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Russia Masses Military Equipment Near Ukraine Borders: A Prologue to WWIII?


Grim Reaper 6
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, jmccr8 said:

Hi Knob

No like people that are living in a safe zone as members here that do not seem to understand that citizens have an obligation to the country they live in. They are willing to take the sugar and none of the salt

Yeah, just like if you were a man in 1930’s Germany you would have stepped up and honored your “obligation” to Hitler. Heck, if you had maybe Ukraine would be naming a bunch of streets after you? 
 

Not every country is worth fighting for. You can keep you blind nationalism.  
 

Edited by el midgetron
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On 2/13/2022 at 5:44 PM, Cookie Monster said:

NATO and Russia have never had good relations. Russia is outraged at 3 things:

1. NATO creeping to its border - It doesnt want NATO allies next door to it. 

2. ABM silos - NATO builds anti-ballistic missile silos in member countries and has been building them in its recent Eastern European acquisitions. ABM missiles are used to knock-out ICBMs before they reach orbit. With them building built in Eastern Europe, and probably Ukraine too if it becomes a member, it effectively means most Russian ICBMs would be knocked out in a nuclear conflict.

3. Hypersonic Missiles - While Russia and China are a couple of years ahead of the USA, the thing is should NATO deploy hypersonic missiles in Eastern Europe they could hid Moscow in under 6 minutes. It opens up a first strike strategy from NATO and by the time Russia realises its under attack its already crippled.

So Russia has returned to its Pre-WW2 tactic and creating as much difference between it as its future opponents as possible.

Since Peter the Great Russia has been trying to get a warm water port on the Black Sea.  The only one available is Sevastopol in Crimea.  We have heard this song-and-dance before.

Doug

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Helen of Annoy said:

:lol:  Congratulations, putlerians. What a model soldier you've got there. 

(It's just too funny to be true, but one can hope it is true :lol: After all, that's Ruzzia... it might as well be true.)

 

Source: Daily Star. It doesn't want to be linked.

  

An obese Russian retired general has been sent to fight on the frontlines in Eastern Ukraine because Vladimir Putin is running out of senior officers.

The 20 stone general, 67, is now said to be in charge of Russian special forces operating in the region after the unit’s former commander was seriously injured in an artillery strike.

...

A senior intelligence source last night told the Daily Star Sunday: “Putin is now scraping the barrel.

“Most of his best and battle-hardened senior commanders have been killed or injured fighting in Ukraine so he is resorting to sending second rate officers to the front who don’t last very long.

...

He is understood to require five meals a day washed down with at least a litre of vodka.

 

Photo taken from elsewhere: 

Putin u rat poslao pretilog generala (67)? "Ruča 5 puta dnevno i strusi litru votke"

Perhaps this is true, perhaps not, This general is identified as “General Pavel” with a short bio that he served in both Afghanistan and Syria. I am not able to find such a person. There is a General Pavel Popov who does looks similar (a bit slimmer) but lacks all of the foreign military experience and “Pavel” is his first name not last. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pavel_Popov

Anyway, a little more confirmation of ALL information is the way to go, From what I can tell this story originated in the DailyStar. The same outlet that was happy to publish Ukrainian propaganda stories like the “Ghost of Kyiv”. 

https://www.**************/news/world-news/feared-ukrainian-air-ace-the-26448808

(huh apparently UM blocks links to the DailyStar?)

As the conflict in Ukraine drags on, the country’s communications strategy has become slicker and more professional, say academics studying information warfare. Ukraine has also shifted its strategy away from amplifying exaggerated myths to focusing on the courage of ordinary people who are committing small, achievable acts of bravery in the face of the Russian invasion.

Like any country at war, Ukraine has been working to shape the information its people see. The military is not allowed to disclose casualty numbers, photos of deceased Ukrainian soldiers are rare, and pictures of Zelensky dressed as superman have been shared by officials. Fedorov describes the campaign as something of a morale boost. “We wanted [Ukrainians] to know their efforts are not going unnoticed, so they continue resisting,” he says.

But there’s a fine line between messaging that can boost morale at home and propaganda that can damage a country’s reputation abroad. The meeting between Banda executives and the digital ministry took place as Ukraine was facing scrutiny for communication missteps early in the conflict. 

https://www.wired.com/story/ukraine-propaganda-war/

Edited by el midgetron
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59 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Yeah, just like if you were a man in 1930’s Germany you would have stepped up and honored your “obligation” to Hitler. Heck, if you had maybe Ukraine would be naming a bunch of streets after you? 
 

Not every country is worth fighting for. You can keep you blind nationalism.  
 

Hi Midge

The Ukraine is not an invading force there is a big difference in Germany wanting to conquer Europe and the Ukrainian defence against an invading country.

The Ukrainian people do not have nor support a nazi government that is your fixation.

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25 minutes ago, jmccr8 said:

Hi Midge

The Ukraine is not an invading force there is a big difference in Germany wanting to conquer Europe and the Ukrainian defence against an invading country.

The Ukrainian people do not have nor support a nazi government that is your fixation.

What part of your statement “members here that do not seem to understand that citizens have an obligation to the country they live in” provides a caveat for the Germans who resisted Hitler?

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So it seems there was yesterday a late night emergency in Moscow, reasons are not clear but rumours points to the new and in use rocket launchers given to Ukraine, that are currently out of reach of Russian artillery, as it seems a russian base deep within occupied territory was destroyed.

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Posted (edited)

G-7 to back Ukraine ‘as long as it takes’; Zelensky seeks antiaircraft systems

TELFS, Austria — Leaders from the Group of Seven, the world’s wealthiest democracies, pledged to “stand with Ukraine for as long as it takes” — after Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky asked the group for more heavy weapons to force a Russian retreat before winter.

Source: Latest Russia-Ukraine war news: Live updates - The Washington Post

Putin must be furious, especially in light of this comment, at the end of the article:

NATO will kick-start the “biggest overhaul” of its defense and deterrence capabilities since the Cold War in response to Russia’s invasion of Ukraine, NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg said Monday. The alliance is set to ramp up its ability to respond to a crisis, including by increasing the size of its high-readiness forces from around 40,000 “to well over 300,000,” Stoltenberg said ahead of a NATO summit in Madrid.

Edited by Nuclear Wessel
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I've just noticed that Occult hasn't been around. Did @Helen of Annoy scare him off? 

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25 minutes ago, godnodog said:

So it seems there was yesterday a late night emergency in Moscow, reasons are not clear but rumours points to the new and in use rocket launchers given to Ukraine, that are currently out of reach of Russian artillery, as it seems a russian base deep within occupied territory was destroyed.

On the topic of launchers, apparently the US is poised to give Ukraine some long-range surface-to-air missile systems:

US to announce purchase of medium- to long-range surface-to-air missile defense system for Ukraine

(CNN)The US plans to announce as soon as this week that it has purchased an advanced, medium-to-long range surface-to-air missile defense system for Ukraine, a source familiar with the announcement tells CNN.

President Joe Biden, who is currently meeting with G7 leaders in Germany for a summit primarily focused on Ukraine, announced recently that the US would provide Ukraine with "more advanced rocket systems and munitions" as its war with Russia grinds on. Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky is slated to virtually address Biden and other G7 leaders on Monday.

Source: US to announce purchase of medium- to long-range surface-to-air missile defense system for Ukraine - CNNPolitics

This may stir up some increased tensions between Moscow and Kiev, because Putin could see that as an attempt to reach deeper into Russian territory.

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Russia defaulted on it's debt.
Nothing to see....

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, el midgetron said:

What part of your statement “members here that do not seem to understand that citizens have an obligation to the country they live in” provides a caveat for the Germans who resisted Hitler?

Most people naturally assume that caveat.

If you're trying to compare  defending Ukraine to fighting for Hitler, than idk what to tell you. 

Almost all nations on earth (possibly all but I'm too lazy to look it up) have a draft.

If you are trying to imply that most Ukrianians do not want to fight than you need to supply actual evidence for that claim.

Edited by spartan max2
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10 hours ago, el midgetron said:

What part of your statement “members here that do not seem to understand that citizens have an obligation to the country they live in” provides a caveat for the Germans who resisted Hitler?

USA draft rules and exemptions:

https://www.usa.gov/selective-service

"

The Draft

A draft is the mandatory enrollment of individuals into the armed forces. The United States military has been all-volunteer since 1973. But an act of Congress could still reinstate the draft in case of a national emergency. The Selective Service System is the agency that registers men and is responsible for running a draft.

Important part: But an act of Congress could still reinstate the draft in case of national emergency.

So, Ukraine is not doing anything different than what any other country would do in case of national emergency, including USA.

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2 hours ago, Nuclear Wessel said:

I've just noticed that Occult hasn't been around. Did @Helen of Annoy scare him off? 

Nah, it wasn't me. Because we're all adults here, right? Aware that everything we ever say, even in an illusion of anonymity, might have consequences. I didn't say anything he wasn't aware of. :D 

 

 

A rant to go with that, you absolutely do not have to read it, it's not your fault :D that I feel like ranting for a while:  

For example, I won't be surprised at all if some pro-Russian cracks my skull in a "traffic accident". Only it doesn't scare me. It does make me extremely angry, but doesn't scare me. What does scare me is the possibility that they will take over. Some politicians in my part of the world outed themselves as pro-Russians (with the same disgustingly cheap "disclaimer" that they're just being impartial or some such crap) and though their chances look slim, they are not to be ignored, because our local situation is complex and might escalate overnight, in a number of really ugly ways. 

It's just a trolling game for the majority of putlerian Internet brigade, or a chance to satisfy own perversion for a portion of them, while for me, that is the future of Eastern Europe at stake, complete with our history that will be erased if we lose this war.

This war is clear for me, either I'll be physically erased and my heritage with me, either I won't. 

And then putlerians come with their spins and whataboutism, in bizarrely irrational belief they can make me forget who I am, forget both my history and my own experiences and surrender my future into hands of the same demons who were shelling the hospital near which I lived, in particular. 30 years ago, still rings in my head.  

They've got no idea what they're doing, so god will forgive them, but I won't. 

Rant over :D 

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Did you see it people, I was right, it looks like Belarus is going to invade Ukraine and Russia is going to take Lithuania.

On top of the 40,000 quick reaction forces already moved to Eastern Europe, NATO is now sending another 260,000: NATO to dramatically increase forces on high alert to over 300,000 from 40,000 amid Russia threat | World News | Sky News

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Ah, this is a sign that putinists should start going to bed early, so they feel they had enough of sleep by 3 AM. 

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Two Ruzzian ammo depots destroyed in one day. Possibly even three. 

 

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Putler's Ruzzia is a terrorist state. 

 

https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-ato/3516469-first-data-on-kremenchuk-mall-casualties-two-dead-20-injured-in-russian-missile-strike.html

As a result of a Russian missile attack on a Kremenchuk mall, at least two were killed and 20 more were injured.

"At the moment we know of 20 injured, nine of them in serious condition. It has already been confirmed that two people were killed," ...

"This is not a military facility, it has no strategic value. An ordinary shopping mall, where people came to shop, ...

In turn, the Head of the President’s Office, Andriy Yermak, stressed that Russia should be recognized as a sponsor of terrorism, while Ukraine needs more weapons and air defense systems to protect its people.

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47 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:

Did you see it people, I was right, it looks like Belarus is going to invade Ukraine and Russia is going to take Lithuania.

On top of the 40,000 quick reaction forces already moved to Eastern Europe, NATO is now sending another 260,000: NATO to dramatically increase forces on high alert to over 300,000 from 40,000 amid Russia threat | World News | Sky News

Russia won't attack Lithuania with NATO troops there.

Ukraines mistake was not having NATO troops 

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7 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Russia won't attack Lithuania with NATO troops there.

Ukraines mistake was not having NATO troops 

You think like that because you've got realistic view of things and you can use logic. You wouldn't do it, I wouldn't. 

But that's not how Putler thinks. Logic and realistic assessment are not in use in Russia anymore. Invading Ukraine was completely stupid and illogical idea too. 

Putler believes, based on what he wants to be true, that he can defeat NATO. 

(I'm not saying it will be Baltic, but he will attack.)

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6 minutes ago, Helen of Annoy said:

You think like that because you've got realistic view of things and you can use logic. You wouldn't do it, I wouldn't. 

But that's not how Putler thinks. Logic and realistic assessment are not in use in Russia anymore. Invading Ukraine was completely stupid and illogical idea too. 

Putler believes, based on what he wants to be true, that he can defeat NATO. 

(I'm not saying it will be Baltic, but he will attack.)

Idk. I haven't really been buying the whole Putin is an irrational madman narrative. I didn't see that narrative start until after he invaded Ukraine. And I feel like Putin's people want to West to see him as some irrational madman who could push the nuclear button at any minute, to try and scare us off of standing up to him.

 

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23 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Idk. I haven't really been buying the whole Putin is an irrational madman narrative. I didn't see that narrative start until after he invaded Ukraine. And I feel like Putin's people want to West to see him as some irrational madman who could push the nuclear button at any minute, to try and scare us off of standing up to him.

 

You didn't see that narrative because he didn't do something that monumentally irrational before. 

Invading Ukraine because you think your forces will be met with flowers, that damn (elected) government will flee and your pet puppet (kicked out of country) will return to rule forever. That's definitely not rational. 

But he's rational in the sense of appearing rational. He's not delivering word salads or eating worms, but his strategical decisions are very obviously based in irrational beliefs. 

He's clearly very much in love with himself (cosmetic surgeries, hilariously pompous protocol, comparing himself to Peter the Great), so he won't push the button just like that, because he wants to live. More than you or me. We can accept the idea of our own mortality, he can't. 

He will attack a NATO country because the contemporary Russian extreme myth, in which he has to believe in order to satisfy own gnawing feeling of inadequacy, includes the assumption that Russian are superior genetically (I mean of course they are, just look at him or his generals :lol: ) and therefore immune to the corruption (human rights) that has destroyed western population. Not to write a whole essay, he is irrational in the sense that he has to believe so he does believe that the West will blink first. 

What exactly happens next, after the West doesn't blink and punches him right back? I don't know. But we'll find out :w00t:

(This does not imply he should be appeased because we don't know how he will react to being not appeased, it implies as I said many times before that he must be punched back to prevent him from continuing to believe that his plan, which consists of belief in western weakness, is working.)

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8 minutes ago, Helen of Annoy said:

You didn't see that narrative because he didn't do something that monumentally irrational before. 

Invading Ukraine because you think your forces will be met with flowers, that damn (elected) government will flee and your pet puppet (kicked out of country) will return to rule forever. That's definitely not rational. 

But he's rational in the sense of appearing rational. He's not delivering word salads or eating worms, but his strategical decisions are very obviously based in irrational beliefs. 

He's clearly very much in love with himself (cosmetic surgeries, hilariously pompous protocol, comparing himself to Peter the Great), so he won't push the button just like that, because he wants to live. More than you or me. We can accept the idea of our own mortality, he can't. 

He will attack a NATO country because the contemporary Russian extreme myth, in which he has to believe in order to satisfy own gnawing feeling of inadequacy, includes the assumption that Russian are superior genetically (I mean of course they are, just look at him or his generals :lol: ) and therefore immune to the corruption (human rights) that has destroyed western population. Not to write a whole essay, he is irrational in the sense that he has to believe so he does believe that the West will blink first. 

What exactly happens next, after the West doesn't blink and punches him right back? I don't know. But we'll find out :w00t:

(This does not imply he should be appeased because we don't know how he will react to being not appeased, it implies as I said many times before that he must be punched back to prevent him from continuing to believe that his plan, which consists of belief in western weakness, is working.)

To be honest I'm unsure with the political resolve amongst the West if Putler hit a NATO country to retaliate. Even Bozo the Prick is still thinking of reducing the British Army regulars further. They're spending alot of money on future projects which is great but UK forces needs stuff now. There's still gaps in the capabilities.

EU seems to still want to try a diplomatic approach to Putler, which I get trying to descalate, but its not working. More and more troops, jets missile systems need to be sent to the area. More than they're sending. Cause I do think Putler will test NATOs resolve by making s few missile strikes on Lithuania and if we don't retaliate then what?

I hope I'm wrong but since the Iraq and Afghanistan war people have had enough of war and I get it. But this is literally like what the Nazis did. Claim their people were persecuted bla bla  la and invaded.

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35 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Idk. I haven't really been buying the whole Putin is an irrational madman narrative. I didn't see that narrative start until after he invaded Ukraine. And I feel like Putin's people want to West to see him as some irrational madman who could push the nuclear button at any minute, to try and scare us off of standing up to him.

 

I never thought of Putin as irrational, in fact I thought of him as a great mastermind which he was years ago and we all feel his moves today. But something has changed in his mind. Guess things did not go according to plan, first the one plan closer to us which I will not explain on this thread, and then the plan to take Ukraine in a few days without the worlds opposition. Both plans have failed or in process to fail. Now his rational thinking made way to irrational way of thinking and I tend to believe he will attack Lithuanua and/ or the other baltic states. 

Since way before the agression on Ukraine Helen and myself repeated many times that his intentions are to bring back all the former states of USSR under the russian umbrella plus balkans (Serbia, Bosnia, Macedonia, Montenegro and at least the croatian part of Dubrovnik down to the Montenegro border) to have access to the mediterian and splitting up south-europe in two.

This was Stalins dream and Putin is trying to fullfill it. 

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