School shooting Michigan

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

Hang on - he’s 15! Why the hell is he being charged as an adult?

[acidhead]

1 minute ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Hang on - he’s 15! Why the hell is he being charged as an adult?

White privilege.

[Buzz_Light_Year]

10 minutes ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Hang on - he’s 15! Why the hell is he being charged as an adult?

There's no mandatory age cutoff and depends on the circumstances of the crime. The youngest tried as adults were 12 and 13 because they planned the killing.

Edited December 13, 2021 by Buzz_Light_Year

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

7 minutes ago, Buzz_Light_Year said:

There's no mandatory age cutoff and depends on the circumstances of the crime. The youngest tried as adults were 12 and 13 because they planned the killing.

Then give him a scotch while he’s serving his time.

[+susieice]

Crumbly pleaded guilty to all counts today in court.

https://nypost.com/2022/10/24/ethan-crumbley-admits-murdering-4-in-oxford-school-shooting/

https://www.wfmz.com/news/michigan-teen-pleads-guilty-to-fatal-school-shooting/article_528d9071-1b4b-5c9f-a555-03424d5f8545.html

The prosecutor's office said no deals were made ahead of Monday's plea. A first-degree murder conviction typically brings an automatic life prison sentence in Michigan, but teenagers are entitled to a hearing where their lawyer can argue for a shorter term and an opportunity for parole.

The teenager withdrew his intent to pursue an insanity defense, and repeatedly acknowledged under questioning by Oakland County Circuit Court Judge Kwame Rowe that he understands the potential penalties.

His parents, James and Jennifer Crumbley, are jailed on charges of involuntary manslaughter, accused of making the gun accessible to their son and ignoring his need for mental health treatment. Ethan Crumbley's lawyer, Paulette Michel Loftin, said it's possible he could be called upon to testify against them. She said they're under a no-contact order, and he has not spoken to his parents.

Ethan Crumbley admitted under questioning Monday that his own money was used to purchase the gun, which his father bought for him on Nov. 26, a few days before the shooting. He also said the gun was “not locked” in a container or safe the morning he took it to the school.

Edited October 24, 2022 by susieice

[+susieice]

It took a while to find this thread, but Ethan's mother is finally now in court to face her charges. Ethan will not testify at her trial. She is facing involuntary manslaughter charges for her part in obtaining her son's gun and ignoring her son's mental issues. According to what was presented in court, he had serious ones. Her husband also faces charges. This is the first time the parents of a school shooter have been held responsible. It's in this thread how they attempted to avoid arrest.

Prosecutor uses texts to try to show mom of school shooter cared more about horses than son (msn.com)

Jennifer Crumbley, 45, is on trial for involuntary manslaughter, the first time parents have been charged in a U.S. mass school shooting. She and her husband are accused of contributing to the deaths at Oxford High School by neglecting their son's mental issues and making a gun accessible at home.

In April 2021, seven months before the school attack, Ethan Crumbley told a friend that he was “mentally and physically dying.” He said he asked his father to take him to a doctor but was told to “suck it up.”

The 17-year-old was sentenced to life in prison in December after he pleaded guilty to murder, terrorism and other crimes. Ethan Crumbley was 15 at the time of the shooting.

James Crumbley faces trial on involuntary manslaughter charges in March.

[+susieice]

Some testimony from the mother's trial.

Watch replay: New testimony in Jennifer Crumbley involuntary manslaughter trial (msn.com)

[+susieice]

The jury has the case now and is in deliberations.

Jurors conclude first day of deliberations in manslaughter trial of Jennifer Crumbley, mother of Michigan school shooter | CNN

[+susieice]

Breaking now. The jury has found Jennifer Crumbley guilty. This is going to be appealed but it is the first time a parent has been held accountable for their child access to a weapon used in a school shooting. 

Jury finds Jennifer Crumbley guilty of involuntary manslaughter in son's school shooting - ABC News (go.com)

In a dayslong trial, prosecutors presented damning evidence of the Crumbley parents -- who bought their son the gun used in the shooting -- failing to respond to warning signs exhibited by the shooter prior to the attack.

Jury finds Jennifer Crumbley guilty of four counts of involuntary manslaughter (msn.com)

 A jury has found Jennifer Crumbley, the mother of the Oxford High School shooter, guilty of all four counts of involuntary manslaughter. 

Jennifer Crumbley will be sentenced on April 9.

Jury deliberations, which lasted 11 hours, began Monday after a week-long trial to determine if the mother bears any responsibility for the Oxford High School shooting, where her son killed four students, Justin Shilling, Madisyn Baldwin, Tate Myre, and Hana St. Juliana, and injured seven other people on Nov. 30, 2021.

The jury foreperson told CBS News Detroit's Andres Gutierrez that one factor that the jury focused on was that Jennifer Crumbley was the last adult with the gun before her son used it in the mass shooting. 

Edited February 6 by susieice

[+OverSword]

Quote

 

Jennifer Crumbley was found guilty of four counts of manslaughter Tuesday — the first parent in the US to be charged over a mass school shooting committed by their child.

Crumbley, a 45-year-old marketing director, was convicted over her role in the Nov. 30, 2021, mass shooting carried out by her son, Ethan Crumbley, at Oxford High School that left four students dead alongside six others and a teacher wounded.

 

Link

[acidhead]

2 hours ago, susieice said:

Breaking now. The jury has found Jennifer Crumbley guilty. This is going to be appealed but it is the first time a parent has been held accountable for their child access to a weapon used in a school shooting. 

White privilege 

[+susieice]

Father James Crumbley's trial began today with jury selection. He bought the gun his son used to shoot his classmates.

James Crumbley defense attorney irks prosecutor as jury selection starts (msn.com)

In a tactic that irked the prosecutor, James Crumbley's lawyer grilled prospective jurors about the key issues in the historic case that seeks to hold a father responsible for a deadly school shooting carried out by his son.

On the first day of jury selection in Crumbley's involuntary manslaughter trial, defense attorney Mariell Lehman zeroed in on perhaps the most damning allegation in the case: that her client gifted his troubled son a gun — the same weapon the teenager used to murder four students at Oxford High School in 2021.

Lehman also zeroed in on the issue that has captured international attention: parenting.

Lehman also got into the issue of what it means to intentionally give someone access to something versus passive access. The prosecution has alleged that James Crumbley gave his son easy access to the gun, though the father has denied that, maintaining it was hidden unloaded in an armoire and the bullets were stored in a separate drawer.

[Doug1066]

On 11/30/2021 at 8:30 PM, Scholar4Truth said:

Thoughts with the families.

Thoughts and prayers won't stop the next one.  We need stronger medicine.

Doug

[Doug1066]

On 3/5/2024 at 5:49 PM, susieice said:

Father James Crumbley's trial began today with jury selection. He bought the gun his son used to shoot his classmates.

James Crumbley defense attorney irks prosecutor as jury selection starts (msn.com)

In a tactic that irked the prosecutor, James Crumbley's lawyer grilled prospective jurors about the key issues in the historic case that seeks to hold a father responsible for a deadly school shooting carried out by his son.

On the first day of jury selection in Crumbley's involuntary manslaughter trial, defense attorney Mariell Lehman zeroed in on perhaps the most damning allegation in the case: that her client gifted his troubled son a gun — the same weapon the teenager used to murder four students at Oxford High School in 2021.

Lehman also zeroed in on the issue that has captured international attention: parenting.

Lehman also got into the issue of what it means to intentionally give someone access to something versus passive access. The prosecution has alleged that James Crumbley gave his son easy access to the gun, though the father has denied that, maintaining it was hidden unloaded in an armoire and the bullets were stored in a separate drawer.

Mrs. Crumbley has already been tried and found guilty.

Doug

[+susieice]

Testimony in the father's second day on trial. Good read. The jury was dismissed Friday afternoon for the weekend.

James Crumbley involuntary manslaughter trial, Day 2: Watch replay (msn.com)

[+susieice]

6 hours ago, Doug1066 said:

Mrs. Crumbley has already been tried and found guilty.

Doug

Look a few posts up.

 

[+susieice]

His defense just gave their final arguments and the state will now give their rebuttal. Then it goes to the jury. It's live on Court TV.

[+Link of Hyrule]

Watching this right now, if anyone's interested in a detailed look at how the first three days went: 

 

[+susieice]

The verdict was reached last night. James Crumbley has been found guilty.

James Crumbley convicted of involuntary manslaughter over son's school shooting (msn.com)

A jury has convicted James Crumbley of involuntary manslaughter over his role in his son's 2021 school shooting at Oxford High School in Michigan.

Jurors reached the verdict Thursday evening after deliberating over two days. He was found guilty on all four counts of involuntary manslaughter.

Prosecutors argued that James Crumbley could have prevented the shooting by securing the gun used in the attack and preventing his son's access to it. He is also accused of failing to get his son help after he displayed warning signs, including violent drawings that were found on a math test the morning of the shooting.

 

 

[itsnotoutthere]

Happened here too, but not much MSM coverage ...weird :-

 

Edited March 15 by itsnotoutthere

[+susieice]

3 hours ago, itsnotoutthere said:

Happened here too, but not much MSM coverage ...weird :-

 

They are covering it. It's been on Philadelphia news of course. That's how I heard about it. There's been a 3rd arrest and a 4th suspect is still being sought.

Philadelphia mass shooting: 8 Northeast High School students shot at SEPTA bus stop at Rising Sun and Cottman in Burholme - 6abc Philadelphia

3 of 4 suspects arrested in Philadelphia bus stop shooting that injured 8 teens (nbcnews.com)

[+susieice]

On 3/15/2024 at 10:39 AM, itsnotoutthere said:

Happened here too, but not much MSM coverage ...weird :-

 

 

On 3/15/2024 at 2:33 PM, susieice said:

They are covering it. It's been on Philadelphia news of course. That's how I heard about it. There's been a 3rd arrest and a 4th suspect is still being sought.

Philadelphia mass shooting: 8 Northeast High School students shot at SEPTA bus stop at Rising Sun and Cottman in Burholme - 6abc Philadelphia

3 of 4 suspects arrested in Philadelphia bus stop shooting that injured 8 teens (nbcnews.com)

The 4th suspect has been taken into custody in Virginia. He's 17 yrs old. The other three were 19, 19 and 18. The news tonight said the four are suspected of being involved in other shootings include two in which the victims died. This article lists one of them.

Philadelphia mass shooting: Asir Boone taken into custody in Alexandria, Virginia after mass shooting at SEPTA bus stop - 6abc Philadelphia

The injured students ranged between the ages of 15 and 17. One of the victims, a 16-year-old boy, was shot nine times and had to be hospitalized in critical condition. Police say he was the intended target.

All of the victims are now in stable condition.

Police have said all along they are still working to see if the bus stop shooting is connected to the killing of 17-year-old Imhotep Charter High School student Dayemen Taylor.

Taylor was shot on March 4 while waiting at a SEPTA bus stop in Ogontz. Two other students and two bus passengers were also injured.

[+susieice]

Crumbley's parents have been sentenced to 10-15 years.

Parents of Michigan school shooter receive historic sentences of 10 to 15 years (msn.com)

"Parents are not expected to be psychic, but these convictions are not about poor parenting. These convictions confirm repeated acts, or lack of acts, that could have halted an oncoming runaway train -- about repeatedly ignoring things that would make a reasonable person feel the hair on the back of their neck," Matthews said.

"Guidelines in this manner do not capture of the catastrophic impact of the acts or in the action. And in these matters, the guidelines do not take into account the complete lack of insight both defendants have for their behavior to this very day," Matthews said.

The parents have already served 858 days in jail while awaiting trial, which will be deducted from their sentence. They have also been instructed to have no contact with the families of the victims.

[Edumakated]

On 3/15/2024 at 1:33 PM, susieice said:

They are covering it. It's been on Philadelphia news of course. That's how I heard about it. There's been a 3rd arrest and a 4th suspect is still being sought.

Philadelphia mass shooting: 8 Northeast High School students shot at SEPTA bus stop at Rising Sun and Cottman in Burholme - 6abc Philadelphia

3 of 4 suspects arrested in Philadelphia bus stop shooting that injured 8 teens (nbcnews.com)

It doesn't fit the narrative.  It is a school shooting in the technical sense in that it involved students, but it was really just thugs shooting at another thug.  These types of shootings happen all the time.

We had two in Chicago last month that didn't really get much coverage outside of Chicago.  The first resulted in two teens being killed as they left a school in downtown Chicago.  A car pulled up and shooters hopped out and smoked them in broad daylight.  A 15 and 17 year old.  There is a video of the shooting and one of them bleeding out on sidewalk.

The other was similar where a kid was gunned down walking home from school.  Target was probably involved in some street beef and his rivals pulled up and gunned him down.

The sad thing is these types of shootings are often over nothing but egos.  Someone was insulted on Facebook or some other nonsense.  Some group/gang of teens doesn't like some other group/gang of teens.  I can't think of anyone I hated so much when I was 16 or 17 that required me being shot at or needing to shoot someone.

Heck, most of the shootings here in Chicago involve teenagers.  14 and 15 year olds often.

[+susieice]

There's shootings everyday in Philadelphia too. There's one right up above my post. Very often done by 13-16 yr olds, but they don't involve a history of drawings and plans and appeals to parents for help. This set of parents were sentenced because of all the signs and pleas for help they ignored from their son. Even Ethan said they ignored him when he asked for help. A very sad and real case of parental neglect. The school tried to send him home only hours before the shootings because of his drawings and the parents refused to take him. They both knew their son was seriously disturbed. When they heard about the shootings, dad went home to check for the gun and called 911 saying it was missing and he thought it was his son that did it. Mom texted him not to do it. The parents of the 4 victims gave impact statements at the sentencing hearing. The court took into account the hundreds of other people that were impacted by their neglect. The school was previously mentioned as an intended target like so many other school shootings. Not an afterschool fight or kids out at night.

Edited April 10 by susieice