Dr Robert Malone interview on Joe Rogan podcast

[el midgetron]

Masks primarily function to prevent your germs from being blown all over. This is why surgeons where them, to protect the person being operated on, not themselves, Unless you have a properly worn N95 mask, wearing a mask isn’t going to do much to protect you from the virus. 
 

The problem with the mosquitoe-chain link fence analogy is that no one is suggesting you be required to build chain link fences to reduce 5% of the number of mosquitoes in your yard because that’s really stupid, It’s the same thing with masks. Telling people to wear a mask when it only offers them 5% more protection isn’t going to convince many people to mask up and we don’t have the social cohesiveness for people to wear a mask out of concern for the other guy. 
 

I wear a mask whenever I go into public facilities and am kind of annoyed by how few people wear them here. However, I am also not a big fan of my 9 year old son being required to wear one in school. Masks are 100% effective at preventing smiles, are very cumbersome to communication and unless kept clean can introduce bacteria and viruses to your respiratory system. 
 

So far nothing we have tried seems to have done anything to prevent the spread of the virus. Delay it? Maybe. Prevent it? No. Two years into our fight against the virus and it’s the worst it’s ever been, at least that’s what they tell us. Shutting down the economy, keeping our kids home from school, wearing masks, abandoning grandma, getting vaccinated twice & boosted and yet the virus is now worse than it’s ever been??? WTF??? Considering all those preventative measures and where they have gotten us, does it make sense why people don’t see how 5% more protecting from a mask is going to make a difference?

[RavenHawk]

 

4 hours ago, Liquid Gardens said:

And the overwrought opposition to them is nothing more than firm evidence how effective right wing propaganda is to the unskeptical.

It’s overwrought because our individual rights are being trampled by a tyrannical regime.  Americans naturally offer resistance.  The evidence shows that those like you, let rightwing propaganda live rent free in you heads.  if you are meaning that the facts don’t affect the non-skeptical, then the non-skeptical are that 30% in Mass Formation Psychosis that carry the party line and will not change their mind no matter of the facts.

 

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Which has resulted in some of the deadliest plagues in history, go on.

That’s basically what it means to have a symbiotic relationship.  The fact is that man has survived and lived on.  With a 98+% survivability rate, covid is nowhere close to the level of lethality of these deadliest plagues.  Seems like Chicken Little and the Boy who cried Wolf are running this country.

 

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I have only one very simple thought experiment.  Let's say someone is wearing a mask that fogs up their glasses and allows them to still smell things and smoke and all that.  Now that person sneezes.  Is it your scientific theory that the same amount of virus was just propelled out compared to if there was no mask? 

That’s not much of a thought experiment.  It’s more gibberish.  If I'm about to sneeze or cough, I tend to remove my mask and use my hand, elbow, a handkerchief, etc (not someone's face).  The same amount is propelled out no matter the status of a mask.  A mask only redirects what's expelled.  The fact is that masks do not effectively stop covid from expelling from a person.  I really doubt that most people go around coughing and sneezing in people’s faces with every breath.  Yes, I think it gross when someone does spew spittle in someone's face and I wish they wouldn't, but we have a system more than capable of dealing with it for the majority of the population.  Did you watch the mask clip?  If you are close enough to a person to be able to spew spittle in someone’s face, then being masked, you are close enough for aerosol to immerse that person’s face.

 

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You understand that most virus material we expel through our nose and mouth is initially attached to larger usually moist particles?

And you would be incorrect.  covid molecules are generally in aerosol form.  On occasion, they will stick to larger particles.

 

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You seem to be drifting towards the same fallacious reasoning that others randomly invoke: things are either perfect/"guaranteed", or they are worthless.   

I’m not the one drifting.  Could it be that things are worthless because they *ARE* worthless?  It’s not a matter of it being perfect or guaranteed, but is the trade off worth it?  If you want perfect and guaranteed, then acquire natural immunity, live a healthy lifestyle, treat the virus, then you don’t need a mask.

 

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I'm willing to wear a mask if it is only 5% effective at preventing virus spread,

That’s your choice, not mine.  At 5% efficacy, a mask is useless.  How many billions or trillions of covid molecules are expelled in every breath?

 

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I prefer not to go out with my own lungs suffocating me. 

Wearing masks doesn’t prevent that.  In fact, it may even help funneling covid molecules.

 

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I do think it's like stopping mosquitoes with a chain link fence, if the chain link fence was covered in adhesive; sure some mosquitoes are going to fly right through, but some aren't. 

I think you’ve missed the analogy.  Here, the wire of the fence represents the fibers in a mask.  The space between the wires is comparable to the space between the fibers.  There is no adhesive other than the particle kinetics.

 

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 And for chrissakes it's simply a mask, it's no more burdensome than shoes.  You guys act like it's: 

It is more than just a mask.  As I’ve said before, these masks represent subjugation.  If the government can push the fear porn and get you to become obedient, then what else can they make you do?  I don’t need someone to tell me to wear shoes that are too small or outdated.

 

[+Liquid Gardens]

7 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

Seems like Chicken Little and the Boy who cried Wolf are running this country.

Not to me, but thanks for proving my point by parroting more right wing propaganda.  Tell me, what is the difference to you between doing things out of fear and doing things out of safety?

10 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

The same amount is propelled out no matter the status of a mask.  A mask only redirects what's expelled.

That's false.  A mask also absorbs what is expelled.

11 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

It’s not a matter of it being perfect or guaranteed, but is the trade off worth it?

What trade-off?  The impact on your reputation if someone who thinks like you sees you wearing a simple mask and thinks you are being subjugated?

13 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

At 5% efficacy, a mask is useless. 

 I'd happily line up to get a shot every single day if it reduced my chances of getting cancer or heart disease by 5%.

14 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

And you would be incorrect.  covid molecules are generally in aerosol form. 

"The principal mode by which people are infected with SARS-CoV-2 (the virus that causes COVID-19) is through exposure to respiratory fluids carrying infectious virus. Exposure occurs in three principal ways: (1) inhalation of very fine respiratory droplets and aerosol particles, (2) deposition of respiratory droplets and particles on exposed mucous membranes in the mouth, nose, or eye by direct splashes and sprays, and (3) touching mucous membranes with hands that have been soiled either directly by virus-containing respiratory fluids or indirectly by touching surfaces with virus on them."

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/sars-cov-2-transmission.html

16 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

I think you’ve missed the analogy.  Here, the wire of the fence represents the fibers in a mask.  The space between the wires is comparable to the space between the fibers.  There is no adhesive other than the particle kinetics.

I understand your analogy, it isn't accurate.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-021-91487-7

"Wearing surgical masks or other similar face coverings can reduce the emission of expiratory particles produced via breathing, talking, coughing, or sneezing. Although it is well established that some fraction of the expiratory airflow leaks around the edges of the mask, it is unclear how these leakage airflows affect the overall efficiency with which masks block emission of expiratory aerosol particles. Here, we show experimentally that the aerosol particle concentrations in the leakage airflows around a surgical mask are reduced compared to no mask wearing, with the magnitude of reduction dependent on the direction of escape (out the top, the sides, or the bottom). "

18 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

As I’ve said before, these masks represent subjugation.

Just like countless other safety measures we take in order to live in a society, like obeying the government at stop signs, and driving sober.  I'd wager that way less than 1% of drunk driving instances result in an accident that kills someone, so I guess obeying drunk driving laws is 'worthless' and sheep behavior using your logic.

[Katniss]

43 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

It is more than just a mask.  As I’ve said before, these masks represent subjugation.  If the government can push the fear porn and get you to become obedient, then what else can they make you do?  

 

It looks like they can make you believe in slippery slope domino effect fallacies.

[jmccr8]

53 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

It is more than just a mask.  As I’ve said before, these masks represent subjugation.  If the government can push the fear porn and get you to become obedient, then what else can they make you do?  I don’t need someone to tell me to wear shoes that are too small or outdated.

Hi Raven

Not sure what your point is other that crying about you don't like something and things have changed to allow greater access. I was out to the mall to pick up some things and people are not social distancing and still crowding up against you simply because they are rude self-centered beings covid or not.

I can only assume that you chant out because you like to and not really about masks in general.

[ChrLzs]

5 hours ago, el midgetron said:

Masks primarily function to prevent your germs from being blown all over.

That's just a silly misrepresentation.  OF COURSE that's ONE of the purposes for a surgeon wearing them, given that if s/he breathes into an exposed/open body cavity that probably won't be good for the patient, but it ALSO protects the surgeon from incoming airborne droplets/spray from the patient or other hospital staff.  Same as it protects me (3-vaxxed) from all the ignorant people at supermarkets and shopping centres.. my favorites are the ones who are coughing or sneezing, (just hayfever, I hope...)

It astonishes me how ignorant people are in regard to vaccination.  Didn't any of you AVers go to school and learn about Salk, Pasteur, Jenner, Fleming and all the other pioneers?  The reason you are alive is because of vaccinations wiping out the diseases that would have killed your forebears.  Or is it forhumans..  

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Ravenhawk: As I’ve said before, these masks represent subjugation.

Yeah and vaccines are directly manufactured by Satan.   If, to you, a simple face mask represents subjugation, then ... well, let's just say it gives away your state of mind..  Maybe you should get out more and discover the real subjugation currently in the US.  In a small way, *you* are helping 'the usual suspects' who are doing it to your once-upon-a-time ''proud'' democracy. 

Edited January 6, 2022 by ChrLzs

[el midgetron]

1 hour ago, ChrLzs said:

Same as it protects me (3-vaxxed) from all the ignorant people at supermarkets and shopping centres.. my favorites are the ones who are coughing or sneezing, (just hayfever, I hope...)

It astonishes me how ignorant people are in regard to vaccination.  Didn't any of you AVers go to school and learn about Salk, Pasteur, Jenner, Fleming and all the other pioneers? 

It’s a “silly misrepresentation” to suggest the PRIMARY function of a mask is to contain your own germs? 

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Your mask helps protect those around you

COVID-19 spreads mainly from person to person through respiratory droplets. Respiratory droplets travel into the air when you cough, sneeze, talk, shout, or sing. These droplets can then land in the mouths or noses of people who are near you or they may breathe these droplets in.

Masks are a simple barrier to help prevent your respiratory droplets from reaching others. Studies show that masks reduce the spray of droplets when worn over the nose and mouth……

Your mask offers some protection to you

A cloth mask also offers some protection to you too. How well it protects you from breathing in the virus likely depends on the fabrics used and how your mask is made (such as the type of fabric, the number of layers of fabric, and how well the mask fits). CDC is currently studying these factors.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/cloth-face-cover-guidance.html

[jmccr8]

23 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

It’s a “silly misrepresentation” to suggest the PRIMARY function of a mask is to contain your own germs? 

Hi El

Not sure why as everyone can carry the virus so even if not feeling the effects of covid it helps contain the spread of airborne particulate. So any pro active measures are just that.

[el midgetron]

Hi Jmccr8

that wasn’t a statement on my part, It was a question about Chrlzs’s statement. Note the “?”. He is the one who made that claim.

[Tatetopa]

9 hours ago, el midgetron said:

Masks primarily function to prevent your germs from being blown all over. This is why surgeons where them, to protect the person being operated on, not themselves,

Very good point. That is the reason I wear one on a couple of levels.  It makes me feel like I am doing a little something to help my fellow citizens.  Even on this site there are a couple of folks who cannot get vaccinated.   Who knows who I cross paths with that has a similar situation?  Also, it answers the question my religion posed to me as a kid, "Am I my brother's keeper?"  I always thought the answer God gave Cain was "Yes you are".  It is a way to be true to my beliefs.

[psyche101]

10 hours ago, el midgetron said:

Masks primarily function to prevent your germs from being blown all over. This is why surgeons where them, to protect the person being operated on, not themselves, Unless you have a properly worn N95 mask, wearing a mask isn’t going to do much to protect you from the virus. 
 

The problem with the mosquitoe-chain link fence analogy is that no one is suggesting you be required to build chain link fences to reduce 5% of the number of mosquitoes in your yard because that’s really stupid, It’s the same thing with masks. Telling people to wear a mask when it only offers them 5% more protection isn’t going to convince many people to mask up and we don’t have the social cohesiveness for people to wear a mask out of concern for the other guy. 
 

I wear a mask whenever I go into public facilities and am kind of annoyed by how few people wear them here. However, I am also not a big fan of my 9 year old son being required to wear one in school. Masks are 100% effective at preventing smiles, are very cumbersome to communication and unless kept clean can introduce bacteria and viruses to your respiratory system. 
 

So far nothing we have tried seems to have done anything to prevent the spread of the virus. Delay it? Maybe. Prevent it? No. Two years into our fight against the virus and it’s the worst it’s ever been, at least that’s what they tell us. Shutting down the economy, keeping our kids home from school, wearing masks, abandoning grandma, getting vaccinated twice & boosted and yet the virus is now worse than it’s ever been??? WTF??? Considering all those preventative measures and where they have gotten us, does it make sense why people don’t see how 5% more protecting from a mask is going to make a difference?

[jmccr8]

1 hour ago, el midgetron said:

Hi Jmccr8

that wasn’t a statement on my part, It was a question about Chrlzs’s statement. Note the “?”. He is the one who made that claim.

Hi El

Okay thanks for clarifying,I don't wear a mask just because someone insisted and do think that precaution is the best medicine in this situation. Whether someone thinks it is to their advantage is not not concern. We as a social group have to think beyond our own personal wants/needs so some sacrifice is to be expected. A couple of hundred years earlier than now with the resources we had we would have been in a sorry state for being the prime species on this planet. We have to work co-operatively to survive as that is our true nature to survive as a species no matter what the cost and these days we can cut that cost.

[ChrLzs]

4 hours ago, el midgetron said:

It’s a “silly misrepresentation” to suggest the PRIMARY function of a mask is to contain your own germs?

It is when you seem to be making a point along the lines of "why bother", so lets look at what you said, in context, which was:

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Masks primarily function to prevent your germs from being blown all over. This is why surgeons where {sic} them

Is this a more common situation than you or I being in a crowded supermarket, with a percentage of folks not even wearing the bloody masks?  Is it really, when you do the maths, the masks Primary function?  For me, I'm triple vaccinated.  Have not had cold or flu symptoms for well over a year.  For me, do you really think that the masks primary function is to protect those nearby, from me?  Hint... NO.

The masks usefulness and primary function depend entirely on the situation.  Allow me to be selfish, and say that for me, and indeed all persons living in places where less than half are infected, I'd have to say the primary function is to protect the wearers from others.

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Unless you have a properly worn N95 mask, wearing a mask isn’t going to do much to protect you from the virus.

 Bull.  There many studies showing that even a hankie tied in front of you gives measurable protection.  It all helps.  It's not stopping the virus, it's stopping all the spray droplets, some of which may contain live virus.  That live virus doesn't get into your airways and dies out as the droplet dries out, reasonably quickly, thankfully.

 

11 hours ago, el midgetron said:

So far nothing we have tried seems to have done anything to prevent the spread of the virus.

Maybe not in the US where you have low vaccination rates.  Ours are a bit better, and I would point out that we pretty well had it under control and then three things happened..

1. People got lazy and a lot stopped wearing masks (I didn't)

2. We opened our borders - the rates immediately started to rise.

3. Omicron arrived, with much higher infection rates.

4. Ludicrously, we opened our borders even wider and pretty much tossed in the towel.

Thank your chosen deity that the Omicron is not the killer that the original and delta variants were - that's about the only consolation.

Don't get me wrong - as you can probably tell, I think this was handled incredibly stupidly in Australia, and now I see that masks are being re-mandated and new restrictions are returning, but it's too effing late.  As I said, we are sooo lucky that Omicron isn't a killer, and may in fact be a signal that this virus is going to peter out... but it's going to be a long six months or more before we know for sure.. 

 

Edited January 7, 2022 by ChrLzs

[el midgetron]

3 minutes ago, ChrLzs said:

Is this a more common situation than you or I being in a crowded supermarket, with a percentage of folks not even wearing the bloody masks?  Is it really, when you do the maths, the masks Primary function?  For me, I'm triple vaccinated.  Have not had cold or flu symptoms for well over a year.  For me, do you really think that the masks primary function is to protect those nearby, from me?  Hint... NO.

yes, because that’s how masks work, Just because you use something for a specific reason doesn’t dictate the reality of how they are effective, 

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The masks usefulness and primary function depend entirely on the situation.  Allow me to be selfish, and say that for me, and indeed all persons living in places where less than half are infected, I'd have to say the primary function is to protect the wearers from others.

That’s fine. I have stated how I always ware a mask too but that doesn’t change their effectiveness, 

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 Bull.  There many studies showing that even a hankie tied in front of you gives measurable protection.  It all helps.  It's not stopping the virus, it's stopping all the spray droplets, some of which may contain live virus.  That live virus doesn't get into your airways and dies out as the droplet dries out, reasonably quickly, thankfully.

Tell that to the people who arrested the guy wearing women’s underpants as a mask……

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2. We opened our borders - the rates immediately started to rise.

Whoa, chill with the racist rants.

[Golden Duck]

42 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Whoa, chill with the racist rants.

Whoa, chill with the ignorance.

[ChrLzs]

54 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

yes, because that’s how masks work, Just because you use something for a specific reason..

You agree but just want to argue?  OK how many surgeons do you see daily?  How many people in supermarkets?  Are more than half of your population infected?  If you think about those questions, you have pretty much debunked your claim of a 'primary purpose'.  If you still think that, then I'm sure your belief is very important to you, so here you go - I give in, you're absolutely 199% right.

So ...... what was your point?

46 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Whoa, chill with the racist rants.

Umm, I'm from Australia.  Not Austria, not America.  You're not very familiar with geography?  It's an island continent and the "borders" here means the borders between the states... normally completely unmonitored, but road blocks went up between our states during the covid crisis and you were refused entry if from a 'hotspot'' (ie highly infected region) AND so it is a generic term that refers to those borders and also our airports, which were blocked to most flights in and out.  It has nothing to do with racism, although I understand how you would think that, coming from the DS (Divided States)...

[acidhead]

3 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

It is a way to be true to my beliefs.

Good for you. Whatever makes you feel good.  Just don't push it to make it public policy.

[psyche101]

5 minutes ago, acidhead said:

Good for you. Whatever makes you feel good.  Just don't push it to make it public policy.

Why shouldn't a member of the public have any say in public policy?

[acidhead]

2 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

Why shouldn't a member of the public have any say in public policy?

Facts don't care about your feelings

Edited January 7, 2022 by acidhead

[Tatetopa]

5 minutes ago, acidhead said:

Good for you. Whatever makes you feel good.  Just don't push it to make it public policy.

Maybe I should have said I don't consider it a burden to comply because I think it does some good.  It is the Federal Government's job under the United States Constitution, "promote the general welfare" and in lots of the country it is already the policy. Hundred or so years ago, we did masks for the Spanish Flu, Washington required small pox vaccinations for his army, it has happened several times in our history.  Its not a new deal.

I would say it is up to you to get vaccinated, but in public you follow the mask requirements of corporations and public institutions if you want to go in.

As far as feelings, abortion is all about Christian ideas and feelings and that is being pushed pretty hard by believers.  You want to tell them they can't say what they want and lobby for it?

[psyche101]

Just now, acidhead said:

Facts don't carry about your feelings

No matter what they carry, why doesn't a member of the public have the right to have a say about public policy?

Isn't that what you claim is the problem here? Stifling views and all that?

[acidhead]

24 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

No matter what they carry, why doesn't a member of the public have the right to have a say about public policy?

Isn't that what you claim is the problem here? Stifling views and all that?

Feels....  

[Golden Duck]

5 minutes ago, acidhead said:

Feels....  

Certainty no thoughts anywhere there.

[psyche101]

15 minutes ago, acidhead said:

Feels....  

Like summer? 

[ChrLzs]

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Good for you. Whatever makes you feel good.  Just don't push it to make it public policy.

What????   Stupidest post ever?  As psyche said, why the hell shouldn't we push common sense?  Are you aware that you are living in a society?  Look that word up, but don't stop after reading three or four words.  And if you are asking us to do stuff, how about this back at you..

Just don't post idiotic memes and ill-thought-out one-line trash/troll posts.  It may make you feel good, but it sure ain't contributing to a meaningful discussion.

And I guess you are also from the Divided States, so you don't understand what governments are supposed to do.  They should do some things even in spite of public stupidity.  You know, like enforce laws, and even (gasp) mandate things.