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Dr Robert Malone interview on Joe Rogan podcast


RavenHawk

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"Polymerase Chain Reaction (“PCR”) tests have been used to identify “cases” of COVID-19 during the course of the pandemic. Notably, PCR alone cannot differentiate between the presence of whole viruses (which can be transmitted and infect individuals) and small fragments of genetic material that are not infectious. A feature of PCR known as the cycle threshold (Ct) can be used to discriminate between these states, but the relationship between Ct and infectiousness is still poorly understood. This well-known limitation of the test compromises the identification of cases and their trends, and consequently those measures to interrupt transmission (such as isolation) that are undertaken on the basis of reliably identifying infectious individuals.

Access to responses from public health authorities to Freedom of Information (FOI) queries shows there is a lack of knowledge on how many PCR tests are in use, their practical usage, and a lack of means of identifying contagious individuals. The current system requires significant changes to ensure it offers accurate diagnostic data to enable effective clinical management of SARS-CoV-2. PCR is an important and powerful tool, but its lack of standardisation risks undermining its usefulness and credibility."

https://collateralglobal.org/article/pcr-testing-in-the-uk-during-the-sars-cov-2-pandemic/

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@Horta, sorry I haven't gotten back to you, been ill and busy and most of all we are not on-topic here (again, I wouldn't attempt to defend this vague Mass Formation drivel either). 

Have you ever heard of the Gish Gallop?  I see you've latched onto the recent 'John's Hopkins' lockdowns 'study' performed by economists among others here.  Have you bothered to look into what other experts say about that?  Why don't their comments disqualify those reports like your analysis of CDC supposedly disqualifies that data?  

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Have you had a look at it in any depth (the data and methods it is based on)? Or you just accept what you're told? 

Wait, I thought we cleared this up a couple discussion ago, you are not bringing any trained expertise to your analysis of studies, I thought we already established that you are not a doctor, scientist, statistician, or epidemiologist, nor have you ever conducted and documented a scientific study in your life. Considering how many links you've been providing from apparently just about any source, you didn't seriously vet all of these studies for accuracy, especially since you have only a typical layman's skills in doing that?  I mean it's not like there is anything that you've said here that I can't trace directly back to the right-wing mediasphere, so it would appear that you are just accepting what you're told?  

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Then it gets further murky re what a covid death or hospitalizations means. It's so bad that you really have to wonder if it's on purpose. It also makes most vaccine studies useless IMO.

It's not that murky to doctors what a covid death or hospitalization means, I'm not sure if this is what you are referring to but this may be of interest, it includes a brief discussion about how causes of death are documented:

https://gidmk.medium.com/covid-19-deaths-are-not-over-counted-9bb3aaa4b9ec

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China on this graph is obviously bogus, but if it showed reality it would further support my point.

Which point?  See Gish Gallop above.   If the China number showed reality then it implies that vaccines are very effective.  I think you said there's no evidence of vaccines reducing mortality 'worldwide' which seems wishy-washy depending on what you mean by 'worldwide', but if the China number is accurate then that is evidence, since it shows high vaccination rates and almost zero deaths.  Since a 1/4 of the world's people live in China, that would also imply effectiveness worldwide.  You seem to have the idea that if vaccines were effective 'worldwide' then every country should show the same stats which is not realistic and it is not any surprise that they do not; real experts know and have said that there are other factors obviously when evaluating region by region and country by country.  Everyone knows that Gibraltar<>China<>Israel<>US<>Cuba.

 

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On 2/8/2022 at 3:20 PM, Manwon Lender said:

Has there ever been a vaccine in the history of vaccination that didn’t cause some adverse reactions or side effects in segments of the Worlds population?:rolleyes:

I'm reading a book now by Judy Mikovitch called "Plague of Corruption". I wish you would read it but I am afraid you wouldn't. I wonder how much it would cost to ship it to Korea? Thanks.

Anyway, here's the thing. If the book were based on lies, there would surely be lawsuits? But it is as if they don't want to bring attention to it. That could also account for the censorship...

Because if you would read it I would ship it to you... :)

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2 minutes ago, Gummug said:

I'm reading a book now by Judy Mikovitch called "Plague of Corruption". I wish you would read it but I am afraid you wouldn't. I wonder how much it would cost to ship it to Korea? Thanks.

Anyway, here's the thing. If the book were based on lies, there would surely be lawsuits? But it is as if they don't want to bring attention to it. That could also account for the censorship...

Because if you would read it I would ship it to you... :)

I am sorry, but she has been destroyed academically, her worked was retracted by the entire scientific community that’s pretty sad my friend, but she has no credibility at all, she has not published a scientific paper since 2012.  However, I sincerely appreciate the offer, but I honestly would not be interested in reading her book!

Fact-checking Judy Mikovits, the controversial virologist attacking Anthony Fauci in a viral conspiracy video

Two months later, the entire Science paper was retracted. Mikovits refused to sign the retraction notice, but she took part in another major replication effort. That $2.3 million study, led by Ian Lipkin of Columbia University and funded by the National Institutes of Health, was "the definitive answer," Mikovits said at a September 2012 press conference where the results were announced. The rigorous study looked for XMRV in blinded blood samples from nearly 300 people, half of whom had the disease, and none had the virus. "There is no evidence that XMRV is a human pathogen," Mikovits conceded

https://www.science.org/content/article/fact-checking-judy-mikovits-controversial-virologist-attacking-anthony-fauci-viral

 

 

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13 hours ago, Gummug said:

I'm reading a book now by Judy Mikovitch called "Plague of Corruption". I wish you would read it but I am afraid you wouldn't. I wonder how much it would cost to ship it to Korea? Thanks.

Anyway, here's the thing. If the book were based on lies, there would surely be lawsuits? But it is as if they don't want to bring attention to it. That could also account for the censorship...

Because if you would read it I would ship it to you... :)

Did you read the thread about the grandfather who almost murdered an infant with invermectin?

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On 2/8/2022 at 6:52 PM, Horta said:

You do realize this is not a peer reviewed article. About all it states is that the authors were not able to understand. They also misstate what Ct is. They state a few things that are already being done as if they might not be and then add things that do not need to be done.

So what do you think this is all about?

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16 hours ago, psyche101 said:

Did you read the thread about the grandfather who almost murdered an infant with invermectin?

I did. I am never going to justify what he did, but I think ivermectin was not at fault...it was his ignorance. With infants, you have to be careful even with aspirin. Btw Manwon, I haven't forgotten you, but I want to do some research and that takes time...

... about Dr. Mikovitch I mean...

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10 hours ago, Gummug said:

I did. I am never going to justify what he did, but I think ivermectin was not at fault...it was his ignorance. With infants, you have to be careful even with aspirin. Btw Manwon, I haven't forgotten you, but I want to do some research and that takes time...

... about Dr. Mikovitch I mean...

You should at least spell her name right before googling.  From the Wiki:

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Judy Anne Mikovits is an American former research scientist who is known for her discredited medical claims, such as that murine endogenous retroviruses are linked to chronic fatigue syndrome.

 

Edited by ChrLzs
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4 hours ago, ChrLzs said:

You should at least spell her name right before googling.  From the Wiki:

 

Sorry, I stand corrected...

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15 hours ago, Gummug said:

I did. I am never going to justify what he did, but I think ivermectin was not at fault...it was his ignorance. With infants, you have to be careful even with aspirin. Btw Manwon, I haven't forgotten you, but I want to do some research and that takes time...

... about Dr. Mikovitch I mean...

No problem my friend take all the time you need!:tu:

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3 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

No problem my friend take all the time you need!:tu:

Thanks :)

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On 2/10/2022 at 4:25 AM, Manwon Lender said:

I am sorry, but she has been destroyed academically, her worked was retracted by the entire scientific community that’s pretty sad my friend, but she has no credibility at all, she has not published a scientific paper since 2012.  However, I sincerely appreciate the offer, but I honestly would not be interested in reading her book!

Fact-checking Judy Mikovits, the controversial virologist attacking Anthony Fauci in a viral conspiracy video

Two months later, the entire Science paper was retracted. Mikovits refused to sign the retraction notice, but she took part in another major replication effort. That $2.3 million study, led by Ian Lipkin of Columbia University and funded by the National Institutes of Health, was "the definitive answer," Mikovits said at a September 2012 press conference where the results were announced. The rigorous study looked for XMRV in blinded blood samples from nearly 300 people, half of whom had the disease, and none had the virus. "There is no evidence that XMRV is a human pathogen," Mikovits conceded

https://www.science.org/content/article/fact-checking-judy-mikovits-controversial-virologist-attacking-anthony-fauci-viral

 

 

Well there's this:

https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=113613955

...as opposed to this:

https://www.nih.gov/news-events/nih-research-matters/study-undermines-xmrv-connection-human-disease

Whom to believe?

The question in my mind is, how many millions of dollars would big pharma stand to lose if it turned out their vaccines, contaminated with XMRV from mice tissue, were making people sick? To what lengths will they go to hush it up and discredit the whistle blowers? How much can their money and power (through political bribes etc.) influence medical publications?

Edited by Gummug
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35 minutes ago, Gummug said:

I would disregard the NPR article and share the information with others if I were in a discussion on the subject. The reason why is simple, it proves no additional sources of information except other articles on the subject from NPR which also supply no scientific sources that show studies and research on the subject! In addition the author that wrote the article has no background on the subject of the article, his education consists of degrees in journalism and English! So basically he is parroting information he had researched, but why didn’t he supply links to the research, that is a question I am unable to answer. 

The scientific journal you provided does supply sources of information that lead to studies and research in a article prepared by the CDC. The CDC article does supply links to the actual research and studies, which also lead to a great deal of additional information. I would share this information in a conversation on the subject because of the sources, links, and all the additional information provided.

Thats my take on the situation, to me I want to share the most accurate information I can. This is why I choose to go directly to the Horses mouth instead of presenting second hand information!

Be well!

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On 2/12/2022 at 2:07 AM, Gummug said:

I did. I am never going to justify what he did, but I think ivermectin was not at fault...it was his ignorance. With infants, you have to be careful even with aspirin. Btw Manwon, I haven't forgotten you, but I want to do some research and that takes time...

... about Dr. Mikovitch I mean...

So someone has to die before you take notice?

Really? 

Sorry but you are wrong. People like Joni Mitchell encourage people like this. They are as responsible as that fool who near murdered an infant.

Terrible that you take a babies life so lightly!! 

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56 minutes ago, Gummug said:

Well there's this:

https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=113613955

...as opposed to this:

https://www.nih.gov/news-events/nih-research-matters/study-undermines-xmrv-connection-human-disease

Whom to believe?

The question in my mind is, how many millions of dollars would big pharma stand to lose if it turned out their vaccines, contaminated with XMRV from mice tissue, were making people sick? To what lengths will they go to hush it up and discredit the whistle blowers? How much can their money and power (through political bribes etc.) influence medical publications?

I think the usual tools to hush people work well enough.  They're tried and trued.  Look at all the censorship!  Where?  You may well ask!

My point exactly!

Mistrust of science can be a tool for gain.  Advantage through division and  confusion is possibly what we see today. ...The worst case scenario, loosely put, a powerfully complex and self illusory technology exists that scientists have no reason even believing exists, its entirety is hidden beyond our best visionaries and has been carried inside the minds of men as cryptic messages since before the advent of fire. Conveniently, but not obviously, 'breadcrumbs' and instructions, more so, 'discoveries' and knowledge have been left lying about in seemingly random timeframes and so the task of constructing the future patiently begins that eventually earth on earth becomes wood on  wood,  becomes stone on stone becomes steel on steel, becomes....fast forward to present day....and then tomorrow.... not until the exact moment that a human hand screws that last screw tightly down and with no breath of warning that that screw was the final jewel in the crown, man will then, to his absolute paralysing horror, unable to even scream or turn away, understand all at once what he himself has become and the meaning of  The 10,000 Broken Horns.

Lol thats a watered down version because it's a family show.

Back on track.  Thanks to your post I remembered this 

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/456598/expert-says-some-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-sufferers-should-be-exempt-from-covid-19-vaccination

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9 hours ago, psyche101 said:

So someone has to die before you take notice?

Really? 

Sorry but you are wrong. People like Joni Mitchell encourage people like this. They are as responsible as that fool who near murdered an infant.

Terrible that you take a babies life so lightly!! 

No I am not saying someone has to die before I take notice. I'm saying ignorant people do dangerous things. Babies have died because their parents or caregivers have left them alone in a hot car in the sunlight. So should we ban cars because careless/ignorant/drunk people misuse them? I don't get where you think that someone has to die before I take notice. I wonder too if that grandfather was all there mentally...and tbh I don't trust msm to give an accurate account, or even all the details...

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6 hours ago, taniwha said:

I think the usual tools to hush people work well enough.  They're tried and trued.  Look at all the censorship!  Where?  You may well ask!

My point exactly!

Mistrust of science can be a tool for gain.  Advantage through division and  confusion is possibly what we see today. ...The worst case scenario, loosely put, a powerfully complex and self illusory technology exists that scientists have no reason even believing exists, its entirety is hidden beyond our best visionaries and has been carried inside the minds of men as cryptic messages since before the advent of fire. Conveniently, but not obviously, 'breadcrumbs' and instructions, more so, 'discoveries' and knowledge have been left lying about in seemingly random timeframes and so the task of constructing the future patiently begins that eventually earth on earth becomes wood on  wood,  becomes stone on stone becomes steel on steel, becomes....fast forward to present day....and then tomorrow.... not until the exact moment that a human hand screws that last screw tightly down and with no breath of warning that that screw was the final jewel in the crown, man will then, to his absolute paralysing horror, unable to even scream or turn away, understand all at once what he himself has become and the meaning of  The 10,000 Broken Horns.

Lol thats a watered down version because it's a family show.

Back on track.  Thanks to your post I remembered this 

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/456598/expert-says-some-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-sufferers-should-be-exempt-from-covid-19-vaccination

Reading your link, it would be very sad if ME/CFS itself is proven to be a result of bad vaccines, but because of rampant corruption, I doubt it will come to light, sadly... sorry my friend but the rest of your post kinda went over my head. It's above my pay grade I guess lol.

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4 hours ago, Gummug said:

sorry my friend but the rest of your post kinda went over my head. It's above my pay grade I guess lol.

I think it's called 'academese windbag'. Some here on UM speak this meaningless jargon whenever they want to look intellectually superior or try and confuse you. :D

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4 hours ago, Gummug said:

Reading your link, it would be very sad if ME/CFS itself is proven to be a result of bad vaccines, but because of rampant corruption, I doubt it will come to light, sadly... sorry my friend but the rest of your post kinda went over my head. It's above my pay grade I guess lol.

Yes. It's already sad enough that a vaccine has to be forced on the entire earth and as a result people die, and lives are ruined as nations destabilize.

Sad enough too that few doctors have bothered to speak out about vaccine failure on  behalf of patients.

It's sad when doctors are  sentenced by the authorities, demonised by the media and executed in the minds of an unthinking and judgemental public.

If  doctors are the white blood cells of a healthy society, then what's that say about where we are headed?

Will we need to check the govt 'apps' in future just to  find out what colour socks we can wear for the day? Lol

P.s you are lucky to have a pay grade.  Thats more than some have here. :tu:

Cheers

 

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1 hour ago, Katniss said:

I think it's called 'academese windbag'. Some here on UM speak this meaningless jargon whenever they want to look intellectually superior or try and confuse you. :D

Thanks for noticing haha.

In fact your exactly right and the scary thing is that's how govts today gain traction with covid by speaking BS well over people's 'pay' grades as Gummug calls it. 

Cheers, mate :tu:

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9 hours ago, Gummug said:

Reading your link, it would be very sad if ME/CFS itself is proven to be a result of bad vaccines, but because of rampant corruption, I doubt it will come to light, sadly... sorry my friend but the rest of your post kinda went over my head. It's above my pay grade I guess lol.

Do you get this he was on a forum getting his advice?

To you get that it was those people who were also involved and helped this moron guess his way through a treatment that would have killed an infant?

Your support for invermectin is dangerous and irresponsible. That's why I'm quite sure you don't care if little ones, or old ones die as long as the anti government narrative is maintained. 

You are supporting a dangerous ideology from the wrong people. 

Please don't offer your advice to others. I don't want to read about how you lost someone to these silly ideas.

You are now promoting dangerous advice with invermectin.

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4 hours ago, taniwha said:

Thanks for noticing haha.

In fact your exactly right and the scary thing is that's how govts today gain traction with covid by speaking BS well over people's 'pay' grades as Gummug calls it. 

Cheers, mate :tu:

Governments are one thing, but when scientists have that stone cold hard (show me the ) evidence to back up all that they say is another. Otherwise it's like trying to refute 1 + 1 = 2, when we all know it makes sense and it darn well does. :lol:

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2 hours ago, psyche101 said:

Do you get this he was on a forum getting his advice?

To you get that it was those people who were also involved and helped this moron guess his way through a treatment that would have killed an infant?

Your support for invermectin is dangerous and irresponsible. That's why I'm quite sure you don't care if little ones, or old ones die as long as the anti government narrative is maintained. 

You are supporting a dangerous ideology from the wrong people. 

Please don't offer your advice to others. I don't want to read about how you lost someone to these silly ideas.

You are now promoting dangerous advice with invermectin.

I'm sorry you feel this way, psyche, I want to maintain a good relationship with you, but stupid people can be dangerous with anything. I get it you are against ivermectin, but I think more people have been killed with remdesevir and other poison from big pharma...

Okay, no, I didn't know that he was getting advice from an online forum. You would think people would have enough common sense to know that ANY medicine, even aspirin or Tylenol, you have to be careful with the doses, even with adults, moreso with children and infants. I don't know what people were telling him, but I am sure he was not the first, or the last, casualty of bad advice.

What if ivermectin, IN PROPER DOSAGE, and for adults, really does help with covid? Does that mean we should stop talking about it because it might be used wrongly?

Considering children are pretty much immune to covid, I am thinking there was something wrong with this grandpa anyway, he may have been an accident waiting to happen...

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1 hour ago, Gummug said:

I'm sorry you feel this way, psyche, I want to maintain a good relationship with you, but stupid people can be dangerous with anything. I get it you are against ivermectin, but I think more people have been killed with remdesevir and other poison from big pharma...

Okay, no, I didn't know that he was getting advice from an online forum. You would think people would have enough common sense to know that ANY medicine, even aspirin or Tylenol, you have to be careful with the doses, even with adults, moreso with children and infants. I don't know what people were telling him, but I am sure he was not the first, or the last, casualty of bad advice.

What if ivermectin, IN PROPER DOSAGE, and for adults, really does help with covid? Does that mean we should stop talking about it because it might be used wrongly?

Considering children are pretty much immune to covid, I am thinking there was something wrong with this grandpa anyway, he may have been an accident waiting to happen...

I'm just pointing out that he got his advice from the community. People insuring invermectin is helpful. It almost murdered an infant, yet as far as I know neither the grandfather or online people have been charged with attempted murder. IMHO they should be. 

The WHO actually doesn't recommend Remdesevir for treatment of Covid.

https://www.who.int/news-room/feature-stories/detail/who-recommends-against-the-use-of-remdesivir-in-covid-19-patients

Its not an approved treatment either 

There have been posters here supporting the use of invermectin. I would not be surprised at all to find one or more also belong to that forum. Possibly even offered deadly advice. 

Doctors are not supposed to be prescribing invermectin for Covid. Those who do are violating their oath.

Lots of people are suffering over that really bad advice 

https://www.ft.com/content/9715bd16-bcb2-4bfc-bbd9-b7316d787698

 

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2 hours ago, Katniss said:

Governments are one thing, but when scientists have that stone cold hard (show me the ) evidence to back up all that they say is another. Otherwise it's like trying to refute 1 + 1 = 2, when we all know it makes sense and it darn well does. :lol:

I'm not disagreeing I'm just looking from a different angle.  

Take censorship as an example. I had a good couple days on here trying track down a news snippet I remember one way, whereas the other member remembered it the other way. Together we could find no evidence wherever, to back my claim.

Conclusion: 1+1=0 

So because it's missing do I accept it didn't happen when I know it darn well did? 

Of course no proof of censorship means I'm doubly wrong about that claim too.

Ever had your pocket picked unnoticed?  Does it mean you never had your wallet to begin with? Does it follow from that, that the pick pocket never existed either?

Look I'm not trying to teach you how anything goes I'm sure you know anyway but it helps me to understand it better by writing it.

So why wouldnt 'fake science' be a 'real' thing?  A decoy. And why wouldnt you use it if it works?.  It already is working. Fact-checkers, data- analysts and statisticians are free to institute a new reality in the void created by censorship.

If your gonna tell a lie, tell a whopper!

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