Dr Robert Malone interview on Joe Rogan podcast

[Myles]

1 hour ago, RavenHawk said:

 

 

I believe that this experiment proves that masks do not work.  They work some but not to the hype they have been advertised.  They work well with spittle but that is just a fraction of what is expelled.  As far as the vaccines go, the question should be how many do they kill vs how many they save?  Of the initial reports I’ve seen, that ratio isn’t that good.  More are killed than saved.  This is from VAERS which is notoriously under countered.  How can you count the number saved anyway?  Almost twice as many have died in 2021 (when vaccines became available) than have died in 2020.  Cases and deaths are increasing and it’s getting more prevalent in the vaccinated crowd.  Soon it should at least be 50-50.  So, the vaccines may be saving lives but more lives are being lost to covid and the vaccines.  So what is the overall effectiveness?  It seems that it could be negative efficacy.

 

 

 

They work as an added later of protection.   Not 100%, but as a layer of protection.  Kind of like seatbelt in a car.   It won't save your life every time, but it can help.  I wear my seatbelt and also wear a mask in public places.      

[Golden Duck]

5 minutes ago, Myles said:

They work as an added later of protection.   Not 100%, but as a layer of protection.  Kind of like seatbelt in a car.   It won't save your life every time, but it can help.  I wear my seatbelt and also wear a mask in public places.      

If seatbelts work, why do we need airbags?  We hear more and more stories of how people are injured from airbags as time ticks by.

[+Nuclear Wessel]

43 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

They are more believable and Fauci is a proven liar.

So is Robert Malone. Lol. The man claims that the COVID vaccine essentially generates a response that causes children's organs to be attacked.

Talk about a fringe ****ing lunatic.

Edited January 10, 2022 by Nuclear Wessel

[Myles]

14 minutes ago, Golden Duck said:

If seatbelts work, why do we need airbags?  We hear more and more stories of how people are injured from airbags as time ticks by.

They are just an added layer of protection like I said.   Not 100%.  Just like safety glasses while using a chainsaw.   You can still get debris in your eye, but the risk is less.  

[Golden Duck]

2 minutes ago, Myles said:

They are just an added layer of protection like I said.   Not 100%.  Just like safety glasses while using a chainsaw.   You can still get debris in your eye, but the risk is less.  

Too dry?

[psyche101]

6 hours ago, RavenHawk said:

Not my taste, I’m just using your analogy.

Had to be your taste. You were given an example, you attempted to modify or to suit a predetermined conclusion. First thing that pops into your head - weirdness. 

[psyche101]

5 hours ago, RavenHawk said:

That’s what he threatens. 

What?

5 hours ago, RavenHawk said:

You’ve invested so much into the narrative and now, it is beginning to fall apart.  So much for your honesty.

What's begging to fall apart? 

What have I got invested? 

I don't think Joe Rogan is a smart man. I don't see any qualifications in his history to suggest otherwise. He is just another idiot shock jock. I kinda chuckle at people who do listen to his podcasts as I wonder if they think he actually smarter than they are. If so, many people have let themselves down. 

5 hours ago, RavenHawk said:

He carries himself well in that.  Even if his questions are prepared for him, he understands them.  It is clear that he is well read on the subjects.

He relies on controversy. 

And on other people. He has been in front of a microphone most of his life. If he wasn't living up to his listeners perceptions he wouldn't have a show. Not sure how impressive it is to ask questions that are controversial to people wanting the attention from that misinformation. 

It is clear that you are impressed by rhetoric, not knowledge. That was obvious in your junk DNA posting though. I don't think you ever realised what a fool you made of yourself there. You provided quite some laughter for many of us.

5 hours ago, RavenHawk said:

Well, this dime a dozen has the most popular podcast.  It must be more than tabloid news.  That interview was right on the mark.  It would have fitted well with the Covid Revealed series. 

Popular amongst people who want to pretend they know more than experts.

Meh. Who cares about those idiots. They are convincing themselves that they are changing things whilst the rest of us actually do. Fantasy prone twits. 

5 hours ago, RavenHawk said:

And the shock jock that you fall for is Fauci.  That says a lot about you.

Lol, so you don't even know what the term actually means, or did you just use the term for shock value? 

Lol, that says a lot about you. And it's not impressive. 

5 hours ago, RavenHawk said:

And yet he still holds 9 patents.  Yes, there were probably a team of doctors working together or separately, but one is usually identified as the top dog.  The theory of Evolution was developed by Darwin and Alfred Wallace, but Darwin is the one that gets the credit.  Columbus is credited at discovering the New World, but it is now known that several other cultures had been here before Columbus.  It was Columbus that realized the “Columbian Exchange”.  There are many examples in history of co-invention or Multiple Discovery Theory.  You almost act like you are jealous of him??  Because he stands up against Fauci. 

Jealous? I'm not in the same field. Your ego is over reaching there. 

He gets credit for what he did. He is claiming total credit and offering BS fear statements that aren't backed by science. He is a loser that has become a prisoner of his own ego. 

That's a why he isn't in charge of squat regarding mRNA today. Didn't make it. Had to hand the torch onto better people who have told us the real story about mRNA research and development. Katalin Karikó in particular. 

5 hours ago, RavenHawk said:

You may have a low opinion of Malone but doctors like Malone, McCullough, Atlas, etc. have a low opinion of Fauci.  They are more believable and Fauci is a proven liar.

Anyone you find believable is a red flag. You have a knack for scrapping the bottom of the barrell. Your blind undying support of Malone is testament to that very fact. 

5 hours ago, RavenHawk said:

Precisely!

I keep trying to help you with perspective but I fear you are a lost cause. 

Edited January 11, 2022 by psyche101

[ChrLzs]

Ravenhawk, can you please be specific - which was the most heinous lie that Fauci perpetrated?

Be specific - here's your chance to show your knowledge.

[itsnotoutthere]

On 1/6/2022 at 3:23 PM, Liquid Gardens said:

And the overwrought opposition to them is nothing more than firm evidence how effective right wing propaganda is to the unskeptical.

Which has resulted in some of the deadliest plagues in history, go on.

I have only one very simple thought experiment.  Let's say someone is wearing a mask that fogs up their glasses and allows them to still smell things and smoke and all that.  Now that person sneezes.  Is it your scientific theory that the same amount of virus was just propelled out compared to if there was no mask?  You understand that most virus material we expel through our nose and mouth is initially attached to larger usually moist particles?

You seem to be drifting towards the same fallacious reasoning that others randomly invoke: things are either perfect/"guaranteed", or they are worthless.  I'm willing to wear a mask if it is only 5% effective at preventing virus spread, I prefer not to go out with my own lungs suffocating me.  I do think it's like stopping mosquitoes with a chain link fence, if the chain link fence was covered in adhesive; sure some mosquitoes are going to fly right through, but some aren't.  And for chrissakes it's simply a mask, it's no more burdensome than shoes.  You guys act like it's: 

That analogy you're looking for :-

 

So effectively rendering it useless then! 

Edited January 11, 2022 by itsnotoutthere

[Buzz_Light_Year]

17 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

If seatbelts work, why do we need airbags?  We hear more and more stories of how people are injured from airbags as time ticks by.

Airbags were responsible for my mom's death and that according to the Dr. He said she suffered the same type of injury that military personal receive from an IED. Airbags are also responsible for several decapitations of young children and that is why young children are now required to be placed in the backseat.

Most vulnerable are old people and short people as they tend to have to have the seat farther forward and receive a more violent impact with the bag.

But those that suffer severe injury and death are just considered acceptable collateral damage much the same as is happening with the vaccines.

[ChrLzs]

17 hours ago, Buzz_Light_Year said:

But those that suffer severe injury and death are just considered acceptable collateral damage much the same as is happening with the vaccines.

Yep, and that sort of handwave is useless unless you populate it with NUMBERS.

I make similar decisions all the time - do I cross the street just anywhere and not look, or do I use the pedestrian crossing?  I do an almost subconscious mental risk assessment or cost/benefit study about almost every decision I make.

Edited January 12, 2022 by Saru
Removed antagonism

[Golden Duck]

6 hours ago, Buzz_Light_Year said:

Airbags were responsible for my mom's death and that according to the Dr. He said she suffered the same type of injury that military personal receive from an IED. Airbags are also responsible for several decapitations of young children and that is why young children are now required to be placed in the backseat.

Most vulnerable are old people and short people as they tend to have to have the seat farther forward and receive a more violent impact with the bag.

But those that suffer severe injury and death are just considered acceptable collateral damage much the same as is happening with the vaccines.

Hey Buzz, there was no disrespect intended to your family.

The subtext is essentially satirising this argument for, or against, the Swiss Cheese Model.

Edited January 11, 2022 by Golden Duck

[Grim Reaper 6]

On 1/11/2022 at 6:11 AM, RavenHawk said:

Yes, it’s cool.  It is factual, true, and simple.  The simpler something is, the better teacher it is.  Science should be simple.  It doesn’t have to be some complex dissertation.

Spoiler

That's kind of strange statement, the only thing that makes this a Complex Dissertation is you lack of knowledge on subject!

 I believe that this experiment proves that masks do not work.  They work some but not to the hype they have been advertised.  They work well with spittle but that is just a fraction of what is expelled.  As far as the vaccines go, the question should be how many do they kill vs how many they save?  Of the initial reports I’ve seen, that ratio isn’t that good.  More are killed than saved.  This is from VAERS which is notoriously under countered.  How can you count the number saved anyway?  Almost twice as many have died in 2021 (when vaccines became available) than have died in 2020.  Cases and deaths are increasing and it’s getting more prevalent in the vaccinated crowd.  Soon it should at least be 50-50.  So, the vaccines may be saving lives but more lives are being lost to covid and the vaccines.  So what is the overall effectiveness?  It seems that it could be negative efficacy.

Spoiler

You claim the vaccinations are killing more people than they save, do you have have a source ANY SOURCE to prove that comment?

Anyway, I know you never supply sources because you make up your information as you type it, so to be plain your comments above are pure BS, nothing more.

Next you say twice as many have died in 2021 after the vaccines became available than in all of 2020. That's correct but again the substance of your comments are not mentioned.

1.  It took until late 2020 for the Virus to spread to all corners of the globe.

2.  Then starting in late 2021 all the mutations started occurring and this multiplied the number of infections by 100 plus do the infectious nature of these mutations.

3.  The Americans who have been dying in droves since the Vaccines came out are the unvaccinated. Since June 2021, a 163,000 Americans died from SARS-Cov-2.

4. Statistically the mortality rate between Vaccinated and Unvaccinated will never reach 50 / 50 simply because the unvaccinated are dying at approximately 12% mortality rate compared to a approximate mortality rate of 1.8 to 2.3% for the vaccinated. In reality and sadly if things do not change drastically over the next 2 years there will be no Unvaccinated to compare the vaccinated too!

 

 

We’ve had 60m cases and 840k deaths.  That’s a 1.4% death rate.  How many deaths are of those that have died in the hospital?  People come into the hospital for a number of reasons (not just covid).  They are tested and if they test positive, they are counted as a covid case and hospitalization.  How many die of covid and how many die with covid?  Most I suspect were asymptomatic coming into the hospital.  But then what are the average stays in the hospital?  When are they put on Remdesivir?  Of those that go on ventilators, how many die?  I suspect that if you are asymptomatic, if you have any comorbidities, they are probably not severe and that hospitalization really has no quantitative meaning. 

I recently heard a good example.  If someone takes vitamin C and they don’t get sick, that is reason to continue to take vitamin C.  But if they are taking vitamin C and gets sick every other day or whatever, why continue to take it?  If the vaccines work, then why don’t they work?  How many shots are they going to deem necessary and how often?  To answer that, you’ll need to follow the money.

Spoiler

Again your falsifying data again you stated and I quote "We’ve had 60m cases and 840k deaths" when according to the CDC   146,585,169 Americans have been infected as of Sept 2021 so that number is much higher, it actually approximately 3 times the figure you quoted. So basically everything you said in the paragraph above is in accurate. It is amazing you are so uninformed!

 

Yes, circumstances have changed, but the data has not.  Just what is being collected and what isn’t.  At first it was only thought that age was a factor, but now we know more.  Age and obesity are the two major factors, but the more comorbidities one has, the higher the chance one will die.  Of those with the more serious comorbidities, how many of those have lived if they are fully vaxed?  We need better stats on recovery.  Only 18% of the population has been recorded as a case.  That would seem to imply that the other 4/5^ths are unknown and are probably asymptomatic (or mild symptoms).

 

That, I don’t know about.  The only official treatment that hospitals dispense is Remdesivir which is known to cause renal failure.  That’s the same protocol they’ve used from the beginning.  They are restricting monoclonal anti bodies and they have vilified hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin (many pharmacies and doctors are prevented from prescribing them and they always appear on lists of essential drugs).  They ignore vitamins D, C and zinc and don’t even consider natural immunity or diet.  Actual treatment is scarce.

Spoiler

Currently they are using many drugs to treat hospitalized patients such as, Antiviral Drugs remdesivir, paxlovid, ritonavir,  molnupiravir.  Drugs for Immune based therapy casirivimab, imdevimab, bamlanivimab, etesevimab.  Plus many others, so again your information is inaccurate does it ever end, I have an idea do some research and stop making things up.

 

The most recent trend is that vaccinated are getting covid as often as the unvaccinated.  They are constantly reporting on fully vaxed celebrities and lawmakers that are getting covid.  What isn’t being reported is that more and more of the unvaccinated are acquiring natural immunity.  But that doesn’t seem to be complete protection from Omicron, as it does with all the prior mutations.  But everyone is going to get omicron despite vaccination status.  The good thing is that for the vast majority, it is mild – just another cold.  The need for vaccines has come to an end.  Another thing to look for is how the lipids in these vaccines are attacking the immune system.  This degradation allows other disease besides covid to enter the body.  It takes the spike protein from 15 to 18 months to clear the body after the last shot.  The individual will be vulnerable for that long before their own immune system builds back if it ever does.

Well, all the data needs to be reexamined.  Our covid death numbers are over counted.  Those that died within 14 days of their last shot and are tested positive for covid, are considered a covid death.  Have you noticed that the number of unexpected deaths are on the increase?  How much do you want to bet that the majority of these had a shot recently?  These stats aren’t being collected.  They need to develop a tactful survey sent out to the families of those that have passed to collect that data.

 

•  

[psyche101]

17 hours ago, itsnotoutthere said:

That analogy you're looking for :-

 

So effectively rendering it useless then! 

If air was water perhaps.

It's not.

Water is much more dense.

Edited January 12, 2022 by Saru
Removed insult

[Grim Reaper 6]

17 hours ago, itsnotoutthere said:

That analogy you're looking for :-

 

So effectively rendering it useless then! 

I bet you like to dive underwater around those kids, for that warm felling you can only get from peeing in a pool!

Do you wear a mask while diving!

Edited January 12, 2022 by Manwon Lender

[Horta]

On 1/6/2022 at 8:32 AM, RavenHawk said:

Please do, it is worth the price of admission.  So is a series titled “Covid Revealed”: https://vrevealed.com/c19/trailer .  Unfortunately, the free viewing period is over and the series can be purchased, but you can peruse the trailer to find a list of doctors, scientist, and other professional who have signed on.  My wife follows many of them on things like telegram and others.  Once you become aware of these things, you can’t unsee it (common sense).

 

If you study MFP at any length, you’ll discover the incorrectness of your statement.  Again, that is an Alinsky move.

 

I’ve known about MFP for some time.  Years ago, I was looking into the Milgram experiment and that led me to MFP.  From the interview, Malone says he was talking to Mattias about MFP.  Mattias Desmet, Ghent University is the one that has done a lot of work in this.  Here’s an article about him and MFP: https://www.clarkcountytoday.com/opinion/opinion-how-have-we-gotten-here-mass-formation-psychosis-explained/

 Here's another interesting article on Mattias: https://thomascasey.wordpress.com/2021/08/28/mass-formation-by-dr-mattias-desmet-professor-of-psychology-university-of-ghent/

 

An interesting interview, though I have a few problems with it. What I get from it is that Malone (while obviously intelligent and well meaning) doesn't really understand what Desmet is saying and probably should have deferred to him without trying to go too in depth. The real term to begin with is "Mass Formation" and tacking the "psychosis" part on the end of it is unhelpful and not strictly correct either.

While it does involve a generalized type of "psychosis", Desmet doesn't mean that in the sense it might be evident in any specific clinically diagnosed condition and has said that it might not be the best description for what is happening. He is always at pains to explain it as very similar to being "hypnotized" and stresses the conditions that lead up to it. It is a valid explanation for how and why populations can be convinced to believe things and act in ways they normally would not.

There are many examples of this throughout history and 1930's Germany or the Soviets offer historical study of the concept and a warning of where it can lead, but direct comparisons to the present are probably a little OTT as yet.

Unfortunately the (incorrect) term is now being used as a way for people to denigrate those they disagree with as being "crazy" and as  a way of justifying their own "narrative" without having any real curiosity beyond that. I doubt it requires being genuinely "crazy" and the "psychosis" part only involves a small percentage of the population anyway (20-30%) with social conformity taking a lot more for the ride.

It is obviously happening (Mass Formation) to some extent and the narrative is getting ever more ridiculous. So it is important to keep being critical of the narrative itself.

The reason to keep speaking up is that historically when opposing voices are silenced at times like this (assuming it is happening) is when things can get ugly. Unfortunately that would be when the Milgram experiments would probably be more relevant. With supposed "academics" like Chomski wanting the unvaxxed cut off from society completely (to the extent of not even being able to get the most basic necessities such as food) and others wanting forced vaccination it does sound ominous. While the pandemic will end as they all do, where the other problem (Mass Formation) eventually leads or how it evolves, who knows?

[Grim Reaper 6]

5 minutes ago, Horta said:

An interesting interview, though I have a few problems with it. What I get from it is that Malone (while obviously intelligent and well meaning) doesn't really understand what Desmet is saying and probably should have deferred to him without trying to go too in depth. The real term to begin with is "Mass Formation" and tacking the "psychosis" part on the end of it is unhelpful and not strictly correct either.

While it does involve a generalized type of "psychosis", Desmet doesn't mean that in the sense it might be evident in any specific clinically diagnosed condition and has said that it might not be the best description for what is happening. He is always at pains to explain it as very similar to being "hypnotized" and stresses the conditions that lead up to it. It is a valid explanation for how and why populations can be convinced to believe things and act in ways they normally would not.

There are many examples of this throughout history and 1930's Germany or the Soviets offer historical study of the concept and a warning of where it can lead, but direct comparisons to the present are probably a little OTT as yet.

Unfortunately the (incorrect) term is now being used as a way for people to denigrate those they disagree with as being "crazy" and as  a way of justifying their own "narrative" without having any real curiosity beyond that. I doubt it requires being genuinely "crazy" and the "psychosis" part only involves a small percentage of the population anyway (20-30%) with social conformity taking a lot more for the ride.

It is obviously happening (Mass Formation) to some extent and the narrative is getting ever more ridiculous. So it is important to keep being critical of the narrative itself.

The reason to keep speaking up is that historically when opposing voices are silenced at times like this (assuming it is happening) is when things can get ugly. Unfortunately that would be when the Milgram experiments would probably be more relevant. With supposed "academics" like Chomski wanting the unvaxxed cut off from society completely (to the extent of not even being able to get the most basic necessities such as food) and others wanting forced vaccination it does sound ominous. While the pandemic will end as they all do, where the other problem (Mass Formation) eventually leads or how it evolves, who knows?

What do you expect from the Joe Rogan Show! Why would anyone looking for serious information tune in to a show were the moderator is a brain damaged JOC who only had a double digit IQ in the first place!

Bias oh yea!

Edited January 12, 2022 by Manwon Lender

[Horta]

6 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

What do you expect from the Joe Rogan Show! Why would anyone looking for serious information tune in to a show were the moderator is a brain damaged JOC who only had a double digit IQ in the first place!

Bias oh yea!

I don't mind Rogan at all. He has a wide variety of guests, many who he disagrees with (he seems to actually want to hear opposing views) and some of them well qualified and intelligent.

The below is a better talk on "Mass Formation" from a leading academic on the subject, and the host seems far more researched (than Rogan). 

 

 

[Grim Reaper 6]

4 minutes ago, Horta said:

I don't mind Rogan at all. He has a wide variety of guests, many who he disagrees with (he seems to actually want to hear opposing views) and some of them well qualified and intelligent.

The below is a better talk on "Mass Formation" from a leading academic on the subject, and the host seems far more researched (than Rogan). 

 

 

I would rather go directly to academic journals for information, I know it takes a little more effort but it’s well worth it to me. I signed up for a few pay sites that alert me when new Peer Reviewed Journals and Papers are published on subjects I am interested in like COVID. That way the political bias does not affect the information like it does on the YouTube videos and podcasts from these talk show hosts.

Thanks for the video I will check it out when I have more time. 

[Golden Duck]

2 hours ago, Horta said:

I don't mind Rogan at all. He has a wide variety of guests, many who he disagrees with (he seems to actually want to hear opposing views) and some of them well qualified and intelligent.

The below is a better talk on "Mass Formation" from a leading academic on the subject, and the host seems far more researched (than Rogan). 

 

 

It took almost an hour to mention the counter mass formation process.

[Horta]

12 minutes ago, Golden Duck said:

It took almost an hour to mention the counter mass formation process.

That's why Robert Malone and Joe Rogan might not be the best source of info on this particular topic.

Though I'm not sure to what extent that group is really brought about by the pandemic narrative itself, as much already existing groups who have always had their own narrative and are now feeling threatened. Such as those who were already genuine anti vaxxers and conspiracy theorists. The ones who find this a convenient way to insult, without really having an interest in understanding it. That the term being used now is "Mass Formation Psychosis"  gives a hint at the thought process and bias. It's not helpful.

Though I think "Mass Formation" is a real phenomena and is happening. 

 

[+Nuclear Wessel]

3 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

I would rather go directly to academic journals for information, I know it takes a little more effort but it’s well worth it to me. I signed up for a few pay sites that alert me when new Peer Reviewed Journals and Papers are published on subjects I am interested in like COVID. That way the political bias does not affect the information like it does on the YouTube videos and podcasts from these talk show hosts.

Thanks for the video I will check it out when I have more time. 

If you are interested in other areas of science, phys.org is a fantastic resource that is slightly more technical than most sources of a similar nature. 

[+Liquid Gardens]

4 hours ago, Horta said:

The real term to begin with is "Mass Formation" and tacking the "psychosis" part on the end of it is unhelpful and not strictly correct either.

When I google that I get very little, and 'Mass Formation' does not have a wiki entry which is suspicious.  When I entered the term in wiki I was taken to an article on a century-old book by Freud which doesn't exactly make this sound recent.  From what you've seen/read what is the difference between people believing things out of supposed semi 'hypnosis' and people believing experts because of their expertise for example? 

I disagree with you a tiny bit with your mention of 'the' narrative with covid, there's actually a lot of narratives and I agree some of them are definitely far out.  But I don't think all or even most people who believe those narratives are 'hypnotized'; not all people base their opinions on facts and evidence for example, but that doesn't then mean they are just going along with the masses.  It seems like we instead need to tease out ideas or actions that a person would not normally do in the situation and look for an inconsistency, but unfortunately something as huge and thankfully novel as the pandemic does not give us much basis to say, 'in this situation if you weren't under the effects of 'Mass Formation' you wouldn't think/do that'.  Nobody has been in this situation before to be able to have a comparison.

 

[Grim Reaper 6]

7 hours ago, Nuclear Wessel said:

If you are interested in other areas of science, phys.org is a fantastic resource that is slightly more technical than most sources of a similar nature. 

Thanks, I will check it out!

[ChrLzs]

Quote

Ravenhawk: Science should be simple.  It doesn’t have to be some complex dissertation.

That is patently ridiculous.  Of course some things are simple, but most things are complex, and complexity doesn't arise only when you want it to...

I hear this ludicrous argument often, and it always comes from people:

• without knowledge of science and how it works (or doesn't)
• who wish to push an untenable / incorrect viewpoint
• who are also offering up completely inapplicable 'analogies', like that pool one above..

I find it rather ironic that the person posting this is using a very complex device, on a very complex data transmission network.  And I'll lay a sizable bet that s/he doesn't have the first clue about how it all works.

But    ...   it's just exactly like two cans and a long bit of string, right, ravenhawk?