, Gordon said. He said Earth’s mantle is ever-changing as new material constantly cycles in and out from tectonic plates. The drawing down and recycling of plates via subduction provides a possible explanation for the highly viscous mantle anomalies that probably cause true polar wander. He and Woodworth are working with colleagues is to extend their analysis, both from 12 million years ago to the present as well as further into the past than the 48-million-year start date in the newly published study.""

https://news2.rice.edu/2018/11/19/true-polar-wander-may-have-caused-ice-age-2/

Paleolatitude of the Hawaiian Hot Spot Since 48 Ma: Evidence for a Mid-Cenozoic True Polar Stillstand Followed by Late Cenozoic True Polar Wander Coincident With Northern Hemisphere Glaciation  https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2018GL080787

Hot spot at Hawaii? Not so fast  https://news2.rice.edu/2017/08/18/hot-spot-at-hawaii-not-so-fast/

The influence of true polar wander on glacial inception in North America  https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0012821X1630749X

 

 

 

 

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4.2 billion years ago, the Mars-sized planet Theia, impacted the Earth, splashing it with her oceans and birthing her child, Selene, in our sky. Gigantic chunks of Theia's core still reside deep in Earth's crust.

Blobs of dense rock could be remnants of Theia, study finds (msn.com)

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17 hours ago, Autochthon1990 said:

Short answer: No

Long answer: Folks need to stop making excuses to avoid doing what we all know we have to do but some people decide it's haaaaard and might require lifestyle changes and minor inconveniences and listening to people objectively smarter then the average republican. 

Well, that rules you out, Pippin!:lol:

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On 11/25/2021 at 2:12 PM, Manwon Lender said:

Great post and I totally agree that the Earth axis tilt is a major fact in creating an ice or depending upon the angle of the shift a increase in global temperature gradient. You completely identified how the Earths rotational tilt effects global weather patterns and here is the fundamental theory that tilts like this occur.

See Milankovitch Cycles for more information on how axial tilt, orbital eccentricity and orbital change influence climate.

Can the Solar Cycle influence climate?  No.  The maximum temperature fluctuation associated with the Solar Cycle is 0.3C over an 11-year period.  Average that over 30 years and you get a 0.02C fluctuation.

Mountain glaciers in western US extended as far south as southern Colorado.  Rock glaciers extended into New Mexico.

Doug

Edited by Doug1066
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5 hours ago, Doug1066 said:

See Milankovitch Cycles for more information on how axial tilt, orbital eccentricity and orbital change influence climate.

Can the Solar Cycle influence climate?  No.  The maximum temperature fluctuation associated with the Solar Cycle is 0.3C over an 11-year period.  Average that over 30 years and you get a 0.02C fluctuation.

Mountain glaciers in western US extended as far south as southern Colorado.  Rock glaciers extended into New Mexico.

Doug

Hello Doug I think you misinterpreted what I believe occurred that created the Ice Age were technically are still in. See  post 7 in this thread or read the Peer Reviewed Paper below. I believe that True Polar Wander could be part of the current problem that is creating some of our climate issues we are experiencing today. Now please don't understand me I also believe that Man Made Climate change is also real and very serious matter. While I certainly don't have the knowledge that many here have concerning this subject, including you I do have a limited understanding of has the major of effects on our Earths climate. 

Paleolatitude of the Hawaiian Hot Spot Since 48 Ma: Evidence for a Mid-Cenozoic True Polar Stillstand Followed by Late Cenozoic True Polar Wander Coincident With Northern Hemisphere Glaciation

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2018GL080787

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2 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

Hello Doug I think you misinterpreted what I believe occurred that created the Ice Age were technically are still in. See  post 7 in this thread or read the Peer Reviewed Paper below. I believe that True Polar Wander could be part of the current problem that is creating some of our climate issues we are experiencing today. Now please don't understand me I also believe that Man Made Climate change is also real and very serious matter. While I certainly don't have the knowledge that many here have concerning this subject, including you I do have a limited understanding of has the major of effects on our Earths climate. 

Paleolatitude of the Hawaiian Hot Spot Since 48 Ma: Evidence for a Mid-Cenozoic True Polar Stillstand Followed by Late Cenozoic True Polar Wander Coincident With Northern Hemisphere Glaciation

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2018GL080787

The topic is whether the Solar Cycle affects climate change.  Because the Solar Cycle is  a short-term cycle, its results average out to almost nothing.

I agree that a Mid-Cenozoic True Polar Standstill could have changed earth's climate and that a small residual effect may still be with us, but the topic is the Solar Cycle.

Besides, climate change in the context of CO2 pollution is a product of the Industrial Revolution and OUR climate has only been warming since 1907.

Doug

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1 minute ago, Doug1066 said:

The topic is whether the Solar Cycle affects climate change.  Because the Solar Cycle is  a short-term cycle, its results average out to almost nothing.

I agree that a Mid-Cenozoic True Polar Standstill could have changed earth's climate and that a small residual effect may still be with us, but the topic is the Solar Cycle.

Doug

That's the original topic of the thread, but after discussing it with other members it shifted in post #6 and do to my response in post #7. I didn't disagree with your comments in post #10 I was only making clear the conversation had changed. To go further I would like to say a similar event to the Mid-Cenozoic True Polar Shift may be occurring again. 

My point is simply with the accelerated rate that our North and South Poles are moving currently which is very dramatic along with manmade climate change, the Earth may also be heading for another “Laschamps excursion” even though according to Academia its far to soon based upon the last one that occurred. The last time this occurred was only 42,000 years ago, and this pole shift event is thought to have lasted about 800 years after which the Earth’s magnetic field corrected itself “by flipping backwards.” This alone could have an almost apocalyptic effect on the Earths weather not to even mention the other dramatic effects it will have in so many other ways. When I consider this I wonder what our Homo Sapien Ancestors  were thinking when this occurred, it must have put the fear of their Gods into them. But they did survive the event and the human species continued on. I sometimes wonder if that event could have been passed down through the ages in a verbal history and if it could account for some of the biblically catastrophes like the Great Flood and other similar events. Because a Laschamps excursion could certainly cause those events to occur. But, lets face it if such an event occurs today the effects will so much more destructive, cities will be leveled and so on it could set mankind back many many hundreds of years or simple create a form of the dark ages!

Peace Doug!!

Rapid geomagnetic changes inferred from Earth observations and numerical simulations; Rapid geomagnetic changes inferred from Earth observations and numerical simulations | Nature Communications

If you want to stay on the original topic here is a Peer Reviewed Journal that may interest you.

Solar and Anthropogenic Influences on Climate: Regression Analysis and Tentative Predictions: Climate | Free Full-Text | Solar and Anthropogenic Influences on Climate: Regression Analysis and Tentative Predictions (mdpi.com)

 

 

 

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On 11/26/2021 at 4:35 PM, Hammerclaw said:

4.2 billion years ago, the Mars-sized planet Theia, impacted the Earth, splashing it with her oceans and birthing her child, Selene, in our sky. Gigantic chunks of Theia's core still reside deep in Earth's crust.

Blobs of dense rock could be remnants of Theia, study finds (msn.com)

Yes a planet named Theia did impact the earth but the most dramatic thing that occurred from that impact was the creation of our Moon, not suppling the Earths water, the Earth water come from the sources listed below!

Here is a Summery from a recent Peer Reviewed Journal that explains the process in detail!

People have long had curiosity in the origin of Earth's water (equivalently hydrogen). Solar nebula has been given the least attention among existing theories, although it was the predominating reservoir of hydrogen in our early solar system. Here we present a first model for Earth's water origin that quantifies contribution from the solar nebula in addition to that from chondrites, the primary building blocks of Earth. The model considers dissolution of nebular hydrogen into the early Earth's magma oceans and reaction between hydrogen and iron droplets within the magma ocean. Such processes not only delivered countless hydrogen atoms from the mantle to the core but also generated an appreciable difference in hydrogen isotopic composition (2H/1H ratio) between the mantle and core. Fitting the model to current knowledge about Earth's hydrogen produces best combinations of nebular and chondritic contributions to Earth's water. We find that nearly one out of every 100 water molecules on Earth came from the solar nebula. Our planet hides majority of its water inside, with roughly two oceans in the mantle and four to five oceans in the core. These results suggest inevitable formation of water on sufficiently large rocky planets in extrasolar systems.

Here is the link to the Peer reviewed Journal this information comes from, its a great read and worth the time:

Origin of Earth's Water: Chondritic Inheritance Plus Nebular Ingassing and Storage of Hydrogen in the Core - Wu - 2018 - Journal of Geophysical Research: Planets - Wiley Online Library

Take care my friend!!

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6 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

Yes a planet named Theia did impact the earth but the most dramatic thing that occurred from that impact was the creation of our Moon, not suppling the Earths water, the Earth water come from the sources listed below!

Here is a Summery from a recent Peer Reviewed Journal that explains the process in detail!

People have long had curiosity in the origin of Earth's water (equivalently hydrogen). Solar nebula has been given the least attention among existing theories, although it was the predominating reservoir of hydrogen in our early solar system. Here we present a first model for Earth's water origin that quantifies contribution from the solar nebula in addition to that from chondrites, the primary building blocks of Earth. The model considers dissolution of nebular hydrogen into the early Earth's magma oceans and reaction between hydrogen and iron droplets within the magma ocean. Such processes not only delivered countless hydrogen atoms from the mantle to the core but also generated an appreciable difference in hydrogen isotopic composition (2H/1H ratio) between the mantle and core. Fitting the model to current knowledge about Earth's hydrogen produces best combinations of nebular and chondritic contributions to Earth's water. We find that nearly one out of every 100 water molecules on Earth came from the solar nebula. Our planet hides majority of its water inside, with roughly two oceans in the mantle and four to five oceans in the core. These results suggest inevitable formation of water on sufficiently large rocky planets in extrasolar systems.

Here is the link to the Peer reviewed Journal this information comes from, its a great read and worth the time:

Origin of Earth's Water: Chondritic Inheritance Plus Nebular Ingassing and Storage of Hydrogen in the Core - Wu - 2018 - Journal of Geophysical Research: Planets - Wiley Online Library

Take care my friend!!

So, you know Theia was completely waterless and didn't add any, impacting Earth? Since any rocky Terrestrial type planet in the inner solar system had water, at that point in time even, perchance, oceans, I feel my use of poetic license was justified.:P

Water Present on All Rocky Planets, Martian Meteorite Study Suggests | Sci-News.com

Edited by Hammerclaw
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51 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

So, you know Theia was completely waterless and didn't add any, impacting Earth? Since any rocky Terrestrial type planet in the inner solar system had water, at that point in time even, perchance, oceans, I feel my use of poetic license was justified.:P

Water Present on All Rocky Planets, Martian Meteorite Study Suggests | Sci-News.com

You can use any license you choose but if you had read the Peer Reviewed Journal I provided you would understand why I made that comment which is based upon the Chemical Composition of Earths water. But just as importantly Theia impacted Earth approximately  4.5 Billion Years ago, and that should be a very significant date for you because that is approximately the same time our Sun ignited and our planets and Solar System were formed. With the heat generated by that process and the time collision occurred their were no water covered Planets or Proto-planets ( Theia ) in our Solar system.  

Remains of impact that created the Moon may lie deep within Earth https://www.science.org/content/article/remains-impact-created-moon-may-lie-deep-within-earth

Oh and by the way, your link doesn't apply to the time when a Sun ignites and planets begin forming from the dust and debris left over from the Nebula that our Solar System was created from, 

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24 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

You can use any license you choose but if you had read the Peer Reviewed Journal I provided you would understand why I made that comment which is based upon the Chemical Composition of Earths water. But just as importantly Theia impacted Earth approximately  4.5 Billion Years ago, and that should be a very significant date for you because that is approximately the same time our Sun ignited and our planets and Solar System were formed. With the heat generated by that process and the time collision occurred their were no water covered Planets or Proto-planets ( Theia ) in our Solar system.  

Remains of impact that created the Moon may lie deep within Earth https://www.science.org/content/article/remains-impact-created-moon-may-lie-deep-within-earth

Oh and by the way, your link doesn't apply to the time when a Sun ignites and planets begin forming from the dust and debris left over from the Nebula that our Solar System was created from, 

Yes, really ought to fully research a topic before you decide you're expert enough to dispute it with someone else.

Did Theia Bring Water To The Earth? | A Moment of Science - Indiana Public Media

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8 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

Yes, really ought to fully research a topic before you decide you're expert enough to dispute it with someone else.

Did Theia Bring Water To The Earth? | A Moment of Science - Indiana Public Media

At least I read the article and there is not real proof there, you didn't bother to read the paper I provided you with which is a Scientific Journal not some article that isn't Peer reviewed please have the last word both discussions I will not longer to respond. 

Dont Know what is wrong, but your obviously distressed about something and I am sorry to hear that. 

Have great night

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7 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

At least I read the article and there is not real proof there, you didn't bother to read the paper I provided you with which is a Scientific Journal not some article that isn't Peer reviewed please have the last word both discussions I will not longer to respond. 

Dont Know what is wrong, but your obviously distressed about something and I am sorry to hear that. 

Have great night

Good night to you too, Peter.

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See the source image

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43 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

See the source image

Finally you admit, thank you!:lol:

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56 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

Finally you admit, thank you!:lol:

Well, someone had to do it for you!:tu:

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15 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

 

There are about 20 chronologies that date back 2000 years.  Some New Zealanders were working on one that could reach 60,000, but last time I checked, they had a long way to go.  So I conclude that the trees listed here are individual trees in free-floating chronologies, which means that the central estimate of the chronology's age is based on radiocarbon, not ring counts.  And that introduces all the inherent errors related to radiocarbon.  Still, an error of 1500 or so years at 42,000 YBP is not bad.

The current state of dendrochronology is such that if you can produce a 1000-year chronology, you can publish a paper on it.  In Europe there are two chronologies that reach deep into the Ice Age (17,000 YBP).  Richard Guyette at the University of Missouri is trying to produce a chronology for the entire Holocene.  I have made a proposal for a 1000-year shinnery oak chronology from western Oklahoma and the Texas Panhandle - a 1000-year chronology from the Great Plains!

 

Tree ring dating and Egyptian history suggest that Noah's Flood probably happened about 5000 YBP.  There is a climate disturbance shown in tree rings in 2806 BC.  This corresponds with a major flood event in Egypt during which the world's first earth-fill dam washed out; its ruins are still there.  There have been four epic floods in the Tigris-Euphrates valley since the Ice Age.  The stories could have come from any of them.

Doug

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3 hours ago, Doug1066 said:

There are about 20 chronologies that date back 2000 years.  Some New Zealanders were working on one that could reach 60,000, but last time I checked, they had a long way to go.  So I conclude that the trees listed here are individual trees in free-floating chronologies, which means that the central estimate of the chronology's age is based on radiocarbon, not ring counts.  And that introduces all the inherent errors related to radiocarbon.  Still, an error of 1500 or so years at 42,000 YBP is not bad.

The current state of dendrochronology is such that if you can produce a 1000-year chronology, you can publish a paper on it.  In Europe there are two chronologies that reach deep into the Ice Age (17,000 YBP).  Richard Guyette at the University of Missouri is trying to produce a chronology for the entire Holocene.  I have made a proposal for a 1000-year shinnery oak chronology from western Oklahoma and the Texas Panhandle - a 1000-year chronology from the Great Plains!

 

Tree ring dating and Egyptian history suggest that Noah's Flood probably happened about 5000 YBP.  There is a climate disturbance shown in tree rings in 2806 BC.  This corresponds with a major flood event in Egypt during which the world's first earth-fill dam washed out; its ruins are still there.  There have been four epic floods in the Tigris-Euphrates valley since the Ice Age.  The stories could have come from any of them.

Doug

Doug thank you, for the information I appreciate the time you have taken to discuss and to exclude some of the inaccurate information and claims it's a very interesting topic I have been looking into but I lack the knowledge you do on the subject. I would appreciate it if you would indulge me, and talk about the complete Pole reversal that occurred 42,000 years ago. In addition to the current major True Polar wander event that occurring now at this moment. Well, scratch that, I will start a thread and it can be discuses there.

Doug, you have been very helpful and I appreciate it, thank you and I would appreciate your participation in the new thread I am going start.:tu:

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39 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

In addition to the current major True Polar wander event that occurring now at this moment.

The earth's magnetic north pole is now over the Arctic Ocean and continuing to track northwest.  I guess you could call this True Polar Wander, but it is only 1% of that shown in the study.  Something is going on with the earth's magnetic field, but I don't think anybody can yet say for sure what it is.

I really don't know anything about the 42,000 YBP Pole Reversal.  You can read the paper as well as I can.

 

I have been studying the Chandler Wobble.  It seems to be recorded in tree rings and so must have something to do with weather.  It's a tiny wobble.  It has two loops, one about 75m long and a second one about 150m long both over a 7-year period.  It is small enough that its period is re-set by large earthquakes.  It seems incongruous that a wobble so small could affect weather/climate, but it seems to.  And if it does, an equally-small period cycle might also affect climate.

Doug

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