Russia Masses Military Equipment Near Ukraine Borders: A Prologue to WWIII?

[el midgetron]

5 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

So surrender to the aggressor to avoid fighting, real coward move.

I love you tough guys. You are so manly and brave, 

Selling oil is the same thing as taking a hand-out and negotiating peace is the same thing as “surrendering”. The brave “defenders” hiding under a steel plant were “evacuated” by Russia forces, 

Ukraine can’t even defend its self and at some point the international community is going to cut its loses. Facing that reality could have saved tens of thousands of innocent Ukrainians so far, Tough guys don’t negotiate though, 

[Helen of Annoy]

And one for Putler's groupies, so they realize their dream is to surrender to a... shaky babushka. 

(I hope his tremors are a symptom he's being slowly poisoned.)

 

[DarkHunter]

3 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

I love you tough guys. You are so manly and brave, 

Selling oil is the same thing as taking a hand-out and negotiating peace is the same thing as “surrendering”. The brave “defenders” hiding under a steel plant were “evacuated” by Russia forces, 

Ukraine can’t even defend its self and at some point the international community is going to cut its loses. Facing that reality could have saved tens of thousands of innocent Ukrainians so far, Tough guys don’t negotiate though, 

Ukraine seems to be doing well with only getting 10% to 15% of what they need, pushed back Russia from Kyiv, Chernihiv, and Sumy.  Ukraine is gaining ground in Kherson and the Russians have nearly been pushed out of Kharkiv.  Seems Ukraine is doing fine.

It seems America and Europe understand that Russia needs stopped and if they arent stopped in Ukraine it will be the Baltic states or Poland next.

[+Nuclear Wessel]

4 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

negotiating peace is the same thing as “surrendering”.

What kind of negotiations do you think Putin would agree to, and honour 100%? If your answer is conceding anything less than 100% of Ukraine, you are delusional. In this case, negotiating peace is the same thing as surrendering.

8 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

The brave “defenders” hiding under a steel plant were “evacuated” by Russia forces, 

You realize they were all pretty heavily wounded and running very low on supplies, right? What else would you have had them do?

10 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Ukraine can’t even defend its self and at some point the international community is going to cut its loses.

The international community has provided overwhelming support and will continue to do so. If you think support is going to die off, you're sorely mistaken.

[Silver]

1 hour ago, Knob Oddy said:

Hahaha, is that the real MoD twitter account? LGBT flag in the profile picture, with #standwithukraine and the Ukrainian flag.

I mean, you can't support homosexuality and homophobia at the same time. Actually, apparently you can

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Ukraine

Is there something about the British military that you find risable? Is it supporting Ukraine and gay rights that amuses you? A lot of organisations do both.

Edited June 22, 2022 by The Silver Shroud

[spartan max2]

18 minutes ago, Trelane said:

It just keeps getting funnier. The mask has been pulled off the liar's face.

http://New Pew poll: International views on NATO, U.S. rise; Russia decline

"In a time of crisis, the international image of the United States, NATO and Russia has shifted — with views on Russia plunging and views of the United States and NATO remaining positive, even increasing, a new Pew study of 18 nations found."

"In Poland, the shifts have been dramatic. Views on the United States, European Union and NATO have reached all time highs — all hovering around 90 percent — since the question was first asked in 2007. And views on Russia plummeted down from one-third of Poles sharing a favorable view in 2019 to a measly 2 percent in 2022."

 

Prior to the invasion, many in Europe believed the US was just warmongering about Russia.

But then Russia actually invaded Ukraine, making it all clear 

[el midgetron]

19 minutes ago, Helen of Annoy said:

Surrendering to Ruzzians is also a suicidal move. They don't hide their intention to erase Ukrainian identity. 

Ukraine will cease to exist if Ukrainians surrender. 

I know you know, I just want to rub Putler bots' noses in it.  

No one is suggesting “surrendering”. That’s not a thing suggested anywhere here.

 Do you have anything to support your claim that Russia wants to “erase Ukrainian” identity? I believe the negotiation terms Russia proposed just stipulated Ukrainian “neutrality”.  

[spartan max2]

5 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

No one is suggesting “surrendering”. That’s not a thing suggested anywhere here.

 Do you have anything to support your claim that Russia wants to “erase Ukrainian” identity? I believe the negotiation terms Russia proposed just stipulated Ukrainian “neutrality”.  

Not sure how you could trust anything Putin says after he told the world he wouldn't invade Ukraine.

Putin definition of neutrality means a puppet government that listens to the Kremlin. Ukraine was already neutral. Evidence by the fact they never joined NATO or the EU.

Which was clearly a mistake not to join. Free and independent nations should be free to make alliances as they see fit. 

 

Edited June 22, 2022 by spartan max2

[el midgetron]

8 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

Ukraine seems to be doing well with only getting 10% to 15% of what they need, pushed back Russia from Kyiv, Chernihiv, and Sumy.  Ukraine is gaining ground in Kherson and the Russians have nearly been pushed out of Kharkiv.  Seems Ukraine is doing fine.

It seems America and Europe understand that Russia needs stopped and if they arent stopped in Ukraine it will be the Baltic states or Poland next.

And here’s the political time-bomb, my colleagues reported: Those who want the war over worry their governments have put “action against Russia ahead of other important issues, such as rising inflation and the cost-of-living crisis.”

That obviously has echoes in the United States.

You can hear it in the message from some major European countries, like France, Germany and Italy, which have all signaled support for negotiations to end the war. That has irked Ukraine, because talks would begin with Russia holding large swaths of its territory, unlikely to give them up

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/06/16/us-support-ukraine-test-is-coming/

Biden says Ukraine might have to give Russia land in ‘negotiated settlement’
 

https://nypost.com/2022/06/03/biden-says-ukraine-might-have-to-give-russia-land/

[el midgetron]

2 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Not sure how you could trust anything Putin says after he told the world he wouldn't invade Ukraine.

Putin definition of neutrality means a puppet government that listens to the Kremlin. Ukraine was already neutral. Evidence by the fact they never joined NATO or the EU.

Which was clearly a mistake not to join. Free and independent nations should be free to make alliances as they see fit. 

Ukraine was not already neutral. Ukraine has been receiving US military aid in the war against Russia for 8 years….

 

[Knob Oddy]

13 minutes ago, The Silver Shroud said:

Is there something about the British military that you find risable? Is it supporting Ukraine and gay rights that amuses you? A lot of organisations do both.

Cognitive dissonance. Yes it is risable

[spartan max2]

11 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Ukraine was not already neutral. Ukraine has been receiving US military aid in the war against Russia for 8 years….

 

Did Ukraine invade Russia?

Or did Ukraine receive weapons out of fear of being invaded.

Edited June 22, 2022 by spartan max2

[Helen of Annoy]

23 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

No one is suggesting “surrendering”. That’s not a thing suggested anywhere here.

 Do you have anything to support your claim that Russia wants to “erase Ukrainian” identity? I believe the negotiation terms Russia proposed just stipulated Ukrainian “neutrality”.  

I believe no one sane believes in anything Ruzzia says. 

I find your question bizarre.  

But let it be answered: Bucha, Irpin, Kherson, Mariupol and every other place where your idols tortured and murdered Ukrainians. 

 

And be aware that your hard work for Putler is making me more determined to do everything I can to stop that putlerian disease. 

Edited June 22, 2022 by Helen of Annoy

[el midgetron]

1 minute ago, spartan max2 said:

Did Ukraine invade Russia?

Or did Ukraine receive weapons out of fear of being invaded.

Does either of those thing impact the fact that Ukraine was not neutral like you claimed?

[spartan max2]

2 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Does either of those thing impact the fact that Ukraine was not neutral like you claimed?

Wanting weapons for self-defense does not negate neutrality. That's pretty silly logic you have there.

[Helen of Annoy]

An oldie but goldie. Not only it still applies, it applies more with each day. 

 

[el midgetron]

Just now, Helen of Annoy said:

But let them be answered: Bucha, Irpin, Kherson, Mariupol and every other place where your idols tortured and murdered Ukrainians. 

I see. So the casualties of the war that Ukraine refused to negotiate an end to is the evidence that Russia want to erase Ukrainian identity. 

It’s apparent some of the pro war members here really enjoy throwing around the war rhetoric. I don’t think it helps the situation.

What do you make of Biden suggesting zelelnsky might been to give Russia land in a negotiated settlement? #7214 

Is Biden crazy? Senile? A Putler fan boy?

[DarkHunter]

Just now, el midgetron said:

I see. So the casualties of the war that Ukraine refused to negotiate an end to is the evidence that Russia want to erase Ukrainian identity. 

It’s apparent some of the pro war members here really enjoy throwing around the war rhetoric. I don’t think it helps the situation.

What do you make of Biden suggesting zelelnsky might been to give Russia land in a negotiated settlement? #7214 

Is Biden crazy? Senile? A Putler fan boy?

Russia deciding that the Ukranian language wont be taught in occupied territory, burning every book of Ukranian history that the Russian military can find, purposefully demolishing anything and everything of Ukranian cultural importance in occupied territories, the running of what Russia calls filtration camps (really concentration camps), forced relocation of Ukranian citizens into Russia's central and far east regions where they are used as slave labor, the use of rape as a weapon and mass execution of Ukranians in occupied territory.  All of that is Russis trying to erase Ukrainian identity.

[spartan max2]

6 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

I see. So the casualties of the war that Ukraine refused to negotiate an end to is the evidence that Russia want to erase Ukrainian identity. 

It’s apparent some of the pro war members here really enjoy throwing around the war rhetoric. I don’t think it helps the situation.

What do you make of Biden suggesting zelelnsky might been to give Russia land in a negotiated settlement? #7214 

Is Biden crazy? Senile? A Putler fan boy?

Causalities are unintentional deaths.

The deaths Helen referenced were very intentional 

[el midgetron]

9 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Wanting weapons for self-defense does not negate neutrality. That's pretty silly logic you have there.

Mkay. Ukraine can receive military aid from the US to fight against Russia and simultaneously maintain “neutrality”. Very interesting. 
 

[spartan max2]

3 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Mkay. Ukraine can receive military aid from the US to fight against Russia and simultaneously maintain “neutrality”. Very interesting. 
 

So by your logic to be "neutral" you are not allowed to own weapons to defend yourself?

That seems like a pretty one sided definition of neutrality. 

That's like saying if I own a gun to defend my house for if a break in happens than I'm not "neutral" towards my neighbor apparently .

Russia broke neutrality by invading a nation. 

Edited June 22, 2022 by spartan max2

[Silver]

I was thinking about the MOD tweet gving casualties of over 50%. I am guessing that Ukrainian casualties are also high. You go into a battle with 200 men, and return with less than 100. How do the Russians persuade their men to go into battle with those odds? I can understand the Ukrainian motivation, they are literally fighting for their lives and defending their country. But what are the Russian fighting for? Even if they believed their own propaganda surely they must think the Ukrainians should sort their own **** out, the price is too high.

[+and-then]

On 6/21/2022 at 11:51 AM, Tatetopa said:

A question for those who know more about diplomacy and military practice than I do:

Russia says Americans captured are mercenaries and have no rights under the Geneva Convention.

Would the same be applied to Wagner mercenaries captured by Ukraine?  That does not seem like a morale booster for Wagner employees.

 

 

Mercs do not have the legal protection that uniformed soldiers do.  I assume that ideological types who truly volunteer out of a passion to help are probably treated as Mercs as well.

[el midgetron]

5 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Causalities are unintentional deaths.

The deaths Helen referenced were very intentional 

Spartan, I don’t know why you seem to seek me out but this kind of post by you is becoming tiresome. You are literally just making things up. Please cite something that supports “casualties” only being “unintentional” deaths. 
 

https://schoolresources.militaryfamilies.psu.edu/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Casualty-Statuses-Types-and-Categories.pdf

https://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/casualty

https://www.encyclopedia.com/history/dictionaries-thesauruses-pictures-and-press-releases/war-casualties

[spartan max2]

3 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Spartan, I don’t know why you seem to seek me out but this kind of post by you is becoming tiresome. You are literally just making things up. Please cite something that supports “casualties” only being “unintentional” deaths. 
 

https://schoolresources.militaryfamilies.psu.edu/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Casualty-Statuses-Types-and-Categories.pdf

https://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/casualty

https://www.encyclopedia.com/history/dictionaries-thesauruses-pictures-and-press-releases/war-casualties

Okay. My misunderstanding. I don't see a need to get bogged down in the definition of causality.

As we are in agreement that many of the civilians deaths were intentional. Which was my point.

Edited June 22, 2022 by spartan max2