Russia Masses Military Equipment Near Ukraine Borders: A Prologue to WWIII?

[Trelane]

4 minutes ago, Occult1 said:

Well they have a say in the matter, since Ukraine is constantly petitioning the EU for more support.

Ukraine is totally dependent on foreign support at this point in it's defense against Russia.

Fixed that for you. It's still an illegal invasion. No matter what anyone says.

That being said, I think this whole mess clearly shows how useless the UN really is. 

 

Another interesting wrinkle to the illegal Russian invasion of a sovereign country;

"The widow of a Russian sergeant who was executed by Chechen forces when he refused to lead his troops into battle in Ukraine has joined a legion of disgruntled Russians fighting for Ukraine against their compatriots."

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/grieving-russian-widow-joins-group-of-defectors-fighting-for-ukraine/ss-AAZhAOB?ocid=msedgntphdr&cvid=4d30d3dc2e104e8c804f8a591254aefb

 

[Grim Reaper 6]

7 minutes ago, Occult1 said:

Well they have a say in the matter, since Ukraine is constantly petitioning the EU for more support.

Ukraine is totally dependent on foreign support at this point in it's war against Russia.

Well I don’t suspect it matters much how much the Ukraine petitions the EU for support since they will be a former member very soon. Oh and by the way my friend, the words out NATO IS NEXT.

European leaders formally accept Ukraine as a candidate to join the EU:  https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/23/ukraines-eu-candidate-status-decision-kosovo-says-eu-needs-to-do-more.html

 

[+Hammerclaw]

12 minutes ago, Occult1 said:

Well they have a say in the matter, since Ukraine is constantly petitioning the EU for more support.

Ukraine is totally dependent on foreign support at this point in it's war against Russia.

So is Russia----China.

[el midgetron]

21 minutes ago, Occult1 said:

Except that the information is easily verifiable. You are attacking the source but ignoring the content of the article.

The poll comes from RTL/ntv’s. The Daily Express is simply reporting on it.

I can find you the original NTV article in german:

https://www.n-tv.de/politik/Russland-Ukraine-Krieg-Mehrheit-der-Deutschen-haelt-Bundesregierung-fuer-konzeptlos-article23443407.html

 

Also from your quote:

''Articles are typically written by journalists or correspondents and are reasonably sourced to credible information.''

From the link above -

“47 Prozent der Bundesbürger sind der Meinung, dass die Ukraine zu Zugeständnissen bereit sein und auf Gebiete in der Ostukraine verzichten sollte, wenn es irgendwann zu Verhandlungen über eine Beendigung des Krieges kommen sollte. Ähnlich viele (41 Prozent) meinen, die Ukraine sollte solche Kompromisse nicht eingehen. 12 Prozent trauen sich in dieser Frage keine Einschätzung zu.”

Translation via Google -

“47 percent of Germans are of the opinion that Ukraine should be prepared to make concessions and renounce areas in eastern Ukraine if negotiations to end the war should come about at some point. A similar number (41 percent) believe that Ukraine should not make such compromises. 12 percent do not dare to make an assessment on this question.”

 

[+Nuclear Wessel]

18 minutes ago, Occult1 said:

Well they have a say in the matter, since Ukraine is constantly petitioning the EU for more support.

The people - i.e. the common people, who were the ones polled - have literally no say in the government's actions. It's not like the government is going to consult them on their next decision, nor are they going to be able to, in any way, influence concessions in Ukraine. 

Edited July 7, 2022 by Nuclear Wessel

[DarkHunter]

Partisans in Kherson are taking a new approach to showing their presence within the city.  It seems that the partisans have started hanging the bloody clothes of killed Russian soldiers from street signs in and around the city.  Not going to post the pictures but I have seen a picture of a bloody Russian uniform with a white Z spray painted onto it with a paper saying something to the effect of "Orcs will die" nailed next to the uniform.

Definitely will be effective psychological warfare.  Been hearing rumors that Russian soldiers are afraid to go out on night patrols now and that the collaborators wont leave safe locations without large amount of armed escorts, around 10+ soldiers guarding them.

[Occult1]

17 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

Well I don’t suspect it matters much how much the Ukraine petitions the EU for support since they will be a former member very soon. Oh and by the way my friend, the words out NATO IS NEXT.

European leaders formally accept Ukraine as a candidate to join the EU:  https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/23/ukraines-eu-candidate-status-decision-kosovo-says-eu-needs-to-do-more.html

 

There is a growing consensus in the 'old' Europe (France, Germany Italy) that once Russia takes over the Donbass, a new Minsk-type agreement should be signed.

They don't want this to go on for longer than it should. The EU leaders care about their jobs and if the support from the population is shifting, Ukraine will be steered towards making concessions.

Edited July 7, 2022 by Occult1

[el midgetron]

Ukraine can’t have NATO-style security guarantees from the West, Germany says

Western assurances for the country won’t amount to the ‘mutual defense’ enshrined in Article 5 of the NATO treaty, Chancellor Olaf Scholz says…..

….However, answering questions from lawmakers in the Bundestag, the German lower house of parliament, Scholz said that it was “clear” that such security guarantees for Ukraine “won’t correspond to Article 5 of the NATO Treaty.”…

…..The chancellor was referring to the mutual defense clause of the military alliance, which says that an attack on one NATO country has to be treated as an attack on all members. In practice, the Article 5 clause is a major safeguard, especially for more vulnerable countries like the Baltics, because it means, for example, that the U.S. would intervene with all its military power if Russia attacked — acting as a powerful deterrent….

…. remarks appear to suggest that Ukraine won’t be able to count on direct military support by NATO in the future either. NATO countries have indirectly supported Kyiv in its war with Russia by sending tanks, artillery and other kinds of weapons, but they have cautiously made sure to not get directly involved in the war.

https://www.politico.eu/article/ukraine-cant-have-nato-style-security-guarantees-scholz/

 

[Occult1]

14 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

So is Russia----China.

I haven't seen evidence that China is providing weapons, ammunition and intelligence to Russia in Ukraine.

Buying cheap oil and gas is probably benefiting China as much as it does Russia. It's a win-win situation.

Edited July 7, 2022 by Occult1

[Grim Reaper 6]

2 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

From the link above -

“47 Prozent der Bundesbürger sind der Meinung, dass die Ukraine zu Zugeständnissen bereit sein und auf Gebiete in der Ostukraine verzichten sollte, wenn es irgendwann zu Verhandlungen über eine Beendigung des Krieges kommen sollte. Ähnlich viele (41 Prozent) meinen, die Ukraine sollte solche Kompromisse nicht eingehen. 12 Prozent trauen sich in dieser Frage keine Einschätzung zu.”

Translation via Google -

“47 percent of Germans are of the opinion that Ukraine should be prepared to make concessions and renounce areas in eastern Ukraine if negotiations to end the war should come about at some point. A similar number (41 percent) believe that Ukraine should not make such compromises. 12 percent do not dare to make an assessment on this question.”

 

That’s accurate but this is also from the article referenced, oh and by the way the article is a month old kinda old news isn’t it! 

Supporters of heavy weapons supplies to Ukraine remain in the majority in Germany. The German government's decision to support Ukraine with the Panzerhaubitze 2000, the Gepard anti-aircraft tank and modern anti-aircraft missiles in addition to 1,000 anti-tank weapons and 500 surface-to-air missiles, among other things, is the right one for 56 percent of Germans. In the previous week it was 58 percent. However, the group of critics of this policy is growing - from 36 percent in the previous week to 40 percent in the current trend barometer from RTL and ntv.

[+Hammerclaw]

I'm all for optimism, but does anyone seriously think the countries of Europe, in either the guise of the EU or NATO, are going vote themselves into an automatic state of war with Russia?

[+Hammerclaw]

5 minutes ago, Occult1 said:

I haven't seen evidence that China is providing weapons, ammunition and intelligence to Russia in Ukraine.

Buying cheap oil and gas is probably benefiting China as much as it does Russia. It's a win-win situation.

Russian military vehicles run on Chinese tires and components and fire Chinese made munitions.

Edited July 7, 2022 by Hammerclaw

[Grim Reaper 6]

2 minutes ago, Occult1 said:

There is a growing consensus in the 'old' Europe (France, Germany Italy) that once Russia takes over the Donbass, a new Minsk-type agreement should be signed.

They don't want this to go on for longer than it should. The EU leaders care about their jobs and if the support from the population is shifting, Ukraine will be steered towards making concessions.

Do you have a link to a source for it  that isn’t a month or more old? I am will to discuss this with you, but I refuse to take your word for it especially after your post above where you did not accurately quote the comments from my post that makes your remarks suspect to me!

[Occult1]

2 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

Do you have a link to a source for it  that isn’t a month or more old? I am will to discuss this with you, but I refuse to take your word for it especially after your post above where you did not accurately quote the comments from my post that makes your remarks suspect to me!

A month old? The german article I posted is dated:

06.07.2022, 11:40 Uhr

Edited July 7, 2022 by Occult1

[DarkHunter]

Seems a Ukranian drone took out a Russian T-62 tank, also seems to be the first T-62 taken out in Ukraine.

Not familiar enough with Russian armor to determine if it actually is a T-62 but it's still an impressive improvised drone strike.

[el midgetron]

G-20 Meeting May Lead to Wider Divisions Over War in Ukraine

Foreign ministers from the world’s largest nations are looking to address Russia's war in Ukraine and its impact on global energy and food security when they meet in Indonesia this week.

WASHINGTON (AP) — Foreign ministers from the world’s largest nations are looking to address Russia's war in Ukraine and its impact on global energy and food security when they meet in Indonesia this week. Yet instead of providing unity, the talks may well exacerbate existing divides over the Ukraine conflict…..

…..And, unlike in recent leader-level meetings with NATO partners and other like-minded partners, Blinken will find himself among diplomats from countries wary of the U.S. approach to Ukraine and concerned about its impact on them.

https://www.usnews.com/news/business/articles/2022-07-06/g-20-meeting-may-lead-to-wider-divisions-over-war-in-ukraine

[jmccr8]

50 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

Ukraine still relies heavily on Russian-made weapons and will need to turn to other countries outside of NATO to secure enough Soviet-era arms and ammunition to keep up its fight against Moscow, according to a new report.

Hi El

The weapons that the Ukraine don't blow up they return( fire back with) to the Russian's the munitions that they forgot when they moved. Seems neighborly to me.

[Occult1]

12 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

Russian military vehicles run on Chinese tires and components and fire Chinese made munitions.

If Russia really use Chinese tires, they have bought them before the invasion, which doesn't prove your point. They could have bought Michelin XZL tires instead.

The US is also dependent on other countries to source some it's components:

Biden humiliated as reliance on RUSSIA for weapon ammo exposed – and it includes nuclear

''In spite of being the world’s largest military force, as well as enjoying the largest military budget, the US depends on two of its sworn adversaries to produce its ammunition and military equipment. The reliance comes in the form of a key mineral required in the production of such hardware, and something that is in short supply in the US.

Antimony is a critical element in producing many military items including armour-piercing bullets, explosives and nuclear weapons.''

https://www.express.co.uk/news/science/1623040/joe-biden-russia-china-weapon-supply-ammo-bullets-nuclear-defence-news

 

Edited July 7, 2022 by Occult1

[+Hammerclaw]

5 minutes ago, Occult1 said:

If Russia really use Chinese tires as some sources have suggested, they have bought it before the invasion, which doesn't prove your point. They could have bought Michelin XZL tyies instead.

The US is also dependent on other countries to source some it's components:

Biden humiliated as reliance on RUSSIA for weapon ammo exposed – and it includes nuclear

''In spite of being the world’s largest military force, as well as enjoying the largest military budget, the US depends on two of its sworn adversaries to produce its ammunition and military equipment. The reliance comes in the form of a key mineral required in the production of such hardware, and something that is in short supply in the US.''

https://www.express.co.uk/news/science/1623040/joe-biden-russia-china-weapon-supply-ammo-bullets-nuclear-defence-news

 

They buy the cheapest they can get. They could get that here and elsewhere, but it costs more, that includes rare earth minerals they source from China.

Mining Company Determined to Restore US Rare Earth Supply Chain (nationaldefensemagazine.org)

Edited July 7, 2022 by Hammerclaw

[Occult1]

6 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

They buy the cheapest they can get. They could get that here and elsewhere, but it costs more, that includes rare earth minerals they source from China.

China produces 80% of the world's antimony so the U.S. is wholly dependent on China and even Russia to source it.

But we are getting slightly off-topic.

Edited July 7, 2022 by Occult1

[jmccr8]

8 minutes ago, el midgetron said:

G-20 Meeting May Lead to Wider Divisions Over War in Ukraine

Foreign ministers from the world’s largest nations are looking to address Russia's war in Ukraine and its impact on global energy and food security when they meet in Indonesia this week.

WASHINGTON (AP) — Foreign ministers from the world’s largest nations are looking to address Russia's war in Ukraine and its impact on global energy and food security when they meet in Indonesia this week. Yet instead of providing unity, the talks may well exacerbate existing divides over the Ukraine conflict…..

…..And, unlike in recent leader-level meetings with NATO partners and other like-minded partners, Blinken will find himself among diplomats from countries wary of the U.S. approach to Ukraine and concerned about its impact on them.

https://www.usnews.com/news/business/articles/2022-07-06/g-20-meeting-may-lead-to-wider-divisions-over-war-in-ukraine

Hi El

Maybe NATO and other countries should be offering escort services through the Black Sea as the cargo ships are owned by foreign companies and if a food emergency was implemented to aid in the transport of grain and processed byproducts to countries in need. Russia doesn't own the Black Sea so having other naval security for transport could both impede Putin as well as help with a food crisis.

[Occult1]

Russia Is Targeting Europe With Weaponized Kazakh Crude

''(Bloomberg) -- Russian President Vladimir Putin has found another weapon to use against European countries supporting Ukraine -- Kazakhstan’s crude -- and it will cost him almost nothing, writes Bloomberg oil strategist Julian Lee.

While a grace period ticks down before European sanctions on Russian oil kick in on Dec. 5 and the G7 group of industrialized countries considers a price cap on Moscow’s crude exports, Putin is getting his retaliation in early. A court in the town of Novorossiysk has ordered the Caspian Pipeline Consortium to halt shipments from its Black Sea export terminal for a month as punishment for violating oil spill regulations.''

The beauty of the move, from a Russian perspective, is that the flow that will be curtailed is not primarily Russian crude, which can be diverted elsewhere anyway, but output from neighboring Kazakhstan. Almost 1.5 million barrels a day of crude supply can be taken off an already tight market at virtually no cost to Russia.''

https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/russia-is-targeting-europe-with-weaponized-kazakh-crude-1.1788585

 

Europe is losing the energy war.. and badly.

Edited July 7, 2022 by Occult1

[+Hammerclaw]

7 minutes ago, Occult1 said:

China produces 80% of the world's antimony so the U.S. is wholly dependent on China and even Russia to source it.

But we are getting slightly off-topic.

Antimony Mines In The United States | The Diggings™

[Likely Guy]

55 minutes ago, Occult1 said:

A month old? The german article I posted is dated:

06.07.2022, 11:40 Uhr

Americans go 'month/day/year' while Europeans go 'day/month/year'

it's a common misconception..

[Trelane]

2 hours ago, Occult1 said:

I haven't seen evidence that China is providing weapons, ammunition and intelligence to Russia in Ukraine.

Buying cheap oil and gas is probably benefiting China as much as it does Russia. It's a win-win situation.

Financial support is still support. Nice try though.