Russia Masses Military Equipment Near Ukraine Borders: A Prologue to WWIII?

[Helen of Annoy]

The ice hockey player I mentioned before, Ivan Fedotov, here's the link in English with basic info (but it's been mentioned elsewhere that he suffers sudden, intense stomach pain - may I be wrong, but it reminds me of the poisoning of Navalny)

 

https://www.rferl.org/a/russia-ice-hockey-fedotov-evasion-military-service/31925048.html

Russian ice hockey goalkeeper Ivan Fedotov was taken by ambulance from the St. Petersburg military commissariat during the night of July 1-2 and hospitalized, Russian media reported.

Russian authorities made no official statement on the reports, and no information about the state of Fedotov’s health was reported.

Earlier on July 1, Fedotov, 25, had been detained at the request of military prosecutors on suspicion of avoiding military service.

Last month, Fedotov -- one of Russia’s best goalkeepers and a member of the national team -- signed an entry-level contract with the Philadelphia Flyers of the U.S. National Hockey League and planned to quit his Russian club, Central Sport Club of the Army (CSKA), to play in the United States.

[el midgetron]

Ukraine’s farmers face Russia’s blockade and ordinance in their farms this harvest

Liubchenko, 72, farms wheat and sunflowers on the front lines of the Ukraine war’s southern campaign. He says he paid off Russian soldiers with samogon — moonshine — so they wouldn’t torch his fields or steal his equipment in the early weeks of the war in February.

“They were completely drunk,” he says. “They didn’t steal anything or destroy anything. The next day our Ukrainian forces pushed them back.”

Months later, burned Russian tanks and vehicles still line the farm roads that square his several-thousand-acre plots. Red flags sprout above young sunflower shoots, alerting farmhands to unexploded ordnance left behind. A rocket sits perched on a tree trunk, in what looks like it was once a defensive military position.

“I have 1,000 hectares [2,471 acres] of winter wheat and barley, that I don’t know how to harvest. I’ll probably just light it on fire,” he says. “If I let combines and tractors work, drivers could be blown up because there are still some shells.”….…

…..For Khmilenko, if he cannot sell this year, he says he’ll be out about $70,000. “If we lose this it will be impossible to rebuild. I paid too much in this business to recover it,” he says.

https://www.witf.org/2022/07/03/ukraines-farmers-face-russias-blockade-and-ordinance-in-their-farms-this-harvest/

[Helen of Annoy]

11 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:

Both videos violate the Geneva Convention.

They don`t get to ask if they want to go on camera, they are in a position where if they don`t cooperate they are for it.

I'll let you know if I ever need a legal advice from your parallel universe.  

(The very first minutes of the video show the interviewer explaining to the captives their rights, instructs them to refuse freely if they want to do so and for the entire video you can't see a single guy who had any objections to being given a chance to force Russia to exchange him so he can finally go home.)

This is not Russia, that sends hostages literally to Vladivostok, that uploads recordings of murdered POW after his mother couldn't pay the ransom, that steals children and doesn't recognize human, let alone civil rights of prisoners. 

When details about Russian treatment of POWs emerge in their full horror, Russia and its suppositories among westerners will be even more despised.  

[Helen of Annoy]

7 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Ukraine’s farmers face Russia’s blockade and ordinance in their farms this harvest

Liubchenko, 72, farms wheat and sunflowers on the front lines of the Ukraine war’s southern campaign. He says he paid off Russian soldiers with samogon — moonshine — so they wouldn’t torch his fields or steal his equipment in the early weeks of the war in February.

“They were completely drunk,” he says. “They didn’t steal anything or destroy anything. The next day our Ukrainian forces pushed them back.”

Months later, burned Russian tanks and vehicles still line the farm roads that square his several-thousand-acre plots. Red flags sprout above young sunflower shoots, alerting farmhands to unexploded ordnance left behind. A rocket sits perched on a tree trunk, in what looks like it was once a defensive military position.

“I have 1,000 hectares [2,471 acres] of winter wheat and barley, that I don’t know how to harvest. I’ll probably just light it on fire,” he says. “If I let combines and tractors work, drivers could be blown up because there are still some shells.”….…

…..For Khmilenko, if he cannot sell this year, he says he’ll be out about $70,000. “If we lose this it will be impossible to rebuild. I paid too much in this business to recover it,” he says.

https://www.witf.org/2022/07/03/ukraines-farmers-face-russias-blockade-and-ordinance-in-their-farms-this-harvest/

Cherry-picking much? No one is smart enough to notice this fine manipulation, huh? Nah. I can see right through it. 

 

No, it wouldn't be so nice and sweet if only drunk Russians were allowed to blackmail the farmer. It would not be a happy end, as it was implied. (Story is told in a way supposed to lead the reader into conclusion that Ukrainian army is to be blamed for loss of crops - though it's Russia that invaded Ukraine and only if Russian army would **** off, no loss of anything would happen.)  

And even if farmers would agree to be blackmailed and screwed by drunk orcs, they'd still lose their crops. 

Because Russia is stealing Ukrainian grains. 

https://www.bbc.com/news/61790625

 There's mounting evidence that Russian forces in occupied areas of Ukraine have been systematically stealing grain and other produce from local farmers. The BBC has talked to farmers and analysed satellite images and shipping data to track where the grain is going.

 

"They stole our grain. They destroyed our premises, destroyed our equipment."

 

[Trelane]

Seems like a pretty brutal price to pay for a sliver of land they have taken illegally. land they won't likely get to keep in the long run.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russia-military-deaths-pass-36k-ukraine-says-as-putin-s-gains-exact-heavy-toll/ar-AAZbnG4?ocid=msedgntphdr&cvid=8a026624e37748d7a4885f42367bf91d

"Putin has also lost 1,589 tanks, 3,754 armored combat vehicles, 804 artillery systems, 246 multiple rocket launchers, 105 air defense systems, 217 aircraft, 658 operational-tactical UAVs, 15 warships, 2,629 vehicles and tankers, and 187 helicopters, according to Ukraine's combat losses update."

That's one hell of a butcher's bill for an alleged military powerhouse. Getting ground into nothing for small slices of land and decimated towns is tactically incompetent on every level of combat planning. Strategically speaking Russia has already failed, spectacularly so. 

Edited July 4, 2022 by Trelane

[el midgetron]

7 minutes ago, Helen of Annoy said:

Cherry-picking much? No one is smart enough to notice this fine manipulation, huh? Nah. I can see right through it. 

No, it wouldn't be so nice and sweet if only drunk Russians were allowed to blackmail the farmer. It would not be a happy end, as it was implied. (Story is told in a way supposed to lead the reader into conclusion that Ukrainian army is to be blamed for loss of crops - though it's Russia that invaded Ukraine and only if Russian army would **** off, no loss of anything would happen.)  

And even if farmers would agree to be blackmailed and screwed by drunk orcs, they'd still lose their crops. 

Because Russia is stealing Ukrainian grains. 

https://www.bbc.com/news/61790625

 There's mounting evidence that Russian forces in occupied areas of Ukraine have been systematically stealing grain and other produce from local farmers. The BBC has talked to farmers and analysed satellite images and shipping data to track where the grain is going.

 

"They stole our grain. They destroyed our premises, destroyed our equipment."

 

No idea what you are even talking about. Nothing in what I quote implies Ukrainian forces are destroying the crops. My quotation clearly says he had to bribe Russian troops to keep them from stealing his equipment and destroying his crops. 
 

I posted the story to highlight the reality the war has created for Ukrainian farmers and by extent the food crisis it is expected to cause. 

[el midgetron]

Three Ukrainian soldiers who’ve served in the Donbas have described the fighting there as brutal. They say the Russian troops they faced are far more experienced and ruthless than those who tried to take Kyiv in the spring.

“Russians like to destroy a city, a village, totally. Never mind who’s there - Ukrainian civilians or military,” Mark, a volunteer fighter just back from the front line in the Luhansk region, told me.

He said Russia was using its overwhelming firepower to "wipe out" villages in its advance, leaving the Ukrainians with little cover. 

Another soldier, Nikolai, told me he’d be lying if he didn’t admit it was "terrifying". 

They asked for more support, more weapons.

All three soldiers agree with Ukraine pulling back when its troops are outgunned: “It’s very hard to hold ground. It’s a lot of deaths. There’s nothing left there now anyway. No civilians. No city. They bombed it all."

https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-europe-62035108?ns_mchannel=social&ns_source=twitter&ns_campaign=bbc_live&ns_linkname=62c303499db6d5693fa58287%26Volunteer fighters 'want payback'%2C as Russians 'wipe out' Luhansk%262022-07-04T15%3A35%3A04.790Z&ns_fee=0&pinned_post_locator=urn:asset:b8636f7a-3a01-4210-ad61-479074acc5b9&pinned_post_asset_id=62c303499db6d5693fa58287&pinned_post_type=share

[Helen of Annoy]

9 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

No idea what you are even talking about. Nothing in what I quote implies Ukrainian forces are destroying the crops. My quotation clearly says he had to bribe Russian troops to keep them from stealing his equipment and destroying his crops. 
 

I posted the story to highlight the reality the war has created for Ukrainian farmers and by extent the food crisis it is expected to cause. 

And now I explained to you in very simple words that the material you posted is meant to mislead people into criminally wrong conclusion that letting drunk orcs **** on your head is the way to go, because if you resist, drunk orc will destroy your fields. 

Such perverse manipulation is wrong by default, but it's also wrong because Russia is not only destroying Ukrainian crops, Russia is stealing Ukrainian crops. (See link in my previous post.)

You will undoubtedly thank me for taking time to clear it up a little for you. 

You're welcome. Just say when you need further clarifications. That Russian disinformation minefield can be tricky to navigate.    

Edited July 4, 2022 by Helen of Annoy

[Helen of Annoy]

4 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Three Ukrainian soldiers who’ve served in the Donbas have described the fighting there as brutal. They say the Russian troops they faced are far more experienced and ruthless than those who tried to take Kyiv in the spring.

“Russians like to destroy a city, a village, totally. Never mind who’s there - Ukrainian civilians or military,” Mark, a volunteer fighter just back from the front line in the Luhansk region, told me.

He said Russia was using its overwhelming firepower to "wipe out" villages in its advance, leaving the Ukrainians with little cover. 

Another soldier, Nikolai, told me he’d be lying if he didn’t admit it was "terrifying". 

They asked for more support, more weapons.

All three soldiers agree with Ukraine pulling back when its troops are outgunned: “It’s very hard to hold ground. It’s a lot of deaths. There’s nothing left there now anyway. No civilians. No city. They bombed it all."

https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-europe-62035108?ns_mchannel=social&ns_source=twitter&ns_campaign=bbc_live&ns_linkname=62c303499db6d5693fa58287%26Volunteer fighters 'want payback'%2C as Russians 'wipe out' Luhansk%262022-07-04T15%3A35%3A04.790Z&ns_fee=0&pinned_post_locator=urn:asset:b8636f7a-3a01-4210-ad61-479074acc5b9&pinned_post_asset_id=62c303499db6d5693fa58287&pinned_post_type=share

Whose fault is this?

Edited July 4, 2022 by Helen of Annoy

[Helen of Annoy]

Excellent but long read: 

https://kyivindependent.com/national/how-western-heavy-weaponry-can-make-a-difference-in-the-war-in-ukraine

 

Sums up to: 

“Artillery sweat saves infantry blood.”

and Ukraine needs more weapons, they have proven already they can use it right. 

[el midgetron]

 

12 minutes ago, Helen of Annoy said:

And now I explained to you in very simple words that the material you posted is meant to mislead people into criminally wrong conclusion that letting drunk orcs **** on your head is the way to go, because if you resist, drunk orc will destroy your fields. 

Such perverse manipulation is wrong by default, but it's also wrong because Russia is not only destroying Ukrainian crops, Russia is stealing Ukrainian crops. (See link in my previous post.)

You will undoubtedly thank me for taking time to clear it up a little for you. 

You're welcome. Just say when you need further clarifications. That Russian disinformation minefield can be tricky to navigate.    

It’s not clear to me how anyone could read what I posted or the article I linked to and come to your conclusion, 

Edited July 4, 2022 by el midgetron

[el midgetron]

4 minutes ago, Helen of Annoy said:

Whose fault is this?

It’s right in the title of the article -

“Volunteer fighters 'want payback', as Russians 'wipe out' Luhansk”

It was also clearly stated in what I quoted -

“He said Russia was using its overwhelming firepower to "wipe out" villages in its advance, leaving the Ukrainians with little cover.”

 

[el midgetron]

1 hour ago, Helen of Annoy said:

This is not Russia, that sends hostages literally to Vladivostok, that uploads recordings of murdered POW after his mother couldn't pay the ransom, that steals children and doesn't recognize human, let alone civil rights of prisoners. 

When details about Russian treatment of POWs emerge in their full horror, Russia and its suppositories among westerners will be even more despised.  

Ukraine is also guilty of abuse, torture and summary executions of its Russian prisoners. We’ve seen the videos, they just receive different treatment by the media. 

“Ukrainian doctor tells TV interviewer he has ordered his staff to CASTRATE Russian soldiers because they are 'cockroaches'”

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10636597/Ukrainian-doctor-tells-TV-interviewer-ordered-staff-CASTRATE-Russian-soldiers.html

POWs should be treated with dignity, I’m happy to condemn abuses from both sides. Russia shouldnt abuse its prisoners and neither should Ukraine, 

Dehumanization of the enemy is part of nearly every war. However, I feel like in the US we have rejected it since the war on terror. We don’t call our enemies derogatory names or place blame on an entire country or religion for the actions of the groups we oppose. Heck, even calling Covid the “China virus” was criticized as blaming the Chinese people for the virus. 

I know Russia engages in this dehumanization behavior too but we don’t have a problem with Russian members engaging in such behavior here. Its not really how we act in the west any more. We regret calling nationalities “Japanese” and “Krauts” and the subhuman characterization of those nationalities, I think the leaders who wage war deserve all the condemnation and ridicule they get. However, indiscriminately extending that hate onto a nationality or religion should probably be avoided. 
 

On these grounds I object to calling Russians “orcs” and cockroaches. If UM has Russian members, I think it’s disrespectful to them.
 

*UM’s filters auto corrects the WW2 era slur to “Japanese”. 

Edited July 4, 2022 by el midgetron

[Helen of Annoy]

1 hour ago, el midgetron said:

 

It’s not clear to me how anyone could read what I posted or the article I linked to and come to your conclusion, 

I suggest you try re-reading my explanation. It's really simple and very obvious. 

I also suggest you try avoiding such malicious yet thin veiled manipulations. They're insulting the intelligence of people supposed to fall for them.  

[Helen of Annoy]

1 hour ago, el midgetron said:

It’s right in the title of the article -

“Volunteer fighters 'want payback', as Russians 'wipe out' Luhansk”

It was also clearly stated in what I quoted -

“He said Russia was using its overwhelming firepower to "wipe out" villages in its advance, leaving the Ukrainians with little cover.”

 

Whose fault is this? 

I don't ask you to re-quote the article, I ask you to say whose fault is this. 

[Helen of Annoy]

48 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Ukraine is also guilty of abuse, torture and summary executions of its Russian prisoners. We’ve seen the videos, they just receive different treatment by the media. 

“Ukrainian doctor tells TV interviewer he has ordered his staff to CASTRATE Russian soldiers because they are 'cockroaches'”

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10636597/Ukrainian-doctor-tells-TV-interviewer-ordered-staff-CASTRATE-Russian-soldiers.html

POWs should be treated with dignity, I’m happy to condemn abuses from both sides. Russia shouldnt abuse its prisoners and neither should Ukraine, 

Dehumanization of the enemy is part of nearly every war. However, I feel like in the US we have rejected it since the war on terror. We don’t call our enemies derogatory names or place blame on an entire country or religion for the actions of the groups we oppose. Heck, even calling Covid the “China virus” was criticized as blaming the Chinese people for the virus. 

I know Russia engages in this dehumanization behavior too but we don’t have a problem with Russian members engaging in such behavior here. Its not really how we act in the west any more. We regret calling nationalities “Japanese” and “Krauts” and the subhuman characterization of those nationalities, I think the leaders who wage war deserve all the condemnation and ridicule they get. However, indiscriminately extending that hate onto a nationality or religion should probably be avoided. 
 

On these grounds I object to calling Russians “orcs” and cockroaches. If UM has Russian members, I think it’s disrespectful to them.
 

*UM’s filters auto corrects the WW2 era slur to “Japanese”. 

Ukraine was accused by Russia, that does not equate "guilty". 

Give me the links to credible (so no Russian assets) sources that found Ukraine guilty of abuse, torture and summary executions (no less! like Ukrainians would waste POW exchange material... ). 

Regarding castration, the doctor said what he said but no orc was indeed castrated. Otherwise sane people tend to say outrageous things after seeing the evidence of war crimes in their own country, committed on civilians, by invading horde of orcs. 

We've been over "dehumanization" before. I already explained to you that the claim that "orc" is a term meant to refer to any Russian is false. An orc is an Russian invader. Russian volunteers who fight for Ukraine are not orcs. They're Russians. Only someone who doesn't want to see the difference will keep complaining that "orc" is somehow offensive to Russians. It's not. What orcs do in Ukraine is offensive for Russians. 

The false claim that the term "orc" is meant to be offensive for all Russians is what is truly offensive for Russians. Because sane and kind among Russians do not share orc intentions, which is the basis of your false claim.  

 

edit to add: an orc can be Buryat, Kazakh, Syrian... even an Ukrainian... any nationality. It's not nation but actions that define an orc.  

Edited July 4, 2022 by Helen of Annoy

[Duke Wellington]

Something I have noticed before a major war is the rhetoric starts to mention the terms `the final war` or `the war to end all wars`.

That hasn`t happened yet so hopefully no WW3.

But I have noticed Putin is a tiny man, Napoleon and Hitler were little people too, so mmm.... who knows?

[Helen of Annoy]

I won't post any links, because the topic is heartbreaking and photos disturbing. I'll quote titles, they can easily be googled: 

Farm animals in Mala Rogan burned alive in Russian bombing

Russian military intentionally strikes dog shelters and horse stables

More than 300 dogs died in shelter in Borodjanka, after remaining locked during Russian occupation

Russian soldiers murder volunteers who were trying to help starving animals

Both animals and employees of Feldman Ecopark near Kharkiv targeted and murdered by Russian invaders 

It goes on and on.... 

 

On the other side

 

[Helen of Annoy]

https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-society/3521937-residents-of-russianoccupied-mariupol-dying-from-lack-of-medicines.html

In Donetsk region, residents of Mariupol, temporarily occupied by Russian troops, are dying from the lack of medicines.

...

for more than two months, the Russians and their accomplices, the self-proclaimed authorities of Mariupol, have been blocking residents' normal access to drinking water, sufficient food and medicines.

- end of quote - 

 

More horrors in the article on the link. 

Summed up, orc occupation continues to murder residents of Mariupol. 

 

Why is it so, Russian admirers? Who's stopping Russia from delivering medicine to Mariupol? Who's stopping Russia from fixing the damage they made? 

Is that the glory of Russia? Cholera and corpses bulldozed away together with remnants of once civilized city?  

Orcs. Calling Putin's orcs that name is an insult to Tolkien's orcs. 

[Helen of Annoy]

Something more uplifting 

Zaporizhya direction. HIMARS continue demilitarization of Russian occupation army

(I've seen the version with specific "Happy 4th of July to Americans" but I can't remember where. So, happy 4th, Americans, enjoy the fireworks  )

 

Edited July 4, 2022 by Helen of Annoy
adding "of" before July... one day, I'll learn English... maybe...

[el midgetron]

54 minutes ago, Helen of Annoy said:

Whose fault is this? 

I don't ask you to re-quote the article, I ask you to say whose fault is this. 

Well, it’s seems elementary that if Russia is the one “wiping out” Ukrainian villages, that it’s Russia’s fault for what Russia is doing. Despite whatever the point you are trying to make I trust this is a conclusion you were already able to reach on your own.

[Helen of Annoy]

38 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Well, it’s seems elementary that if Russia is the one “wiping out” Ukrainian villages, that it’s Russia’s fault for what Russia is doing. Despite whatever the point you are trying to make I trust this is a conclusion you were already able to reach on your own.

It's a pretzel, not an answer. 

This is Russia's fault.  

 

And the fault of various Russian admirers is that they chose particularly putrid demon to bow to, whose actions are war crimes and crimes against humanity. You can't excuse that. Not even with "provocations". Especially not with "provocations". 

 

For example, you might think I'm provoking you right now. How far do you think you could go, in your reaction to my provocations? 

Burn my house? Commit any of crimes from Russian orc wish list? 

 

Do you ****ing begin to realize what you tried to do in this thread? 

 

edit: to change "Russian" into "orc". See why we need that "orc" term? To avoid associating atrocities with just any Russian. It's not their fault. 

 

Edited July 4, 2022 by Helen of Annoy

[DarkHunter]

1 hour ago, Cookie Monster said:

Napoleon

Napoleon was slightly taller than average for his time period, only British propaganda portrayed him as short.

[Helen of Annoy]

Oooh, I like this... 

https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-society/3521982-copy-of-charles-xii-of-swedens-letter-recognizing-independence-of-zaporizhzhia-sich-brought-to-ukraine.html

Prime Minister of Sweden Magdalena Andersson brought to Ukraine a copy of the letter of King Charles XII dated 1711 with instructions on the recognition of Zaporizhzhia Sich as an independent state.

"In the letter, he gives instructions to the Swedish ambassador to recognize Zaporizhzhia Sich as an independent state, as a subject of international law, so that there is no oppression from the Moscow tsar. I think it fits very well in the current political context. Already at the beginning of the 18th century, our king was impressed by Cossacks and Cossack democracy," said the Prime Minister of Sweden.

 

[el midgetron]