CDC: Study Confirms Natural Immunity Stronger Than Vaccines

[toast]

50 minutes ago, Only_ said:

If we are really for the freedom of choice, there shouldn't be any restriction for someone who choose not to be vaccinated.

There are places on Earth where freedom of choice is without limitations, Mogadishu for example. A functioning society isnt possible without guidelines, which must limit the freedom of choice at a certain level, to the benefit of the society. If a minority try to ignore the guidelines, or to call them wrong, then this minority is of a dictatorial mindset.

Unvaxxed people have to live with the needed restrictions, which are designed to enable the physical integrity of the people who do verything possible to keep themselves and others healthy. 

[psyche101]

3 hours ago, Only_ said:

If we are really for the freedom of choice, there shouldn't be any restriction for someone who choose not to be vaccinated.

You're asking for choice without accountability.

That's not a fair proposal.

[Only_]

4 hours ago, stereologist said:

Ridiculous. If you choose to be a threat to others then restrictions are required.

I'm pointing out the inconsistencies. You can't be for the right to choose to be vaccinated or not and then support imposing restrictions on those people.

That don't make sense to me.

Quote

Babies cannot be vaccinated. You want to allow people to be baby killers?

That seems to be a rare occurrence.

Don't forget, there are babies that also dies from the flu. Do you support imposing restrictions on people who don't take the flu vaccine?

Quote

Transplant recipients have reduced immune systems. You want to allow people to kill transplant recipients?

Cancer patients have reduced immune systems. You want to allow people to kill cancer survivors?

Again, individuals who have a compromised immune system are at risk of many other viruses than Covid-19.

The CDC has a whole guideline in that situation on how to avoid catching or spreading germs.

Still, I wouldn't want to be in that position.

Edited January 28, 2022 by Only_

[Only_]

4 hours ago, toast said:

Unvaxxed people have to live with the needed restrictions, which are designed to enable the physical integrity of the people who do verything possible to keep themselves and others healthy. 

I don't see it that way. I chose to be vaccinated to protect myself.

I don't expect more from a vaccine (it's not a panacea) and unless dictatorship and brute force be employed I certainly don't expect that everyone will choose to be vaccinated.

We have to do everything we can be stay healthy, protect the vulnerable while also respecting the rights of others. I understand that isn't easy. But I think it can be done without falling for one extreme or the other.

Edited January 28, 2022 by Only_

[toast]

3 hours ago, Only_ said:

 But I think it can be done without falling for one extreme or the other.

The term extreme is relative here. We have to manage a situation that is extreme because the virus itself is merciless in its actions so, effective  actions might look extreme to a few but the personal sensitivities of these people should not be taken into account and/or as a scale.

 

[taniwha]

As for the topic and the post in question, I conclude its a fair analysis.

I don't know about stereos qualifications either or Isabella's, all I can tell you is I'm not a Dr either I've probably been to the hospital only 3x  before, and that was to hold someone else's hand 

You might be medically correct on the terminology concerning myocarditis and blood clots v heart attacks.

If your heart fails it sends you cardiac arrest from my understanding.  I guess for the appropriate treatments sakes it's critical not to split hairs on the issue, so I agree with you for pointing that out.

I have a sister in Perth she is paramedic.  She took the jab to keep her job.  I have never talked to her since covid.

Her boyfriend is a regular Outback Dundee.  He has a red dog that is the same red colour as his sheep, their diet must be 1 part pellets and 2 parts sand or else they are just permenantly sunburned, or evolved to look like the desert.

He was talking about sunglasses for his hardy flock at one stage but he got sidetracked and instead got busy and invented the world's first and only harmonica boomerang cool thing is it  whizzles waltzing matilda.

That's what it's called, a Whizzling Matilda, changed the name for copyright purposes of course. Reckons he won't mass produce it cos b***** paying Banjo and that  Ralph character royalties everytime someone throws it, even if they get sick of it and throw it away, more money out his pocket he reckons. 

You OZs are something else though,  go 'walkabout', get over it, couple days later, come back, good as gold, eh?just like boomerangs lol 

Cheers 

 

Edited January 28, 2022 by taniwha

[taniwha]

1 hour ago, toast said:

The term extreme is relative here. We have to manage a situation that is extreme because the virus itself is merciless in its actions so, effective  actions might look extreme to a few but the personal sensitivities of these people should not be taken into account and/or as a scale.

 

Except it is extreme, even to the majority, and it's the few that made the decision. A few Politicians.

[toast]

19 minutes ago, taniwha said:

...  and it's the few that made the decision. A few Politicians.

Decision were taken based on scientific data which are absolute and independant from opinions. Covidiots who ignore scientific data and act based on stupid opinions only, require strict guidelines and have to accept restrictions.

[taniwha]

21 minutes ago, toast said:

Decision were taken based on scientific data which are absolute and independant from opinions. Covidiots who ignore scientific data and act based on stupid opinions only, require strict guidelines and have to accept restrictions.

Lol I agree, the decision makers probably don't have a choice about it.

Vaxaholics might even agree with me on that 

[taniwha]

On 1/27/2022 at 2:15 PM, stereologist said:

Already posted the evidence in this thread. If you choose not to follow the thread then so be it.

Problems with natural immunity:

• Roughly 1/3 of people infected with COVID-19 do not show signs of natural immunity
• Natural immunity wanes faster than vaccine induced immunity

Being asymptomatic has nothing to do with the 1/3. You really don't understand the issues or take the time to follow the posted evidence.

And actually I posted the evidence in this thread that natural immunity fades faster than vaccine induced immunity.

You have proved multiple times that you are not following the thread.

It's a twisted truth you choose to believe because interpretation is key.

In at least one study cohort recipients in the previously infected group were not subject to pre trial antibody testing, and there is no evidence to calculate how many in all of the previously vaccinated groups were in fact covid positive at the time of their initial vaccinations.

Such incomplete safeguards would slew any correct answer your way mine.

Obvious, the data comes to you as no surprise at all, it seems the only thing that you find surprising is why anyone would be surprised by it.

This is an interesting question for you.

Would the CDC have a model or forecast of expected outcomes?

If so how correct was it?

That would be a better gauge on the size of the 'bombshell'.

Cheers 

 

[taniwha]

16 hours ago, thedutchiedutch said:

My point is better safe than sorry so I get vaccinated. In regards to the studies what I meant is that more studies and research is needed in regards to natural immunity vs vaccines because different studies are counteracting each other. I do agree that it should be a choice to get vaccinated yes or no but at the same token if you choose not to get vaccinated you will have to put up with the restrictions. It's that simple. 

100% agree, just as everyone else will have to put up with the protests until change happens for the better, end of  

[taniwha]

On 1/27/2022 at 6:01 PM, F3SS said:

Fully vaccinated isn't recognized anymore. "Up to date" is the new term. 

That amount of flippy flopps and still he isn't breathless. If he is the puppet, I wonder who the ventriloquist is. 

Makes me wonder if an artificial intelligence is the oracle of truth.  Some of the plot twists are out right sinister.

Like get vaxxed, save your life. Morphs into get vaxxed save everyone else's life.

Hard to make that up but not for deep blue haha.

[F3SS]

1 hour ago, taniwha said:

That amount of flippy flopps and still he isn't breathless. If he is the puppet, I wonder who the ventriloquist is. 

Makes me wonder if an artificial intelligence is the oracle of truth.  Some of the plot twists are out right sinister.

Like get vaxxed, save your life. Morphs into get vaxxed save everyone else's life.

Hard to make that up but not for deep blue haha.

I don't think we're in the ai realm yet but up to date is an underhanded way of saying you'll never comply your way out of this. 

[stereologist]

12 hours ago, Only_ said:

I'm pointing out the inconsistencies. You can't be for the right to choose to be vaccinated or not and then support imposing restrictions on those people.

That don't make sense to me.

That seems to be a rare occurrence.

Don't forget, there are babies that also dies from the flu. Do you support imposing restrictions on people who don't take the flu vaccine?

Again, individuals who have a compromised immune system are at risk of many other viruses than Covid-19.

The CDC has a whole guideline in that situation on how to avoid catching or spreading germs.

Still, I wouldn't want to be in that position.

I think you are very confused about my position. I am not for allowing people to choose to be vaccinated or not.

COVID-19 is not the flu. It is far more widespread than the flu. It kills more than the flu. COVID-19 has more lasting damage than the flu. Your suggestion is without merit.

The simple fact is that there are those that cannot  be vaccinated and allowing those unwilling to get vaccinated be a threat the general population is in my opinion a terrible selfish thing to do.

[stereologist]

6 hours ago, taniwha said:

It's a twisted truth you choose to believe because interpretation is key.

In at least one study cohort recipients in the previously infected group were not subject to pre trial antibody testing, and there is no evidence to calculate how many in all of the previously vaccinated groups were in fact covid positive at the time of their initial vaccinations.

Such incomplete safeguards would slew any correct answer your way mine.

Obvious, the data comes to you as no surprise at all, it seems the only thing that you find surprising is why anyone would be surprised by it.

This is an interesting question for you.

Would the CDC have a model or forecast of expected outcomes?

If so how correct was it?

That would be a better gauge on the size of the 'bombshell'.

Cheers 

 

You seem to not be following the evidence. Let's see if  can help you out. Here is a recent study which also refers to a published article from last year also showing you are mistaken.

https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciimmunol.abn8014

Quote

It has been well established that natural infection alone provides short-lived protection from infection, (17) showing the importance of vaccination, regardless of infection history. Because vaccination protects against severe disease and death, (19) it is safer for individuals to be vaccinated before rather than after natural infection.

Bolding mine.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8360277/

Quote

This study found that among Kentucky residents who were previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 in 2020, those who were unvaccinated against COVID-19 had significantly higher likelihood of reinfection during May and June 2021. This finding supports the CDC recommendation that all eligible persons be offered COVID-19 vaccination, regardless of previous SARS-CoV-2 infection status.

In other words as the referencing article points out, immunity from natural infection is short lived.

As shown by evidence

Problems with natural immunity:

• Roughly 1/3 of people infected with COVID-19 do not show signs of natural immunity
• Natural immunity wanes faster than vaccine induced immunity

 

[F3SS]

2 hours ago, stereologist said:

I think you are very confused about my position. I am not for allowing people to choose to be vaccinated or not.

COVID-19 is not the flu. It is far more widespread than the flu. It kills more than the flu. COVID-19 has more lasting damage than the flu. Your suggestion is without merit.

The simple fact is that there are those that cannot  be vaccinated and allowing those unwilling to get vaccinated be a threat the general population is in my opinion a terrible selfish thing to do.

So you feel that people should ultimately be forced at gunpoint, pinned down, tackled, doors kicked and and injected against their will? Sounds extreme but if you don't belive in personal choice here then how should it go? Your stance is insane. 

[Only_]

3 hours ago, stereologist said:

I think you are very confused about my position. I am not for allowing people to choose to be vaccinated or not.

So you are for a totalitarian approach?

Where coercion and brute force are used to serve your convictions? How else can you get 100% of the population vaccinated then by treating the unvaccinated as a subclass of citizens, not worthy of any rights or considerations?
 

Quote

COVID-19 is not the flu. It is far more widespread than the flu. It kills more than the flu. COVID-19 has more lasting damage than the flu. Your suggestion is without merit.

I'm pointing out the flu as a clear example. There was a world before 2020. There were people (including babies) dying of influenza. Are these people less important to you?

How can you justify the double standard of advocating mandatory vaccination for Covid-19 but not the flu? That's my question.

Quote

The simple fact is that there are those that cannot  be vaccinated and allowing those unwilling to get vaccinated be a threat the general population is in my opinion a terrible selfish thing to do.

You do realize that ~3% of the population has a weakened immune system for a variety of reasons? It's far from the general population. Unvaccinated people may not always be the reason why they are a greater risk of severe illness from COVID, sometimes it's the medications and dosages that might affect the risks and vaccine response. I think the issue is more complex than you are willing to admit.

Edited January 28, 2022 by Only_

[stereologist]

18 hours ago, F3SS said:

So you feel that people should ultimately be forced at gunpoint, pinned down, tackled, doors kicked and and injected against their will? Sounds extreme but if you don't belive in personal choice here then how should it go? Your stance is insane. 

Thanks for another pointless insane post.

The idea of "gunpoint, pinned down, tackled, doors kicked and and injected against their will" has not happened with mandates. Clearly your hyperbole is nothing a joke of a rant as had been almost all of your commentary

 

[stereologist]

19 hours ago, Only_ said:

So you are for a totalitarian approach?

Where coercion and brute force are used to serve your convictions? How else can you get 100% of the population vaccinated then by treating the unvaccinated as a subclass of citizens, not worthy of any rights or considerations?
 

I'm pointing out the flu as a clear example. There was a world before 2020. There were people (including babies) dying of influenza. Are these people less important to you?

How can you justify the double standard of advocating mandatory vaccination for Covid-19 but not the flu? That's my question.

You do realize that ~3% of the population has a weakened immune system for a variety of reasons? It's far from the general population. Unvaccinated people may not always be the reason why they are a greater risk of severe illness from COVID, sometimes it's the medications and dosages that might affect the risks and vaccine response. I think the issue is more complex than you are willing to admit.

Mandates have worked without brute force. So wake up and get back to reality.

The flu is a terrible example. I've pointed out why, but you seem unable to comprehend even third grade level concepts.

Let's try one last time. COVID-19 is far deadlier than the seasonal flu. COVID-19 does not infect and leave without injuring a significant percentage of people. COVID-19 and the seasonal flu are very different. Therefore there is no double standard.

Not getting vaccinated is a selfish act.

Edited January 29, 2022 by stereologist

[F3SS]

25 minutes ago, stereologist said:

Thanks for another pointless insane post.

The idea of "gunpoint, pinned down, tackled, doors kicked and and injected against their will" has not happened with mandates. Clearly your hyperbole is nothing a joke of a rant as had been almost all of your commentary

 

 

15 minutes ago, stereologist said:

Mandates have worked with brute force.

 

You're all about it man. You'd cheer it on if it came down to it. 

[stereologist]

6 minutes ago, F3SS said:

 

 

You're all about it man. You'd cheer it on if it came down to it. 

Thanks for pointing out my bad typing.

Quote

Mandates have worked without brute force. So wake up and get back to reality.

 

[F3SS]

29 minutes ago, stereologist said:

Thanks for pointing out my bad typing.

 

Fair enough but when you state that you are not for people's right to choose to get the shots just how do you think it goes? Get the shot, there is no choice or else... What? 

[quiXilver]

On 1/25/2022 at 10:22 PM, taniwha said:

That's 6 months since... Did you miss the booster or forego it?

August to February is six months captn maths.

22 hours ago, F3SS said:

So you feel that people should ultimately be forced at gunpoint, pinned down, tackled, doors kicked and and injected against their will? Sounds extreme but if you don't belive in personal choice here then how should it go? Your stance is insane. 

I think folks should be allowed to continue to forgoe the shot and continue to wear their @$$ for a hat.  It comforts them and keeps them warm.

[F3SS]

12 minutes ago, quiXilver said:

I think folks should be allowed to continue to forgoe the shot and continue to wear their @$$ for a hat.  It comforts them and keeps them warm.

Great thank you. That's how it should be. 

[stereologist]

I am for mandated vaccinations to protect the public. Where is this stupidity of the anti-vaxx sums coming from from? Apparently from politicians.

The former president of the US and Brazil are two prime examples of anti-science politicians.

I wonder if their idiotic anti-science stances will change voting in the future as they get more of their followers to get sick or die, and opt for fake useless remedies.